What is Wrong With Socialism and why is Capitalism better?

[SuperNatural]

I didn't read all this thread, I apologize, but I figured I'd post this pertinent Chomsky discussion

[Decker]

I still see nothing wrong with a managed economy.  If we could only tighten the screws on the management of our own economic interests, I don't think we'd be in free-fall with these bail-outs.

One failure of unmoderated capitalism is the rise of big ticket business corruption at the expense of the People.  Ask Fannie Mae's Board of Directors how 'socialism' sucks...or Bear Sterns or Ford.

[Chico_Holiday]

The problem with socialism is lack of incentive for people to work hard and better themselves.........

If everyone (in theory) lives by the same means, with a very modest standard of living, regardless of what job they do.........why would anyone want to pursue advanced degrees or go above and beyond in their job?  You can never implement a true (or successful) socialist government, because not everyone will "buy in" and a lot of people are just greedy by nature.  Socialism and Capitalism are both great in theory, but we do not live in a perfect world and Capitalism is easier (and more realistic) to implement and maintain..........

[George Whorewell]

The inherent problem with socialism and communism is that it is run by people. People are fallable, corrupt, greedy and wasteful by nature. This imaginary utopia which socialists and communists strive for is impossible. The idea that "people" in government somehow know whats better for me than myself is absurd.  The only way to keep human beings free and honest is to allow them to survive and achieve as individuals. Capitalism is the only system that has survived the test of time.

[headhuntersix]

I don't know why this is even a debate...we watched the Soviets fall and only after setting up economic free zones..did they begin to really prosper, yet most of the country is very third world.

[Decker]

I don't know why this is even a debate...we watched the Soviets fall and only after setting up economic free zones..did they begin to really prosper, yet most of the country is very third world.

Is Communism Socialism?

[headhuntersix]

Nope (nice try Decker)...but both seek to regulate everything...one, much more then the other. I don't need a hug from Uncle Sam, I need him to get out of the way, some of u guys all want a big hug and a hand out. I don't want people taking my hard earned money and giving it to others, I don't want irresponsible people getting my tax dollars.

[Decker]

The problem with socialism is lack of incentive for people to work hard and better themselves.........

If everyone (in theory) lives by the same means, with a very modest standard of living, regardless of what job they do.........why would anyone want to pursue advanced degrees or go above and beyond in their job?  You can never implement a true (or successful) socialist government, because not everyone will "buy in" and a lot of people are just greedy by nature.  Socialism and Capitalism are both great in theory, but we do not live in a perfect world and Capitalism is easier (and more realistic) to implement and maintain..........

I don't think that stark commune style of living is best representative of socialism.  I think Socialism is where the worker (instead of the capitalist) owns the means of production.  I think, in the face of scarce essential resources, that management of those resources is smart.  Should this be extended all facets of the economy or should the capitalist feature of production for profit still exist?  

I think a mixture of the two is a good idea.

[Decker]

The inherent problem with socialism and communism is that it is run by people. People are fallable, corrupt, greedy and wasteful by nature. This imaginary utopia which socialists and communists strive for is impossible. The idea that "people" in government somehow know whats better for me than myself is absurd.  The only way to keep human beings free and honest is to allow them to survive and achieve as individuals. Capitalism is the only system that has survived the test of time.

Is utopia the goal of socialism?  Or is a sensible allocation of certain resources the goal?  Capitalism is extremely wasteful...look at the car, housing and food industries for a taste of that waste.  It is predicated on having it your way, right now regardless of need, potential or scarcity.  Capitalism predisposes hollow acquisitive success.

Why here in the 24th century we have no need for money....

[Decker]

Nope (nice try Decker)...but both seek to regulate everything...one, much more then the other. I don't need a hug from Uncle Sam, I need him to get out of the way, some of u guys all want a big hug and a hand out. I don't want people taking my hard earned money and giving it to others, I don't want irresponsible people getting my tax dollars.

How is Big Government on your back? 

This goes back to the idea that the US, its gov., and its people all contribute to your ability to make dollar one.  You gotta kick a little something back for the effort.

[headhuntersix]

I have no problem paying my taxes. Its when Uncle Sam decides to start helping everybody, helping em get houses, helping em with this program and that, with my money. And generally its people without jobs or people who can't pay us back. How about all the ridiculous earmarks. 3 million for otter studies, 6 million for a Coke museum, 10 million for Moose testical cancer cures..u get my point. Why

[Decker]

I have no problem paying my taxes. Its when Uncle Sam decides to start helping everybody, helping em get houses, helping em with this program and that, with my money. And generally its people without jobs or people who can't pay us back. How about all the ridiculous earmarks. 3 million for otter studies, 6 million for a Coke museum, 10 million for Moose testical cancer cures..u get my point. Why

That's a huge problem but it's not a problem b/c of Socialism.

Politicians get elected, for the most part, b/c they meet the needs of their constituency.  They bring home the bacon-i.e., federal spending.  That's how they stay in office.  More spending brought home = pleasing the people = winning elections.

We call for cutting spending----but not in my state.

That keeps the vicious cycle going.

[headhuntersix]

Thats just one issue....couple that with Universal healthcare and the money keeps flowing.

[Decker]

Thats just one issue....couple that with Universal healthcare and the money keeps flowing.

I don't view UHC as wasteful b/c of its utility and effectiveness.

[headhuntersix]

Where is it effective...people hate it in England/Canada and they don't have 350 million plus. U guys rail against the gov all the time, now u want him regulating ur healthcare?

[shootfighter1]

Socialism depends on everyone doing relatively equal work, which is absolutely not the case in American.
In an ideal world, socialism would certainly work.  When I was a teenager, I talked about socialism being a wise system...as I got to understand people and the world, I see that pure socialism would be extremely unfair.
Pure capitalism is also not ideal because there are very greedy people.
So, like most other things in life, a compromise and combination is probably best.

[Fury]

I still see nothing wrong with a managed economy.  If we could only tighten the screws on the management of our own economic interests, I don't think we'd be in free-fall with these bail-outs.

One failure of unmoderated capitalism is the rise of big ticket business corruption at the expense of the People.  Ask Fannie Mae's Board of Directors how 'socialism' sucks...or Bear Sterns or Ford.

Should we be surprised you believe in socialism? No, you're a moron.

[Dos Equis]

The problem with socialism is lack of incentive for people to work hard and better themselves.........

If everyone (in theory) lives by the same means, with a very modest standard of living, regardless of what job they do.........why would anyone want to pursue advanced degrees or go above and beyond in their job?  You can never implement a true (or successful) socialist government, because not everyone will "buy in" and a lot of people are just greedy by nature.  Socialism and Capitalism are both great in theory, but we do not live in a perfect world and Capitalism is easier (and more realistic) to implement and maintain..........

Good point.  Why work hard to earn, save, and invest if the government will take what you have? 

[gcb]

  One of the concepts of Socialism is the idea that money, power and health care should be granted to everyone, including people who don't pull their own weight or do their fair share of the work. That's just plain wrong.

You mean like company CEOs and Chairmen of the Board? Yeah that is wrong.

[w8tlftr]

You mean like company CEOs and Chairmen of the Board? Yeah that is wrong.

GCB, can you tell us what a CEO does? What are his day-to-day responsibilities to this company and shareholders?

Do you think anyone can simply step in and do it successfully?

[Oldschool Flip]

GCB, can you tell us what a CEO does? What are his day-to-day responsibilities to this company and shareholders?

Do you think anyone can simply step in and do it successfully?

Not to mention that most CEO's don't really have a life to live because work is their life. 24/7. People could care less if people win the lotto, but if a hard working person earns it, it's wrong.

[gcb]

GCB, can you tell us what a CEO does? What are his day-to-day responsibilities to this company and shareholders?

Do you think anyone can simply step in and do it successfully?

No - I don't. But these guys are well compensated whether they do a good job or not.

[gcb]

Not to mention that most CEO's don't really have a life to live because work is their life. 24/7. People could care less if people win the lotto, but if a hard working person earns it, it's wrong.

Yes, I pray every night for these poor CEOs at their business lunches and golf days.

[w8tlftr]

Yes, I pray every night for these poor CEOs at their business lunches and golf days.

So... what happens at these business lunches and golf outings with their business partners and clients?

How many people's jobs and livelihood depend on them to strike deals that can generate the revenue that keeps their company afloat?

Now, I am of the opinion that a CEO's bonuses and salaries should be tied to their companies profit margin. If the company they lead does poorly then ribs-n-dick for them. Getting fat bonuses or severances checks for running a company into the ground is BS.

But let's not kid ourselves and pretend what they do is easy. If it was easy everyone would be doing it.

[gcb]

I never said it was easy - but it is more about who you know then what you know.