Simple carbs after workout,, HOW MANY?

[cbo]

I am 167 pounds and my post workout recover drink contains a creatine mix and about 45 grams of simple carbs. Is this enough to spike my insulin or do i need more simple carbs than just 45 grams.  I bought a gatorade powder mix bucket and I'm trying to figure out whether i need to put a scoop of that in there as well. That would boost it up to about 60 or 70ish,, whatcha think,, TANKS

[Markoni]

I would use 75g

[JasonH]

I am 167 pounds and my post workout recover drink contains a creatine mix and about 45 grams of simple carbs. Is this enough to spike my insulin or do i need more simple carbs than just 45 grams.  I bought a gatorade powder mix bucket and I'm trying to figure out whether i need to put a scoop of that in there as well. That would boost it up to about 60 or 70ish,, whatcha think,, TANKS

I would say it is - I have the same amount of carbs post workout and I haven't seen a aproblem and I weigh 240.

[Necrosis]

i would suggest littel to none as research has shown high gi carbs after training have minimal effect on body composition

[candidizzle]

i would suggest littel to none as research has shown high gi carbs after training have minimal effect on body composition

 

[Go 4 It]

i would suggest littel to none as research has shown high gi carbs after training have minimal effect on body composition

Really? I thought the high gi carbs along with whey isolate help shuttle the protein into the muscle quickly and restore glycogen.....is this a myth..seriously?

[candidizzle]

Really? I thought the high gi carbs along with whey isolate help shuttle the protein into the muscle quickly and restore glycogen.....is this a myth..seriously?

myth? no. thats what happens. BUT, you dotn need high gi carbs to 'shuttle' protein into the muscle post training.  in fact; you NEVER need insulin or carbs in order to get protein into the muscle. insulin is counterbalanced by igf. so you always grow and absorb your food. carb or no carb.   the difference is that insulin does it better than igf.  so carbs are better for anabolism than no carbs. insulin=most anabolic hormone. BUT, and this is a big BUT, post training protien synthesis is ALREADY maximized; there is no need for insulin; the body is already growing and manufacturing proteins at the fastest rate possible. 

[Necrosis]

Really? I thought the high gi carbs along with whey isolate help shuttle the protein into the muscle quickly and restore glycogen.....is this a myth..seriously?

pretty much, glycogen depletion is a beneficial state where nutrients are taken up quite easity as the GLUT4 receptors are up regulated, insulin sensitivity increased etc.. so spiking insulin is not all that importatnt. A recent study showed no gains over straight protein, as did others. id say its just some shitty macros that you dont need in your diet. Pre workout carbs are helpful, nice complex ones is all you'll need and some protein in milk afterwards.

[Necrosis]

myth? no. thats what happens. BUT, you dotn need high gi carbs to 'shuttle' protein into the muscle post training.  in fact; you NEVER need insulin or carbs in order to get protein into the muscle. insulin is counterbalanced by igf. so you always grow and absorb your food. carb or no carb.   the difference is that insulin does it better than igf.  so carbs are better for anabolism than no carbs. insulin=most anabolic hormone. BUT, and this is a big BUT, post training protien synthesis is ALREADY maximized; there is no need for insulin; the body is already growing and manufacturing proteins at the fastest rate possible. 

good post.

[Go 4 It]

So what would be the ideal post workout shake or meal?

[candidizzle]

So what would be the ideal post workout shake or meal?

how about 3 g bcaa +5 g leucine + 5g creatine+ 20 g whey + 20 g casien

[candidizzle]

good post.

thanks !

[candidizzle]

and maybe consider some safflower oil ! LOL !

[Go 4 It]

how about 3 g bcaa +5 g leucine + 5g creatine+ 20 g whey + 20 g casien

So no carbs at all post workout? No waxymaize, dextrose, maltodex, vitargo?

[Necrosis]

So no carbs at all post workout? No waxymaize, dextrose, maltodex, vitargo?

vitargo may be beneficial, with its unique GI and insuligenic properties. Dextrose etc nope. Sugar is a toxic substance, super quick insulin release with hypoglycemia to follow, not to mention immunosuppression, oxidants etc..

i would have mostly complex carbs all day for my meals, you wil gain much more size with this then adding in glucose.

[Go 4 It]

vitargo may be beneficial, with its unique GI and insuligenic properties. Dextrose etc nope. Sugar is a toxic substance, super quick insulin release with hypoglycemia to follow, not to mention immunosuppression, oxidants etc..

i would have mostly complex carbs all day for my meals, you wil gain much more size with this then adding in glucose.

So what would you suggest then a couple scoops of isolate in water?? Does it matter then if I eat complex carbs then directly post workout?

[Bobby]

40-80g carbs from dextrose + 40g protein of whey

[d0nny2600]

and maybe consider some safflower oil ! LOL !

Candidizzle your posts/information you are posting is getting better and better. Props!

[candidizzle]

40-80g carbs from dextrose + 40g protein of whey

hey bro if you want to do the simpl carbs post workout thats cool, but i dont think your ever going to need 80 grams of carbs. MAYBE, if you did quads+hams+calves and kicked major ass on all of them then did some cardio.....   other wise i am pretty sure you wont be depleting anywhere near that much glycogen.

[Bobby]

hey bro if you want to do the simpl carbs post workout thats cool, but i dont think your ever going to need 80 grams of carbs. MAYBE, if you did quads+hams+calves and kicked major ass on all of them then did some cardio.....   other wise i am pretty sure you wont be depleting anywhere near that much glycogen.

Really? there are tons of ppl that recommend a 2:1 carb/protein ratio and 1:1 if dieting...

Do you think the body can absorb all of the 40g wheyprotein at once? or will some go to waste..

[candidizzle]

Really? there are tons of ppl that recommend a 2:1 carb/protein ratio and 1:1 if dieting...

Do you think the body can absorb all of the 40g wheyprotein at once? or will some go to waste..

for sure i think the body can ABSORB 40 grams of whey protein. the question is does it NEED that much whey protien ? personally, i dont think so.  i am a huge believe in high protein intake and eating TONS of meat throughout the day. but whey protein is a different kind of protein, really. the major difference is DIGESTION RATE. whole meats take a lloooonnnngggg time to digest and provide a slow small steady stream of amino acids into the blood stream. whereas whey protein is "pre digested" and it all enters the blood stream at one time.  i doubt you will ever benefit from more than 20-30 grams of whey protein concentrated in the blood stream at any one time. at least, not unless you have a LBM of 220+.

but if you are a "hard gainer", maybe go ahead and take the 40 grams of whey.


as for the 2=1 carb to protein ratio... (1=1 when dieting).... there is just simply ZERO evidence to support that theory and nothing to make me think drinking simple sugars post workout is going t do anything for growth.

[Bobby]

What do you take pwo?

[candidizzle]

What do you take pwo?

i just drink about 20 grams whey

[Bobby]

why no carb? did u not watch the milos seminar?

[candidizzle]

yeah

i outlined why no carbs earlier in the thread

basically, even if i was in off season mode, i see  no reason toconsume any liquid sugars. there is no benefit and it doesnt make you grow faster. so to me, post workout carbs (like dextrose or waxy) are uneccesary calories that mess with insulin sensitivity..    ill eat some black beans or ezekiel bread along with some chicken or turkey or tuna or steak about 45 mins post workout when im looking for mass.

right now though, im burning fat. so im more worried about being anti-catabolic than being anabolic.