DNA pioneer's theory: Africans are less intelligent than Westerners

[Al Doggity]

earth to getbig earth to getbig. This is true many Harvard psychologists came to this conclusion back in the 60's and wrote books on it.

Some people's names you may recognize that have suggested such: Darwin, Piaget, Jung, Locke.....

I think you failed to grasp the science in it, they have done such studies and those of latino, and african decent usually fall 25 standard deviations below the sample population, .

What? Most iq classifications only contain 8 standard deviations.

[placeboeffect]

saw this in an RSS feed.

Just to clear up this misconception, this is not the same as the fast sprinter theory.  What that really refers to is a sub group of west africans with higher than standard fast twitch muscle fibers (not all africans).   It would not be possible to measure intelligence in this same way, there are an infinite amount of variables and the brain and cognition are simply a more complex and dynamic issue.

If you do your research, African Immigrants in the United States are actually the highest achieving immigrant group, above even Asians and significantly above African Americans.   This seems to suggest the explanation is easier found in culture and social class.

[Dos Equis]

'Race row' Nobel winner suspended     

LONDON, England (CNN) -- Nobel laureate biologist James Watson was suspended Friday from his longtime post at a research laboratory and canceled his planned British book tour after controversial comments that black people are not as intelligent as white people.

James Watson won the 1962 Nobel prize for discovering the structure of DNA.

Watson has apologized for the controversial remarks.

He failed to appear to a book signing at a London bookshop Friday afternoon, and organizers of his planned Sunday evening talk at Newcastle's Center for Life said they had been informed Watson would not appear because he was already on a flight home to the States.

The board of trustees at New York's Cold Spring Harbor Laboratory, which Watson has led for nearly four decades, said they had suspended his administrative responsibilities pending a review of his comments.

Watson, 79, an American who won the 1962 Nobel prize for his role in discovering the double-helix structure of DNA, apologized Thursday for his remarks -- but not before London's Science Museum canceled his talk there, planned for Friday evening.

The museum said Watson's words had "gone beyond the point of acceptable debate."

The controvery began with an October 14 interview Watson gave to the Sunday Times, which quoted him saying he was "inherently gloomy about the prospect of Africa" because "all our social policies are based on the fact that their intelligence is the same as ours, whereas all the testing says not really."

Watson also asserted there was no reason to believe different races separated by geography should have evolved identically, and he said that while he hoped everyone was equal, "people who have to deal with black employees find this is not true."

The biologist apologized "unreservedly" Thursday for his comments and said he was "mortified" by the words attributed to him.

"I cannot understand how I could have said what I am quoted as having said," Watson said during an appearance at the Royal Society in London. "I can certainly understand why people, reading those words, have reacted in the ways that they have."

"To all those who have drawn the inference from my words that Africa, as a continent, is somehow genetically inferior, I can only apologize unreservedly. That is not what I meant. More importantly from my point of view, there is no scientific basis for such a belief."

. . .

http://www.cnn.com/2007/TECH/science/10/19/uk.race/index.html

[Parker]

This was the purpose of my asking this question. None of these objectives will be accomplished
with studies
in this area and a definitive answer could never be reached. Just anecdotally, it's apparent that there are many blacks who are smarter than many whites.


Even in the example you cited, scientific data  confirming a lower iq among Africans wouldn't really have a practical application.


And I don't see how you've come to the conclusion that the guy's credentials are "impeccable". Just reading that article, it looks like he's a guy who has some pretty wacky opinions and thinks
his
accomplishments give those opinions undeserved credence. Did you read his comment about melanin and sex drive? Why doesn't this apply to middle easterners, who are often just as swarthy as latinos?

The man is 79 years old, and has that "Good Old Boy's" or Colonial mentality. Many his age still have those thoughts, it was fixed from his early days. You have to understand, some people only know what they know, and never get out of that box. You know, he probably still wears boxers with hearts on them, and thinks women aren't supposed to drive. And being a scientist, many only know science and not common sense, nor how to socialize, only dealing with each other, especially  at his age.

You find the same mentality in the AM South, where guys his age still refer to blacks as n iggers, and these are the ones who are taking care of these old folks.

As far as making all women pretty, notice he said women, chances are dude, wasn't a looker himself, but attractive-ness is about symmetry. The more symmetrical the face the the attractive the person, male or female, is. There was some Hollywood study and many women across all races and backgrounds, thought that Denzel Washington had the most symmetrical face. I don't see it, but hey  .

If he wanted to have a propensity for attractive women, He should have checked Brazil . But I'm willing to bet, this dude, has done his share sowing his oats with Indian and black women, cause many who make those comments, usually are the ones dabbling---He just told on himself    

[xxxLinda]

at his age.
\
 He should have checked Brazil . But I'm willing to bet, this dude, has done his share sowing his oats with Indian and black women, cause many who make those comments, usually are the ones dabbling---He just told on himself    

Or California (I thought that was where they manufactured young good looking blonde bimbos?


Anyways, they cancelled his gig, due to public condemnation


we Brits said oy mate, get real, get outta here.

...but on the other hand, he probably only came here to sell his autobiography and he will now have even better publicity?




TOPIC: Dr.Watson banned for telling awful truth

Dr Watson was due to arrive in Britain to promote his new book
The Science Museum has cancelled a talk it was due to host by a geneticist, after he claimed black people were less intelligent than white people.
Dr James Watson, who won the Nobel Prize for his part in discovering the structure of DNA, was due to speak at the venue on Friday.

But the museum has cancelled the event, saying Dr Watson's views go "beyond the point of acceptable debate".

Dr Watson was due to arrive in Britain on Friday for a speaking tour.

In an interview with The Sunday Times, the 79-year-old said he was "inherently gloomy about the prospect of Africa" because "all our social policies are based on the fact that their intelligence is the same as ours - whereas all the testing says not really".

He went on to say he hoped everyone was equal but that "people who have to deal with black employees find this is not true".

A spokesman for the Science Museum said: "We know that eminent scientists can sometimes say things that cause controversy and the Science Museum does not shy away from debating controversial topics.

"However, we feel Dr Watson has gone beyond the point of acceptable debate and we are as a result cancelling his talk."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/7050020.stm
_________________

[Tre]

Well, my DNA is superior to his, so there. 

[dorkeroo]

Well, my DNA is superior to his, so there. 

My dad's DNA could beat up your dad's DNA 

[Parker]

My dad's DNA could beat up your dad's DNA 

Fight, Fight...Fight in the Downstairs lab!!

[younggunz]

u jackass's, its really simple! its all about how you are raised and the environment you are surrounded by. if you took a baby black/Latino.etc and raised them in a wealthy culture (private school, collage etc) and surrounded them by intelligent people guess what! most ppl are a product of their enviroment and to be honest if u did go by test scores and stats and what not, ya black ppl and Latinos, etc would def be lower on the intellect scale because of the environment and yes its that simple.

[Nordic Superman]

u jackass's, its really simple! its all about how you are raised and the environment you are surrounded by. if you took a baby black/Latino.etc and raised them in a wealthy culture (private school, collage etc) and surrounded them by intelligent people guess what! most ppl are a product of their enviroment and to be honest if u did go by test scores and stats and what not, ya black ppl and Latinos, etc would def be lower on the intellect scale because of the environment and yes its that simple.

No it's not that simple.

[Dos Equis]

No it's not that simple.

Actually, it is pretty much that simple.  Your environment plays a huge role.  For example, put Obama in rural Waianae High School as the child of drug addicted parents, instead of the child of college professor parents who sent him to Punahou (arguably best high school in the state) and it is highly likely we are not talking about him today. 

But let's assume that race dictates IQ.  What difference would that make to our society?   

[Nordic Superman]

Actually, it is pretty much that simple.  Your environment plays a huge role.  For example, put Obama in rural Waianae High School as the child of drug addicted parents, instead of the child of college professor parents who sent him to Punahou (arguably best high school in the state) and it is highly likely we are not talking about him today. 

But let's assume that race dictates IQ.  What difference would that make to our society?   

No it's not that simple.

Obama is a terrible example as a control to this experiment considering he is half white.

[Parker]

Actually, it is pretty much that simple.  Your environment plays a huge role.  For example, put Obama in rural Waianae High School as the child of drug addicted parents, instead of the child of college professor parents who sent him to Punahou (arguably best high school in the state) and it is highly likely we are not talking about him today. 

But let's assume that race dictates IQ.  What difference would that make to our society? 

If Race dictated IQ, then there would be no inteeligent black kids, and no dumb white kids. And if a black kid was intellignet, it was due to the fact that he some white in him...much like what people said in the South. Supposedly WEB DuBois was intelligent because he was a Mulatto, but it doesn't explain how Benjamin Banneker was intelligent as well.

[Dos Equis]

No it's not that simple.

Obama is a terrible example as a control to this experiment considering he is half white.

Obama is a great example, because our country is full of mixed race people.  This is actually one of the problems with race-based statistics.

[Nordic Superman]

What you're suggesting is that there is zero genetic differences in intelligence in relation to different races.

This as I see it is an impossibility.

[Dos Equis]

If Race dictated IQ, then there would be no inteeligent black kids, and no dumb white kids. And if a black kid was intellignet, it was due to the fact that he some white in him...much like what people said in the South. Supposedly WEB DuBois was intelligent because he was a Mulatto, but it doesn't explain how Benjamin Banneker was intelligent as well.

Also, if certain groups are genetically inferior, wouldn't this support things like race-based affirmative action?  

[Parker]

No it's not that simple.

Obama is a terrible example as a control to this experiment considering he is half white.

So, you say, because he is "half white", therefore he is more intelligent? That's what the ignorant white southern said during the time of Jim Crow.  Read my post above.

.

[Dos Equis]

What you're suggesting is that there is zero genetic differences in intelligence in relation to different races.

This as I see it is an impossibility.

That's exactly what I'm suggesting.  Dude I have been around too many smart and dumb people of all races, including mixed race people, to believe intelligence is race-based.  You really see it in a place like here, which is about as diverse as you can get anywhere in the U.S.  

[Nordic Superman]

I'm not saying a particular race is more intelligent than another. But to say there's no difference in the DNA which specifies our intelligence in race to race comparisons just appears to be a statistical improbability considering the size of our genome.

[Parker]

Also, if certain groups are genetically inferior, wouldn't this support things like race-based affirmative action? 

No, if Aff. action is a bandaid for a problem that bigger than just "getting a leg up". It has to be a change of culture for black americans. Black Americans have a huge inferiority compleex, that was built on them being told that they were nothing, and that anything resembling doing well was "being white". After you are told for hundreds of years that you ain't shit, and after the physical shackles are off, mental "shackles" are still on.

Because blacks have let themselves be defined by stereotypes, or what other say they are, they are in turn letting others to define them. If they break that cycle and actually believe that that are "something", which it has shown in various individuals like B. Banneker among others, and create an environment for not just learning, but athletics as well, blacks will shine.

[Dos Equis]

I'm not saying a particular race is more intelligent than another. But to say there's no difference in the DNA which specifies our intelligence in race to race comparisons just appears to be a statistical improbability considering the size of our genome.

But isn't that what science has told us?  That there are no differences between races in terms of DNA? 

[Dos Equis]

No, if Aff. action is a bandaid for a problem that bigger than just "getting a leg up". It has to be a change of culture for black americans. Black Americans have a huge inferiority compleex, that was built on them being told that they were nothing, and that anything resembling doing well was "being white". After you are told for hundreds of years that you ain't shit, and after the physical shackles are off, mental "shackles" are still on.

Because blacks have let themselves be defined by stereotypes, or what other say they are, they are in turn letting others to define them. If they break that cycle and actually believe that that are "something", which it has shown in various individuals like B. Banneker among others, and create an environment for not just learning, but athletics as well, blacks will shine.

I'm not making an argument in favor of race-based affirmative action.  I'm just pointing how those who believe certain races are genetically inferior help make the case for those who support race-based affirmative action. 

I actually think things like affirmative action should be income based and should be unrelated to race.  Several years ago I read a book called "The Big Picture" by Dr. Ben Carson, arguably the world's leading neurosurgeon who happens to be black.  He believes race-based affirmative action should be scrapped and replaced with assistance to those from disadvantaged backgrounds.  I tend to agree.   

[Parker]

I'm not making an argument in favor of race-based affirmative action.  I'm just pointing how those who believe certain races are genetically inferior help make the case for those who support race-based affirmative action. 

I actually think things like affirmative action should be income based and should be unrelated to race.  Several years ago I read a book called "The Big Picture" by Dr. Ben Carson, arguably the world's leading neurosurgeon who happens to be black.  He believes race-based affirmative action should be scrapped and replaced with assistance to those from disadvantaged backgrounds.  I tend to agree.   

Yes, Dr. Ben Carson, He spoke at my sister's college graduation. He is off the meter. Since he is a Marylander,  we often get many stories about him on TV. I'm starting to agree as well.

[Nordic Superman]

But isn't that what science has told us?  That there are no differences between races in terms of DNA? 

References? Skin colour alone is a difference that is determined by DNA.

[Dos Equis]

References? Skin colour alone is a difference that is determined by DNA.

"Biological differences among races do not exist, WU research shows":  http://record.wustl.edu/archive/1998/10-15-98/articles/races.html 
I've read numerous articles like this over the years. 

Skin color is determined by melanin and I'm unaware of any relationship between melanin and intelligence.