Author Topic: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....  (Read 5943 times)

Zach Trowbridge

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #50 on: October 27, 2007, 11:49:04 AM »
I prefer to call it functional fitness

For those people that are just everyday people....they need functional (or useable) fitness that can be applied to everyday living.

Benchpresses, squats, deadlifts, etc...wouldn't be ideal for most

True, but neither is a single-leg stiff-leg deadllift done on a half balance ball.  Hardly something duplicated often in everyday lift.

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #51 on: October 27, 2007, 11:56:13 AM »
!

knny187

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #52 on: October 27, 2007, 11:56:56 AM »
True, but neither is a single-leg stiff-leg deadllift done on a half balance ball.  Hardly something duplicated often in everyday lift.

Well....I wouldn't see the benfit of that for anyone.....

but everyone has very different gaols or what they want to achieve

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #53 on: October 27, 2007, 12:01:42 PM »
I usually don't include any core training in my clients programs
unless they ask for it.
Most just want to lose fat or get bigger.

Still most office worker weaklings should strengthen their core area
to make everyday life easier.

I mostly teach core movements to people that are trying to
improve their athletic performance.


Bigger Business

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #54 on: October 27, 2007, 07:22:36 PM »
Ok, serious question to those who think that "core" or core training is BS.......Why do you think that way and more so, why do you think that some of the methods used in core training is BS??

'Core' training is like dude said...simply a buzz word. The exercise balls greatest achievement was giving personal trainers some variety in programing sessions for their clients nothing more. It has no more benefit than any other exercise.

When I was a personal trainer I used the exercise balls to help housewives learn to squat by putting it against a wall because they were too stupid to understand simple instructions. I would also line up half a dozen then run, jump and slide across the top of them...which I'm convinced has not aided my core stability, though it's a sweet trick.

That being said, I am a firm believer that any exercise is better than no exercise so if it gets them off their asses, power to the balls


HowieW

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #55 on: October 27, 2007, 07:36:54 PM »
So today im round my brothers and his Girlfriend tells me she wants this machine, I ask which and she says its a machine you sit on, it moves one way and you have to move the other, "woking your core and its great for toning the legs and stomach".WTH does this mean, I have always taken the core to mean abs and lower back, where did this stupid thing come in about "THE CORE", it seems like a byword now for people who dont know shit about fitness but want to sound like they do.Also "toning", people who use it have no idea what it means, like these machines are some miracle spot reducers of Bodyfat.She also has a swiss ball.Her main concern is losing fat.How do I tell her she needs to eat healthy, drop her daily calories quite dramatically and do some cardio?Also how do I explain the core was invented by personal trainer who had no money and wanted to train people at home so they invented a "swiss ball" to work "the core" beause its cheap  ::)
Great thread!

To my fellow citizens of GET BIG. I would like to put forward the following get board legislation to be voted on by us the gen board members and singed into law by Pres Ron.

The term of "core" shall be banned from use on this board, as its use refers to a lack of any and all real knowledge of genuine bodybuilding training. The use of this term give me the same feeling as nails on a blackboard.
 :Paddendum rider on this legislation- The topic of swiss balls be banned as well except for the purpose of farting on them or throwing them at any "trainer" that uses the term "core".
Kelly Ryan married well!  Free Titus!

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #56 on: October 27, 2007, 07:57:29 PM »
Ok guys, people answered me, but no one actually gave me the answer I was looking for, I know the answer to my own question, but no one on here seems to understand the answer I'm looking for. So lets try again. I want someone on here to give a an actual reason as to WHY you think specific core training is either "gay" or not necessary. MUIRVSE said "because squatting and deadlifts are enough" which is complete BS. Knny said because it's "functional fitness that might pertain to everyday life" which is completly true, exept for one thing, it also play one of the most major parts in the training of athletes.

Now, I'll ask again (and I would like a specific answer instead of just "it's gay" ::). Please, lets not turn this thread into a shitfest. I love subjects like this and discussing functional-type training.

Bigger Business

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #57 on: October 27, 2007, 08:17:30 PM »
I answered you Joe, but your question isn't very specific...cept you used the term "BS" a few times

...from what I can gather you have a different perspective of what 'core' training is. You're more about sports functionality and balance. Lets say you have a client that wants to be better at golf for example you lay them on the ball and mimic a swing. thats all well and good, but frankly there is no better sports specific training then actually performing what it is you are trying to improve or achieve aka hitting golf balls. I may be off track with what your after, if so please ask more specifically.

HTexan

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #58 on: October 27, 2007, 10:05:15 PM »

My PT has me doing a lot of swiss ball abs exercises, some with a medicine ball. As well as, a few no-weight leg exercises for "core" training. Is that ok?
A

Andre Nickatina

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #59 on: October 27, 2007, 10:33:22 PM »
Please define what the "core" is and what exactly it does. Please.

HTexan

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #60 on: October 27, 2007, 10:58:43 PM »
Please define what the "core" is and what exactly it does. Please.

I'm not a PT. But, i think it is your stabilizing muscles including your abs and lower back, right? One exercise he has me doing, goes like this. You lay on your back, with your heels on a swiss ball. Lift up your hips and curl your legs, in and out. Your feel it in your hamstrings and on your sides. Because you are keeping your trunk area tight. What do you think?
A

Andre Nickatina

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #61 on: October 27, 2007, 11:05:38 PM »
I think that's crazy stuff man, but if it works for you, by all means keep it up.

I feel doing a broad range of exercises and keeping your workouts consistant is enough to keep a strong "core"

wes

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #62 on: October 28, 2007, 05:36:04 AM »
Just work your abs and do hypers,deadlifts,good morning,squats,reverse-hypers,and you`ll have a fantastic "core" !!  :)

Back in the day we called it working abs and lower back/erectors.

I hate these "fitness" catch phrases.

knny187

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #63 on: October 28, 2007, 12:16:26 PM »
Ok guys, people answered me, but no one actually gave me the answer I was looking for, I know the answer to my own question, but no one on here seems to understand the answer I'm looking for. So lets try again. I want someone on here to give a an actual reason as to WHY you think specific core training is either "gay" or not necessary. MUIRVSE said "because squatting and deadlifts are enough" which is complete BS. Knny said because it's "functional fitness that might pertain to everyday life" which is completly true, exept for one thing, it also play one of the most major parts in the training of athletes.

Now, I'll ask again (and I would like a specific answer instead of just "it's gay" ::). Please, lets not turn this thread into a shitfest. I love subjects like this and discussing functional-type training.

what are you asking Joe

HowieW

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #64 on: October 28, 2007, 12:19:01 PM »
Just work your abs and do hypers,deadlifts,good morning,squats,reverse-hypers,and you`ll have a fantastic "core" !!  :)

Back in the day we called it working abs and lower back/erectors.

I hate these "fitness" catch phrases.

I agree it is an arguement over verbs , nouns and semantics. :'(
I am as scientific as anyone but look, the deal is to go in the gym and bustass on what you do.
Kelly Ryan married well!  Free Titus!

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #65 on: October 28, 2007, 01:09:26 PM »
what are you asking Joe

There is much more to the "core" than what people are posting on here. The "core" consists of many muscles besides what was mentioned on here, one of the main one's is the transverse and also in my opinion, the PSOAS, which has a direct correlation to low back weakness, pain and in some cases instability.





When you look at this diagram you can see where the psaos begins and ends, it actually starts at the "core" which includes lower lumbar and erector spinae. If the psoas of any part of the core is weak, especially the transverse abdominus (the muscle that basically holds you erect) your transfer of power will be tough. Example of "transfer of power" would be a baseball player, tennis player, quarter back. Lets take the baseball player, when a player is at bat, and swings, the "tranfer of power" begins at the ankles, then transfers to the hips, tranfers to the core, where the rotation of power is, then to the upper region. The bat speed comes from the "core".

MUVIRSE mentioned that Squats and deads were enough, again dead wrong, because very little of those smaller muscles are not getting worked or activated.
Also, you have phasic and tonic muscles, on muscles and off muscles, in my training wether with the general public or working with athletes, when we work the lower body or doing hip-dominant exercises, I have them go through a series of muscle activation exercises to turn those muscles "on" so they will fire correctly........glute are a good example of being an "off" muscle until activated. Activating the muscles not will help it fire more effeciantly, it also aids in preventing injuries.


knny187

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #66 on: October 28, 2007, 01:14:53 PM »
& the question?

The Coach

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #67 on: October 28, 2007, 01:26:23 PM »
go research some charles poliquin articles he can tell you why. or call you a moron either one.

Hey fuckhead, I'm getting pretty sick of your juvenile BS and name calling. Like Milos, Poliquin is good but he's not the be-all to end-all, everyone has different beliefs and THERORIES, I just believe mine makes more sense, you can have one person say one thing and one say another, it doesn't mean they are wrong. Tell me where I'm wrong in my post "know-it-all"??

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #68 on: October 28, 2007, 01:28:16 PM »
go research some charles poliquin articles he can tell you why. or call you a moron either one.

I read poliquin all the time, doesn't mean i have to agree with everything he says. Learn to think on your own, do your own research and draw your own conclusions.....but I don't think your capable of that. The majority of my off time is spent doing research on everyone and everything that pertains to my specialty!

The Coach

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #69 on: October 28, 2007, 01:35:32 PM »
& the question?

I guess my question is to give me something scientific on why core work is BS.

knny187

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #70 on: October 28, 2007, 01:49:04 PM »
Hey fuckhead, I'm getting pretty sick of your juvenile BS and name calling. Like Milos, Poliquin is good but he's not the be-all to end-all, everyone has different beliefs and THERORIES, I just believe mine makes more sense, you can have one person say one thing and one say another, it doesn't mean they are wrong. Tell me where I'm wrong in my post "know-it-all"??

It makes more sense for you & for you to teach to others....right?

This is why training is debatable.  I couldn't train someone like CHEK....that doesn't mean his theories are wrong....just wrong for me to teach someone else.


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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #71 on: October 28, 2007, 02:03:18 PM »
It makes more sense for you & for you to teach to others....right?
This is why training is debatable.  I couldn't train someone like CHEK....that doesn't mean his theories are wrong....just wrong for me to teach someone else.


During my Judo days Poliquin made me ingurgitate about 30g of fish oil shit until I literally shitted oil all over.

One "trainer" doesn't hold Gospel. Take what fits for you.

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #72 on: October 28, 2007, 04:18:49 PM »
MUVIRSE mentioned that Squats and deads were enough, again dead wrong, because very little of those smaller muscles are not getting worked or activated.
Also, you have phasic and tonic muscles, on muscles and off muscles, in my training wether with the general public or working with athletes, when we work the lower body or doing hip-dominant exercises, I have them go through a series of muscle activation exercises to turn those muscles "on" so they will fire correctly........glute are a good example of being an "off" muscle until activated. Activating the muscles not will help it fire more effeciantly, it also aids in preventing injuries.



Mind sharing some of these "activation exercises" that just cant be done any other way? Are you talking about static core positions? Stretching or yoga of sorts? Elaborate please.

muscleforlife

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #73 on: October 28, 2007, 06:47:53 PM »
because core training is best done by heavy squatting and deadlifts.  :)

Even though the name of this board is


GETBIG
that is not the goal of everyone who steps into a gym, whether an Apollon Gym(basic) to an LA
Fitness(pretty, shiny machines)

Some people can no longer deadlift, hyper extend or squat.  Weight on the upper shoulders, overextending the rotator cuffs are a no no.
A swiss ball or wall squat helps keep the hip, knees, feet in alignment for a proper squat.

I am now getting serious lifters coming to me to stretch them out.  Lower back/hamstring. shoulders/traps, midback, quads are all tight.

Warming up before you jump into the weights is a good thing. 5 minutes to stretch or on a cardio machine works wonders.
Dynamically stretch the spine and trunk.  Stretch the quads, hips/hipflexors, hamstrings, shoulder girdle. calves/shins, biceps, tricep, neck extensors and flexors.

as you get older, your body will thank you.
Sandra

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Re: Lets Discuss "THE CORE"....
« Reply #74 on: October 28, 2007, 07:32:54 PM »
Even though the name of this board is


GETBIG
that is not the goal of everyone who steps into a gym, whether an Apollon Gym(basic) to an LA
Fitness(pretty, shiny machines)

Some people can no longer deadlift, hyper extend or squat.  Weight on the upper shoulders, overextending the rotator cuffs are a no no.
A swiss ball or wall squat helps keep the hip, knees, feet in alignment for a proper squat.

I am now getting serious lifters coming to me to stretch them out.  Lower back/hamstring. shoulders/traps, midback, quads are all tight.

Warming up before you jump into the weights is a good thing. 5 minutes to stretch or on a cardio machine works wonders.
Dynamically stretch the spine and trunk.  Stretch the quads, hips/hipflexors, hamstrings, shoulder girdle. calves/shins, biceps, tricep, neck extensors and flexors.

as you get older, your body will thank you.
Sandra

Translation :People are coming to me who have fallen for the new "secret" to fitness and Im more than willing to rob them of their money for no physical gain on their part.