BARRY BONDS IS

[bigdumbbell]

Whatever, the problem is you just don't understand just how many players ar on gear. Do you remember a guy that played on the Angels (outfielder) around 1978 to about 90-91' named Brian Downing?

I remember when I was playing AA ball (1981-83) and once in a while he was sent down to my team for rehab assignments, we would talk a little about training, at that time he and I were basically the only ones that would weight train because trainers were not really down with baseball players working with weights for fear it would slow them down. He never really came out and said he was using steriods, but we both new without saying a word. Brian was bigger than most players and alot freaking stronger, and usually recovered alot quicker................t here was a reason for that!!!!!!!!

what happened to him  i'm too lazy to google the name and what position did you play coach

[SirTraps]

I saw him play many times backing up Jim Essian with the Sox, and i was aware he juiced.  3/4 of MLB isnt on the juice however, its mainly power hitters and a few pitchers.  You can watch a game and look at the rosters, at least half of the players arent on drugs.

        I dont give a shit what you want to generalize or guess-lets focus on Mr Pharmaceutical CHEATER Barry Bonds.  The guy is all drugs and his record is Bullshit.

        Downing by the way, was known as the "black smith" after the Sox traded him to the Angels, and he became an outfielder-roided up and a different player.

[The Coach]

        I dont give a shit what you want to generalize or guess-lets focus on Mr Pharmaceutical CHEATER Barry Bonds.  The guy is all drugs and his record is Bullshit.

       

You just can't focus one without focusing on the other, Ruths record was made to be broken, it was, Aarons record was made to be broken, it's going to be broken. Take into consideration the age that Aaron was when he set the final record, 42, Bonds is 43 and just now about to the record, almost a years difference between the two. Sorry Traps, no matter how you look at it......it's a fair record. Are you going to say that Aaron's record was because of gear?

[The Coach]

what happened to him  i'm too lazy to google the name and what position did you play coach

I was a catcher and once in while third base!

[SirTraps]

Nope as cited earlier in this thread, Bonds' HR per AB doubled after the age of 35 when he started juicing heavily, he would never have approached the record without DRUGS.

           Ruth and Aaron set the record without juice.   Bonds is a cheating piece of shit who also has been on heavy doses of GH, as his shoe size went from 10 1/2 to 13    pathetic.

[The Coach]

Nope as cited earlier in this thread, Bonds' HR per AB doubled after the age of 35 when he started juicing heavily, he would never have approached the record without DRUGS.

           Ruth and Aaron set the record without juice.   Bonds is a cheating piece of shit who also has been on heavy doses of GH, as his shoe size went from 10 1/2 to 13    pathetic.

You don't get it........it's taken Bonds LONGER to break the record than Aaron.

[SirTraps]

which just underlines the fact that he is unworthy of the record and without DRUGS would have already been retired.  Cheating piece of shit.

[The Coach]

which just underlines the fact that he is unworthy of the record and without DRUGS would have already been retired.  Cheating piece of shit.

Do you think ARod, Clemens and Puljols and anyone else who has big numbers is cheating? After all, ARod's 32 and has one more to tie 500HR's!

[bigdumbbell]

I was a catcher and once in while third base!

i know a guy who'd love to buy your old catchers uniform coach, what number were you?   

[willie mosconi]

do you motherfuckers really think guys like Hank Aaron, Willie Mays, Babe Ruth, and Mickey Mantle wouldn't have used roids if they were popular during their eras?

[SirTraps]

Mickey Mantle was a genetic freak, hed be the fastest player in the game today and would probably hit 80-90 homeruns with that juiced up golf ball they are using.  He never even lifted weights.   

       Bonds without the juice is a 25-30 HR a year guy, good but he wouldnt even sniff the record.

[SAMSON123]

Mickey Mantle was a genetic freak, hed be the fastest player in the game today and would probably hit 80-90 homeruns with that juiced up golf ball they are using.  He never even lifted weights.   

       Bonds without the juice is a 25-30 HR a year guy, good but he wouldnt even sniff the record.

"mantle was a genetic freak" ...SURE HE WAS...SURE HE WAS... Mantle juiced just like the guys today!!! FACT...Juice has ben around since the 1930s. Old mantle was taking it in the ass on the regular...The book tells all...

[bigdumbbell]

Mickey Mantle was a genetic freak, hed be the fastest player in the game today and would probably hit 80-90 homeruns with that juiced up golf ball they are using.  He never even lifted weights.   

       Bonds without the juice is a 25-30 HR a year guy, good but he wouldnt even sniff the record.

mickey mantle was an alcoholic

[SirTraps]

   oh brother, the emotional cripple is back for more pain 

              Im sure Mickey's shoe size went from a 10 to a 13 during his career too, Bonds is 100 % DRUGS and his record is a joke. 

[MikeThaMachine]

exactly, in todays game i just assume EVERYONE is taking the stuff until someone proves me wrong, Bonds goes from never hitting over .316 or 38-40 HR's to hitting .370 and hitting 73 HR's in his late 30's, come on.

Yeah batting averages go up when you juice, just look at McGwire and Sosa

[SAMSON123]

  oh brother, the emotional cripple is back for more pain 

              Im sure Mickey's shoe size went from a 10 to a 13 during his career too, Bonds is 100 % DRUGS and his record is a joke. 

WHO SAID SOMEONE'S SHOES WENT FROM 10 TO 13? PROVE IT?

[The Squadfather]

Yeah batting averages go up when you juice, just look at McGwire and Sosa

hahahahaha, another gullible shitheel who believes that Bonds is clean.

[MikeThaMachine]

The transformation of Barry Bonds

Wednesday, March 8, 2006
Back to Article

In this excerpt from GAME OF SHADOWS by Mark Fainaru-Wada and Lance
 Williams, the statistical transformation of Barry Bonds after he
 began steroid use is detailed.
  * * *

The transformation that Barry Bonds achieved through the use of
performance-enhancing drugs is reflected in his batting statistics.
Bonds began using steroids before the start of the 1999 season, when
he was 34 years old. His numbers, as compiled by baseball-reference.com,
show that his performance improved dramatically at a time when otherwise
he might have been approaching the end of his career.

Of the five best offensive seasons in Bonds' career, four came after
he was 35 years old - and after 1999, the year he began using steroids.
The historic 2001 season, when he was 36 years old (his age as of
Opening Day), was the best of all - .328 batting average, 73 home runs,
an on-base percentage of .515. But 2002, when he was 37 (.370, 46 HR)
and 2004, when he was 39, (.362, 45 HR) also were excellent seasons for
Bonds, and 2003, when he was 38, was not far off the mark.

In fact, of Bonds' five best seasons, only one came in what is usually
considered a baseball player's prime. That was 1993, before steroids,
when Bonds was 28 years old and playing his first season for the Giants.

Year  Age   AB    R   H   2B  3B  HR  RBI   BB  SO    BA   OBP   SLG
2001   36  476  129  156  32   2  73  137  177  93  .328  .515  .863
2002   37  403  117  149  31   2  46  110  198  47  .370  .582  .799
2004   39  373  129  135  27   3  45  101  232  41  .362  .609  .812
1993   28  539  129  181  38   4  46  123  126  79  .336  .458  .677 
2003   38  390  111  133  22   1  45   90  148  58  .341  .529  .749         

Bonds' home run production also increased after he began using steroids.
In his 19-year career (through 2004), Bonds hit 45 or more home runs in
six seasons. Five of those seasons were after 1999 - after age 35, and
after he had begun using performance-enhancing drugs.

Year       Age        HR
2001        36        73
2000        35        49
2002        37        46
1993        28        46
2004        39        45
2003        38        45

Another measure of Bonds' power surge is home run frequency - the number
of at-bats it took him, on average, to hit each home run. Over the first
13 years of his career - that is, before steroids - he hit a home run
every 16.2 at-bats. His most productive year during that period was 1994,
when he hit a home run every 10.6 at-bats. (Bonds played in 112 of the
Giants' 115 games in 1994, the season that ended in a lockout. He hit 37
home runs in 391 at-bats.)

From 1999 through 2004 - after steroids - the frequency with which Bonds
struck homers nearly doubled, to one every 8.5 at-bats. His best year was
2001, when he hit a home run every 6.5 at-bats.

YR       AB/HR
1986      25.8
1987      22.0
1988      22.4
1989      30.5
1990      15.7
1991      20.4
1992      13.9
1993      11.7
1994      10.6
1995      15.3
1996      12.3
1997      13.3
1998      14.9
1999      10.4
2000       9.8
2001       6.5
2002       8.8
2003       8.7
2004       8.3

Before steroids, Bonds was an outstanding player and a likely Hall
of Famer, the numbers affirm. In more than 6,600 at-bats over 13
seasons, he batted .290 and hit 411 homers with 1,216 RBIs. He made
the All-Star team eight times and was selected the National League's
Most Valuable Player in 1990, 1992 and 1993. Had he retired after the
1998 season, he would rank 40th on the all-time home run list, above
Duke Snider. His 1,357 walks would rank 28th.

Using a mathematical average to roll those 13 seasons into a single year,
we see that Bonds, before steroids, hit for average and power and was an
excellent base runner. The composite Bonds year during that period looks
like this:

    G   AB     R   H  2B  3B  HR  RBI   SB  CS   BB  SO   BA   OBP
86-98  146  509   105 147  31   5  32   93   34  10  104  81 .290  .411

But after age 35 - after steroids - Bonds improved his game in most
categories. From 1999 to 2004, he had far better power and drove in and
scored more runs. His batting average increased by an astonishing 38
points, and his on-base percentage soared because of a big increase in
his walk total, which already was high.

At what should have been the end of his baseball career, Bonds became a
significantly better hitter than earlier in his career, as a composite
of those years shows.

         G   AB    R    H  2B  3B  HR  RBI   SB  CS   BB  SO   BA   OBP
99-04  136  413  118  136  27   2  49  105   10   2  158  63 .328  .517

The post-steroids Bonds also became one of the greatest hitters of all time.
Lee Sinins, creator of the Sabermetric Baseball Encyclopedia, used
statistician Bill James' "runs created" formula, a measure of total
batting production, to determine the best offensive performances in
baseball history. As Sinins ran the numbers, Bonds' 73-homer year in
2001 was the second-best offensive season any player has ever had -
second only to Babe Ruth's 1921 season, when the New York Yankees star hit
.378 with 171 RBI.

      Year  Age   AB    R    H  2B  3B  HR  RBI   BB  SO    BA   OBP   RC
RUTH  1921   26  540  177  204  44  16  59  171  145  81  .378  .512  243
BONDS 2001   36  476  129  156  32   2  73  137  177  93  .328  .515  228

Three of Bonds' post-steroids seasons were among the top 10 in baseball
history, according to Sinins' list. Only Ruth had more, with five top-10
seasons.

#      Name     Year      Age       Tm       BA       HR      RBI       RC
1      RUTH     1921       26      NYY     .378       59      171      243
2     BONDS     2001       36      SFG     .328       73      137      228
3      RUTH     1923       28      NYY     .393       41      131      227
4      RUTH     1920       25      NYY     .376       54      137      216
5    GEHRIG     1927       24      NYY     .373       47      175      215
6      RUTH     1927       32      NYY     .356       60      164      211
6      FOXX     1932       24      PHA     .364       58      169      211
8      RUTH     1924       29      NYY     .378       46      121      209
9     BONDS     2002       37      SFG     .370       46      110      206
10    BONDS     2004       39      SFG     .362       45      101      204
10    GEHRIG    1936       33      NYY     .354       49      152      204
10   HORNSBY    1922       26      STL     .401       42      152      204

Sinins' study also underscores the fact that in baseball terms,
Bonds was an old man when he emerged as one of the greats of the game.

Bonds was 36 when he had his 73-home run season, the first of three seasons
that rank in the top 10; he was 39 in 2004, which Sinins puts as 10th best
of all time, tied with Lou Gehrig's 1936 season for the Yankees and Rogers
Hornsby's efforts for the 1922 Cardinals.

No player was older than 33 when he performed at this high level. (Gehrig was
33 in 1936.) Ruth was 26 in 1921, which Sinins rates as the best season of all
time. The average age of the other players on the top-10 seasons list - along
with Ruth, Gehrig and Hornsby, there is Jimmie Foxx, the old-time Philadelphia
Athletic - was 27.

Yet another measure of Bonds' late-in-life power surge: By the end of 2005,
he had hit more home runs after age 35 than any of the game's great sluggers:

HR          35&UP  Total HR         %
BONDS         263       708        37
AARON         245       755        32
PALMEIRO      208       569        37
RUTH          198       714        28
JACKSON       153       563        27
MCCOVEY       137       521        26
MCGWIRE       126       583        22
MURRAY        125       504        25
SCHMIDT       123       548        22
MAYS          118       660        18
ROBINSON      111       586        19
BANKS         108       512        21
WILLIAMS      103       521        20
KILLEBREW      86       573        15
SOSA           49       588         8
OTT            48       511         9
MANTLE         40       536         7
MATTHEWS       19       512         4
FOXX            7       534         1

Sean Forman, proprietor of baseball-reference.com, used a different statistic
to track Bonds' power surge after 1999. In a study done in 2004 for The
Chronicle, he applied a measure of offensive performance called OPS, for
on-base percentage plus slugging percentage, to compare Bonds to other great
hitters.

Forman's conclusion: Starting in 2000, after Bonds had recovered from a 1999
elbow injury, he put together the greatest five consecutive seasons of any
hitter in baseball history. During that stretch, when he was age 35 to 39,
Bonds batted .339, hit 258 homers and drove in 544 runs, with an OPS of 1.316.
His performance was slightly better than what the study showed was the
 second-best five-year run of all time: Babe Ruth's first five years with the
Yankees. From age 25 to 29, Ruth hit .370 with 235 homeruns, 659 runs batted in,
and an OPS of 1.288. No other players in baseball history came close, the study
found.

HAHAHAHA You do realize he was voted player of the decade for the 90's and well everyone says he started "juicing" in 99 so it seems he was already a 3 time MVP and future hall of famer before he got into the "drugs".

[MikeThaMachine]

hahahahaha, another gullible shitheel who believes that Bonds is clean.

No but I don't believe he is only great because of using anything. Yeah it may have made it easier to play longer and given him some extra strength but do you really think just anyone could take some HGH and be as great as he has???

[scottallen]

his feet grew 4 sizes from eating his wheaties.

go barry!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  hell yes

[SirTraps]

R       AB/HR
1986      25.8
1987      22.0
1988      22.4
1989      30.5
1990      15.7
1991      20.4
1992      13.9
1993      11.7
1994      10.6
1995      15.3
1996      12.3
1997      13.3
1998      14.9
1999      10.4
2000       9.8
2001       6.5
2002       8.8
2003       8.7
2004       8.3

          Hey "Mike the Machine" see how his HR numbers per AB leaped up after his confirmed drug use ? see how that was at the age that nearly all other natural ball players numbers decline ? His record is bullshit.

ESPN announced yesterday that Barry Bonds shirt size ballooned from 42″ to 52″, his shoe size grew from 10 1/2 to 13, and his hat size went from a 7 1/8 to 7 3/4.

[MikeThaMachine]

R       AB/HR
1986      25.8
1987      22.0
1988      22.4
1989      30.5
1990      15.7
1991      20.4
1992      13.9
1993      11.7
1994      10.6
1995      15.3
1996      12.3
1997      13.3
1998      14.9
1999      10.4
2000       9.8
2001       6.5
2002       8.8
2003       8.7
2004       8.3

          Hey "Mike the Machine" see how his HR numbers per AB leaped up after his confirmed drug use ? see how that was at the age that nearly all other natural ball players numbers decline ? His record is bullshit.

ESPN announced yesterday that Barry Bonds shirt size ballooned from 42″ to 52″, his shoe size grew from 10 1/2 to 13, and his hat size went from a 7 1/8 to 7 3/4.

Ummm Yeah SirDoucheBag yet some how you fail to realize still that during those years from 90-99 he was voted as THE BEST, he was a top vote getter for MVP EVERY YEAR and did overall some of the best all around baseball of all time. You are stuck focusing on the years in which he did things that no one else has ever done, when he was literally the most dominate batter EVER. That was when he became larger then life and "unbelievable" yet no one else who has ever used drugs has ever come close to be that great, I wonder why

[SirTraps]

winning a few MVPs isnt when he "became larger than life" Dumbass, he became larger than life when he started hitting the sauce.

      Again, at age 35 he suddenly becomes an incredible homerun hitter and his shoe size goes from a 10 1/2 to a 13   hahahahha 


         

[MikeThaMachine]

winning a few MVPs isnt when he "became larger than life" Dumbass, he became larger than life when he started hitting the sauce.

      Again, at age 35 he suddenly becomes an incredible homerun hitter and his shoe size goes from a 10 1/2 to a 13   hahahahha 


        

Ummm Yeah SirDoucheBag yet some how you fail to realize still that during those years from 90-99 he was voted as THE BEST, he was a top vote getter for MVP EVERY YEAR and did overall some of the best all around baseball of all time. You are stuck focusing on the years in which he did things that no one else has ever done, when he was literally the most dominate batter EVER. That was when he became larger then life and "unbelievable" yet no one else who has ever used drugs has ever come close to be that great, I wonder why

Did you read my post correctly, I stated that you are focusing on the "steroid" years when he became larger then life and not giving notice to his already stellar and hall of fame worthy career.

[SirTraps]

He was a very good player, but not a player who would have ever..........ever sniffed the HR record without drugs.   Period.