Author Topic: 9/11- When is enough enough?  (Read 3604 times)

Al Doggity

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9/11- When is enough enough?
« on: September 01, 2007, 12:35:52 PM »
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/02/nyregion/02fatigue.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin


Again it comes, for the sixth time now — 2,191 days after that awful morning — falling for the first time on a Tuesday, the same day of the week.

Again there will be the public tributes, the tightly scripted memorial events, the reflex news coverage, the souvenir peddlers.

Is all of it necessary, at the same decibel level — still?

Each year, murmuring about Sept. 11 fatigue arises, a weariness of reliving a day that everyone wishes had never happened. It began before the first anniversary of the terrorist attack. By now, though, many people feel that the collective commemorations, publicly staged, are excessive and vacant, even annoying.

“I may sound callous, but doesn’t grieving have a shelf life?” said Charlene Correia, 57, a nursing supervisor from Acushnet, Mass. “We’re very sorry and mournful that people died, but there are living people. Let’s wind it down.”

Some people prefer to see things condensed to perhaps a moment of silence that morning and an end to the rituals like the long recitation of the names of the dead at ground zero.

But many others bristle at such talk, especially those who lost relatives on that day.

“The idea of scaling back just seems so offensive to me when you think of the monumental nature of that tragedy,” said Anita LaFond Korsonsky, whose sister Jeanette LaFond-Menichino died in the World Trade Center. “If you’re tired of it, don’t attend it; turn off your TV or leave town. To say six years is enough, it’s not. I don’t know what is enough.”

As the ragged nature of life pushes on, it is natural that the national fixation on an ominous event becomes ruptured and its anniversary starts to wear out. Once-indelible dates no longer even incite curiosity. On Feb. 15, how many turn backward to the sinking of the battleship Maine in 1898?

Few Americans give much thought anymore on Dec. 7 that Pearl Harbor was attacked in 1941 (the date to live in infamy). Similar subdued attention is paid to other scarring tragedies: the Kennedy assassination (Nov. 22, 1963), Kent State (May 4, 1970), the Oklahoma City bombing (April 19, 1995).

Generations, of course, turn over. Few are alive anymore who can recall June 15, 1904, when 1,021 people died in the burning of the steamer General Slocum, the deadliest New York City disaster until Sept. 11, 2001. Also, the weight of new wrenching events crowds the national memory. Already since Sept. 11, there have been Katrina and Virginia Tech. And people have their own more circumscribed agonies.

“Commemoration aims to simplify, but life as it’s lived and feelings as they’re felt are never simple,” said John Bodnar, a professor of history at Indiana University.

The Sept. 11 attack may well have an unusually long resonance. It was a watershed moment in the nation’s history. And it is a tragedy named after a date. But the way it is recalled is sure to undergo editing.

For the first time this year at ground zero, the main ceremony will not be at the trade center site. Because of construction, the families will be allowed to pass onto the ground only momentarily, but the ceremony will be shifted to nearby Zuccotti Park, at Broadway and Liberty Street — its moving on somewhat of a metaphor for the feelings of those who favor change.

Sept. 11, of course, remains complicated by its unfinished contours — continuing worry over terrorism, the war in Iraq, a presidential race in which candidates repeatedly invoke the day and its portents. Episodes like the fire at the vacant Deutsche Bank building stir up haunting memories. Books rooted in the attack continue to arrive.

Some people are troubled by what they see as others’ taking advantage of the event. “Six years later, we can see that a lot of people have used 9/11 for some gain,” said Matt Brosseau, 27, of Westfield, N.J. He sees the public tributes as “crassly corporatized and co-opted by false patriots.”

“Me personally, I wouldn’t involve myself in a public commemoration,” he said. “I don’t see the need for an official remembrance from the city or anyone else. In six years, is Minneapolis going to pay for something for the people who died in the bridge collapse?”

David Hendrickson, 56, a computer software trainer who lives in Manhattan, said he began being somewhat irritated by the attention to the commemoration on the third anniversary. “It seems a little much to me to still be talking about this six years later,” he said. “I understand it’s a sad thing. I understand it’s a tragedy. I’ve had my own share of tragedies — my uncle was killed in a tornado. But you get on. I have the sense that some people are living on their victimhood, which I find a little tiring.”

Mental health practitioners see a certain value in the growing fatigue.

“It’s a good sign when people don’t need an anniversary commemoration or demarcation,” said Charles R. Figley, the director of the Florida State University Traumatology Institute. “And it’s not disrespectful to those who died.”

Laurie Pearlman, a clinical psychologist in Massachusetts, said, “Our society has a very low tolerance for grief — it’s exhausting and unrelenting, and we don’t want to hear about it.”

Some of the relatives of those who died that day hold fast to the anniversary and are the most insistent that it not be dismantled.

Al Doggity

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #1 on: September 01, 2007, 12:36:57 PM »
(Page 2 of 2)

“I would no sooner tell survivors of the Holocaust how to mourn or how to commemorate their atrocity, so why do others feel they have any right to dictate how family members should feel or memorialize our loved ones on Sept. 11 or any day, for that matter?” said Nancy Nee, whose brother George Cain died in the attack. “Six years feels like the blink of an eye. That number means nothing to me.”

Ms. Korsonsky has not attended any of the ceremonies at ground zero, but she has watched them on television. “I always have a lot of friends who watch it and then call me and tell me they listened for my sister’s name. I can’t tell you how much that means to me. She’s remembered for that one instant. I’m just so afraid that she’ll be forgotten.”

But even family members diverge over what should or should not happen on this anniversary of death.

Lesli Rice, 26, who works in insurance and lost her mother, Eileen Rice, on Sept. 11, thinks something respectful should occur on the anniversary — a tolling of church bells or a moment of silence — but that otherwise the event should be scaled back. “The grieving part has to be more personal,” she said. “The whole city wasn’t affected by my mother’s death.”

A hairdresser’s question told Nikki Stern something about her own sensibilities. Ms. Stern lost her husband, James Potorti, in the collapsing towers. Two years ago, her hairdresser mentioned that she was planning to marry on Sept. 11. It was a Sunday, a day that worked best for all involved. She was grasping for guidance: Was that all right?

Ms. Stern suggested that if it was the most convenient day, fine, but perhaps a portion of the wedding gifts could go to some charity.

“I thought that it was completely cool,” she said. “The last thing my husband would have wanted was for everyone to lie down and die.”

“I still get so many letters from people that even I suffer from 9/11 fatigue to some extent,” she said. “People who don’t want to do anything on 9/11, they shouldn’t be forced to. I never thought I’d say that.”

Part of the problem with remembrances is that people are unsure what is expected of them, said Rachel Yehuda, a professor of psychiatry at the Mount Sinai School of Medicine. “People wonder, ‘How sad am I supposed to feel? What do you expect me to do, because possibly I’ve gotten over it,’ ” she said. “We have to figure out how to commemorate other people’s grief. It’s a generic question we haven’t answered that goes beyond 9/11.”

An organization called myGoodDeed.org was begun last year to urge people to do something nice for Sept. 11, and, if they want, to post it on its Web site. “We asked what should 9/11 be 20 or 30 years from now, and the big concern is that people will become tired of conventional ceremonies,” said David Paine, president of the organization.

Some 150,000 deeds were posted last year, with more than 40,000 intentions clocked so far this year. One person chose to put quarters in expired parking meters. Another is knitting socks for soldiers. A boy said he would help his mother around the house and not torment his siblings.

Where you were, your proximity to the attack — these things shade your tie to the anniversary. On Sept. 11, Jonathan Zimmerman, a professor of history and education at New York University, was crossing Washington Square in Greenwich Village and was approached by a panhandler, whom he brushed off. The panhandler then said, “The World Trade Center is on fire.”

Dr. Zimmerman didn’t even look. Not until he got to his office did he find out it was truth. “I now pay more attention to what homeless people say,” he said.

Dr. Zimmerman knows that the N.Y.U. dynamic is now different, the undergraduates who were there during the attack gone, supplanted largely by students who did not see it and whose feelings are thus likely to be more varied.

“I’m quite troubled about all this talk of 9/11 fatigue,” he said. “It’s true that commemorations can take on bombastic and ritualistic forms that trivialize them, but 9/11 is with us every day. Every political issue in our times is refracted through this event. I can understand why some people are sick of hearing about it, but they should get used to it.”

It seems likely that attention to the anniversary will ebb and flow. Events become artificially magnified during 10-year, 25-year, 50-year demarcations.

What might happen on Sept. 11 a hundred years from now? “It’s conceivable that it could be virtually forgotten,” said Dr. Bodnar, the history professor. “Does anyone go out on the streets of New York and commemorate the firing on Fort Sumter?”

kh300

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #2 on: September 01, 2007, 05:00:40 PM »
911 isn't about mourning over lost ones.. its about remembering how strong we were and how we came together.. its about people stepping up and becoming hero's. it will always be remembered as not only the worst time,,but one of the greatest times in american history. for a few months we weren't black or white, or democrate or republican -we were americans.

we were tested, and we past.. the fuckers tried(and are still trying) to stop the way we live.. when all they did was make us stronger.. i sure as hell will never forget.

Eyeball Chambers

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #3 on: September 01, 2007, 06:51:34 PM »
we were tested, and we past.. the fuckers tried(and are still trying) to stop the way we live.. when all they did was make us stronger.. i sure as hell will never forget.

We need a fair investigation of 9/11 to determine exactly who attacked us.

http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/topten/fugitives/laden.htm

No mention of 9/11?
S

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #4 on: September 01, 2007, 07:09:45 PM »
We need a fair investigation of 9/11 to determine exactly who attacked us.

http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/topten/fugitives/laden.htm

No mention of 9/11?
hahaha i saw that a few weeks back.

Eyeball Chambers

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #5 on: September 02, 2007, 12:31:50 AM »
Why did families of the Victims have to fight so hard for an investigation? 

In my opinion almost anyone that has researched the 9/11 Commission members will come to the conclusion that they all had conflicting interests.


S

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #6 on: September 02, 2007, 12:37:18 AM »
are you THAT CLUELESS?

The day before 911, DICK FUCKING CHANEY, BUSH'S RIGHT HAND BOY, became COMMANDER of   NORAD, AIR TRAFFIC SECURITY

norad were doing tests that day, AND HAD 4 FAILURES IN ONE DAY(9/11) whille the tradegy was happening

THE TOTAL FAILURE% FOR THE YEAR 2000 WAS ZERO

THEY MADE SURE THEM PPLANES HIT

IT MEANS PRELUDE TO WAR, IT MEANS PROFIT FOR INTERNATION BANKS,

BE STRONG

Quickerblade

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #7 on: September 02, 2007, 01:21:11 AM »
are you THAT CLUELESS?

The day before 911, DICK FUCKING CHANEY, BUSH'S RIGHT HAND BOY, became COMMANDER of   NORAD, AIR TRAFFIC SECURITY

norad were doing tests that day, AND HAD 4 FAILURES IN ONE DAY(9/11) whille the tradegy was happening

THE TOTAL FAILURE% FOR THE YEAR 2000 WAS ZERO

THEY MADE SURE THEM PPLANES HIT

IT MEANS PRELUDE TO WAR, IT MEANS PROFIT FOR INTERNATION BANKS,

BE STRONG
Thats all hearsay and bullshit and you know it.

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #8 on: September 02, 2007, 02:02:54 AM »
dick chaney is till this day commander of NORAD, all important decisions go through him FIRST

ill give you bullshit bro,

when the supposed PLANE hit the pentagon, there were THREE separate surveillance video's depicting WHAT EXACTLY WENT DOWN....


WHY DID THE FBI WITHHOLD THE VIDEOS FROM THE PUBLIC?

EVERYTHING IS ON THAT VIDEO, WHY WERE THEY CONFISCATED?

IF AN ACTUAL PLANE HIT THE PENTAGON, WHY NOT RELEASE THE VID SHOWING IT?

bro theres a fuckin myriad of evidence. you clueless sheep


Quickerblade

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #9 on: September 02, 2007, 02:04:42 AM »
dick chaney is till this day commander of NORAD, all important decisions go through him FIRST

ill give you bullshit bro,

when the supposed PLANE hit the pentagon, there were THREE separate surveillance video's depicting WHAT EXACTLY WENT DOWN....


WHY DID THE FBI WITHHOLD THE VIDEOS FROM THE PUBLIC?

EVERYTHING IS ON THAT VIDEO, WHY WERE THEY CONFISCATED?

IF AN ACTUAL PLANE HIT THE PENTAGON, WHY NOT RELEASE THE VID SHOWING IT?

bro theres a fuckin myriad of evidence. you clueless sheep


Ok...Im not smart enough to debate you on each point but i do know that 90% of what you wrote is pure crap.

Quickerblade

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #10 on: September 02, 2007, 02:08:20 AM »
cant stand these fuckers that blame Bush and the U.S government for everything, I dont really care that much for the Bush administration or any other administration, but you got to love these E-Journalist on message boards supply us with there nit-witted theories on what went down, when they dont know whats going on in there own lives..


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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #11 on: September 02, 2007, 02:25:59 AM »
Ok... Im not smart enough to debate you on each point but i do know that 90% of what you wrote is pure crap.

Eh, i'm done with you, naive, pessimistic, delusional idiot

bro what are you 30? im fuking 19years and it's pathetic the mindest of some of my elders, wait your not an edler,because
Quote
Im not smart enough
 

i guess this makes you my son,yea your my son now

get the fuck outta here with that jibberish you speak of, im no e journalist i have 50 posts

dont get mad because of your ignorance, do me a favor and enlist in the marines

Quickerblade

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #12 on: September 02, 2007, 02:30:41 AM »
Eh, i'm done with you, naive, pessimistic, delusional idiot

bro what are you 30? im fuking 19years and it's pathetic the mindest of some of my elders, wait your not an edler,because 

i guess this makes you my son,yea your my son now

get the fuck outta here with that jibberish you speak of, im no e journalist i have 50 posts

dont get mad because of your ignorance, do me a favor and enlist in the marines

after you enlist for spelling lessons Michael moore Jr and i'm actually 20..
Your just full of facts aren't you,  what do you think hit the pentagon you silly twat...A missile??? from where???? staff at the Sheraton, cars passing by witnessed a plane, but since you refer to internet geeks for reference it makes you right??? did you see a few minutes after the PLANE hit the pentagon they broadcast it on TV and the parts of the plane were visible ...Geez get off the government nuts you jack off..

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #13 on: September 02, 2007, 02:38:21 AM »
are you THAT CLUELESS?

The day before 911, DICK FUCKING CHANEY, BUSH'S RIGHT HAND BOY, became COMMANDER of   NORAD, AIR TRAFFIC SECURITY

norad were doing tests that day, AND HAD 4 FAILURES IN ONE DAY(9/11) whille the tradegy was happening

THE TOTAL FAILURE% FOR THE YEAR 2000 WAS ZERO

THEY MADE SURE THEM PPLANES HIT

IT MEANS PRELUDE TO WAR, IT MEANS PROFIT FOR INTERNATION BANKS,

BE STRONG

C-c-calm down! You're getting all p-p-paranoid and shit. b-b-bro.

Quickerblade

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #14 on: September 02, 2007, 02:40:01 AM »
Eh, i'm done with you, naive, pessimistic, delusional idiot

bro what are you 30? im fuking 19years and it's pathetic the mindest of some of my elders, wait your not an edler,because 

i guess this makes you my son,yea your my son now

get the fuck outta here with that jibberish you speak of, im no e journalist i have 50 posts

dont get mad because of your ignorance, do me a favor and enlist in the marines


please take one for your own benefit

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #15 on: September 02, 2007, 02:53:11 AM »
after you enlist for spelling lessons Michael moore Jr and i'm actually 20..
Your just full of facts aren't you,  what do you think hit the pentagon you silly twat...A missile??? from where???? staff at the Sheraton, cars passing by witnessed a plane, but since you refer to internet geeks for reference it makes you right??? did you see a few minutes after the PLANE hit the pentagon they broadcast it on TV and the parts of the plane were visible ...Geez get off the government nuts you jack off..

oh no the grammar police  :'(

bro if the plane really hit the pentagon, why did they keep the surveillance vids from us? whats your answer?

i can almost guarantee you live in the south, you sound like a true patronite. Are you a devout christian also? i guess you believe the earth has only existed for 12,000 years than huh? ::)

where do you get off calling me a geek bro?????????????

i happen to like my freedom, be prepared when they stick a chip in your spine,because they wont be putting one in minezzzzz 8)

Eyeball Chambers

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #16 on: September 02, 2007, 03:07:35 AM »
I'm not in the position to label anyone guilty for 9/11. 

You should reconsider your opinion on it though.  There are many many gigantic legitimate questions concerning 9/11.

Interesting site:
http://911research.wtc7.net/
S

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #17 on: September 02, 2007, 03:12:47 AM »
oh no the grammar police  :'(

bro if the plane really hit the pentagon, why did they keep the surveillance vids from us? whats your answer?

i can almost guarantee you live in the south, you sound like a true patronite. Are you a devout christian also? i guess you believe the earth has only existed for 12,000 years than huh? ::)

where do you get off calling me a geek bro?????????????

i happen to like my freedom, be prepared when they stick a chip in your spine,because they wont be putting one in minezzzzz 8)
ok lets put jokes aside...(i was just fucking around with you bro..But seriously)
I would be making up a lie if i knew why they kept the videos, maybe they didnt want to show the world how the Pentagon which is the US military Nerve centre got attacked??? I dont know, what do you think attacked it???
Im from NY i saw that shit happen.

Quickerblade

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #18 on: September 02, 2007, 03:13:48 AM »
I'm not in the position to label anyone guilty for 9/11. 

You should reconsider your opinion on it though.  There are many many gigantic legitimate questions concerning 9/11.





such as?

Eyeball Chambers

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #19 on: September 02, 2007, 03:39:01 AM »
such as?

Why did Ashcroft stop flying commercial, citing an unidentified "threat" in July 2001?
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2001/07/26/national/main303601.shtml

Why were there no photos or videos of the Pentagon plane?
I'm not claiming I know what happend, but lots of people estimate the most secure building in the world would have more than just one camera that would have been aimed in that direction on 9/11.  We know for a fact the FBI confiscated two of them from the gas station and hotel.  Why were we only allowed to see this:


There are hundreds more questions, we don't know much about 9/11.

If you're interested research it. 


S

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #20 on: September 02, 2007, 03:42:56 AM »
Why did Ashcroft stop flying commercial, citing an unidentified "threat" in July 2001?
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2001/07/26/national/main303601.shtml

Why were there no photos or videos of the Pentagon plane?
I'm not claiming I know what happend, but lots of people estimate the most secure building in the world would have more than just one camera that would have been aimed in that direction on 9/11.  We know for a fact the FBI confiscated two of them from the gas station and hotel.  Why were we only allowed to see this:


There are hundreds more questions, we don't know much about 9/11.

If you're interested research it. 



this shit is getting old..Seriously fuck it. I dont give a fuck if george bush used a remote control to crash the planes himself, its fucken old news...Entourage has one more episode this year then im gonna have to wait a year for a new season thats a real problem.

Eyeball Chambers

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #21 on: September 02, 2007, 03:48:03 AM »
this shit is getting old..Seriously fuck it. I dont give a fuck if george bush used a remote control to crash the planes himself, its fucken old news...Entourage has one more episode this year then im gonna have to wait a year for a new season thats a real problem.

It's OK, it might be to much for you to think about.  There are others that feel exactly like you do, go watch TV.

Thankfully the amount of Americans that are demanding answers is growing like wild fire now.  8)

S

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #22 on: September 02, 2007, 03:52:42 AM »
It's OK, it might be to much for you to think about.  There are others that feel exactly like you do.  Thankfully the amount of people asking questions is growing like wild fire now.  8)


I really think people are over it, the ones that continue asking questions are lunatics and losers on message boards, i never hear of this shit in real social setiings, if your spouse, parent died in that tragic event i can understand the greif but its been 6years for crying out loud, stop living in the past and think ahead

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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #23 on: September 02, 2007, 04:35:49 AM »
I really think people are over it, the ones that continue asking questions are lunatics and losers on message boards, i never hear of this shit in real social setiings, if your spouse, parent died in that tragic event i can understand the greif but its been 6years for crying out loud, stop living in the past and think ahead

bro, think ahead? 9/11 was the catalyst for the war we're in now. Operation liberty shield. Without 9/11,bush would have no reason to go into iraq, now that he's there, what does he want- OIL

without 9/11, do you really think congress would push for war?no. There would be no reason to.

It's fucking pathetic how naive people WANT TO BE.


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Re: 9/11- When is enough enough?
« Reply #24 on: September 02, 2007, 04:40:51 AM »
bro, think ahead? 9/11 was the catalyst for the war we're in now. Operation liberty shield. Without 9/11,bush would have no reason to go into iraq, now that he's there, what does he want- OIL

without 9/11, do you really think congress would push for war?no. There would be no reason to.

It's fucking pathetic how naive people WANT TO BE.


everything is bout Oil man, had U.S not taking control of it then Iran would of...