TO ALL IFBB PROS

[cherrybody]

I post a simple reminder and I'm "full of shit"..? and a "company man"..?

What the hell are you talking about??

Thanks Chic I appreciate the heads up. Yes we received a reminder in the mail from IFBB but you never know who's training for a show and spacing out on things,or someone's moved etc. Even if 1 person benefits from your effort it was worth it. Now the average person knows theres a yearly participation fee we must pay to have the privilege to compete and even if you miss the deadline you can still register, it will just cost you more $. On a personal note,thanks for offering me answers to any questions I might have as a new IFBB PRO I'm sure someday I'll get a chance to pick your brain. A.D. Cherry

[Chick]

Chick, are you saying that every IFBB "pro" has been offered the same opportunities as you?

Yep, sure have. In a sport decided by individual talent and competition...it's up to the athlete to do the best with what they have. I was never going to challenge any of the top 5 for the Olympia, but excelled in other areas and utilized my skills to make a living from the sport.

 You are so caught up in being the front man for the IFBB and not the "athletes" it has affected your judgement. It is obvious to most here that you spin any argument you can to make the IFBB look right in it's decisions, when in reality they are stopping some of the guys that aren't top 10 from making extra money.

If you're not in the top 15-20, it's pretty tough to make any real money anyways( at least from prize money) for the simple fact that people want the BEST, and the best will always get bigger money for obvious reasons...PDI was a great example of that, Le made money, so did Sami, St. Cloud...the BEST of what they had...the rest, made nothing....no different. It's not called "spin" it's called "REALITY".


If I find time, I will look for specific examples of wwe guys showing up and performing at smaller shows for you, OK?

You do that...good luck

One more question, noy being an ass, but how many times and what examples can you give, that would show you have gone to bat for specific people in the IFBB, not talking prize money, but who has run into trouble that you've helped out? Anyone?

Sure...

Silvio- had to negotiate for him not to get fined for pictures posted by Milos which violated his contract.  RESULT: no fine

Don Long- although I didn't agree with his decision to compete again, I represented on his behalf tomake it a possibility. RESULT: he was cleared to compete

Lee- At his request, I went to bat and tried to get his suspension lifted the day of the AC Pro to alow him to compete. RESULT: rejected due to his previously rejecting offer to came back

Milos-Put together and submitted his official appeal to the suspension resulting from the Paul Chua allegation, this was done on MIlos' behalf as he was out of the country and couldn't be reached. RESULT: appeal rejected based on Milos' own previous admission of guilt

NUmerous other endeavors including submitting Silvio's name to the ASC as he was out of the country...and of course, numerous submissions/ proposals resulting in more money to pro's, more qualifying spots for the O, per diem increase, no declaration rule (for the women) judging changes (more rounds of comparison), etc, etc....



 The cases documented here on getbig Lee, Milos..seem to point to you telling the bber to do what IFBB wants instead of you fighting the IFBB for bbers.

One more edit...by saying "how many of those pros are in the top 20"? does that mean pros out of the top 20 are subject to different rules? Thanks for your time.

[Chick]

Thanks Chic I appreciate the heads up. Yes we received a reminder in the mail from IFBB but you never know who's training for a show and spacing out on things,or someone's moved etc. Even if 1 person benefits from your effort it was worth it. Now the average person knows theres a yearly participation fee we must pay to have the privilege to compete and even if you miss the deadline you can still register, it will just cost you more $. On a personal note,thanks for offering me answers to any questions I might have as a new IFBB PRO I'm sure someday I'll get a chance to pick your brain. A.D. Cherry

No problem...welcome to the club, bro!

As we talked after your victory, I'm available anytime to answer any and all queastions you may have, or to help you should you need it...

Now get your rookie ass ready for the bigboys!!

See you in Colombus

[cherrybody]

No problem...welcome to the club, bro!

As we talked after your victory, I'm available anytime to answer any and all queastions you may have, or to help you should you need it...

Now get your rookie ass ready for the bigboys!!

See you in Colombus

You got it. Thanks again and Happy New year to you and your family from the Cherry family.

[bigdumbbell]

RMC:  how is exclusive free agency possible?   

[chaos]

So you are useful after all





Sure...

Silvio- had to negotiate for him not to get fined for pictures posted by Milos which violated his contract.  RESULT: no fine

Don Long- although I didn't agree with his decision to compete again, I represented on his behalf tomake it a possibility. RESULT: he was cleared to compete

Lee- At his request, I went to bat and tried to get his suspension lifted the day of the AC Pro to alow him to compete. RESULT: rejected due to his previously rejecting offer to came back

Milos-Put together and submitted his official appeal to the suspension resulting from the Paul Chua allegation, this was done on MIlos' behalf as he was out of the country and couldn't be reached. RESULT: appeal rejected based on Milos' own previous admission of guilt

NUmerous other endeavors including submitting Silvio's name to the ASC as he was out of the country...and of course, numerous submissions/ proposals resulting in more money to pro's, more qualifying spots for the O, per diem increase, no declaration rule (for the women) judging changes (more rounds of comparison), etc, etc....

[Chick]

RMC:  how is exclusive free agency possible?   

Not sure I understand the question, rephrase it

[bigdumbbell]

Not sure I understand the question, rephrase it

sure  correct me if i've got it wrong.

the IFBB has an exclusive clause with their contract workers so how can there be free agency  if a contractor has an exclusive with the IFBB?  it seem incompatible.

[G o a t b o y]

sure  correct me if i've got it wrong.

the IFBB has an exclusive clause with their contract workers so how can there be free agency  if a contractor has an exclusive with the IFBB?  it seem incompatible.

When I call a plumbing contractor to fix a leaky pipe in my home, I require that he not do plumbing work for anyone else and be exclusive to me.  Granted, I'm not paying him a salary or anything, but I'm giving him an "opportunity" to make money with me.  Who knows, maybe I'll have 10 or 12 leaky pipes next year?  (then again, maybe not.)   

[timfogarty]

Just how many pro's actually engage in those acvtivities? Especially in the top 20?

I know of two.  Many more if we count the women.

[Chick]

Which is exactly my point, not exactly the norm...

[chaos]

When I call a plumbing contractor to fix a leaky pipe in my home, I require that he not do plumbing work for anyone else and be exclusive to me.  Granted, I'm not paying him a salary or anything, but I'm giving him an "opportunity" to make money with me.  Who knows, maybe I'll have 10 or 12 leaky pipes next year?  (then again, maybe not.)   

You explain it better than me, but this is my point, how does an "opportunity" make you money? Especially if every single pro is being given the same opportunity.

[timfogarty]

Which is exactly my point, not exactly the norm...

we're talking about pornography and prostitution here.   why is it tolerated at all?

[Chick]

You explain it better than me, but this is my point, how does an "opportunity" make you money? Especially if every single pro is being given the same opportunity.

I cant believe this needs to be explained, but here goes:

After earning your pro card into the IFBB, opportunity is opened to you in various ways...

 prize money

 contracts/ endorsements

 publication contracts

 guest appearances/ seminars/ etc.

 These opportunities are 99.9% from being a part of the IFBB, as the exposure on the stage, in the publications, with the NPC, etc are all there for the taking.

 Lee is a prime example of those opportunities drying up/ unavailable when you're NOT in the Pro League as other federations are short lived, don't offer much in prize money,supp company endorsement contracts, or in opportunities otherwise...

[Chick]

we're talking about pornography and prostitution here.   why is it tolerated at all?

Personally, if I were running the club...it wouldn't. That said, if I had to guess, they don't want to open the Pandoras box of infringing on the rights,free speech, etc...

[timfogarty]

Lee is a prime example of those opportunities drying up/ unavailable when you're NOT in the Pro League as other federations are short lived, don't offer much in prize money,supp company endorsement contracts, or in opportunities otherwise...

if they dried up for Lee it is only because of the thuggish behavior of the IFBB.  Fans still like him.  His endorsement is just as valuable.  If supplement companies aren't hiring him, it is only due to pressure from the IFBB.

[chaos]

I cant believe this needs to be explained, but here goes:

After earning your pro card into the IFBB, opportunity is opened to you in various ways...

 prize money

 contracts/ endorsements

 publication contracts

 guest appearances/ seminars/ etc.

 These opportunities are 99.9% from being a part of the IFBB, as the exposure on the stage, in the publications, with the NPC, etc are all there for the taking.

 Lee is a prime example of those opportunities drying up/ unavailable when you're NOT in the Pro League as other federations are short lived, don't offer much in prize money,supp company endorsement contracts, or in opportunities otherwise...

So what about someone like Derek Anthony, who I've never seen comp pics of....how does he get a contract without a "rep" or the IFBB? I'm sure there are others, didn't Peter Putnam have a contract before he was pro?

[timfogarty]

Personally, if I were running the club...it wouldn't. That said, if I had to guess, they don't want to open the Pandoras box of infringing on the rights,free speech, etc...

infringe on the right to commit an illegal activity (prostitution) ?

[G o a t b o y]

*insert IFBB bullshit here*

You're missing the point.  Independent contractors are just that, independent.  You can only require exclusivity from employees, not contractors.


Next time I need to call a roofer, I will refuse to let him do my roof unless he agrees not to take any other jobs from anyone else the whole year, despite the fact my roof will take only one week, and I will not be paying him for the other 51 weeks or anything.   

[timfogarty]

So what about someone like Derek Anthony, who I've never seen comp pics of....how does he get a contract without a "rep" or the IFBB? I'm sure there are others, didn't Peter Putnam have a contract before he was pro?

Stan McQuay probably made more from his endorsements than did most IFBB pros.  And some of that is certainly due to the TV coverage he got as a Musclemania pro.

[bigdumbbell]

"You're missing the point.  Independent contractors are just that, independent.  You can only require exclusivity from employees, not contractors."  that is what i'm talking about RMC

has the IFBB legal team discuss the legal issues regarding this forced exclusivity of contract laborers?

[Chick]

if they dried up for Lee it is only because of the thuggish behavior of the IFBB.  Fans still like him.  His endorsement is just as valuable.  If supplement companies aren't hiring him, it is only due to pressure from the IFBB.

If thats the case, why did CEL drop him? THey hired him when he wa already gone from the iFBB...if he was such a great spokesman for a company, i'm sure someone would hire him.

[lastrep]

He did burn them by refusing their offer to come back when HE requested it...after that, they didn't see any need to make any more offers. I've never stated anything different...burned, slighted, duped, pick whatever word you wish...same principle.

Nahh.. Lee TOOK the offer.. Lee was given two offers to be precise, "leave the PDI and come back now" (offer 1) OR "stay with PDI and serve a term of a penalty" (offer 2). Both were offered, Lee ACCEPTED #2. Lee TOOK the offer, accepted the terms, paid the time - got blackballed.

(From what I've read on the boards - We need Lee here to state his side of the facts)

[Chick]

infringe on the right to commit an illegal activity (prostitution) ?

If someone were found out to be a prostitute, and arrested and convicted, the IFBB could take action against their pro card...other than that, the IFBB isn't the police dept.

[bigdumbbell]

If someone were found out to be a prostitute, and arrested and convicted, the IFBB could take action against their pro card...other than that, the IFBB isn't the police dept.

dont get caught  is the understanding