Author Topic: Chiropractic Dangers  (Read 21014 times)

bodybuildermdpitt

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #25 on: June 10, 2008, 10:41:51 PM »
Nah. Thanks anyway.

I don't get caught up in all that jazz.

I am very conservative in practice, and just try to help as many people as I can.

Mike

I think it is called science not jazz. I could be wrong though.

Azn Muscle

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #26 on: June 10, 2008, 11:02:30 PM »
Moose,

       I went to a chiropractor a few years ago for some adjustments and it was great relief for some back pain I had.  My question is, how many times a month do you recommend people getting adjustments?  Some people say it has to be an ongoing thing (like twice a month), can you elaborate on this?


Tre

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #27 on: June 10, 2008, 11:08:34 PM »
I have adjusted over 135,000 patients in 18 years of being a chiropractor.

Never had one problem with one patient in  any way.

They're scared to tell you out of the fear that you might get angry and paralyze them.   ;)

Moosejay

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #28 on: June 11, 2008, 04:20:12 AM »
So in 8 years you are claiming to have seen 124,000+ patients?

MooseJaw has been at it 18 years and he's only seen 135K patients, he also claims to work 80-90 hours a week. How do you manage to double his patients which he claims is about 143 per week? Do you work 160-180 hours a week? :o



I own two businesses

Moosejay

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #29 on: June 11, 2008, 04:21:25 AM »
Now wait a minute, he's claiming 135,000 unique patients or fucking patient visits?  I don't think there are 135,000 people in the whole state of CT, are there?    ???

 ;D

PV's

Moosejay

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #30 on: June 11, 2008, 04:23:36 AM »
Good thing I have call tonight, I guess posting makes the night go by faster. I will address all the issues you have brought up. Chiropractics should not under any circumstance diagnose any ailment through their interpretation of scans (CT or even X-ray). Quite frankly, you don't have the training to do it accurately. To be taken seriously you need to have your scans read by MSK radiologists. Many, many studies have shown that, unfortunately, you guys do not have uniform diagnoses on simple MSK complaints. Secondly, you have to address this issue of laxity of the ligaments secondary to chronic manipulations. Although this may surprise you, manipulations have a place in medicine, and should be done through physiatrists. Physiatry is a science, and unfortunately the other is modern day "quackery."

Young man: if you are going to be a doctor....may I suggest you concentrate on helping people instead of getting in pissing contests.

Your attitude is EXACTLY waht fucks up healthcare

Hope this helps (But I doubt It)

liberty

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #31 on: June 11, 2008, 04:26:04 AM »
I got an uncle in Cairo.....
He's a Cairopracter........nyuk nyuk nyuk

Moosejay

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #32 on: June 11, 2008, 04:26:19 AM »
Moose,

       I went to a chiropractor a few years ago for some adjustments and it was great relief for some back pain I had.  My question is, how many times a month do you recommend people getting adjustments?  Some people say it has to be an ongoing thing (like twice a month), can you elaborate on this?



Nah. I go case-by-case. Whatever the patient needs.

If you keep on engaging in activity that causes the back problem, then, obviously, you'd need more.

Moosejay

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #33 on: June 11, 2008, 04:27:21 AM »
They're scared to tell you out of the fear that you might get angry and paralyze them.   ;)

Doubt it. They just wouldn't return

Team Diver

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #34 on: June 11, 2008, 04:44:46 AM »
How many patients does Franco have?

dr.chimps

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #35 on: June 11, 2008, 04:55:26 AM »
I have a clinical question I am thinking of researching with a colleague of mine. It deals with neck readjustments and CVAs (strokes).  Have any of you guys had chronic neck readjustments from chiropractors? If so, what was the reason, and does it help? Also, did the chiropractor read any images for you, and try to diagnose you from his interpretation of the images? I am trying to start a study (obviously it is in its very early inception), as of now I am trying to get some basic brain storming ideas.

cheers,

bodybuildingmdpitt
Brainstorming!? From the title of this thread you've already made your conclusions. What do you need our input for? Legitimacy?   ???

Moosejay

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #36 on: June 11, 2008, 05:30:35 AM »
How many patients does Franco have?

He has an associate. From what I understand he is not there much.

Monster_Everything

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #37 on: June 11, 2008, 05:32:04 AM »
How many patients does Franco have?
Hahahahah gayer than getting 'franco' to give you the 'Arnold Special' at his 'shop' ...er i mean 'office' ....  ::)
The Number 2 in Scranton

Moosejay

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #38 on: June 11, 2008, 05:32:11 AM »
Brainstorming!? From the title of this thread you've already made your conclusions. What do you need our input for? Legitimacy?   ???

And there you are.

Yes, I have never heard of any dangers regarding medicine.

Most deleterious observations come from $ motivations.

Brutal_1

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #39 on: June 11, 2008, 05:33:15 AM »
Good thing I have call tonight, I guess posting makes the night go by faster. I will address all the issues you have brought up. Chiropractics should not under any circumstance diagnose any ailment through their interpretation of scans (CT or even X-ray). Quite frankly, you don't have the training to do it accurately. To be taken seriously you need to have your scans read by MSK radiologists. Many, many studies have shown that, unfortunately, you guys do not have uniform diagnoses on simple MSK complaints. Secondly, you have to address this issue of laxity of the ligaments secondary to chronic manipulations. Although this may surprise you, manipulations have a place in medicine, and should be done through physiatrists. Physiatry is a science, and unfortunately the other is modern day "quackery."



I KNEW IT!

I saw this coming a mile away...  ::)  ::)  ::)
just not good enough

Moosejay

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #40 on: June 11, 2008, 05:37:55 AM »


I KNEW IT!

I saw this coming a mile away...  ::)  ::)  ::)

Aww, leave him alone. He just feels threatened....

Brutal_1

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #41 on: June 11, 2008, 05:42:22 AM »
Aww, leave him alone. He just feels threatened....

I just don't see what the point is??   ::)

How can he be so busy with medicine yet still find time to be a hater?!  This is expressly why I don't get along with medical students...they're a "special breed"
just not good enough

Moosejay

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #42 on: June 11, 2008, 05:46:04 AM »
I just don't see what the point is??   ::)

How can he be so busy with medicine yet still find time to be a hater?!  This is expressly why I don't get along with medical students...they're a "special breed"

Put it this way:

Everyone has something to offer in helping patients. He's wasting his time with the negativity.

He should concentrate on how he is going to pay his loans back with the advent of Nationalized health care.

Chances are, he won't be able to.

Let those thoughts keep him warm at night.

Moosejay Approved

Luv2Hurt

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #43 on: June 11, 2008, 06:20:53 AM »
Just make sure you have a good treatment goal...there is no need for lifetime treatment.

It seems the Chiro I go to regularly right now, makes sense he has me doing excersise at home, Cerv traction, head weights, forming thingys you lay on, wooble chair.  My xrays showed not much curve in neck, thoratic cob (bend in spine).  So I have been being adjusted 3 times a week for the first 3 months then on to maintenece. The neck adjustments took some getting used to thats for sure.

I was always sceptical of chiros but now think they have lots to offer, they teach the whole lifestyle approach which makes sense also.  This helped convince me they can help, when i did the wobble chair thing I noticed it would cause a pain in my left testicle when I moved to one side.  After a while thinking not much of it told the DC and he said thats a pinched nerve.  He adjusteted me on my side where they push bent legs down and after that the pain in the nuts was gone.  It has come back a bit to a lesser degree now and then but much less than before and very infrequently now, it suprised me how well it worked.

Anyhow It seems they push that being adjusted is a lifelong thing, yeah it keeps the money coming in for them.  But it makes sense to me especially if training heavy and stressing my spine pretty hard.  Does 2 times a month sound about right for maintence?  Im sure it varys with the individual.  My insurance covers 40 visits a year so that should have me covered.

onlyme

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #44 on: June 11, 2008, 06:34:59 AM »
Not sure if this was asked.  I had prolotherapy done on my wrist.  It hurt so bad during treatment but the end result was awesome and above what I suspected.  My good friend also had it done on his shoulder when every other form of treatment did nothing, prolotherapy works wonders.  Why is it that only chiropractors did this therapy and why was it illegal and so many chiropractors lost their license for doing it.  Why didn't MD's use this therapy.

onlyme

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #45 on: June 11, 2008, 06:47:26 AM »
Some more on chiropractic stuff.  My old manager had severe asthma and he gained a lot of weight and when we traveled he always spent time in the hospital.  He started seriously going to a chiropractor where he lives and the chiropractor helped his asthma and he lost all the weight and became a very successful bodybuilder.  Whenever I put on an armwrestling meet I got a local chiropractor to sponsor the show and they would come in and massage the athlete after a match.  The guys loved it and they all felt great so they could go compete more.  If you see in the background of this picture you can see a big banner promoting the clinic in Ft Meyer we had.  Funny thing is 15 years later I was at the Paris hotel here in Vegas and was walking into the casino when I saw one of the chiropractors from the clinic.  He was a really cool guy. 

Krankenstein

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #46 on: June 11, 2008, 07:32:11 AM »
So in 8 years you are claiming to have seen 124,000+ patients?

MooseJaw has been at it 18 years and he's only seen 135K patients, he also claims to work 80-90 hours a week. How do you manage to double his patients which he claims is about 143 per week? Do you work 160-180 hours a week? :o


As I have said...PATIENT VISITS....thats what my practice sees per week.  Some patients 3x/week.....some 1x/week....some 1x/month.  As far as what my hours are.....9 - 12, 3 - 7 M/W/F.....3 - 7 Tu/Th.....and 9 - 12 on Sat.

As far as how do I manage?  Simple....I dont get caught up chit-chatting a lot for 20mins per patient

Krankenstein

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #47 on: June 11, 2008, 07:41:15 AM »
Good thing I have call tonight, I guess posting makes the night go by faster. I will address all the issues you have brought up. Chiropractics should not under any circumstance diagnose any ailment through their interpretation of scans (CT or even X-ray). Quite frankly, you don't have the training to do it accurately. To be taken seriously you need to have your scans read by MSK radiologists. Many, many studies have shown that, unfortunately, you guys do not have uniform diagnoses on simple MSK complaints. Secondly, you have to address this issue of laxity of the ligaments secondary to chronic manipulations. Although this may surprise you, manipulations have a place in medicine, and should be done through physiatrists. Physiatry is a science, and unfortunately the other is modern day "quackery."

Quackery...how did I know you were going to throw that in.  As far as diagnosing "ailments" on film.  I diagnose biomechanical problems and structural misalignments.  If I see anything that I dont recognize or think could in ANY WAY be something other than normal tissue appearance....guess where it goes?  A RADIOLOGIST.  I get a full report back in 24hrs.  Other than that I am qualified. 

I would like to know where these studies are that show I cant properly diagnose a musculo-skelatal complaint properly.  I wont get into anymore of this...because you sure attempted to not be very anti-chiro.....but each post you make has little "jabs" at my profession.  One in which I have helped manythat HAVEN'T gotten the relief they asked their MD's for.  So when you claim that we need to do XYZ in order to be taken seriously....I take offense to it.

Necrosis

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #48 on: June 11, 2008, 08:09:08 AM »
Quackery...how did I know you were going to throw that in.  As far as diagnosing "ailments" on film.  I diagnose biomechanical problems and structural misalignments.  If I see anything that I dont recognize or think could in ANY WAY be something other than normal tissue appearance....guess where it goes?  A RADIOLOGIST.  I get a full report back in 24hrs.  Other than that I am qualified. 

I would like to know where these studies are that show I cant properly diagnose a musculo-skelatal complaint properly.  I wont get into anymore of this...because you sure attempted to not be very anti-chiro.....but each post you make has little "jabs" at my profession.  One in which I have helped manythat HAVEN'T gotten the relief they asked their MD's for.  So when you claim that we need to do XYZ in order to be taken seriously....I take offense to it.

MDs are above chiros, you guys seem so defensive, like you have to prove something. All they ask is for proof, science will reveal the truth.

for the record, chiros are great, osteopaths better imo. Certainly not quackery, but all the energetic shit etc.. that some do is ridiculous

stormshadow

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Re: Chiropractic Dangers
« Reply #49 on: June 11, 2008, 08:40:52 AM »
As a child I grew up with headaches everyday and my parents took me to the chiropractor very often.  He used the Pierce method which involves a scan and very specific adjustments.  I think many do this now, but keep in mind this was 20 years ago.

My headaches disappeared somewhere around middle school age and I think it was mostly due to stress and diet.

On the negative, My mom had a disc ruptured from a chiropractor which resulted in back surgery.  The same doctor that worked on Mario Lemieux, did my mom's surgery.

I also had a friend in VT that had a disc ruptured from a chiropractor.  As he started to research, he found from reports in the hospital emergency room that it happens quite often.

I think they offer some good things, esp Active Release Techniques, but having them make these multiple adjustments on a regular basis is putting yourself at risk.