How to Swift Boat John McCain's Candidacy

[Decker]

How to Swift Boat John McCain

Or

Can We Trust This Man to be President?

THE TRUTH ABOUT JOHN MCCAIN'S "HEROISM" AS A POW

Was a Friend to the Enemy North Vietnamese

McCain has said repeatedly that he was afforded no special treatment while in the "Hanoi Hilton". Yet when he was first interviewed by the North Vietnamese he is shown at a hospital reserved for Vietnamese military and he was seen by Soviet Surgeons. He was drinking coffee and smoking cigarettes while being interviewed. This was a far cry from the way the rest of the POWs were treated.

Sold out his own men by collaborating with the Enemy

He was shot down October 26, 1967, and by November 9, 1967 he was giving interviews to foreign correspondents, providing information on his prior command, casualties and tactics, in direct violation of the Code of Conduct. (The U.S. military Code of Conduct is the definitive code specifying the responsibilities of American military personnel while in combat or captivity. Article V of the Code is very specific in ordering U.S. military personnel to avoid answering questions to the utmost of their ability and to make no oral or written statements disloyal to the United States and its allies, or harmful to their cause. Any willful violation of the Code is considered collaborating with the enemy.)

Embraced the Enemy that Tortured his fellow soldiers

In the interview that he gave on November 9, 1967 to VNA International, he claims when he bailed out and landed in the lake, that locals pulled him out and took him to the hospital. Yet in the U.S. News and World Report - May 14, 1973. McCain is quoted as saying "I think it was on the fourth day (after being shot down) that two guards came in, instead of one. One of them pulled back the blanket to show the other guard my injury. I looked at my knee. It was about the size of a football . . . when I saw it, I said to the guard, Ok, get the officer'...an officer came in after a few minutes. It was the man that we came to know very well as 'The Bug'. He was a psychotic torturer, one of the worst fiends that we had to deal with. I said, Ok, I'll give you military information if you will take me to the hospital."
While testifying before the Senate Select Committee, the very man McCain claims was responsible for his own torture, his interrogator, "The Bug" was appearing. When the moment of confrontation came, McCain rose from his seat, walked from the podium to the floor and stood face to face with the man who was responsible for torturing him and countless other Prisoners of War...McCain then grabbed the man and embraced him!

A Commie Sympathizer

He has been a consistent advocate of lenient treatment of Vietnam.

A Traitor to the USA

The Communist Vietnamese erected a bust of John McCain beside the lake where he was shot down.

Heartless

While a member of the Senate Select Committee on POW/MIA Affairs (1991-1993) he referred to POW/MIA Family Members and POW/MIA Activists as whiners, vultures and the lunatic fringe.
http://www.farfromglory.com/john_s_mccain.htm


Presidential material or not-so clandestine Manchurian Candidate?

You decide.


brought to you by Swift Boat Veterans For Truth...or a reasonable facsimile thereof

[headhuntersix]

I would expect better of u Decker..this is all pure bullshit..the bust they erected...was for the shitheads who shot him down...says so on the website. If its true there are guys who were in the Hilton and Comrade Obama will find them if they exist.

[Decker]

I would expect better of u Decker..this is all pure bullshit..the bust they erected...was for the shitheads who shot him down...says so on the website. If its true there are guys who were in the Hilton and Comrade Obama will find them if they exist.

Come on HH, I clearly entitled this bit, "How to Swift Boat McCain...".

It's just a gentle reminder of the things that may come down the pike this political season.

Hell, if the Swift Boaters could turn a war hero like Kerry into a murderous traitor, whose to say it can't happen again.

I didn't put this together to prove the truth of the stuff asserted about McCain because I don't believe it myself.

Your reaction was much like my own when the real Swift Boaters pretty much called Candidate Kerry a murderous, cowardly, underserving hero poseur and the Republican machine ate it up.

I remember that all the attendees at the Republican Convention of 2004 wore band-aids with little purple hearts on them.

So the Swift Boat message was taken to heart.

[Dos Equis]

I wouldn't mention Kerry and McCain in the same sentence.  What Kerry did was treacherous.   

[240 is Back]

ranked 894th out of 899 students in the naval academy.

that's kinda important.

[headhuntersix]

Ok fine Decker...that site does give both sides. I will say that the Kerry stuff has been out there for a long time. It took some organization to get the Swift boat thing moving. I guess my question would be, how long has that info been out.  I'm from Mass and both my parents were Dems, my dad hated Kerry for that Winter Soldier bs.

Look for my money..in the Service we always ask where academy grads graduated....what rank...the lower the rank, the better the guy. I served with a guy who was 2nd to last at West Point. He was a soccer player and hippy. He also held off a Taliban assualt with his ODA team, in 2001 with 5th Group....and won both a Bronze Star with V device and got a purple heart...he was the last guy any of us thought would go SF. U guys would all fit in better with Mccain then with the guy who graduated 1.

[Decker]

I wouldn't mention Kerry and McCain in the same sentence.  What Kerry did was treacherous.   

This is what I'm talking about.

The SwiftBoat Bullshit works b/c people like you want to believe it's true.  It's a hell of a lot easier to base your vote on disproven propaganda than to analyze the issues.

The Swift Boaters were thoroughly debunked: Print coverage failed to note Swift Boat Vets' claims have been debunked
http://mediamatters.org/items/200703300008

But what of McCain's treachery?  Here's a website that looks at McCain's Manchurian Candidacy

John McCain: The Manchurian Candidate

 By Ted Sampley
U.S. Veteran Dispatch
December 1992 Issue


HOW MUCH MORE INFORMATION DID HE GIVE?

McCain has admitted that the Vietnamese repeatedly threatened to withhold much needed operations unless he would give them more information. Did he provide it?

After six weeks of this type of threats and medical treatment, he was delivered to Room No. 11 of "The Plantation" and into the hands of two other POWs, who helped further nurse him along until he was eventually able to walk by himself.

For the next 22 months, McCain was kept isolated from the other American prisoners. Because the Vietnamese considered him a "special prisoner" he was the target of intense indoctrination programs. His communist interrogators believed that because McCain came from a "royal family," he would, when finally released, return to the United States to some important military or government job.

The communist were very much aware that POW McCain would be under great psychological pressure not to do or say anything that would tarnish his famous military family and they considered that to be the key to eventually breaking and then "turning" him.

During that period of time McCain was visited by several foreign delegations (including Cubans) and interviewed by many high ranking North Vietnamese leaders including Gen. Vo Nguyen Giap, North Vietnam's Minster of Defense and national hero . . .

http://www.usvetdsp.com/manchuan.htm

[Decker]

Ok fine Decker...that site does give both sides. I will say that the Kerry stuff has been out there for a long time. It took some organization to get the Swift boat thing moving. I guess my question would be, how long has that info been out.  I'm from Mass and both my parents were Dems, my dad hated Kerry for that Winter Soldier bs.

Look for my money..in the Service we always ask where academy grads graduated....what rank...the lower the rank, the better the guy. I served with a guy who was 2nd to last at West Point. He was a soccer player and hippy. He also held off a Taliban assualt with his ODA team, in 2001 with 5th Group....and won both a Bronze Star with V device and got a purple heart...he was the last guy any of us thought would go SF. U guys would all fit in better with Mccain then with the guy who graduated 1.

Did you believe that John Kerry shot a naked child in the back as the child fled?

I guess I'm asking if you believed the Swift Boaters?

Beach Bum does and that's troubling.

[Dos Equis]

This is what I'm talking about.

The SwiftBoat Bullshit works b/c people like you want to believe it's true.  It's a hell of a lot easier to base your vote on disproven propaganda than to analyze the issues.

The Swift Boaters were thoroughly debunked: Print coverage failed to note Swift Boat Vets' claims have been debunked
http://mediamatters.org/items/200703300008

But what of McCain's treachery?  Here's a website that looks at McCain's Manchurian Candidacy

John McCain: The Manchurian Candidate

 By Ted Sampley
U.S. Veteran Dispatch
December 1992 Issue


HOW MUCH MORE INFORMATION DID HE GIVE?

McCain has admitted that the Vietnamese repeatedly threatened to withhold much needed operations unless he would give them more information. Did he provide it?

After six weeks of this type of threats and medical treatment, he was delivered to Room No. 11 of "The Plantation" and into the hands of two other POWs, who helped further nurse him along until he was eventually able to walk by himself.

For the next 22 months, McCain was kept isolated from the other American prisoners. Because the Vietnamese considered him a "special prisoner" he was the target of intense indoctrination programs. His communist interrogators believed that because McCain came from a "royal family," he would, when finally released, return to the United States to some important military or government job.

The communist were very much aware that POW McCain would be under great psychological pressure not to do or say anything that would tarnish his famous military family and they considered that to be the key to eventually breaking and then "turning" him.

During that period of time McCain was visited by several foreign delegations (including Cubans) and interviewed by many high ranking North Vietnamese leaders including Gen. Vo Nguyen Giap, North Vietnam's Minster of Defense and national hero . . .

http://www.usvetdsp.com/manchuan.htm

Wrong.  I was fine with Kerry's military service until two things happened:  (1) I watched the Stolen Honor documentary, which showed how he threw his fellow soldiers under the bus during the war and included interviews of POWs and their wives; and (2) he tried to use his military service to support his presidential candidacy (e.g., his salute and "reporting for duty" comments at the convention).  I saw the documentary after the convention, but it just upset me to no end that he engaged in such despicable conduct and then tried to run in part on his military record.     

[Hugo Chavez]

I would expect better of u Decker..this is all pure bullshit..the bust they erected...was for the shitheads who shot him down...says so on the website. If its true there are guys who were in the Hilton and Comrade Obama will find them if they exist.

Uh,... HH, forget the Bust, if this is true, there's going to be big problems for McCain.

"I think it was on the fourth day (after being shot down) that two guards came in, instead of one. One of them pulled back the blanket to show the other guard my injury. I looked at my knee. It was about the size of a football . . . when I saw it, I said to the guard, Ok, get the officer'...an officer came in after a few minutes. It was the man that we came to know very well as 'The Bug'. He was a psychotic torturer, one of the worst fiends that we had to deal with. I said, Ok, I'll give you military information if you will take me to the hospital."

[Hugo Chavez]

WOW, this is really bad, if it is shown he gave military info to the enemy, it's not much to ask if American troops lost their lives due to the info he gave.  oooohhh, this is pretty serious...

Not to mention Repugs opened up the door by nailing Kerry so the playing field for this stuff is wide open and who's at fault for that?

I wouldn't mention Kerry and McCain in the same sentence.  What Kerry did was treacherous.   

Dude, if McCain gave secrets for his safety, that's just as much if not more treacherous.  There's no way to argue it's not.

[240 is Back]

(2) he tried to use his military service to support his presidential candidacy

Mccain's ad campaign is playing clips of him as a POW over and over.  It's been their whole campaign for 4 weeks now.  Isn't that the same thing?

[Dos Equis]

WOW, this is really bad, if it is shown he gave military info to the enemy, it's not much to ask if American troops lost their lives due to the info he gave.  oooohhh, this is pretty serious...

Not to mention Repugs opened up the door by nailing Kerry so the playing field for this stuff is wide open and who's at fault for that?
Dude, if McCain gave secrets for his safety, that's just as much if not more treacherous.  There's no way to argue it's not.

When it isn't tabloid news then I'll pay attention. 

[Hugo Chavez]

When it isn't tabloid news then I'll pay attention. 

Then you should pay attention because the only part that I pointed out as being big came from his own mouth and was published in U.S. News in May 1973    I confirmed it.

[Dos Equis]

Mccain's ad campaign is playing clips of him as a POW over and over.  It's been their whole campaign for 4 weeks now.  Isn't that the same thing?

No.  McCain didn't betray his fellow POWs like Kerry.  In fact, McCain was offered an early release when they realized who his father was and he turned it down to stay with his comrades.  That's the kind of man who can run on his military record; not a jerk who testifies before Congress calling his fellow soldiers baby killers while they are still being held as POWs.    

[240 is Back]

No.  McCain didn't betray his fellow POWs like Kerry.  In fact, McCain was offered an early release when they realized who his father was and he turned it down to stay with his comrades.  That's the kind of man who can run on his military record; not a jerk who testifies before Congress calling his fellow soldiers baby killers while they are still being held as POWs.    

We're not discussing the quality of their service (unless you're choosing to change the debate).

You said Kerry "tried to use his military service to support his presidential candidacy".

Mccain's ad campaign is playing clips of him as a POW over and over.  It's been their whole campaign for 4 weeks now.  Isn't that the same thing? 

[Dos Equis]

Then you should pay attention because the only part that I pointed out as being big came from his own mouth and was published in U.S. News in May 1973    I confirmed it.

You confirmed what someone allegedly said they heard McCain say after he had crashed, had two broken arms, a broken leg, etc. and been tortured?  Works for me . . . .   

[Dos Equis]

We're not discussing the quality of their service (unless you're choosing to change the debate).

You said Kerry "tried to use his military service to support his presidential candidacy".

Mccain's ad campaign is playing clips of him as a POW over and over.  It's been their whole campaign for 4 weeks now.  Isn't that the same thing? 

Actually, what I said was this: 

Wrong.  I was fine with Kerry's military service until two things happened:  (1) I watched the Stolen Honor documentary, which showed how he threw his fellow soldiers under the bus during the war and included interviews of POWs and their wives; and (2) he tried to use his military service to support his presidential candidacy (e.g., his salute and "reporting for duty" comments at the convention).  I saw the documentary after the convention, but it just upset me to no end that he engaged in such despicable conduct and then tried to run in part on his military record.     

[240 is Back]

additionally, he crashed 4 Navy jets.

that can't be true - they stop giving pilots planes after 2.

[Hugo Chavez]

No.  McCain didn't betray his fellow POWs like Kerry.  In fact, McCain was offered an early release when they realized who his father was and he turned it down to stay with his comrades.  That's the kind of man who can run on his military record; not a jerk who testifies before Congress calling his fellow soldiers baby killers while they are still being held as POWs.    

LOL...  How you can justify this statement of yours with McCain giving in and giving military secrets is beyond me.  You do know that this kind of intelligence obtained by the enemy leads to the death or potential for of our troops...  How's that not a betrayal?!?!

[Hugo Chavez]

You confirmed what someone allegedly said they heard McCain say after he had crashed, had two broken arms, a broken leg, etc. and been tortured?  Works for me . . . .   

McCain WROTE the article... OH OOOOPS!!!!! EAT THAT BUBBA   fact...


John McCain, Prisoner of War: A First-Person Account
By John S. McCain III, Lieut. Commander, U.S. Navy
published in U.S. News in May 1973

"I said, "O.K., I'll give you military information if you will take me to the hospital."

BB, did other soldiers die and suffer greatly for not cooperating?  If you don't know the answer, it's yes!

[Dos Equis]

LOL...  How you can justify this statement of yours with McCain giving in and giving military secrets is beyond me.  You do know that this kind of intelligence obtained by the enemy leads to the death or potential for of our troops...  How's that not a betrayal?!?!

I don't know any such thing.  Proof?

[Hugo Chavez]

I don't know any such thing.  Proof?

see my above post

[Dos Equis]

McCain WROTE the article... OH OOOOPS!!!!! EAT THAT BUBBA   fact...


John McCain, Prisoner of War: A First-Person Account
By John S. McCain III, Lieut. Commander, U.S. Navy
published in U.S. News in May 1973

"I said, "O.K., I'll give you military information if you will take me to the hospital."

Oooh.  You got me.  So he said he would give them military information.  And?  What did he give them?  If you're trying to equate McCain making that statement after crashing, suffering serious injuries, and being tortured with Kerry sitting in front of TV cameras throwing his comrades who were still POWs under the bus, sorry, I'm not buying.  

[Hugo Chavez]

Oooh.  You got me.  So he said he would give them military information.  And?  What did he give them?  If you're trying to equate McCain making that statement after crashing, suffering serious injuries, and being tortured with Kerry sitting in front of TV cameras throwing his comrades who were still POWs under the bus, sorry, I'm not buying.  

I'm sure in exchange for the special treatment for years, he told the we were wearing green   COME ON