Author Topic: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections  (Read 2238 times)

jakecody

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End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« on: January 22, 2008, 07:53:05 AM »
Yesterday i shot my 20th and last injection of Test E.  The following is a quick summery of my experience of this 10 week cycle.
First some stats:
    36 yo, trained for 20 years naturally.  Before cycle 6' 215 9.2% bf.  After not seeing much results for the past 3-4 years i started to get curious about steroids.  Did research for about 5 months as well as asked questions on this and other boards.  i found this board to be more helpfull then others.  Before i forget spacial thanks to Arnold, Overload, trab, and RDW.
My cycle was:
1-10 Test E 500/week split in 2
3-10 Adex .5 grams eod
4-11 HCG 500 iu/week

Before starting my main concerns were: acne, hair loss, gyno, excess gain of water and fat.  My goal was to gain 15 pounds of lean muscle.  I did blood work before starting and all came within range except total test and free test ( 350 and 41).

So in Nov all the preparation and planning is done, the gear is in front of me, only one obstacle now...I AM F***** TERRIFIED OF NEEDLES!!!  Here is a good advice if you are new and in the same situation - memorize the step by step procedure for pinning ( do it in your head over and over) and then do it like a machine without stopping or thinking.  When it was over I laughing at myself for being so scared.  i used 23g 1.5 inch needle and pinned my thighs only.  Mon left Thur right.  For my second cycle i will have to rotate more and involve other bodyparts.  By week 8 i began to feel more pain from the pin.  Overall though all the injections went smoothly - never hit a nerve or a vein, no severe pain or infection.  Another advice - never cut corners when it comes to cleanliness.  Wash the surface where you are putting the gear, ash hands and area to be pinned, use alcohol swabs.  i even used a small bendaid.

Training : i worked out 5 days /week 1-1.5 hours each time.  i am not a strong guy and had my share of injuries over the past 20 years.  i promissed myself no matter how strong I feel I am getting i will not increase weight until I am able to lift a given weight for 12 reps.  Before cycle i was benching 225 for 12 reps and 235 for 10.  After 4 weeks i was benching 225 for 16 and 235 12.  Increase to 245 and did 10.  Now benching 265 for 10.  Squat - 245 for 12 before and 285 for 12 now.  My stamina increased as well, i feel i can keep going even after an hour and a half.

Diet - consuming 300-350 grams of protein, about 400 carbs, and 30-40 grams of fat.  Eating mainly chicken breast and fish with red meat about once a week.  Potatoes, whole wheat pasta, and whole wheat bread for carbs.  Plenty of raw broccoli.  Whey protein and a multi vitamin for supplements. i think too much of my protein came from powder.  i use 6 servings(about 150 g)a day, just can't eat so much meat but for next cycle i will force myself to actually eat more.

The cycle itself - gained 14 pounds with almost no water retention and no fat gain (9.2% before and 9.8 now).  Although it's not 35 pounds that some get on their first cycle i am happy with the results.  My back is wider and thicker, i put 2 inches on my thighs, 2 on my calves(weakest body part), 1.5 inches on my chest, 3/4 inches on arms, no change on waist, shoulders became round and vascular.  Sex drive way up - the wife loved that :).  No acne and no hair loss - that was a concern of mine.  i read though that acne might strike during pct.  I did not change bed sheets every day nor did i take 3 showers a day - I think with acne either you are sensitive to it or you are not.

Plan for PCT - Next week I will start clomid 100/100/50/50 and Nolvadex 40/40/20/20/10.  i will continue to lift heavy but will cut down on volume and train 4 days/week instead of 5.  i will increase the amount of fat i consume for the next 5-6 weeks and keep protein and cards the same.
Thanks again for all the help.







davinci

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #1 on: January 22, 2008, 07:56:40 PM »
2 weeks after last shot is ruffest for me, i can really feel my body crashing, and some lazyness sets in, during pct is when i really have to challenge myself to keep as much gains as i can  but in smart way and not lift heavy.... also during this time is when i use regular supps like creatine and preworkout energy drinks

trab

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2008, 08:07:18 PM »
2 weeks after last shot is ruffest for me, i can really feel my body crashing, and some lazyness sets in, during pct is when i really have to challenge myself to keep as much gains as i can  but in smart way and not lift heavy.... also during this time is when i use regular supps like creatine and preworkout energy drinks

Do you reduce dose at end?
Ever try reduce the Te to 200mg, then switch to TP for a month at 100 eod?

It makes a BIG differance, saves juice to.

THere is NO reason to feel like that.

davinci

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #3 on: January 22, 2008, 08:11:39 PM »
yea i taper off with prop now, sorry i should of been more clear, that was on my first cycle and i was reflecting back like the title said... guess i shoulda been more clear, but yes i do use prop, infact i know it sounds crazy but for me if ound running prop throughout with enanth is what makes me feel best, so yea last 2 weeks i now i drop the enanth and finish out with prop.

trab

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #4 on: January 22, 2008, 08:42:10 PM »
yea i taper off with prop now, sorry i should of been more clear, that was on my first cycle and i was reflecting back like the title said... guess i shoulda been more clear, but yes i do use prop, infact i know it sounds crazy but for me if ound running prop throughout with enanth is what makes me feel best, so yea last 2 weeks i now i drop the enanth and finish out with prop.

Makes for a smooth landing IME.

TP + Stan as last injectables after a steady tapper down the TE,
I ran var only for 10-14 days after taht once then HGH  2x ew at only 2iu in the morning.
I didnt even hardly notice I came off taht time.

Crashing suddenly sucks.

benz

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #5 on: January 22, 2008, 08:44:25 PM »
Even though the roids masters helped you, i hate to say this thread is useless without pictures  ;D
.

trab

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #6 on: January 22, 2008, 08:49:15 PM »
Even though the roids masters helped you, i hate to say this thread is useless without pictures  ;D

No "Master", No advice, just personal experience and opinion and BS...  ;D

Didnt the S American BBers put a Hit on you yet?   ???   ;D

Better be carefull....

WTF got him all worked up like taht?
I am geting a kick out of his expertise on American politics and some other shit to..

benz

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #7 on: January 22, 2008, 08:52:11 PM »
No "Master", No advice, just personal experience and opinion and BS...  ;D

Didnt the S American BBers put a Hit on you yet?   ???   ;D

Better be carefull....

WTF got him all worked up like taht?
I am geting a kick out of his expertise on American politics and some other shit to..

Umhh me no comprender  ;D
.

trab

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #8 on: January 22, 2008, 08:59:57 PM »
Umhh me no comprender  ;D

Me either..........
I dont give advice. Id advise these guys NOT to use UG steroids.

Arnold jr

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #9 on: January 22, 2008, 09:32:32 PM »
Sounds like success Jake...well done. Couple questions and comments though.

Was your diet as good before you began this cycle? I ask because obviously that would have played a huge role in things for you if it was not.

Suggestion, once you come off, bumping up the fats with healthy fats, congratulations, someone here with a brain! However, I would probably drop the carbs down a tad bit for at least a few wks. After 3-4wks if you're maintaining just fine, you can try adding a few more back in. The point of doing this is to ensure you don't get unwanted and unnecessary fat gain when you come off...it happens to a lot of guys. Now by keeping protein the same and adding in more fat, there is no way you're going to lose any muscle...not a chance on earth.

Fulgorre

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #10 on: January 22, 2008, 09:41:32 PM »
Christ bro!  Wait till you add in 75mg of Tren A!  Trust me...worth any sweats, cough, acne, whatever.  Stuff is truly the shit.

Also, try dbol with test. 

Best of luck!

LatsMcGee

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #11 on: January 23, 2008, 12:02:40 AM »
Sounds like success Jake...well done. Couple questions and comments though.

Was your diet as good before you began this cycle? I ask because obviously that would have played a huge role in things for you if it was not.

Suggestion, once you come off, bumping up the fats with healthy fats, congratulations, someone here with a brain! However, I would probably drop the carbs down a tad bit for at least a few wks. After 3-4wks if you're maintaining just fine, you can try adding a few more back in. The point of doing this is to ensure you don't get unwanted and unnecessary fat gain when you come off...it happens to a lot of guys. Now by keeping protein the same and adding in more fat, there is no way you're going to lose any muscle...not a chance on earth.

I think he should probably hit a 3 day split for a few weeks also instead of the 4 day split he has planned.

4thAD

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #12 on: January 23, 2008, 01:16:43 AM »
Congrats bro sounds like you had a successful cycle. No pics necessary as you determine your success not anyone on this board. On another note I and a lot of people I know in real life and on this board train the same on cycle and off cycle. Obviously the gains will come faster while on, you should continue to train just as hard and aggressive. Get on creatine and eat big to help keep the strength up. You might even consider some tribulus to help keep libido in check. Welcome to the dark side bro, now the only thing you have to do is keep the gains.

As far as the HCG goes continue to use until four days prior to PCT. IMO there is no reason to take both nolva and clomid. Drop one and run aromasin for six weeks to help stave off estrogen rebound and help increase test levels. Aromasin is spendy, but well worth it and needed for a good PCT. You may also want to run some vitamin E during PCT just to keep your heart healthy. I believe a good PCT includes the heart also.

jakecody

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #13 on: January 23, 2008, 04:42:59 AM »
Sounds like success Jake...well done. Couple questions and comments though.

Was your diet as good before you began this cycle? I ask because obviously that would have played a huge role in things for you if it was not.

Suggestion, once you come off, bumping up the fats with healthy fats, congratulations, someone here with a brain! However, I would probably drop the carbs down a tad bit for at least a few wks. After 3-4wks if you're maintaining just fine, you can try adding a few more back in. The point of doing this is to ensure you don't get unwanted and unnecessary fat gain when you come off...it happens to a lot of guys. Now by keeping protein the same and adding in more fat, there is no way you're going to lose any muscle...not a chance on earth.
My diet was always on argot although i got a bit more strict when started cycle cause i did not want want fat gain.  My normal range is between 9-10% bf.  during PCT i will allow myself to get as high as 12.  Thanks for the carb note, will do.  Not sure about dropping to only a 3 day split does not sound like enough but i guess I'll see how I feel.  Trab your prop idea makes total sense and i read threads where you mention it.  If i do a second cycle i will def try it.  to those who use clomid for PCT, i read a lot of threads where people complain about depression.  How real is it?  Can get away with just Nolca?i actually did take a picture 3 days ego but not sure how to upload it.If anyone will give me a step by step I'll try.

Arnold jr

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #14 on: January 23, 2008, 06:23:22 AM »
My diet was always on argot although i got a bit more strict when started cycle cause i did not want want fat gain.  My normal range is between 9-10% bf.  during PCT i will allow myself to get as high as 12.  Thanks for the carb note, will do.  Not sure about dropping to only a 3 day split does not sound like enough but i guess I'll see how I feel.  Trab your prop idea makes total sense and i read threads where you mention it.  If i do a second cycle i will def try it.  to those who use clomid for PCT, i read a lot of threads where people complain about depression.  How real is it?  Can get away with just Nolca?i actually did take a picture 3 days ego but not sure how to upload it.If anyone will give me a step by step I'll try.
I train the same on or off...do what works best for you though.

The depression factor after a cycle can be very real...it should not be clinical though IMO. But this is the time that distinguishes real drive and discipline more then other times IMO.

The depression is not cause by clomid but rather the drop in test levels...run a good solid PCT and this should make things much easier.

You could probably be fine with just nolva...4wks should be decent

Pics, when you post, you can click on the "additional options" button on the bottom left of the screen. Follow the step by step after that.

trab

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #15 on: January 23, 2008, 06:47:12 PM »
My diet was always on argot although i got a bit more strict when started cycle cause i did not want want fat gain.  My normal range is between 9-10% bf.  during PCT i will allow myself to get as high as 12.  Thanks for the carb note, will do.  Not sure about dropping to only a 3 day split does not sound like enough but i guess I'll see how I feel.  Trab your prop idea makes total sense and i read threads where you mention it.  If i do a second cycle i will def try it.  to those who use clomid for PCT, i read a lot of threads where people complain about depression.  How real is it?  Can get away with just Nolca?i actually did take a picture 3 days ego but not sure how to upload it.If anyone will give me a step by step I'll try.

Just 500mg of Testo? Depression/ recovery should not be a major deal. If I drop that cold w/ no A'dex during the run
or HCG at all,,,, about 4 weeks of not so great energy before things get better fast.

Multi compound runs and bigger dose and longer duration change things.
Probing a little further allway is the trick to understand your body.
Too much at once make it hard to iron out.

This should be pretty painless even if you did nothing post cycle.

Tell us how it goes. Im not big on HCG during cycle. Interesting to see how fast/ lag time.
See it 4-6 weeks how you feel.

Dropping a big load of many compounds can really suck though. Never underestimate it...

Luv2Hurt

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #16 on: January 24, 2008, 04:32:21 AM »

The depression is not cause by clomid but rather the drop in test levels...run a good solid PCT and this should make things much easier.


I don't know about this being the cause. I think the depression comes from the huge glaring fact that you are in a couple months going to be about exactly where you started before you did the cycle.  Gains from juice are just temporary no matter what you do.  Someone please explain to me how gear permanently makes your muscles bigger and stronger?

Possibly if you can come off and get your test levels up very quickly, if you are lucky, keep training and eating very hard you may be able to keep an LB or 2  :-\  Please remember I am talking about keeping real muscle not fat.

Beener

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #17 on: January 24, 2008, 10:00:11 AM »
I don't know about this being the cause. I think the depression comes from the huge glaring fact that you are in a couple months going to be about exactly where you started before you did the cycle.  Gains from juice are just temporary no matter what you do.  Someone please explain to me how gear permanently makes your muscles bigger and stronger?

Possibly if you can come off and get your test levels up very quickly, if you are lucky, keep training and eating very hard you may be able to keep an LB or 2  :-\  Please remember I am talking about keeping real muscle not fat.

A lb or two? Thats a little bit of an exageration. Sure after a few years with no aas, but in a few months no way.

sinbad

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #18 on: January 25, 2008, 11:06:32 AM »
Thanks alot for sharing your experience. I am basically in the same boat and considering the same thing you did. I am a little bit older, but similar size and strength. Barriers I am having are: No real good source- I am very reluctant to order off the internet, even with research and testimonials I could be getting baby oil or baby aspirin, not to mention the risk of getting caught. and 2: like you, I am not all too fond of needles, but I think I could over come this, for some reason I also think I would pin my thighs too. I no longer work out in a lifters gym, so I don't come across to many people who could help me out. In my world steroids are not everywhere you look. I will continue to keep my eyes open until I come across the right situation. I appreciate you providing this info as it gives me a realistic idea of what to expect.

Luv2Hurt

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #19 on: January 25, 2008, 02:37:47 PM »
Thanks alot for sharing your experience. I am basically in the same boat and considering the same thing you did. I am a little bit older, but similar size and strength. Barriers I am having are: No real good source- I am very reluctant to order off the internet, even with research and testimonials I could be getting baby oil or baby aspirin, not to mention the risk of getting caught. and 2: like you, I am not all too fond of needles, but I think I could over come this, for some reason I also think I would pin my thighs too. I no longer work out in a lifters gym, so I don't come across to many people who could help me out. In my world steroids are not everywhere you look. I will continue to keep my eyes open until I come across the right situation. I appreciate you providing this info as it gives me a realistic idea of what to expect.

Here is a guy asking for trouble with the way he is asking for help.  Sinbad If anybody from here contacts you to "help you out" source wise, dont be stupid just ignore them cause it will be a scam.

sinbad

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #20 on: January 25, 2008, 07:43:42 PM »
Here is a guy asking for trouble with the way he is asking for help.  Sinbad If anybody from here contacts you to "help you out" source wise, dont be stupid just ignore them cause it will be a scam.

Thanks, but believe me I won't be paypaling anyone any cash ;D, I am going to go the face to face route when I do hook up.

jakecody

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Re: End of first cycle - Thoughts and reflections
« Reply #21 on: January 26, 2008, 01:25:28 PM »
Thanks, but believe me I won't be paypaling anyone any cash ;D, I am going to go the face to face route when I do hook up.

Luv2hurt is right.  I am not in hardcore gym either.  I did my research and got the gear off the net.  Money is not an issue for me so i did not care if it got confiscated.  Once it arrived I had it tested.  Gotta be careful though.