Author Topic: War On Democracy  (Read 1684 times)

Hugo Chavez

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War On Democracy
« on: December 05, 2007, 12:12:07 AM »
The War On Democracy by John Pilger (stickied for a few days)
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3739500579629840148&q

I don't know why people get so bent out of shape that I would be supportive of Hugo Chavez.  We all know full well that those who support him in America are a very small minority and in the major media, there is not one single person that I'm aware of that gives us a perspective from the other side.  So what's the big deal about lone Berserker bringing a leftwing viewpoint on the subject to this board?  Several times I’ve been told that if I like him so much, I should just move there?

What we have here is something entirely lacking in our failed national media. Once upon a time we expected to be given the full story in which people would take it, weigh it and form an opinion.  That is so often not what we're given today.  What does it mean to be an informed citizen?  Does it mean only hearing one side of things and taking it as gospel?  Or does it mean having all the information available then forming an opinion?  Why is it important in a democracy to be well informed and to have ALL the information? Loco brought up John Pilger’s mention that some liberties have been taken away from Venezuelans.  So I post his full documentary so that the full story of John’s words on this topic may be heard.

Like it or not, America has intervened and continues to do so in governments throughout Central and South America which means that if we have a true interest in being fully informed, we need to hear the full story.  This is our tax dollars being spent in the name of National Security Interests throughout Latin America, hell yes it’s our business as citizens to care what’s going on and why…  There is the story as heard thought CNN/Fox/MSNBC/CBS/ABC and then there is another side of the story not heard on the networks.

Mars

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #1 on: December 05, 2007, 05:35:53 AM »
Thanks for your input and the video. good stuff.

Hugo Chavez

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2007, 10:57:03 AM »
This documentary is gold, pure gold...

I love that Pilger is able to get these CIA guys to admit they don't give two shits about democracy and none of their goals in the Latin world have been about democracy.

Absolute gold is Pilger getting a Jack Nickelson style "You want the truth, you can't handle the truth" meltdown from CIA Chief Duane Clarridge in which he goes on to justify actions taken at the expense of democracy...

classic gold ;D

Hedgehog

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2007, 02:46:14 AM »
John Pilger is an incredible journalist.

Very competent, his book Hidden Agendas is an awesome read, he disclosed the Tony Blair-Rupert Murdoch connection in all its rotten existence.
As empty as paradise

MB_722

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2008, 12:51:02 AM »
finally watching this Doc. now :)


Deicide

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2008, 02:19:08 AM »
Fuck Democracy, just mob rule in a sports coat.
I hate the State.

headhuntersix

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2008, 08:25:50 AM »
You're kidding me right..another Leftist nutbag. It’s almost unbelievable what the liberal mind can come up with. John Pilger’s articles are akin to someone writing about a rapist being the victim of the Woman that the rapist raped.


TONY JONES: John Pilger, do you still maintain that the world depends on what you call "the Iraqi resistance" to inflict a military defeat on the coalition forces?
JOHN PILGER: Well, certainly, historically, we've always depended on resistances to get rid of occupiers, to get rid of invaders. And what we have in Iraq now is I suppose the equivalent of a kind of Vichy Government being set up. And a resistance is always atrocious, it's always bloody. It always involves terrorism.
You can imagine if Australia was occupied by the Japanese during the Second World War the kind of resistance there would have been, and so on. We've seen that all over the world. Now, I think the situation in Iraq is so dire that unless the United States is defeated there that we're likely to see an attack on Iran, we're likely to see an attack on North Korea and all the way down the road it could be even an attack on China within a decade, so I think what happens in Iraq now is incredibly important.


Your admiring a guy who hopes America looses..he's always said this...I hope he gets cancer and dies...

This is not Journalism..its Liberal bullshit at its finest.
L

calmus

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2008, 10:20:51 AM »
John Pilger’s articles are akin to someone writing about a rapist being the victim of the Woman that the rapist raped.




Huh?  ???

headhuntersix

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2008, 12:40:15 PM »
Good..bye..anyway this guy has been around along time and i was kinda surprised one of u libs had'nt quoted him earlier..he's been on the America is the bad guy bandwagon for years....This guy would rather see the US fail and fall apart..I've got shit tons of this nutjobs' articles saved..google this prick. I kinda wish he'd get shot so yeah...sure whatever. If ur looking for fair and balaced..ur not getting it here. This might be the worst example of it.
L

headhuntersix

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2008, 08:14:05 AM »
The film trailer already makes clear that this is not a serious documentary but rather a propaganda film for what is currently (apart from Cuba) the most undemocratic and repressive regime in Latin America. U can debate the long history of US interventions against both democratic and undemocratic governments in the region. But as far as Venezuela goes, it is not the US president who has declared "war on democracy" but the self-styled "revolutionary leader" Hugo Chavez. Those in doubt should consult the latest reports from Human Rights Watch or Amnesty International about this country. Neither of these bodies paints Chavez and his workers paradise in a wonderful light...but I would imagine only when they attack gitmo are they to be believed right?
L

Hugo Chavez

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #10 on: February 07, 2008, 08:31:49 AM »
John Pilger is an incredible journalist.

Very competent, his book Hidden Agendas is an awesome read, he disclosed the Tony Blair-Rupert Murdoch connection in all its rotten existence.
Well said Hedgehog.  He's indeed a highly honored and dedicated journalist fighting to uncover truth in the democratic fashion.  Only a Nazi would flip out at the work done by John.  Luckly there isn't many Nazis around these days. :)

Awards of John Pilger

Descriptive Writer of the Year (1966)
Reporter of the Year (1967)
Journalist of the Year (1967)
International Reporter of the Year (1970)
News Reporter of the Year (1974)
Campaigning Journalist of the Year (1977)
Journalist of the Year (1979)
UN Media Peace Prize, Australia (1979 – 80)
UN Media Peace Prize – Gold Medal, Australia (1980 – 81)
TV Times Readers' Award (1979)
The George Foster Peabody Award, USA (1990)
American Television Academy Award ('Emmy') (1991)
British Academy of Film and Television Arts (BAFTA) – The Richard Dimbleby Award (1991)
Reporters Sans Frontiers Award, France (1990)
International de Television Geneve Award (1995)
The Monismanien Prize, Sweden (2001)
The Sophie Prize for Human Rights, Norway (2003)
EMMA Media Personality of the Year (2003)
Royal Television Society – Best British Documentary for Stealing a Nation (2004)

Hugo Chavez

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #11 on: February 07, 2008, 08:34:10 AM »
Huh?  ???
trust me, don't ask.  No telling what was in his mind ::)

headhuntersix

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #12 on: February 07, 2008, 08:38:33 AM »
He's a leftist nutjob....well respected by the leftist media maybe.  I am seriously surprised that Pilger is still seen as a remotely credible commentator. In the last decade or so he has majorly gone out into lala land and yet he keeps appearing in supposedly reputable print and TV. Why? Is it sheer force of habit? Dosn't this leftist fuckwad realise what damage he does to his cause any time he appears in front of an appauled public to laude child-killers, car-bombers and fascist dictators in the name of pretend concern for their victims? These days Pilger is seriously nuts. I wonder how long it's going to take for the shit-for-brains press to catch on?

L

headhuntersix

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #13 on: February 07, 2008, 08:41:01 AM »
Pilger would love the Nazis, i don't think he's met a dictator he hasn't liked...all they have to do is hate the US.
L

Hugo Chavez

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2008, 08:47:16 AM »
He's a leftist nutjob....well respected by the leftist media maybe.  I am seriously surprised that Pilger is still seen as a remotely credible commentator. In the last decade or so he has majorly gone out into lala land and yet he keeps appearing in supposedly reputable print and TV. Why? Is it sheer force of habit? Dosn't this leftist fuckwad realise what damage he does to his cause any time he appears in front of an appauled public to laude child-killers, car-bombers and fascist dictators in the name of pretend concern for their victims? These days Pilger is seriously nuts. I wonder how long it's going to take for the shit-for-brains press to catch on?


Do you have a serious refutation to the material he presents? Specifics please!!! otherwise STFU.  Your rightwing crybaby fest is growing old.  You've provided ZERO against any point he's made in this documentary or any of the work he's done so all I see is a spazing rightwing fool.

headhuntersix

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #15 on: February 07, 2008, 08:54:49 AM »
He doesn't present facts..he attacks the US, the US military and anything he feels isn't fair...do u have any facts supporting him. I bet u never even heard of this guy until u found this "documentary" He's been a leftwing nutjob for years....

quote - "With the most lethal weapons that billions of dollars can buy, and the threats of their cowboy generals and the panic-stricken brutality of their foot soldiers, more than 120,000 of these invaders have ripped up the fabric of a nation that survived the years of Saddam Hussein, just as they oversaw the destruction of its artefacts"

Iraqi workmen and American soldiers cleared out debris by the truckload. They swept, scrubbed, rewired and filled the wide halls with the smell of fresh paint. As completion of the project neared, local artists submitted their work to be displayed in the reborn museum. The 173rd commissioned a Kirkuk sculptor to produce a centerpiece for the courtyard and the grand opening was slated to coincide with the onset of Ramadan.
On Oct. 23, the museum opened to a jubilant throng of proud citizens. The sculpture was unveiled, speeches were made and the old Ottoman structure was baptized by the tears of people who had not walked through its doors for 30 years...London Times article

Cowboy Generals and the panic stricken brutality of their soldiers...need I remind u that these are ur countrymen..or are ua citizen of the world ::)




L

Hugo Chavez

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #16 on: February 07, 2008, 09:14:24 AM »
He doesn't present facts..he attacks the US, the US military and anything he feels isn't fair...do u have any facts supporting him. I bet u never even heard of this guy until u found this "documentary" He's been a leftwing nutjob for years....

quote - "With the most lethal weapons that billions of dollars can buy, and the threats of their cowboy generals and the panic-stricken brutality of their foot soldiers, more than 120,000 of these invaders have ripped up the fabric of a nation that survived the years of Saddam Hussein, just as they oversaw the destruction of its artefacts"

Iraqi workmen and American soldiers cleared out debris by the truckload. They swept, scrubbed, rewired and filled the wide halls with the smell of fresh paint. As completion of the project neared, local artists submitted their work to be displayed in the reborn museum. The 173rd commissioned a Kirkuk sculptor to produce a centerpiece for the courtyard and the grand opening was slated to coincide with the onset of Ramadan.
On Oct. 23, the museum opened to a jubilant throng of proud citizens. The sculpture was unveiled, speeches were made and the old Ottoman structure was baptized by the tears of people who had not walked through its doors for 30 years...London Times article

Cowboy Generals and the panic stricken brutality of their soldiers...need I remind u that these are ur countrymen..or are ua citizen of the world ::)





First of all you stupid fucking twit, you do not know me.  I have known about John Pilger for a long time and I've even posted his material here before!  Unlike you, I have a genuine interest in politics.  I don't lock onto Fox News all day long.  I consume this shit all day long from many sources.  I have even read that twit Rush Limbaugh's books to try and get where he comes from.  So don't pretend to know me, you fucking don't.  John Pilger is a good journalist.  Even with the source you provide against him, it's in typical defensive fashion of a rightwing delusional douche.  In that this conflict wasn't needed one bit, in that they were warned by generals who were let go that they would need more troops to invade, generals who calculated these kind of things and were dismissed for it!  SO IN THAT THEY IGNORED THIS They ARE responsible for the plundering of the museums and the unraveling of a Nation!!!  DEAL ASSHOLE.  FUCKING PERIOD, JOHN IS RIGHT ON THE GODDAMED MONEY BUBBA.

headhuntersix

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #17 on: February 07, 2008, 09:22:43 AM »
Deal with it..ur melting in down and as usual calling people names. He's a leftist nut..deal with it..ur ,melting down...I don't hink I've ever seen u post where u don't end up swearing and calling people names....WAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA.
L

headhuntersix

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #18 on: February 07, 2008, 09:30:44 AM »
Besides u will need all ur strength to fend off our attacks as Obama and or Hil screw up the country even more then Bush has, over the next 4 years. I imagine ol' Johnny boy will have to go into semi-retirement since a new kinder gentler uncle sam is about to emerge.
L

Hugo Chavez

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #19 on: February 07, 2008, 09:36:05 AM »
Look, I told you, come up with a serious refute to the material provide in "War on Democracy" or another work.  I don't know how simple I can make this for you.  State the point made may Pilger and show evidence that he is wrong.  You can't seem to pull off that simple thing. Either do it or I will consider this crap a simple sabatoge attempt and despence with it.  Oh, and if you don't want a meltdown, don't bait it.

MB_722

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #20 on: February 07, 2008, 09:39:37 AM »
This documentary is gold, pure gold...

I love that Pilger is able to get these CIA guys to admit they don't give two shits about democracy and none of their goals in the Latin world have been about democracy.

Absolute gold is Pilger getting a Jack Nickelson style "You want the truth, you can't handle the truth" meltdown from CIA Chief Duane Clarridge in which he goes on to justify actions taken at the expense of democracy...

classic gold ;D

I agree I liked this documentary.

sure it had a leftist twist to it, you can't deny what the U.S.A did to south america.

pure gold

headhuntersix

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #21 on: February 07, 2008, 01:42:55 PM »
Look, I told you, come up with a serious refute to the material provide in "War on Democracy" or another work.  I don't know how simple I can make this for you.  State the point made may Pilger and show evidence that he is wrong.  You can't seem to pull off that simple thing. Either do it or I will consider this crap a simple sabatoge attempt and despence with it.  Oh, and if you don't want a meltdown, don't bait it.

Piler says -  American foreign policy has often been a complete failure on a practical, ethical and moral level,
But forgets...Totalitarian Left governments in Latin America have been a complete failure on a practical, ethical and moral level,
Piler says American foreign policy hardliners have disregarded democracy, human rights, the rule of law and the lessons of history (in terms of political and economic policies),
But forgets ...Totalitarian Left governments in Latin America have disregarded democracy, human rights, the rule of law and the lessons of history (in terms of political and economic policies),
Pilger added nothing to our knowledge of the region but instead further fortified his own apparent Left totalitarian sympathies using hyperbole, confected moral outrage, strawmen and extreme examples.

A career military officer, Chávez founded the leftist Fifth Republic Movement after leading the failed 1992 coup d'état against the democratically-elected President of Venezuela......this is ur buddy.  ::)

L

Bindare_Dundat

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Re: War On Democracy
« Reply #22 on: February 07, 2008, 09:04:02 PM »
Piler says -  American foreign policy has often been a complete failure on a practical, ethical and moral level,
But forgets...Totalitarian Left governments in Latin America have been a complete failure on a practical, ethical and moral level,
Piler says American foreign policy hardliners have disregarded democracy, human rights, the rule of law and the lessons of history (in terms of political and economic policies),
But forgets ...Totalitarian Left governments in Latin America have disregarded democracy, human rights, the rule of law and the lessons of history (in terms of political and economic policies),
Pilger added nothing to our knowledge of the region but instead further fortified his own apparent Left totalitarian sympathies using hyperbole, confected moral outrage, strawmen and extreme examples.

A career military officer, Chávez founded the leftist Fifth Republic Movement after leading the failed 1992 coup d'état against the democratically-elected President of Venezuela......this is ur buddy.  ::)



You're too busy thinking about a retort that you don't even take the time to process what anyone else is saying to you. Your bombarded with video's and info everyday on this site of how you've been lied to, how your being cheated, what the real reasons for the war are, the flip floper canidates etc.. and it goes in one ear and out the other with you.