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Author Topic: An open letter to Bob Chic  (Read 5613 times)
Chick
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sometimes you get the elevator, somtimes the shaft


« Reply #75 on: April 02, 2008, 08:55:30 AM »

I think Howie meant being successful IN THE IFBB   Wink

Your response is akin to saying anyone can be a football star, not in the NFL but through different organizations like flag football or the local weekend team  Roll Eyes


You simply can't argue the fact that if you want to be a "star" in bodybuilding and grace the pages/covers of FLEX, you have to be in the IFBB i.e. you have to take drugs.   You do more sidestepping than the people on dancing with the stars  Kiss

I know what he meant...and my answer still stands.

You can be talented and steroid free in the NFL as well, but you'll probably have to be taking something in order to have a shot and get there in the first place....why do you think the use starts in H.S.? The lure of a scholarship, then signing into the pro's, then big money contracts...

Anyone can be a successful pro in the IFBB, all you have to do is display a physique thats better than everyone else...how anyone achieves that is up to them, IMO.
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Trev
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« Reply #76 on: April 02, 2008, 09:02:53 AM »

I know what he meant...and my answer still stands.

You can be talented and steroid free in the NFL as well, but you'll probably have to be taking something in order to have a shot and get there in the first place....why do you think the use starts in H.S.? The lure of a scholarship, then signing into the pro's, then big money contracts...

Anyone can be a successful pro in the IFBB, all you have to do is display a physique thats better than everyone else...how anyone achieves that is up to them, IMO.
FIXED
Anyone can be a successful pro in the IFBB, all you have to do is display a physique thats better than more orange, less symmetrical and fatter than everyone else...how anyone achieves that is up to them, IMO.
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HowieW
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« Reply #77 on: April 02, 2008, 09:14:04 AM »

Now everyone has had it spelled out what the IFBB thinks. If you don't want to take drugs then that is your choice. Enter the natural contests. If you want to be a pro and don't want to take drugs then too bad, just retire. Nice one, Bob.

I am on your side when it comes to this issue Vince. However, Bob Chic has one valid pt here.
The vast majority of the pros want to be free to use whatever drugs they please. If even a few pros felt like us, then it might be a real issue within the IFBB pro ranks.
The majority of the fans and promoters seem pretty content as well.
I never won a national championship or got close to a pro card, so this issue is more academic than personal for me.
I chose the mainstream career path and have no regrets. Some decide to take the legal and health risks and go for it.
I think it sad they have to take those risks, but that is the current reality.
Howard
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Brutal_1
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« Reply #78 on: April 02, 2008, 09:15:14 AM »

I know what he meant...and my answer still stands.

You can be talented and steroid free in the NFL as well, but you'll probably have to be taking something in order to have a shot and get there in the first place....why do you think the use starts in H.S.? The lure of a scholarship, then signing into the pro's, then big money contracts...

Anyone can be a successful pro in the IFBB, all you have to do is display a physique thats better than everyone else...how anyone achieves that is up to them, IMO.

 Wink
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just not good enough
Meso_z
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« Reply #79 on: April 02, 2008, 09:28:27 AM »

Congratulations HowieW for creating quality threads on this board.
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HowieW
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« Reply #80 on: April 02, 2008, 09:30:07 AM »

Congratulations HowieW for creating quality threads on this board.
Thanks but my dog is of the same mind set of most get biggers when asked about them ..


* Tazzy squats.jpg (46.68 KB, 383x493 - viewed 155 times.)
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Vince Basile
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« Reply #81 on: April 02, 2008, 09:36:05 AM »

Well, Howie, Bob can't be any clearer. He is not taking any responsibility for drug use and says it is a matter of choice. Can you believe this guy? That must be what Jim M and Ben W say, too. Very sad that bodybuilding has become bodychemistry.

I don't want any part of this professional bullshit. The system is pathetic and dangerous. No thanks, but there is no choice. If I were a young guy starting out I would have a go at competing against these guys and remain natural. I think I know enough to build up big enough to come close to what they have. Wouldn't take much to build bigger calves than most of them! I guess I am the last guy who believes this because everyone else has abandoned the ship.

Almost everyone believes you need drugs and that is why it is tolerated. No wonder bodybuilding remains a sport that is frowned upon and is a cult enterprise.

Bob Chick officially killed this sport today on Getbig.
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Chick
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« Reply #82 on: April 02, 2008, 09:55:20 AM »

Well, Howie, Bob can't be any clearer. He is not taking any responsibility for drug use and says it is a matter of choice. Can you believe this guy? That must be what Jim M and Ben W say, too. Very sad that bodybuilding has become bodychemistry.

I don't want any part of this professional bullshit. The system is pathetic and dangerous. No thanks, but there is no choice. If I were a young guy starting out I would have a go at competing against these guys and remain natural. I think I know enough to build up big enough to come close to what they have. Wouldn't take much to build bigger calves than most of them! I guess I am the last guy who believes this because everyone else has abandoned the ship.

Almost everyone believes you need drugs and that is why it is tolerated. No wonder bodybuilding remains a sport that is frowned upon and is a cult enterprise.

Bob Chick officially killed this sport today on Getbig.


You're not part of it NOW....don't worry about it.
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Tamer Razor
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« Reply #83 on: April 02, 2008, 10:04:49 AM »

Well, Howie, Bob can't be any clearer. He is not taking any responsibility for drug use and says it is a matter of choice. Can you believe this guy? That must be what Jim M and Ben W say, too. Very sad that bodybuilding has become bodychemistry.

I don't want any part of this professional bullshit. The system is pathetic and dangerous. No thanks, but there is no choice. If I were a young guy starting out I would have a go at competing against these guys and remain natural. I think I know enough to build up big enough to come close to what they have. Wouldn't take much to build bigger calves than most of them! I guess I am the last guy who believes this because everyone else has abandoned the ship.

Almost everyone believes you need drugs and that is why it is tolerated. No wonder bodybuilding remains a sport that is frowned upon and is a cult enterprise.

Bob Chick officially killed this sport today on Getbig.


You may as well send your complains to the Olympic Committee, NFL and of course the MLB....get back to reality.
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Stark
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« Reply #84 on: April 02, 2008, 10:07:09 AM »

Stark and Howie want to give muslims the steroids.......die a long slow incredibly muscular,strong and tan death

Your posts are beyond stupidity Roll Eyes
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HowieW
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« Reply #85 on: April 02, 2008, 10:14:29 AM »

Well, Howie, Bob can't be any clearer. He is not taking any responsibility for drug use and says it is a matter of choice. Can you believe this guy? That must be what Jim M and Ben W say, too. Very sad that bodybuilding has become bodychemistry.

I don't want any part of this professional bullshit. The system is pathetic and dangerous. No thanks, but there is no choice. If I were a young guy starting out I would have a go at competing against these guys and remain natural. I think I know enough to build up big enough to come close to what they have. Wouldn't take much to build bigger calves than most of them! I guess I am the last guy who believes this because everyone else has abandoned the ship.

Almost everyone believes you need drugs and that is why it is tolerated. No wonder bodybuilding remains a sport that is frowned upon and is a cult enterprise.

Bob Chick officially killed this sport today on Getbig.

No Vince ,you are NOT the last guy that thinks the extreme drug use ship has gone over the falls ( I agree with you on that). Bob is not guilty of killing the sport of pro bodybuilding. He states the current reality of the situation.
Most guys like us are NOT part of the hardcore scene. It appears they know what health and legal risks thay are taking. It also appears to be true that a lot of the fans demand to see drugged up freaks to buy a ticket.
If more fans were like us , the IFBB would drug test and be thrilled the fans continued to support the shows.
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medz zeppelin
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« Reply #86 on: April 02, 2008, 11:18:37 AM »

Your posts are beyond stupidity Roll Eyes
hi Starky.............."have a nice day........ take steroids"
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chainsaw
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« Reply #87 on: April 02, 2008, 11:41:26 AM »

I know what he meant...and my answer still stands.

You can be talented and steroid free in the NFL as well, but you'll probably have to be taking something in order to have a shot and get there in the first place....why do you think the use starts in H.S.? The lure of a scholarship, then signing into the pro's, then big money contracts...

Anyone can be a successful pro in the IFBB, all you have to do is display a physique thats better than everyone else...how anyone achieves that is up to them, IMO.

Chick, you're makin an ass out of yourself now.  For someone who has carried himself as an educated man
on these boards, these quotes of airheaded ness makes me cringe.
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bic_staedtler
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That is all.


« Reply #88 on: April 02, 2008, 12:39:12 PM »

Since this topic will never die, or be resolved, here's my take:

Drugs are here to stay.  People in the right places are making plenty of cash...promoters, supp companies.  Even 'some' atheletes. 

To them, there's nothing wrong with the equation.

And it all comes down to cash.  Nobody will care about bodybuilding once the cashflow stops.  Think about it...even the supplement industry, where there is NO regulation.  You don't have to prove a damn thing, you just have to market it properly and make the cash...until your product sells poorly, then you start the whole damn process again.

Listen to Serge Nubret on PBW....he took NO supplements, like protein.  Steroids, I'm sure he did just like the rest.  But the MINDSET of the guys back then was to TRAIN hard, eat hard and compete.

That formula worked for during the 70's....you had guys with superior genetics winning titles.  But there are SO FEW guys who can compete at that level due to their genetics, that unless you had something that allows ANYBODY to compete, you'd still have five guys at the Mr O contest and supplement and magazine companies wouldn't be where they are now.

It's all business...and that's what's truly ruining bodybuilding.

Check out CURLING...many people love that game (sport, whatever).  They get NO money from winning world titles, but people watch it, follow it, and it gets national television coverage...and you can SEE the passion their have for the game.

Right now, CURLING has a bigger following than pro bodybuilding.  That's sad, but very telling:  mainstream success doesn't mean jack unless you've got something worth competing for.

Bodybuilding won't be mainstream again until you get another Arnold...which doesn't look likely.  The closest I see is Phil Heath....there's a guy who LOVES bodybuilding, and doesn't look or talk like a guy who's on death row two weeks before a contest!!!

The golden eras of ANY sport 'happen' because you get a guy with CHARISMA to bring new blood into the sport.

It's true for basketball (Jordan), hockey (Gretzky, Crosby) and golf (Woods).  The only thing about bodybuilding is that for you to even CONSIDER becoming great, you must break the law.

And most smart people never bother doing that, because they know they don't have the genetics to beat someone like Phil Heath, even with ALL the drugs in the world.

At the end of the day, either you choose to like bodybuilding or you don't.  Don't expect the system to change as long as you fund and take part in the status quo.

And Chick...I seriously doubt that 10 people attend the natural shows.  FAME holds many contests up in Canada and the USA and they PACK auditoriums...and the competitors are (as much as can be proven thus far) natural trainers. 

If only the NPC put a lil more emphasis on the natural shows...THAT'S what would turn this trend around, as well.  They'll NEVER do it though because there's no money in it.  Simple.

Thanks for the comments, though.  Nice to hear some intelligent comments for a change on this topic.
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That is all.
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« Reply #89 on: April 02, 2008, 12:54:00 PM »

I think I know enough to build up big enough to come close to what they have. Wouldn't take much to build bigger calves than most of them! I guess I am the last guy who believes this because everyone else has abandoned the ship.

Bob Chick officially killed this sport today on Getbig.


Crazy Galilean self-righteousness here, Vince.
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HowieW
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« Reply #90 on: April 02, 2008, 02:40:47 PM »

Since this topic will never die, or be resolved, here's my take:

Drugs are here to stay.  People in the right places are making plenty of cash...promoters, supp companies.  Even 'some' atheletes. 

To them, there's nothing wrong with the equation.

And it all comes down to cash.  Nobody will care about bodybuilding once the cashflow stops.  Think about it...even the supplement industry, where there is NO regulation.  You don't have to prove a damn thing, you just have to market it properly and make the cash...until your product sells poorly, then you start the whole damn process again.

Listen to Serge Nubret on PBW....he took NO supplements, like protein.  Steroids, I'm sure he did just like the rest.  But the MINDSET of the guys back then was to TRAIN hard, eat hard and compete.

That formula worked for during the 70's....you had guys with superior genetics winning titles.  But there are SO FEW guys who can compete at that level due to their genetics, that unless you had something that allows ANYBODY to compete, you'd still have five guys at the Mr O contest and supplement and magazine companies wouldn't be where they are now.

It's all business...and that's what's truly ruining bodybuilding.

Check out CURLING...many people love that game (sport, whatever).  They get NO money from winning world titles, but people watch it, follow it, and it gets national television coverage...and you can SEE the passion their have for the game.

Right now, CURLING has a bigger following than pro bodybuilding.  That's sad, but very telling:  mainstream success doesn't mean jack unless you've got something worth competing for.

Bodybuilding won't be mainstream again until you get another Arnold...which doesn't look likely.  The closest I see is Phil Heath....there's a guy who LOVES bodybuilding, and doesn't look or talk like a guy who's on death row two weeks before a contest!!!

The golden eras of ANY sport 'happen' because you get a guy with CHARISMA to bring new blood into the sport.

It's true for basketball (Jordan), hockey (Gretzky, Crosby) and golf (Woods).  The only thing about bodybuilding is that for you to even CONSIDER becoming great, you must break the law.

And most smart people never bother doing that, because they know they don't have the genetics to beat someone like Phil Heath, even with ALL the drugs in the world.

At the end of the day, either you choose to like bodybuilding or you don't.  Don't expect the system to change as long as you fund and take part in the status quo.

And Chick...I seriously doubt that 10 people attend the natural shows.  FAME holds many contests up in Canada and the USA and they PACK auditoriums...and the competitors are (as much as can be proven thus far) natural trainers. 

If only the NPC put a lil more emphasis on the natural shows...THAT'S what would turn this trend around, as well.  They'll NEVER do it though because there's no money in it.  Simple.

Thanks for the comments, though.  Nice to hear some intelligent comments for a change on this topic.
Great post and I hope EVERYONE on get big reads it.
I know what you mean about lack of coverage and $$ in natural shows. I went to the Musclemania Universe and Fitness comp 4 years ago in Miami. I expected THAT to be a big show and it was in terms of bodybuilders and fitness babes on stage. The audiance was made up of no more than 100 people plus those that were in the show.
Frank Zane is my ideal MR Olympia and I was always a fan the Bob Paris physique.I have always viewed bodybuilding as performing art more than a muscleman exhibit. Thus, I know I am different than many in the hardcore crowd.
On that note, the posing routines of Kai Greene are more like what I prefer to see.
Unlike some , I see no point in "calling out " some individual pro on his drug use. They are all in the same boat and why should a fan hassle those he buys a ticket to see on stage.
The bottom line for me, after the dust clears, is that big bodybuilding contests are a lot of fun to attend.
Drug use is a "policy issue", rather than a "personal issue" for me.
Thanks again for a great post, I may not agree with 100% of your ideas, but I enjoyed reading them.
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Vince Basile
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« Reply #91 on: April 02, 2008, 03:16:35 PM »

When young kids 'know' that the pros use steroids then that is the end of bodybuilding because everyone knows that is cheating. Nothing has changed in all these years. Finally, the public and kids have an excuse to reject bodybuilding as an healthy activity because it is lunacy to use those drugs like the pros do. Thus, why should anyone admire or respect those who use the now illegal drugs? That is the bottom line and we cannot gain acceptance for bodybuilding while the top guys are abusing steroids and goodness knows what else they are doing. If you want to see the reaction to steroid use then look at the women bodybuilders who are pros. No thanks. In the old days I admired women with muscles. How things change. Now when I see those fake boobs, lined faces and bizarre look I cringe.
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SHUTUPANDTRAIN
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« Reply #92 on: April 02, 2008, 03:18:38 PM »

When young kids 'know' that the pros use steroids then that is the end of bodybuilding because everyone knows that is cheating. Nothing has changed in all these years. Finally, the public and kids have an excuse to reject bodybuilding as an healthy activity because it is lunacy to use those drugs like the pros do. Thus, why should anyone admire or respect those who use the now illegal drugs? That is the bottom line and we cannot gain acceptance for bodybuilding while the top guys are abusing steroids and goodness knows what else they are doing. If you want to see the reaction to steroid use then look at the women bodybuilders who are pros. No thanks. In the old days I admired women with muscles. How things change. Now when I see those fake boobs, lined faces and bizarre look I cringe.

Isn't it time for you to go outside and play for a little bit, or at least get some bandages for your fingers from banging the keys so hard...
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Chick
The Pros
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sometimes you get the elevator, somtimes the shaft


« Reply #93 on: April 02, 2008, 03:20:37 PM »

Since this topic will never die, or be resolved, here's my take:

Drugs are here to stay.  People in the right places are making plenty of cash...promoters, supp companies.  Even 'some' atheletes. 

To them, there's nothing wrong with the equation.

And it all comes down to cash.  Nobody will care about bodybuilding once the cashflow stops.  Think about it...even the supplement industry, where there is NO regulation.  You don't have to prove a damn thing, you just have to market it properly and make the cash...until your product sells poorly, then you start the whole damn process again.

Listen to Serge Nubret on PBW....he took NO supplements, like protein.  Steroids, I'm sure he did just like the rest.  But the MINDSET of the guys back then was to TRAIN hard, eat hard and compete.

That formula worked for during the 70's....you had guys with superior genetics winning titles.  But there are SO FEW guys who can compete at that level due to their genetics, that unless you had something that allows ANYBODY to compete, you'd still have five guys at the Mr O contest and supplement and magazine companies wouldn't be where they are now.

It's all business...and that's what's truly ruining bodybuilding.

Check out CURLING...many people love that game (sport, whatever).  They get NO money from winning world titles, but people watch it, follow it, and it gets national television coverage...and you can SEE the passion their have for the game.

Right now, CURLING has a bigger following than pro bodybuilding.  That's sad, but very telling:  mainstream success doesn't mean jack unless you've got something worth competing for.

Bodybuilding won't be mainstream again until you get another Arnold...which doesn't look likely.  The closest I see is Phil Heath....there's a guy who LOVES bodybuilding, and doesn't look or talk like a guy who's on death row two weeks before a contest!!!

The golden eras of ANY sport 'happen' because you get a guy with CHARISMA to bring new blood into the sport.

It's true for basketball (Jordan), hockey (Gretzky, Crosby) and golf (Woods).  The only thing about bodybuilding is that for you to even CONSIDER becoming great, you must break the law.

And most smart people never bother doing that, because they know they don't have the genetics to beat someone like Phil Heath, even with ALL the drugs in the world.

At the end of the day, either you choose to like bodybuilding or you don't.  Don't expect the system to change as long as you fund and take part in the status quo.

And Chick...I seriously doubt that 10 people attend the natural shows.  FAME holds many contests up in Canada and the USA and they PACK auditoriums...and the competitors are (as much as can be proven thus far) natural trainers. 

If only the NPC put a lil more emphasis on the natural shows...THAT'S what would turn this trend around, as well.  They'll NEVER do it though because there's no money in it.  Simple.

Thanks for the comments, though.  Nice to hear some intelligent comments for a change on this topic.

Keep in mind, my friend...bodybuilding was NEVER mainstream...not back in the 70's and not now. Arnold et all, were the "freaks" of THEIR time...the regular guy could no more relate to that look than to the look of Dexter Jaxson, or Troy Alves...

BB back then was an enigma, something new to behold...especially when the women started BBing.

FAME does do well in attendance....because of the FIGURE/ Modeling contests..not the BB. Just like 50% or more of the competitors in pretty much any NPC show is made up of figure girls...do yourself a favor and attend a natural ro show, etc, that DOESN'T have and bikini/ figure contest attached....you believe me then.

Other than that...very well said.
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Chick
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sometimes you get the elevator, somtimes the shaft


« Reply #94 on: April 02, 2008, 03:26:51 PM »

When young kids 'know' that the pros use steroids then that is the end of bodybuilding because everyone knows that is cheating. Nothing has changed in all these years. Finally, the public and kids have an excuse to reject bodybuilding as an healthy activity because it is lunacy to use those drugs like the pros do. Thus, why should anyone admire or respect those who use the now illegal drugs? That is the bottom line and we cannot gain acceptance for bodybuilding while the top guys are abusing steroids and goodness knows what else they are doing. If you want to see the reaction to steroid use then look at the women bodybuilders who are pros. No thanks. In the old days I admired women with muscles. How things change. Now when I see those fake boobs, lined faces and bizarre look I cringe.

Got news for you Basile...I was once one of those "young kids" aspiring to be a pro in the 1970's....and I knew they were using steroids, EVERYONE knew steroids were involved. Check out any of the old Muscle Builder issues, they even had columns (like Gyrmkowski's) which were devoted to talk of steroids....this was WELL beofore Al Gore invented the internet Smiley 

Was it accepted or better when they were LESS illegal? You didn't seem to have any problem taking steroids back then...there would be just as much "acceptance" if al shows were tested...or the physiques looked like yours circa 1970...no more, no less.

Bodybuilding is what it is because it's NOT a mainstream sport...not because of the drug usage. There's just as much usage in the NFL.
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« Reply #95 on: April 02, 2008, 03:28:48 PM »

Why is a thoughtful reply with no threats or emotion considered a meltdown? hehehehe.
Look, if you don't agree with my topic argue the pt.
In all honesty you sound fairly dumb, juvinille and silly when you make ad naseum lame silly replys to me and posts like mine. You want GET BIg to be some wacky silly JR HS place and I don't fit in.
Well too bad, I am not going away, so deal with it chucko Hehe
I staked my get big calim long ago and you idiots are not driving me off it.
Ya gonna have to deal with me or ignore me.
Thanks for playing, Howard

haha
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Vince Basile
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« Reply #96 on: April 02, 2008, 03:31:16 PM »

You're riding a dead horse, Bob, and you know it. Get off now before it takes you down with it.
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Chick
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sometimes you get the elevator, somtimes the shaft


« Reply #97 on: April 02, 2008, 03:33:18 PM »

You're riding a dead horse, Bob, and you know it. Get off now before it takes you down with it.

Guess this "dead horse" pays pretty well...it's taking me down allright...all the way to the bank.
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Vince Basile
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« Reply #98 on: April 02, 2008, 03:44:04 PM »

Thanks, Bob, for self-owning yourself. Bottom line is you make money out of what you do so that is why you don't want to change anything. What a niche you have made for yourself. King of the pros. The voice and face of bodybuilding.
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HowieW
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« Reply #99 on: April 02, 2008, 03:45:10 PM »

Got news for you Basile...I was once one of those "young kids" aspiring to be a pro in the 1970's....and I knew they were using steroids, EVERYONE knew steroids were involved. Check out any of the old Muscle Builder issues, they even had columns (like Gyrmkowski's) which were devoted to talk of steroids....this was WELL beofore Al Gore invented the internet Smiley 

Was it accepted or better when they were LESS illegal? You didn't seem to have any problem taking steroids back then...there would be just as much "acceptance" if al shows were tested...or the physiques looked like yours circa 1970...no more, no less.

Bodybuilding is what it is because it's NOT a mainstream sport...not because of the drug usage. There's just as much usage in the NFL.
Hmmm, I knew about this "steroid  thing" as well shortly after I got serious with bodybuilding contests.
As EVERYONE here knows ALREADY, that issue was tough for me to accept. I dabbled into for 3 yrs ( 83-86)and made my shot to "go for the pros" and never got that close.
I honestly didn't think I was all that great a bodybuilder anyway.
I went into another stable career path, teaching chemistry and physics and was glad I did.
Down deep I really admire old school guys like Vince that won a big title like Mr Canada , back in the day.
At the same time I respect what Bob has down and his 13 yr  "never say die" saga to win the USA and turn pro.
I consider bodybuilding more like performing art than a muscle show, so right there I am really different anyway LOL
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