HOLY CRAP

[Hugo Chavez]

We've been doing covert ops in Iran AND abducting targets, dragging them into Iraq and interrogating them   Is this fucking crap for real.  I don't have a link, just heard it on the news this morning.

[Stark]

We've been doing covert ops in Iran AND abducting targets, dragging them into Iraq and interrogating them   Is this fucking crap for real.  I don't have a link, just heard it on the news this morning.

hold your horses, "they" have said they want to make sure that we all understand that no US personal is crossing the border, they just give
friendlies a lot of money and equipment to do the dirty work for them

[headhuntersix]

Welcome to the real world...the article, which I read, did not detail what Iran is doing in Iraq. I liked the article but I'm sorry, iran is doing all kinds of shit in the South to try and distablize our position. Much of the Mahdi army command group has fled into Iran to regroup.

[Hugo Chavez]

Welcome to the real world...the article, which I read, did not detail what Iran is doing in Iraq. I liked the article but I'm sorry, iran is doing all kinds of shit in the South to try and distablize our position. Much of the Mahdi army command group has fled into Iran to regroup.

oh fuck, you're going to do it, do it right asshole.  I want a full fledged "You can't handle the truth" moment.

[Fury]

oh fuck, you're going to do it, do it right asshole.  I want a full fledged "You can't handle the truth" moment.

Why do you only focus on the American side and refuse to acknowledge what Iran has been doing in Iraq for a few years now? 

Proxy wars are interesting things.

[headhuntersix]

I guess what happens to our side just doesn't matter. I could care less what happens to Iranians. Every see what an EFP does to a Humvee..or a human body.

[Bindare_Dundat]

Welcome to the real world...the article, which I read, did not detail what Iran is doing in Iraq. I liked the article but I'm sorry, iran is doing all kinds of shit in the South to try and distablize our position. Much of the Mahdi army command group has fled into Iran to regroup.

Do you have irriftual proof of what you claim. Something as concrete as say this type of proof,

[Fury]

I guess what happens to our side just doesn't matter. I could care less what happens to Iranians. Every see what an EFP does to a Humvee..or a human body.

Hugo and co. couldn't give two shits about what happens to Americans as a direct result of Iranian actions. We're the bad guy remember. It's wrong for us to meddle in foreign affairs but it's perfectly ok for Iran to kill Americans in any country not named Iran. Funny double-edged sword that is.

[Stark]

I guess what happens to our side just doesn't matter. I could care less what happens to Iranians. Every see what an EFP does to a Humvee..or a human body.

You ever seen what a JDAM does to a family?

Most of the people in iran are friendlies, the Government and religios figures are the once that fuck it up for the rest.

[headhuntersix]

Proof...yeah I have slide shows full of briefings showing Irainin Quds bringing weapons/EFP's etc. Let me ask u something...where do get any proof to say otherwise...the internet. Give me a break. Again its all America's fault. iran just wants to be left alone.  

a JDAM...is that ur buzz weapon of the week. Whats a JDAM Stark. And yes i do...not that I care but I've seen B1 strikes...A-10's is awsome. It means I don't have to risk the lives of my soldiers to clear an area.

[Hugo Chavez]

Do you have irriftual proof of what you claim. Something as concrete as say this type of proof,

lol... slight credibitlity problem they have

[Hugo Chavez]

Why do you only focus on the American side and refuse to acknowledge what Iran has been doing in Iraq for a few years now? 

Proxy wars are interesting things.

really you have proof?  I've looked for it over and over.  I've asked on this board several times.  Nobody has any proof and the proof that has been delivered has ended up being false by offical accouts--such and the "made in Iran" weapons.  false.  You got proof, please feel free to list it, I'm listening.

[MuscleMcMannus]

Why do you only focus on the American side and refuse to acknowledge what Iran has been doing in Iraq for a few years now? 

Proxy wars are interesting things.

Because America is supposed to represent something bigger and better than Iran or any other country in the world.  We are not supposed to succumb to the same tactics used by terrorist nations.  We are supposed to stand for justice and morality.  Like headhuntersix said........that's not the real world.  But somehow you forgot to tell the American people that.  

[MRDUMPLING]

Proof...yeah I have slide shows full of briefings showing Irainin Quds bringing weapons/EFP's etc. Let me ask u something...where do get any proof to say otherwise...the internet. Give me a break. Again its all America's fault. iran just wants to be left alone.  

a JDAM...is that ur buzz weapon of the week. Whats a JDAM Stark. And yes i do...not that I care but I've seen B1 strikes...A-10's is awsome. It means I don't have to risk the lives of my soldiers to clear an area.

Hey, HH6...just curious.

How good are the Iranian special forces?  I haven't heard anything for or against, militarily speaking.(training, weapons, experience, etc.)

I know you have read his book and you gotta admit whether you like him or not...I'm glad Richard Marcinko was on our side.  LOL

[youandme]

I guess what happens to our side just doesn't matter. I could care less what happens to Iranians. Every see what an EFP does to a Humvee..or a human body.

Dude, people on this board have no idea what it takes to keep this country safe day in day out. And sad thing is I'm not talking about the past 8 years I'm talking about pre 9/11. I had friends pulling dead bodies out of the gulf on covert mission before homeland security was even brainstormed. Another sad thing is half the people on this board don't deserve these freedoms that US soldiers give them, they only know of the dead body count on the news from the Iraq war and not the ones that die fighting secret terror wars against smaller nation states off our coast and in our waters, the ones you don't hear about on the news, alot more countries other than just ME want bloodshed. 

[Bindare_Dundat]

Dude, people on this board have no idea what it takes to keep this country safe day in day out. And sad thing is I'm not talking about the past 8 years I'm talking about pre 9/11. I had friends pulling dead bodies out of the gulf on covert mission before homeland security was even brainstormed. Another sad thing is half the people on this board don't deserve these freedoms that US soldiers give them, they only know of the dead body count on the news from the Iraq war and not the ones that die fighting secret terror wars against smaller nation states off our coast and in our waters, the ones you don't hear about on the news, alot more countries other than just ME want bloodshed. 

So questioning things makes people anti American? I thought being allowed to question things is what makes America great.

[youandme]

So questioning things makes people anti American? I thought being allowed to question things is what makes America great.

I never said questioning things was anti-american. I pointed out a great majority of people do not know the sacrifices people and this country take and make in order for people to question things. 

[Bindare_Dundat]

I never said questioning things was anti-american. I pointed out a great majority of people do not know the sacrifices people and this country take and make in order for people to question things. 

 if we werent in Iraq right now we wouldnt be able to question things?

[youandme]

if we werent in Iraq right now we wouldnt be able to question things?

wow 

[MuscleMcMannus]

Dude, people on this board have no idea what it takes to keep this country safe day in day out. And sad thing is I'm not talking about the past 8 years I'm talking about pre 9/11. I had friends pulling dead bodies out of the gulf on covert mission before homeland security was even brainstormed. Another sad thing is half the people on this board don't deserve these freedoms that US soldiers give them, they only know of the dead body count on the news from the Iraq war and not the ones that die fighting secret terror wars against smaller nation states off our coast and in our waters, the ones you don't hear about on the news, alot more countries other than just ME want bloodshed. 

No I have a very good idea of what it takes to keep this country safe.  But like many I also realize all the bullshit behind the scenes corruption, deceit, and propaganda that goes on behind closed doors.  Maybe instead of the Art of War every U.S. soldier should read War is a Racket by Smedley Butler.  

[youandme]

I'll check that book out.

But I'm pretty sure most soldiers already know the ins and outs of what they do and what is asked of them, they are not cyborgs or emotionless human beings as some liberal media outlets would have some believe.

The bullshit behind the scenes is an important part of the process. Wihout it, we would have seen British and German troops (happend to the French for the lack of the "behind the scenes" approach) give up on the battlefields of passchendale, instead they stood together because of the unity, that propaganda had built into their outlooks of the battlefield.

Always a dark side to everything. And when this is all said in done in Iraq it's going to be something great. People also don't realize we are done fighting with "Iraq" that assault lasted 3 days. We went into the lion's den to fight the lions and to attract them, and we are pulling out our enemies one by one.

The "axis of evil" Iran (we have made them show their cards) Iraq (completed) North Korea (in the process of breaking down, in a very sad way since many innocent people have suffered as a result)

[MuscleMcMannus]

I'll check that book out.

But I'm pretty sure most soldiers already know the ins and outs of what they do and what is asked of them, they are not cyborgs or emotionless human beings as some liberal media outlets would have some believe.

The bullshit behind the scenes is an important part of the process. Wihout it, we would have seen British and German troops (happend to the French for the lack of the "behind the scenes" approach) give up on the battlefields of passchendale, instead they stood together because of the unity, that propaganda had built into their outlooks of the battlefield.

Always a dark side to everything. And when this is all said in done in Iraq it's going to be something great. People also don't realize we are done fighting with "Iraq" that assault lasted 3 days. We went into the lion's den to fight the lions and to attract them, and we are pulling out our enemies one by one.

The "axis of evil" Iran (we have made them show their cards) Iraq (completed) North Korea (in the process of breaking down, in a very sad way since many innocent people have suffered as a result)

Soldiers are part of an institution.  They are indoctrinated.  The military spends countless hours and billions of dollars indoctrinating young men and women.  And as such they should.  Without this indoctrination soldiers would not be able to do his or her job appropriately.  They need this in order to follow commands without question.  To say anyone would want a military filled with independent thinking philosophers is ludicrous.  With that being said VERY FEW soldiers have a far reaching objective grasp on foreign policy.  I'm not harping on you but my example illustrates my point.  You've never heard of Smedley Butler nor his book War is a Racket, it was written back in the 30's I believe.  He was a decorated Marine, one that made public the plot to assassinate the President Franklin Roosevelt.  I'd be curious as to know how many soldiers have read the 9/11 Commission Report and how many of those soldiers have also read The Road to 9/11 by Peter Dale Scott or 9/11 Questions by David Ray Griffin or any other book that questions the official 9/11 story.  How many soldiers have read House of Saud House of Bush?  Or do soldiers only read what fits their beliefs?  Why is it the military so often seems to be made up of right wing conservative liberal haters.  I've read Lone Survivor by Marcus Luttrell have you?  It's a great book but it's filled with as much propaganda as any book written by the left.  And I don't consider myself a liberal by any means.  But I'm also not a neocon right wing nut hugger either. 

[Fury]

really you have proof?  I've looked for it over and over.  I've asked on this board several times.  Nobody has any proof and the proof that has been delivered has ended up being false by offical accouts--such and the "made in Iran" weapons.  false.  You got proof, please feel free to list it, I'm listening.

Do you have proof of anything? Are you privy to classified info. I guess the Iraqi government going to Tehran to tell Iran to stay the fuck out of their business was all just a conspiracy theory (which I suspect you to claim)? I guess all the Iranian EFP's just happening to end up in Mehdi Army hands just appeared out of thin air.

Regardless, what proof do you have of these "abductions." They hold less water than the claims of Iranian involvement in Iraq. But I suspect you aren't bright enough to use logic like that. You're like a Mini-Bush.

http://strata-sphere.com/blog/index.php/archives/5388

Feel free to read that. I'm sure you'll chalk it up to some stupid ass conspiracy theory, though.

[MuscleMcMannus]

I'll check that book out.

But I'm pretty sure most soldiers already know the ins and outs of what they do and what is asked of them, they are not cyborgs or emotionless human beings as some liberal media outlets would have some believe.

The bullshit behind the scenes is an important part of the process. Wihout it, we would have seen British and German troops (happend to the French for the lack of the "behind the scenes" approach) give up on the battlefields of passchendale, instead they stood together because of the unity, that propaganda had built into their outlooks of the battlefield.
Always a dark side to everything. And when this is all said in done in Iraq it's going to be something great. People also don't realize we are done fighting with "Iraq" that assault lasted 3 days. We went into the lion's den to fight the lions and to attract them, and we are pulling out our enemies one by one.

The "axis of evil" Iran (we have made them show their cards) Iraq (completed) North Korea (in the process of breaking down, in a very sad way since many innocent people have suffered as a result)

If you're a student of military and history may I also suggest these books:
Conjuring Hitler
Wallstreet and FDR
Wallstreet and The Bolshevik Revolution
Wallstreet and The Rise of Hitler
Confessions of an Economic Hit Man

Some other good books I suggest you read
Web of Debt by Ellen Brown
The Israel Lobby and U.S. Foreign Policy
The Road to 9/11 by Peter Dale Scott
A Century of War by Engdahl

And please post some books that you'd recommend.  I've read Art of War and Lone Survivor as well in the past year.  What pro U.S. Foreign policy books can you recommend to me?  

[youandme]

I don't have ill regards towards institutionalization. That was not what I was getting at, the view is this - the ability to follow commands and know the objective apart from outside interference. History shows that institutions are heavily wrong in the decision making process and timing of decisions. What you think that those in the armed forces, cannot read philosophy? I know that most of the books Ihave read with regards to war were written by some of the most decorated veterans and fighters, such as Ernst Junger. Something is to be said about a man or women that writes of a first hand account with no bias, with that said I read Lone Survivor, I had already made my mind up and was biased though so I stuck through it, haha.