MESSAGE TO EPHEDRINE USERS!!!!!!!

[The Coach]

I'm denying adrenal fatigue as a disease on the grounds of it not being an accepted medical diagnosis. 

A few quacks selling gimmicks on the net does not an accepted medical diagnosis make.  When there is proper AMA guidelines to the diagnosis and treatment of this "disease," I'll call it that. 
Until then, it is a made up gimmick that ignorant asses with no backing knowledge like to talk about.

Again.......where did I state it was a disease?

[The Coach]

on what grounds are you denying adrenal fatigue exists? it is a syndrome with an complex aggregate of symptoms. It does have some subjective measures however. I am personally on the fence wrt to it.

My guess he's looking for "Adrenal Fatigue" if thats what he's looking for, he's not going to find it. The med term is "adrenal insufficiency".

[roc]

lose the ephedra, it causes a very rapid heart rate that the body cannot control,  my friend died in he sleep because of it, he was a philadelphia police officer. it has caused numerous deaths throught the country. bad stuff!!!!!!!

[windsor88]

lose the ephedra, it causes a very rapid heart rate that the body cannot control,  my friend died in he sleep because of it, he was a philadelphia police officer. it has caused numerous deaths throught the country. bad stuff!!!!!!!

he must have taken a shit load. 

[I ETA PI]

My guess he's looking for "Adrenal Fatigue" if thats what he's looking for, he's not going to find it. The med term is "adrenal insufficiency".

No, adrenal insufficiency is Addison's disease, a REAL disease. 
A real disease that is NOT caused by stimulants.  Addison's disease is caused by a lack of production of cortisol and often aldosterone. 

Do you see the ignorance in your post?  Are you claiming that stimulants cause a DECREASE in cortisol production?
And if so, how is this related to the "crash" you wrote about earlier?



You must have shit where your brains should be. 

[Van_Bilderass]

I'm denying adrenal fatigue as a disease on the grounds of it not being an accepted medical diagnosis. 

A few quacks selling gimmicks on the net does not an accepted medical diagnosis make.  When there is proper AMA guidelines to the diagnosis and treatment of this "disease," I'll call it that. 
Until then, it is a made up gimmick that ignorant asses with no backing knowledge like to talk about.

I agree. That's what I was hinting at in my post. Like with the insulin topic Coach is making a bunch of assumptions that he will have a hard time proving.

[The Coach]

No, adrenal insufficiency is Addison's disease, a REAL disease. 
A real disease that is NOT caused by stimulants.  Addison's disease is caused by a lack of production of cortisol and often aldosterone. 

Do you see the ignorance in your post?  Are you claiming that stimulants cause a DECREASE in cortisol production?
And if so, how is this related to the "crash" you wrote about earlier?



You must have shit where your brains should be. 

What part of "I did not say it was a disease" dont you get?

[AZbodybuilder]

lose the ephedra, it causes a very rapid heart rate that the body cannot control,  my friend died in he sleep because of it, he was a philadelphia police officer. it has caused numerous deaths throught the country. bad stuff!!!!!!!

He was probably abusing it or had other conditions also !

[Nails]

lose the ephedra, it causes a very rapid heart rate that the body cannot control,  my friend died in he sleep because of it, he was a philadelphia police officer. it has caused numerous deaths throught the country. bad stuff!!!!!!!

Are you sure it wasn't from the Asama he had around his waist?? Or the greasy cheese steaks he had for breakfast lunch and dinner? Cus we all know cops are the cream of the crop when it comes to fitness

[Camel Jockey]

The problem is the body getting used to it, and stuff like hypertension with heavy use. I think it should be used on and off and at no more than 25mg a day, or less, like 12.5 mg.

Say what you will, but ephedrine is great pick-me-up when you're slumping. Of course chronic use makes it almost pointless, and that's why it should be used on and off with caffine and asprin.

Using more than 25 mg a day is stupid and increases blood pressure to the point where you feel it and believe me it's not a good feeling. I guess different people people respond differently, but 100mg a day for a few weeks can probably kill someone unless they've got a very strong heart.

[Moosejay]

Your the only who called it a "disease", from what I understand it's a syndrome and yes there is a correlation related to Addisons but it could also be called non-Addison's hypoadrenia, neurasthenia and adrenal neurasthenia....I understand that adrenal fatigue is probably the laymans term for it.

Shortly because I am just starting to learn about this, unlike you who seems to be a doctor and me just a trainer who enjoys learning, reading and doing research because I didn't have privilege of finishing college..........but.... .from what I have learned so far is that when a person is stressed, the body reacts a stress response through the sympathetic nervous system. When this happends epinephrine is secreted through the adrenal medulla and the hypothalamus pituitary releases ACTH which in turns causes the adrenal cortex to increase the production of cortisol.

When we have a high stress situation the production of cortisol is increased to such a high level that the can become exhausted and at that time DHEA is will start to decrease with stress. But with chronic stress there is a decompensation of DHEA at the same time cortisol levels are rising.


I'm not done...I'm leaving work right now and will finish my thought when I get home, but I have more. Dude, like I said, I may not have the formal schooling you have but I am damn well willing to learn and you trying to belittle someone just shows your true character, I hope to God your not a Dr. but don't put someone down just because you might know more.

Joe:

I hope he is not a doc, either.

The fastest way to lose patients is to spring a bunch of scientific stuff on 'em.

They already know you, as a doc, know all this stuff. They just want their solution, they don't want the babble.

Ever seen 'Good Will Hunting' with Matt Damon?

I love the part where there is some Harvard prep school, silver spoon trust fund sissy, trying to impress girls in a bar with some complicated passage from a book he'd memorized that day. Well, I will not go into detail, cause Damon owned him with REAL knowledge.

Respect for all,

Moose

[Necrosis]

Joe:

I hope he is not a doc, either.

The fastest way to lose patients is to spring a bunch of scientific stuff on 'em.

They already know you, as a doc, know all this stuff. They just want their solution, they don't want the babble.

Ever seen 'Good Will Hunting' with Matt Damon?

I love the part where there is some Harvard prep school, silver spoon trust fund sissy, trying to impress girls in a bar with some complicated passage from a book he'd memorized that day. Well, I will not go into detail, cause Damon owned him with REAL knowledge.

Respect for all,

Moose

there is nothing complex about what he said, it is in fact basic physiology.

adrenal fatigue like chronic fatigue, fibro have little objective parameters and like i said are often issues related to sub clinical sequelae. Adrenal fatigue is simply low cortisol output along with other maladies that doesnt fit addisions. to deny that it is not a disease because it is not classified by the AMA is both ignorant and dangerous. Psychiatric pathologies have mostly subjective criteria for diagnosis and many miasms if you will that are subclinical. Sure people suffer from GAD, but alot have anxiety that would not be classified as such, it is abstract anyway. This analogy fits with things like fatigue, headaches, etc with hard to discover organic etiology. I doubt it is a disease, but a poor adrenal health apart from addisions certainly exists.

[Stubborn]

How do ya like them apples!?

[candidizzle]

How do ya like them apples!?

FUCK that movie is greAt!

[Necrosis]

I'm denying adrenal fatigue as a disease on the grounds of it not being an accepted medical diagnosis. 

A few quacks selling gimmicks on the net does not an accepted medical diagnosis make.  When there is proper AMA guidelines to the diagnosis and treatment of this "disease," I'll call it that. 
Until then, it is a made up gimmick that ignorant asses with no backing knowledge like to talk about.

"I'm denying adrenal fatigue as a disease on the grounds of it not being an accepted medical diagnosis"

meh i dont accept borderline disorders of the psyche, the subgroupings of depression nor there etiology, really a moot point, it can still be a issue without medical science. CFS wasnt accepted but a few years ago, if someone feels ill, there is usually something wrong.

many doctors are treating low adrenal function like they would low testosterone, with HTR. Low end test is not a medical diagnosis, but low libido, muscle gain, energy, mood etc are experienced i beleive it warrants treatment, as is the case with people with adreanal insufficiency.

[Van_Bilderass]

The problem is the body getting used to it, and stuff like hypertension with heavy use. I think it should be used on and off and at no more than 25mg a day, or less, like 12.5 mg.

Say what you will, but ephedrine is great pick-me-up when you're slumping. Of course chronic use makes it almost pointless, and that's why it should be used on and off with caffine and asprin.

Using more than 25 mg a day is stupid and increases blood pressure to the point where you feel it and believe me it's not a good feeling. I guess different people people respond differently, but 100mg a day for a few weeks can probably kill someone unless they've got a very strong heart.

The body doesn't get used to it. Only the negative effects lessen with use (insomnia, hyperstimulation, etc), not the anorectic and thermogenic effects.

Blood pressure is usually not a concern. It has been quite safe in obese populations at 60mg/day with 600mg caffeine. How do you feel your blood pressure is high? High BP is called "the silent killer" you know.

The aspirin would be the most dangerous part of the ECA stack IMO and not needed anyway.

[Necrosis]

The aspirin would be the most dangerous part of the ECA stack IMO and not needed anyway.

ephedrine has shitty effects on the cns and cardiovascular system, aspirin is the safest healthiest thing in that stack.

[candidizzle]

i always use the aspirin, but only 81 mg's. the baaby dose. i dont feel the need or the urge to take the suggested 324 mg's... 

[Van_Bilderass]

ephedrine has shitty effects on the cns and cardiovascular system, aspirin is the safest healthiest thing in that stack.

Please elaborate. What kind of negative effects could expect from chronic ephedrine use? How would the side effects manifest? One negative effect I think is fairly common with long term use is BPH.

Aspirin is bad on the stomach. Doing 300mg of aspirin a few times a day, or whatever some recommend, for an extended period could be downright dangerous. One baby aspirin a day, maybe not too bad.

[Camel Jockey]

The body doesn't get used to it. Only the negative effects lessen with use (insomnia, hyperstimulation, etc), not the anorectic and thermogenic effects.

Blood pressure is usually not a concern. It has been quite safe in obese populations at 60mg/day with 600mg caffeine. How do you feel your blood pressure is high? High BP is called "the silent killer" you know.

The aspirin would be the most dangerous part of the ECA stack IMO and not needed anyway.

I got hypertension from using 100-125mg a day along with 600-700mg of caffine.. I could feel it.

[Camel Jockey]

Please elaborate. What kind of negative effects could expect from chronic ephedrine use? How would the side effects manifest? One negative effect I think is fairly common with long term use is BPH.

Aspirin is bad on the stomach. Doing 300mg of aspirin a few times a day, or whatever some recommend, for an extended period could be downright dangerous. One baby aspirin a day, maybe not too bad.

You're telling me you've never felt any negatives effects(besides insomnia) with heavy ephedrine use? No heart pains?

[HTexan]

pnwed

[candidizzle]

You're telling me you've never felt any negatives effects(besides insomnia) with heavy ephedrine use? No heart pains?

you werent asking me, but no i have never had any negative sides. ive taken up to 100mg at one time.   

stupidasfuck

but no negative sides


or i just didnt feel any, cuz of the x and caffiene and weed running trough m at the same time

 

[Van_Bilderass]

I got hypertension from using 100-125mg a day along with 600-700mg of caffine.. I could feel it.

But did you get it tested? It's possible that there was an increase but it's not enough to go by feel IMO. A couple of weeks ago I went to doc and she noticed my hands were shaking (due to having taken a bunch of ephedrine which she didn't know). She wanted to take my BP which was came out very good.

You're telling me you've never felt any negatives effects(besides insomnia) with heavy ephedrine use? No heart pains?

I have used ephedrine on and off for 15 years and the only real side effect I think is related to the ephedrine is some prostate swelling. No heart pains. That's another thing, I did have chest pains once but turned out I had pulled a muscle in my ribcage.

[Camel Jockey]

you werent asking me, but no i have never had any negative sides. ive taken up to 100mg at one time.   

stupidasfuck

but no negative sides


or i just didnt feel any, cuz of the x and caffiene and weed running trough m at the same time

 

100mg a day for more than a week?   With espresso shots, instant coffee, caffine tabs from cvs, and diet soda?

When I stick to 25 mg a day or slightly more, I don't have any negative side effects expect for some insomnia; positives include getting wired. 

Maybe different people respond differently. 240 said his heart felt weird while taking ephedrine, and mine does with very high doses(100mg) for more than a week or so.