Author Topic: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'  (Read 9126 times)

columbusdude82

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 6896
  • I'm too sexy for my shirt!!!
'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« on: May 12, 2008, 06:57:29 AM »
Two weeks ago, The Observer revealed how 17-year-old student Rand Abdel-Qader was beaten to death by her father after becoming infatuated with a British soldier in Basra. In this remarkable interview, Abdel-Qader Ali explains why he is unrepentant - and how police backed his actions. Afif Sarhan in Basra and Caroline Davies report

    * Afif Sarhan in Basra and Caroline Davies
    * The Observer,
    * Sunday May 11 2008
    * Article history

About this article
Close
This article appeared in the Observer on Sunday May 11 2008 on p8 of the News section. It was last updated at 00:03 on May 11 2008.

For Abdel-Qader Ali there is only one regret: that he did not kill his daughter at birth. 'If I had realised then what she would become, I would have killed her the instant her mother delivered her,' he said with no trace of remorse.

Two weeks after The Observer revealed the shocking story of Rand Abdel-Qader, 17, murdered because of her infatuation with a British solider in Basra, southern Iraq, her father is defiant. Sitting in the front garden of his well-kept home in the city's Al-Fursi district, he remains a free man, despite having stamped on, suffocated and then stabbed his student daughter to death.

Abdel-Qader, 46, a government employee, was initially arrested but released after two hours. Astonishingly, he said, police congratulated him on what he had done. 'They are men and know what honour is,' he said.

Rand, who was studying English at Basra University, was deemed to have brought shame on her family after becoming infatuated with a British soldier, 22, known only as Paul.

She died a virgin, according to her closest friend Zeinab. Indeed, her 'relationship' with Paul, which began when she worked as a volunteer helping displaced families and he was distributing water, appears to have consisted of snatched conversations over less than four months. But the young, impressionable Rand fell in love with him, confiding her feelings and daydreams to Zeinab, 19.

It was her first youthful infatuation and it would be her last. She died on 16 March after her father discovered she had been seen in public talking to Paul, considered to be the enemy, the invader and a Christian. Though her horrified mother, Leila Hussein, called Rand's two brothers, Hassan, 23, and Haydar, 21, to restrain Abdel-Qader as he choked her with his foot on her throat, they joined in. Her shrouded corpse was then tossed into a makeshift grave without ceremony as her uncles spat on it in disgust.

'Death was the least she deserved,' said Abdel-Qader. 'I don't regret it. I had the support of all my friends who are fathers, like me, and know what she did was unacceptable to any Muslim that honours his religion,' he said.

Sitting on a chair by his front door and surrounded by the gerberas and white daisies he had planted in the family garden, Abel-Qader attempted to justify his actions.

'I don't have a daughter now, and I prefer to say that I never had one. That girl humiliated me in front of my family and friends. Speaking with a foreign solider, she lost what is the most precious thing for any woman. 'People from western countries might be shocked, but our girls are not like their daughters that can sleep with any man they want and sometimes even get pregnant without marrying. Our girls should respect their religion, their family and their bodies.

'I have only two boys from now on. That girl was a mistake in my life. I know God is blessing me for what I did,' he said, his voice swelling with pride. 'My sons are by my side, and they were men enough to help me finish the life of someone who just brought shame to ours.'

Abdel-Qader, a Shia, says he was released from the police station 'because everyone knows that honour killings sometimes are impossible not to commit'. Chillingly, he said: 'The officers were by my side during all the time I was there, congratulating me on what I had done.' It's a statement that, if true, provides an insight into how vast the gulf remains between cultures in Iraq and between the Basra police the British army that trains them.

Sources have indicated that Abdel-Qader, who works in the health department, has been asked to leave because of the bad publicity, yet he will continue to draw a salary.

And it has been alleged by one senior unnamed official in the Basra governorate that he has received financial support by a local politician to enable him to 'disappear' to Jordan for a few weeks, 'until the story has been forgotten' - the usual practice in the 30-plus cases of 'honour' killings that have been registered since January alone.

Such treatment seems common in Basra, where militias have partial control, especially in the districts on the outskirts where Abdel-Qader lives.

While government security forces and British troops have control over the centre, around the fringes militants can still be seen everywhere on the streets or at the checkpoints they have erected. And they have imposed strict laws of behaviour for all the local people, including what clothing should be worn and what religious practices should be observed. There are reports of men having their hands cut off for looting and women being killed for prostitution.

Homosexuality is punishable by death, a sentence Abdel-Qader approves of with a passion. 'I have alerted my two sons. They will have the same end [as Rand] if they become contaminated with any gay relationship. These crimes deserve death - death in the name of God,' he said.

He said his daughter's 'bad genes were passed on from her mother'. Rand's mother, 41, remains in hiding after divorcing her husband in the immediate aftermath of the killing, living in fear of retribution from his family. She also still bears the scars of the severe beating he inflicted on her, breaking her arm in the process, when she told him she was going. 'They cannot accept me leaving him. When I first left I went to a cousin's home, but every day they were delivering notes to my door saying I was a prostitute and deserved the same death as Rand,' she said.

'She was killed by animals. Every night when go to bed I remember the face of Rand calling for help while her father and brothers ended her life,' she said, tears streaming down her face.

She was nervous, clearly terrified of being found, and her eyes constantly turned towards the window as she spoke. 'Rand told me about the soldier, but she swore it was just a friendship.

'She said she spoke with him because she was the only English speaker. I raised her in a religious manner and she never went out alone until she joined the university and then later when she was doing aid work.

'Even now, I cannot believe my ex-husband was able to kill our daughter. He wasn't a bad person. During our 24 years of marriage, he was never aggressive. But on that day, he was a different person.'

The mother is now trying to raise enough money to escape abroad. 'I miss my two boys,' she said. 'But they have sent a message saying that I am wrong for defending Rand and that I should go back home and live like a blessed Muslim woman,' said Leila, who is now volunteering with a local organisation campaigning for better protection for women in Basra.

One of those running the organisation, who did not want to be identified, said that Rand's case was similar to so many reported in Basra, with the only difference being she was in love with a foreigner, rather than an Iraqi.

'There isn't too much to say. Rand is dead. It is a tragedy and will be a tragedy for many other families in Iraq in the days to come.

'According to information we have been given, some from Rand's colleague, we have doubts that her love was reciprocated. We have the impression that Rand was in love, but the English soldier wasn't. But, for a girl to be paid nice compliments about her beauty and her intelligence, it was enough for her to think she was in love.

'She isn't here any more for her mother to ask any of the questions she would like to. Rand's case had repercussions because she fell in love with a foreigner. But what about the other girls murdered through "honour" killings because they fell in love with some of a different sect, or lost their virginity, or were forced to become prostitutes?'

Rand's mother used to call her 'Rose'. 'That was my nickname for her because when she was born she was so beautiful,' she said.

'Now, my lovely Rose is in her grave. But, God will make her father pay, either in this world ... or in the world after.'


http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/may/11/iraq.humanrights

columbusdude82

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 6896
  • I'm too sexy for my shirt!!!
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #1 on: May 12, 2008, 06:58:13 AM »
The "Religion of Peace" strikes again!!!

genrommel74

  • Getbig III
  • ***
  • Posts: 648
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #2 on: May 13, 2008, 01:47:51 AM »
that is horrible, i think pre-martial sex and homosexuality are wrong, but i dont think that they are punishable by death. All she did was talk to the soldier and they beat her to death

Danimal77

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 7486
  • Yo Adrian
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #3 on: May 14, 2008, 09:42:56 AM »
that is horrible, i think pre-martial sex and homosexuality are wrong, but i dont think that they are punishable by death. All she did was talk to the soldier and they beat her to death

What if someone gets married???? SO, according to you, they should never experience SEX?? That is horrible and SUCH a backwards way of thinking. You taught you this? Your parents?

ANYWAYS, as for the story of that poor little girl. The British soldier should have taken her away from the land of the Barbarians before it was too late for her. They should blow up that entire region (ALL Muslims) and this way they can all be with ALLAH.

Deedee

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5067
  • They sicken of the calm, who knew the storm.
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #4 on: May 14, 2008, 09:49:58 AM »
600 years ago, that scenario might have played out in a Christian society as well. In modern times it's barbaric though, and it must be awfully strange to grow up in a household where your own father would slit your throat at the drop of a hat.

Didn't some girl recently get murdered for having an unknown phone number on her cell? Sad!

Hustle Man

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 1351
  • What is the most common form of stupidity?
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #5 on: May 14, 2008, 11:38:59 AM »
600 years ago, that scenario might have played out in a Christian society as well. In modern times it's barbaric though, and it must be awfully strange to grow up in a household where your own father would slit your throat at the drop of a hat.

Didn't some girl recently get murdered for having an unknown phone number on her cell? Sad!

600 years ago, that scenario might have played out in a Christian society as well.

Then I would not call that a Christian society because this goes totally against Christianity.
W

Hustle Man

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 1351
  • What is the most common form of stupidity?
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #6 on: May 14, 2008, 12:00:40 PM »
Sharif Kanaana, professor of anthropology at Birzeit University states that honor killing is:

A complicated issue that cuts deep into the history of Arab society. .. What the men of the family, clan, or tribe seek control of in a patrilineal society is reproductive power. Women for the tribe were considered a factory for making men. The honor killing is not a means to control sexual power or behavior. What's behind it is the issue of fertility, or reproductive power.

Unreal, see this pisses me off!
W

genrommel74

  • Getbig III
  • ***
  • Posts: 648
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #7 on: May 14, 2008, 09:18:09 PM »
What if someone gets married???? SO, according to you, they should never experience SEX?? That is horrible and SUCH a backwards way of thinking. You taught you this? Your parents?


What? I said pre-martial sex, sex before marriage

The Master

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 13786
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #8 on: June 03, 2008, 01:16:04 PM »
Sharif Kanaana, professor of anthropology at Birzeit University states that honor killing is:

A complicated issue that cuts deep into the history of Arab society. .. What the men of the family, clan, or tribe seek control of in a patrilineal society is reproductive power. Women for the tribe were considered a factory for making men. The honor killing is not a means to control sexual power or behavior. What's behind it is the issue of fertility, or reproductive power.

Unreal, see this pisses me off!


These people are inferior. As simple as that. Completely inferior.

columbusdude82

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 6896
  • I'm too sexy for my shirt!!!
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #9 on: June 03, 2008, 01:17:22 PM »
There's more sad news to this story. The mother, who left her husband after he killed their daughter, was murdered the day she was planning to flee Iraq and move to Jordan to campaign for women's right. How tragic!

Nordic Superman

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 6670
  • Hesitation doesn't come easily in this blood...
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #10 on: June 03, 2008, 11:44:58 PM »
600 years ago, that scenario might have played out in a Christian society as well. In modern times it's barbaric though, and it must be awfully strange to grow up in a household where your own father would slit your throat at the drop of a hat.

Didn't some girl recently get murdered for having an unknown phone number on her cell? Sad!

Aren't you intelligent enough to discuss this without bringing in another religion?

Why try to reduce the negative impact this story has on islam by bringing up Christianity?

What do you expect us to get from your statement? ??? Please help me understand.

Do you honestly believe Christianity is as bad as islam?
الاسلام هو شيطانية

TrapsMcLats

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 2801
  • Lift Heavy. Lift Hard.
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #11 on: June 06, 2008, 06:50:18 PM »
fucking camels.  leave them to their own devices and they'll all kill each other, we don't need to be helping.  TURKA TURKA TURKA ALLLLLAH!!!!

Deedee

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5067
  • They sicken of the calm, who knew the storm.
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #12 on: June 06, 2008, 07:53:59 PM »
Aren't you intelligent enough to discuss this without bringing in another religion?

Why try to reduce the negative impact this story has on islam by bringing up Christianity?

What do you expect us to get from your statement? ??? Please help me understand.

Do you honestly believe Christianity is as bad as islam?

As far as I'm concerned, this is an example of women being relegated to less than human justice. Today the world is disgusted by Sharia law and all the other barbaric crap Islam foists on us. But take a look at the old testament if you want to find a history of similar treatment of women. Read a book about how women have fared throughout our glorious christian history.  Then I suggest you pick up a book about the priest Urbain Grandier to discover all the succulent details of how a heretic like you would have been punished in "our" world. They made it a point to write down every last torment.

You don't have to glorify christianity to make your point about your extremely visceral hatred of muslims. Being a Brit, I can understand your feelings... but really! You always do this, and what does that say about your intelligence? It's ridiculous to think we didn't behave in similar ways 600 hundred years ago.  And that was my point. They're living 600 years in the past and no one in the modern Western world really wants to go back there. 

Deicide

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22921
  • Reapers...
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #13 on: June 07, 2008, 01:15:27 AM »
As far as I'm concerned, this is an example of women being relegated to less than human justice. Today the world is disgusted by Sharia law and all the other barbaric crap Islam foists on us. But take a look at the old testament if you want to find a history of similar treatment of women. Read a book about how women have fared throughout our glorious christian history.  Then I suggest you pick up a book about the priest Urbain Grandier to discover all the succulent details of how a heretic like you would have been punished in "our" world. They made it a point to write down every last torment.

You don't have to glorify christianity to make your point about your extremely visceral hatred of muslims. Being a Brit, I can understand your feelings... but really! You always do this, and what does that say about your intelligence? It's ridiculous to think we didn't behave in similar ways 600 hundred years ago.  And that was my point. They're living 600 years in the past and no one in the modern Western world really wants to go back there. 

I have always said it: the middle east is a portal to the 14th century in many ways.
I hate the State.

Camel Jockey

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 16711
  • Mel Gibson and Bob Sly World Domination
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #14 on: June 07, 2008, 08:43:21 AM »

These people are inferior. As simple as that. Completely inferior.

Yes

Nordic Superman

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 6670
  • Hesitation doesn't come easily in this blood...
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #15 on: June 08, 2008, 02:16:28 PM »
As far as I'm concerned, this is an example of women being relegated to less than human justice. Today the world is disgusted by Sharia law and all the other barbaric crap Islam foists on us. But take a look at the old testament if you want to find a history of similar treatment of women. Read a book about how women have fared throughout our glorious christian history.  Then I suggest you pick up a book about the priest Urbain Grandier to discover all the succulent details of how a heretic like you would have been punished in "our" world. They made it a point to write down every last torment.

You don't have to glorify christianity to make your point about your extremely visceral hatred of muslims. Being a Brit, I can understand your feelings... but really! You always do this, and what does that say about your intelligence? It's ridiculous to think we didn't behave in similar ways 600 hundred years ago.  And that was my point. They're living 600 years in the past and no one in the modern Western world really wants to go back there. 

Christianity is bollocks, but I must admit without its centralizing influence in Europe, the developed world would be far behind where it is today.

The bible and sharia law are wholly different subjects and cannot possibly be compared as simply as you put it, and quite clealry displays a lack of understanding from you.

Read up on the koran, its infallibility, and the laws subscribed by "god". Then you will understand the fallacy in your comparison and also why islam, quite frankly, in my opinion is a dangerous ideology designed for control over primitive tribal cultures.
الاسلام هو شيطانية

24KT

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 24455
  • Gold Savings Account Rep +1 (310) 409-2244
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #16 on: June 08, 2008, 03:07:14 PM »
Christianity is bollocks, but I must admit without its centralizing influence in Europe, the developed world would be far behind where it is today.

The bible and sharia law are wholly different subjects and cannot possibly be compared as simply as you put it, and quite clealry displays a lack of understanding from you.

Read up on the koran, its infallibility, and the laws subscribed by "god". Then you will understand the fallacy in your comparison and also why islam, quite frankly, in my opinion is a dangerous ideology designed for control over primitive tribal cultures.

How can the same not be said of the bible, ...and the organized religion(s) it has spawned?
w

Nordic Superman

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 6670
  • Hesitation doesn't come easily in this blood...
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #17 on: June 08, 2008, 03:35:50 PM »
Simply the concept is not the same.

For a muslim, the koran is the infallible word of god, a perfect copy of the mother of all books which rests at god side since eternity, it transcends time. Ergo, it's laws transcend time. Laws in muhammad's time ARE APPLICABLE now. That means among other things, leaving islam is punishable by death, muslim women cannot marry outside of islam whilst men can (expansion via demographics), women's voice in a sharia court requires more evidence than that of a man.

The koran lays out laws, ways of life for the WHOLE system, your life, morals and that of the government.

Now tell me how that can be directly compared to the ambiguous text of the Christian bible?
الاسلام هو شيطانية

Deedee

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5067
  • They sicken of the calm, who knew the storm.
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #18 on: June 08, 2008, 03:43:00 PM »
Christianity is bollocks, but I must admit without its centralizing influence in Europe, the developed world would be far behind where it is today.

The bible and sharia law are wholly different subjects and cannot possibly be compared as simply as you put it, and quite clealry displays a lack of understanding from you.

Read up on the koran, its infallibility, and the laws subscribed by "god". Then you will understand the fallacy in your comparison and also why islam, quite frankly, in my opinion is a dangerous ideology designed for control over primitive tribal cultures.

I didn't explain myself well.  I realize there are differences between the two, but since this is a thread about women, I'll just go there and the differences are virtually transparent.

The mistake you're making (in my mind) is focusing on RELIGION versus the BEHAVIOR.  It doesn't matter if Islam is a dangerous ideology. As soon as "my religion is better than yours" enters the equation so do questions of the freedom to practice religion in a democratic society.  That in turn makes room for appeasements of all kinds, which is what extremists count on. It hasn't worked anywhere there is mass immigration.

The argument falls short anyway because Islam = horrible, doesn't automatically mean Everything Judeo-Christian = fantastische.

Don't you think we've come very far in 6-900 years. We used to stick pins into peoples' eyes to divine if they were witches.  Any woman in the 14th century was the possession of her father and brothers and if she didn't do what they said, she got the shit beat out of her, or was thrown into the oubliette.  If we look at our past we can see how far we've come and how much we have to lose.

THAT makes it much easier to tell women who can't roll up their sleeves to be sterile... fine don't be a nurse.  Go work in an ice cream factory.  Want to be a cypher with a schmata on your head? Fine, don't be a school teacher and stay out of government buildings.  Go home and cook. Want to kill your daughter... here's a prison cell. End of story.

Btw the Netherlands has started to take that very practical and effective approach. So has Australia.

The West has fought for our hard-won freedoms and civility, and guess that's why I keep comparing our past to their present.

Actually, if all women would throw off their burkas, the whole concept of fundamentalist Islam would totally fall apart, since their domination is central to the tribal culture, like Hustle Man said.  As for the girl and her mother... oh well, it's their country, and that's how it's done.  Besides, it always takes a few martyrs to start a revolution.

This Paul must be a hottie.  :D

The Master

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 13786
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #19 on: June 08, 2008, 03:47:11 PM »
It doesn't matter if Islam is a dangerous ideology.

That is just horseshit. If the dogma itself is more clear on the dominate the woman/expand Islam through violence shit, it will become much more difficult to have behavior that deviates from the scripture than it the "dominate the women/kill the infidel" shit was less clearly written.


Nordic Superman: HAve you found any expert on Islam that can flat out refute the points you made in your last post by using evidence from the Islamic dogma?

Nordic Superman

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 6670
  • Hesitation doesn't come easily in this blood...
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #20 on: June 08, 2008, 03:54:27 PM »
...

Actually, if all women would throw off their burkas, the whole concept of fundamentalist Islam would totally fall apart, since their domination is central to the tribal culture, like Hustle Man said.  As for the girl and her mother... oh well, it's their country, and that's how it's done.  Besides, it always takes a few martyrs to start a revolution.

This Paul must be a hottie.  :D

Frivolous issues aside, can you explain to me the difference between your politically correct perverse concept of "islam", and how it is different to "fundamentalist islam".

Most of your post is frivolous because you clearly missing on some of the key points of islam.
الاسلام هو شيطانية

Deedee

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5067
  • They sicken of the calm, who knew the storm.
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #21 on: June 08, 2008, 04:10:55 PM »
That is just horseshit. If the dogma itself is more clear on the dominate the woman/expand Islam through violence shit, it will become much more difficult to have behavior that deviates from the scripture than it the "dominate the women/kill the infidel" shit was less clearly written.


Nordic Superman: HAve you found any expert on Islam that can flat out refute the points you made in your last post by using evidence from the Islamic dogma?

I'm speaking only with regards to women's issues. What I was trying to tell NS is we should forget religion altogether, take it out of the equation, and judge actions based on our secular Western sensibilities, laws and fundamental freedoms.  As soon as we do that, the justification for all those religious appeasements that are so nauseating fly out the window.

I don't want to see women in burkas all over the streets.  The significance of them is offensive to all Western women who have fought for their freedoms. NS thinks I'm politically correct.  It's the opposite.  The Netherlands has banned them from public areas. Good. 

The Master

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 13786
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #22 on: June 08, 2008, 04:14:12 PM »
I'm speaking only with regards to women's issues. What I was trying to tell NS is we should forget religion altogether, take it out of the equation, and judge actions based on our secular Western sensibilities, laws and fundamental freedoms.  As soon as we do that, the justification for all those religious appeasements that are so nauseating fly out the window.

I don't want to see women in burkas all over the streets.  The significance of them is offensive to all Western women who have fought for their freedoms. NS thinks I'm politically correct.  It's the opposite.  The Netherlands has banned them from public areas. Good. 



Hopefully, Gert Wilders will come to ultimate power in the Netherlands.  >:(


And why the fuck are you Brits still threating these inferior idiots with silk hands? Where the fuck did your ginger cock and balls attitude from WW2 go? >:(

Deedee

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5067
  • They sicken of the calm, who knew the storm.
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #23 on: June 08, 2008, 04:21:27 PM »
Frivolous issues aside, can you explain to me the difference between your politically correct perverse concept of "islam", and how it is different to "fundamentalist islam".

Most of your post is frivolous because you clearly missing on some of the key points of islam.

As you wish. I do know this.  Your country, and France as well, has appeased a barbaric culture and you do this within the context of christian values.  Take religion out of the picture, make no room for it, look at the issues in a more historical and secular context, i.e. that was us then, not now, and we want no part of it, and the problem goes away.  Maybe I'm wrong, but it's how I look at it.

Deedee

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5067
  • They sicken of the calm, who knew the storm.
Re: 'My daughter deserved to die for falling in love'
« Reply #24 on: June 08, 2008, 04:23:26 PM »

Hopefully, Gert Wilders will come to ultimate power in the Netherlands.  >:(


And why the fuck are you Brits still threating these inferior idiots with silk hands? Where the fuck did your ginger cock and balls attitude from WW2 go? >:(


Are you talking to NS cause I'm not a Brit and have no ginger cock and balls attitude.  ;D

I'm Germanish, Canadianish.