What does not go with Clen.

[Alex23]

Clen not being a prescription asthma drug in the US due to it causing heart enlargement is something you pulled out of your ass. Please tell me when it was pulled off the shelves due to it causing heart enlargement (it wasn't on the market in the first place).

Yes it was. Until 1992. Albuterol, replaced it.

Now go push "chemicals" to little dreamers with a body to destroy.

[Van_Bilderass]

Yes it was. Until 1992. Albuterol, replaced it.

What brand names was it sold under for human use? I think you are mistaken but by all means show me wrong.
If you have data showing clenbuterol to cause heart enlargement in asthmatics please show me a reference (not animal data). I'm especially interested in evidence that says clen is drastically more cardiotoxic than something like albuterol. Think about this: if clen kills your heart what makes you think albuterol, another beta-2 agonist, doesn't do the same?

The reason clen isn't and wasn't an asthma medication in the US is most likely due to its very long half-life among other things, not because it was found to cause heart enlargement like you claim.

Now go push "chemicals" to little dreamers with a body to destroy.

I'd never recommend clen to anyone or say it's completely safe. But I don't make up "facts" like you.

[Alex23]

I'd never recommend clen to anyone or say it's completely safe. But I don't make up "facts" like you.

Appologizing. I was quite wasted last night.

I still heard too many stories of "heart enlargment" that correlated with clen users.

[Emmortal]

Appologizing. I was quite wasted last night.

I still heard too many stories of "heart enlargment" that correlated with clen users.

I've heard a lot of stories about a lot of things, but in the end they're usually just that, stories. When trying to make a point or discuss an issue, usually one would base his argument on facts, or at least disclose anecdotal evidence as such.

[Alex23]

I've heard a lot of stories about a lot of things, but in the end they're usually just that, stories. When trying to make a point or discuss an issue, usually one would base his argument on facts, or at least disclose anecdotal evidence as such.

You comment is fair. I still heard it too many times to be a coincidence and do not get funding to do clinical studies

Clen = not worth the risk.

[Emmortal]

You comment is fair. I still heard it too many times to be a coincidence and do not get funding to do clinical studies

Clen = not worth the risk.

It's pretty difficult to quantify the full effects of many of these drugs due to their illegal status in the US so I do understand much of what we have to go by is what we experience or hear about.  I'm begining to lean away from clen myself, it's just been way too harsh the last times I've used it.

Same goes for DNP, I can't believe anyone would use that shit, you will flat out die if you take too much, there's no getting out of it.

[Van_Bilderass]

It's pretty difficult to quantify the full effects of many of these drugs due to their illegal status in the US so I do understand much of what we have to go by is what we experience or hear about.

Maybe some member here who knows German or Spanish could find data from Spain or Germany, etc. I would think that if Clen was much more cardiotoxic than other beta-2 agonists they would have taken the drug off the market.

From what I've read approval for Clen was never sought due to the long half-life, which could lead to OD symptoms due to cumulative levels of the drug in the body.


Some here might not have seen this. Thought it was interesting:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,278078,00.html

(the above does of course not mean clen is good for a healthy heart)

[OTHstrong]

Maybe some member here who knows German or Spanish could find data from Spain or Germany, etc. I would think that if Clen was much more cardiotoxic than other beta-2 agonists they would have taken the drug off the market.

From what I've read approval for Clen was never sought due to the long half-life, which could lead to OD symptoms due to cumulative levels of the drug in the body.

Some here might not have seen this. Thought it was interesting:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,278078,00.html

(the above does of course not mean clen is good for a healthy heart)

Thats exactly right

[Rimbaud]

Yes it was. Until 1992. Albuterol, replaced it.

Now go push "chemicals" to little dreamers with a body to destroy.

Why do you always post something negative here?

See I kept your drunken posts up so there's no grand conspiracy against you. 

[Alex23]

Why do you always post something negative here?

Because of this below, most of you = confound the reality and its consequences:

I still have not zeroed in on my ailment.  all I have done is occupied my time with my job and not beat myself up about it anymore.  I train three times a week and at only two exercises per bodypart in two supersets.  IE: incline bench to failure and wide grip chins to failure x 4 sets then dumbell flyes to failure and reverse grip barbell rows to failure x 4.  I have lost most of my bulk (218 skinny fat lbs at '5"10) yet retain above average strength.  I still keep track of my cpk levels, which are chronically high, but have lost the determination to find the root of my problem.  I have seen a nephrologist, neurologist and three different FP doctors and they all don't have a fucken clue.  it's been frustrating to say the least.  for a time I felt that I could deal with it so much better if I only knew what and where.  fuck it, I am still bigger and stronger than most. I am still a good father. I am still a boss in a very important part of the pharmacological process.  I am still me.  the 270lb zit infested, puffy faced time bomb of 2001-2005 that I used to think was me was just a figment of my imagination.  chinoXL was a science-fictional character that I chemically created and am and WILL continue to pay the price for.  oh well, it was fun while it lasted.  now that time is gone.  steroid induced rhabdomyolysis is the last avenue I was exploring.  it seems to be the answer, but until I can make the time to go see a neuromuscular specialist in Houston I won't know for sure.

Triton, I hope you recover.  I hope you don't have to sit and watch all your hard work go down the drain.  take the time off and let your body rest.  recovery is easily ignored when you are on a cycle.  you feel like you can keep going and going when in all actuality, your body is begging for a break.  overtraining is very real and the severity of it is often downplayed.  according to one of my doctors, overtraining, 300+ grams of protein a day, 10-20g of creatine a day, 1 to 2g of random hormones a week, lack of recovery time taken and stress all contributed to my problems.  I am not saying yours is the same, but the beginning of yours is eerily similar........

[Rimbaud]

Because of this below, most of you = confound the reality and its consequences:

Nice generalization -I have nothing to do with that though. 

Next question: You seem to have an issue with me - why? what?

[Van_Bilderass]

Because of this below, most of you = confound the reality and its consequences:

I'm all for being conservative and cautious. Remember when I warned you about L. Rea's dangerous polypharmacology which you thought was great info? 

[Alex23]

Nice generalization -I have nothing to do with that though. 
Next question: You seem to have an issue with me - why? what?

Nothing against you. I just liked your phony absess / celulitis story "something bit me while playing football with my buddies"

I'm all for being conservative and cautious. Remember when I warned you about L. Rea's dangerous polypharmacology which you thought was great info? 

I still have his book. My take was better be informed than sorry. His short cycles makes sense to me.

After seeing his cadaver like look, seeing people's kidneys dropping like flies, I'm still glad I never got into that shit.

[Rimbaud]

Nothing against you. I just liked your phony absess / celulitis story "something bit me while playing football with my buddies"

So why troll this board & act paranoid? (i.e. conspiracy against you here) Either way, I didn't get cellulitis from an injection - if I did I'd admit it. Besides it started around my knee. What kind of moron would inject their knee?

[Alex23]

So why troll this board & act paranoid? Either way, I didn't get cellulitis from an injection - if I did I'd admit it. Besides it started around my knee. What kind of moron would inject their knee?

Don't make me dig posts; You mentioned the quad many times little bro....

Nobody cares, it just shows the level of denial most juicers get into..

[Rimbaud]

Don't make me dig posts; You mentioned the quad many times little bro....

Nobody cares, it just shows the level of denial most juicers get into..

It went up my quad - took up two thirds of my leg. Either way, what do you have against this board?

Green = show a little respect - former juicer.  Haven't used in a year & don't plan on it. My own choice. If you want my reason's PM me.

[Alex23]

It went up my quad - took up two thirds of my leg. Either way, what do you have against this board?
Green = show a little respect - former juicer.  Haven't used in a year & don't plan on it. My own choice. If you want my reason's PM me.

I have nothing against the board, actually I like you and AJ for your honesty. I've seen pics of some regulars on here and screams fully dellusionized, fat and not a semblant of shape and yet they're lifelong guru juicers...

[Rimbaud]

I have nothing against the board, actually I like you and AJ for your honesty. I've seen pics of some regulars on here and screams fully dellusionized, fat and not a semblant of shape and yet they're lifelong guru juicers...

Thanks. But let's be realistic there's lot of delusional people on getbig.

Either way if you ever make your way to Michigan look me up.

[Alex23]

Thanks. But let's be realistic there's lot of delusional people on getbig.
Either way if you ever make your way to Michigan look me up.

Sure will. IYO, does this "guy" qualifies as a "guru"? Looks to me like hasn't seen the inside of a weight room in a while...

... yet is "on" 363 days out of the year

[candidizzle]

Sure will. IYO, does this "guy" qualifies as a "guru" in your opinion? Looks to me like hasn't seen the inside of a weight room in a while...

... yet is "on" 363 days out of the year

who is that, alex?

[DIVISION]

Maybe some member here who knows German or Spanish could find data from Spain or Germany, etc. I would think that if Clen was much more cardiotoxic than other beta-2 agonists they would have taken the drug off the market.

From what I've read approval for Clen was never sought due to the long half-life, which could lead to OD symptoms due to cumulative levels of the drug in the body.


Some here might not have seen this. Thought it was interesting:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,278078,00.html

(the above does of course not mean clen is good for a healthy heart)

I thought it was well known that Clen was never approved for use by the FDA in America.

It was never on the market to begin with.



DIV

[Fulgorre]

Why someone would prefer ECA over Clen is beyond me.

ECA makes you feel like you are on speed. Your mind races and it has to be taken 3-4 times a day due to the short half life.  Clen only hits the fat burning receptor and there are no annoying speed feelings.  It can be taken 1 time for day due to the extremely long half life of 24hrs+.

[Luv2Hurt]

Why someone would prefer ECA over Clen is beyond me.

ECA makes you feel like you are on speed. Your mind races and it has to be taken 3-4 times a day due to the short half life.  Clen only hits the fat burning receptor and there are no annoying speed feelings.  It can be taken 1 time for day due to the extremely long half life of 24hrs+.

I totally agree with everything you said on this.  For many reasons clen is better.  EC makes you feel wired, clen on the other hand almost lends a sense of wellbeing.

IMO there is no comparison to the 2.  I know many people say they cant tolerate clen and maybe so, but if they go slow and take a bit of time to aclimate to it they may find how good it works and how comfortable it is.  I will admitt I feel good on clen, maybe it just works well with my body chemistry.

[OTHstrong]

Why someone would prefer ECA over Clen is beyond me.

ECA makes you feel like you are on speed. Your mind races and it has to be taken 3-4 times a day due to the short half life.  Clen only hits the fat burning receptor and there are no annoying speed feelings.  It can be taken 1 time for day due to the extremely long half life of 24hrs+.

I train people for shows and I've been to hundreds in the last 10 years and the biggest 2 problems ever in dieting is will power to not eat and lack of energy for your workout and clen does neither, ECA not only surpresses your hunger but gives astounding energy when needed, Why anyone would choose anything else as a replacement is beyond me. if people had the option of only choosing one of the two I would bet everything I owned that they would place better at a show by choosing ECA, but lets face it people now a days do both.

[benz]

Maybe some member here who knows German or Spanish could find data from Spain or Germany, etc. I would think that if Clen was much more cardiotoxic than other beta-2 agonists they would have taken the drug off the market.

From what I've read approval for Clen was never sought due to the long half-life, which could lead to OD symptoms due to cumulative levels of the drug in the body.


Some here might not have seen this. Thought it was interesting:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,278078,00.html

(the above does of course not mean clen is good for a healthy heart)

What kind of data in spanish are you reffering to ? maybe i can give you a hand