Novadex question

[millerbishop]

just finished my first bottle of novadex and I was using it as a pct for some otc prohormone cycle (i know they were a waste of money) I was on a eight week cycle; what I was wondering is if the three weeks I was on nova was sufficient for the test to get back to normal or should I continue yo take?

[mopar_freak]

i found that when i took any kind of pro hormone i didnt need any PCT.
i tried 6-0x0 and novadex  and i didnt notice anything

[JOCKTHEGLIDE]

I took mass tabs.... used gaspair novadex it worked.  YUP I have the blood work to prove it too....

[peroni]

I've done this several times with great success.

4 weeks novadex. week 1, 4 pills daily
week 2, 3 pills daily... etc for 4 weeks depends on which PH you take. I took some strong ones (safely) and did very well with them

[JOCKTHEGLIDE]

I've done this several times with great success.

4 weeks novadex. week 1, 4 pills daily
week 2, 3 pills daily... etc for 4 weeks depends on which PH you take. I took some strong ones (safely) and did very well with them

4 pills/day?  wow I think max is what 2 or 3?....

[candidizzle]

4 pills/day?  wow I think max is what 2 or 3?....

on the bottle it actually says 3-6

but IMO, anyting over 3 (75mg atd) would be sort of wasteful...since in most people 50-75 mg shows significant suppression of aromatase. (all this accoring to lewellyn in anabolics 2006 )

[JOCKTHEGLIDE]

on the bottle it actually says 3-6

but IMO, anyting over 3 (75mg atd) would be sort of wasteful...since in most people 50-75 mg shows significant suppression of aromatase. (all this accoring to lewellyn in anabolics 2006 )

WELL thanks for that info....

[DK II]

Are you guys talking about

NOVEDEX the "supplement"

or

NOLVADEX the prescription drug?

[RDW]

Depending on which you are talking about:

Nolvadex (tamoxifen citrate) does not suppress the aromatase enzyme, it is a SERM (Selective Estrogem Receptor Modulator) which binds to the estrogen receptors instead of the estrogen which has allready been aromatized.

As far as the Novedex XT suppliment (1,4,6-Androstatrien-3,17-dione) it is a type II aromatase inhibitor (suicide inhibitor).  This will bind to the aromatase enzyme permenantly, it works like exemestane (Brand name Aromasin).

However, to answer the original question, neither will really help much with test production.  There has been some suggestion that exemestane can help increase production of LH (leuitizing hormone) like hCG (human chorionic gonadatropin) but at a much lower level, however, I am not aware of ATD (Novedex XT) posting any studies to support this claim even though it would be perfectly reasonable to think it would (to a low degree) assuming that exemestane does as they act in the same fashion.

This increase in LH should help increase test production but it would not be nearly as significant as hCG.  The primary purpose of aromatase inhibitors and estrogen receptor modulators (anti estrogens) is to lower the effects from excess estrogens in the body, not to start test production.  For that you must actively enable the HPTA at some point, while LH is certainly a valid place to do that, the level at which the aromatase inhibitors produce LH isn't significant for the suppression that has resulted from any worth while androgen.

[candidizzle]

Depending on which you are talking about:

Nolvadex (tamoxifen citrate) does not suppress the aromatase enzyme, it is a SERM (Selective Estrogem Receptor Modulator) which binds to the estrogen receptors instead of the estrogen which has allready been aromatized.

As far as the Novedex XT suppliment (1,4,6-Androstatrien-3,17-dione) it is a type II aromatase inhibitor (suicide inhibitor).  This will bind to the aromatase enzyme permenantly, it works like exemestane (Brand name Aromasin).

However, to answer the original question, neither will really help much with test production.  There has been some suggestion that exemestane can help increase production of LH (leuitizing hormone) like hCG (human chorionic gonadatropin) but at a much lower level, however, I am not aware of ATD (Novedex XT) posting any studies to support this claim even though it would be perfectly reasonable to think it would (to a low degree) assuming that exemestane does as they act in the same fashion.

This increase in LH should help increase test production but it would not be nearly as significant as hCG.  The primary purpose of aromatase inhibitors and estrogen receptor modulators (anti estrogens) is to lower the effects from excess estrogens in the body, not to start test production.  For that you must actively enable the HPTA at some point, while LH is certainly a valid place to do that, the level at which the aromatase inhibitors produce LH isn't significant for the suppression that has resulted from any worth while androgen.

ai raises test levels bro

but i agree about pct, cuz lh seems to recover without any help..its just the nuts that gotta get some help

[JOCKTHEGLIDE]

ai raises test levels bro

but i agree about pct, cuz lh seems to recover without any help..its just the nuts that gotta get some help

and the novedex will help with this right as in help the nuts?

[peroni]

As I said. It's helped every cycle. I've come back in fine form in no time. I stand by it and would whole heartedly recommend it.

[candidizzle]

and the novedex will help with this right as in help the nuts?

no the reason why guys take ai/ae during pct is to boost LH. but, if you look at some studies, LH seems to recover just fine post cycle without any help. so...   the science says that these products are sort of useless for bringin back p test production.  hcg will help with the nuts bro. nothing else that i know of will.

this is not to say that an ai/ae wont be beneficial, it hink it would be, but for other reasons, not by helping boost the PRODUCTION.

[JOCKTHEGLIDE]

no the reason why guys take ai/ae during pct is to boost LH. but, if you look at some studies, LH seems to recover just fine post cycle without any help. so...   the science says that these products are sort of useless for bringin back p test production.  hcg will help with the nuts bro. nothing else that i know of will.

this is not to say that an ai/ae wont be beneficial, it hink it would be, but for other reasons, not by helping boost the PRODUCTION.

candid,
thanks for the info. bro very interesting......somtime s it gets confusing with LH, boost natural test, etc...all those stuff.

[rccs]

Are you guys talking about

NOVEDEX the "supplement"

or

NOLVADEX the prescription drug?

Read this...
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=212627.0

[powerpack]

I still believe you need a SERM for PCT.
An AI is not much good if there is little or no Testerone to Aramotise and post cycle that is exactly the place that your are at.

[candidizzle]

what would be the benefit of an anti estrogen post cycle ? and why would that benefit apply to anti estrogens and not antri aromatase?
thanks.

[powerpack]

what would be the benefit of an anti estrogen post cycle ? and why would that benefit apply to anti estrogens and not antri aromatase?
thanks.

The male body uses Estrogen as its feed back loop on how much Testerone it has in its body.
Testerone is converted to Estrogen by your body at a set ratio
So if you drive your Estrogen levels down by using something like 6-OXO your body will be fooled into making more Testerone, well for a natural body builder.

When you take drugs your body sees all this extra Testerone and produces a lot more Estrogen to try and maintain the ratio, hence that is how you get bitch tits, water bloat and all other Estrogenic related side effects when taking testerone.

The trouble is when you come of a cycle your balls have shut down and you are not injecting testerone any more but you still have all this estrogen in your body.
So while the Estrogen is still there your body will not switch the testicals back on.

An AI is only really good to stop the estrogenic side effects when on a cycle.
When of a cycle there is NO TESTERONE TO ARAMOTISE AND DOES NOT HELP YOUR BODY GET RID OF ESTROGEN THAT IS ALREADY THERE.

You need a SERM, this binds to the estrogen receptor, limits estrogenic side effects  and fools the body into thinking that Estrogen levels are low.

Hence the balls are switched back on.

You can take an AI on a cycle but PCT must have a SERM (Nolvadex not Gaspari NOVEDEX XT)

[candidizzle]

okay. so how long is thi left over estrogen going to remain in the system ? shoudlnt testosterone remain for just as long as estrogen ?

[powerpack]

okay. so how long is thi left over estrogen going to remain in the system ? shoudlnt testosterone remain for just as long as estrogen ?

No
Every drug has a life in your system, with orals it is a few days with injectables depending on its ester a couple of weeks.(I am not talking about detection time I am talking about active useful time)
So after a few weeks with your testicles shut off and the steroids worked out there will be almost no testerone in your system.
Hence no agression, no sex drive, no strength, no attitude...... no being a man.

The estrogen will still be there, your body will slowly drop it by itself and then eventually switch on your testicles but it will take months and months if your cycle was long enough to shut you down hard.
That is why a SERM is so amazing it speeds the time up to recover in leaps and bounds.

Just out of interest if you are using a normal steroid like test or Dbol it takes about 2 weeks to start shutting you down.
But a Nandralone based drug shuts you down hard nearly from the first injection.

This is why guys who do these designer steroid oral cycles of only a few weeks  dont really feel much of a shut down, but a short low dose PCT of 2 weeks for them could only help them keep the gain and get switched back on properly.

[candidizzle]

so estrogen takes months to get out of the system?  but testosterone takes a few days? why?

[powerpack]

Rather think more of hormonal balance.

A mans hormonal system is a lot simpler than a womans but anything can knock it it!
If you are sick you Testerone levels drop
If you are stressed your testerone levels drop
When you get older your testerone levels drop
When your soccer team wins your testerone levels spike
When watching an aggressive or sexual movie your testerone levels spike
When you train your testerone levels spike BUT when you over train your testerone levels drop.

Testerone is the prize, it is the hormone of the moment, it is what makes us big, strong, agressive, horny, it makes us win.
But it comes at a price we die before woman.

Estrogen is a hormone that makes you fat, reduces upper body strenght BUT helps yours imune system it helps your body fight disease and live longer....... It is a survival hormone, its stays there to protect you.
Sickness, stress, age all increases estrogen in a mans body

When you take drugs you screw up this balance of strenght and survival big time.
Your body has natural hormonal set points and you just stuffed them up with that pill or injection.
Getting balance back is what takes a long long time.

[candidizzle]

i think ill just cruiiiisssssseeeeee then 

[rccs]

Rather think more of hormonal balance.

A mans hormonal system is a lot simpler than a womans but anything can knock it it!
If you are sick you Testerone levels drop
If you are stressed your testerone levels drop
When you get older your testerone levels drop
When your soccer team wins your testerone levels spike
When watching an aggressive or sexual movie your testerone levels spike
When you train your testerone levels spike BUT when you over train your testerone levels drop.

Testerone is the prize, it is the hormone of the moment, it is what makes us big, strong, agressive, horny, it makes us win.
But it comes at a price we die before woman.

Estrogen is a hormone that makes you fat, reduces upper body strenght BUT helps yours imune system it helps your body fight disease and live longer....... It is a survival hormone, its stays there to protect you.
Sickness, stress, age all increases estrogen in a mans body

When you take drugs you screw up this balance of strenght and survival big time.
Your body has natural hormonal set points and you just stuffed them up with that pill or injection.
Getting balance back is what takes a long long time.

I cycle sust(500mg) and dbol(30mg) for six weeks, and I don't feel any cut on my normal test... 7 days after the cycle, I run 10mg per day of nolvadex, for 10 days... I manage to keep my gains a lt longer without any problem of sex drive or aggression...

[powerpack]

I cycle sust(500mg) and dbol(30mg) for six weeks, and I don't feel any cut on my normal test... 7 days after the cycle, I run 10mg per day of nolvadex, for 10 days... I manage to keep my gains a lt longer without any problem of sex drive or aggression...

Your lucky then.
Sust has the following esters in it
1)Porpionate (half life 4.5days)
2)Phenylpropionate (half life 4.5days)
3)Caproate (half life 9 days)
4)Decanate (half life 15 days)

So you would have started your PCT before your Decanate ester had even reached its half life.
First of all 6 weeks is not a very long cycle but you should have felt a crash at about the 2 1/2 week mark after you last shot.
Even a small one.
10 days is not a very long PCT and half of it was while the Decanate ester was still active.
But if you say you felt no crash you must be the lucky kinda guy who recovers very fast and very well.
Most are not, I personally took Nolvadex for a month after the last half life of the drug I was using.