FLEX magazine's rationale for ignoring the role of AAS

[Chick]

bb needs roids, if the ifbb makes their money off the freak factor of the "athletes" compared to nat feds then this only shows that bb needs roids to make money/fans. it would still be irresposible for flex(the ifbb mag) to glorify the roid usage especialy when kids can read this shit, being decitful in this aspect is still better than having a bunch of dumbasses megadosing on juice cause flex said thats how the pros do it. and after a while you would have to be an idiot to believe that a jay physique is naturaly achiavable so it would not be so much as the mag being misleading as the reader being a naive idiot when you have sites like getbig to learn about the dark side of bb. a little white lie(lies) is better for the "sport" cause dont nobody(figurelatively speaking ofcourse), casual fan or hardcore(or the possible outside mainstreamer), want to see a bunch of gym physiques posing down.

Exactly...just as no one wants to see some guys who are "kind of" fast, or "sorta" good, or hit a few home runs...I don't see any magazine from any other sports talking about what their athletes may or may not be doing....why would they?

[scribbler]

Exactly...just as no one wants to see some guys who are "kind of" fast, or "sorta" good, or hit a few home runs...I don't see any magazine from any other sports talking about what their athletes may or may not be doing....why would they?

yep

I can't believe this all started from a little comment I made on our site to someone who asked why we don't.

BB is definitely a community

C

[Chick]

yep

I can't believe this all started from a little comment I made on our site to someone who asked why we don't.

BB is definitely a community

C

I just wonder if there is a "Get Baseball.com" site out there where the guys all bitch about the players using steroids, anything to do with being Gay, and how the "old days" produced better athletes and better sport,  etc..?

[scribbler]

I just wonder if there is a "Get Baseball.com" site out there where the guys all bitch about the players using steroids, anything to do with being Gay, and how the "old days" produced better athletes and better sport,  etc..?

maybe we should start it and strike it rich

LOL

[Wiggs]

Whats your point? If steroids never exsisted...it would be reletive...the freaks would still be the freaks, just not AS freaky....and BB would still be a nitche sport, just as it has always been, and will always be.

And using linemen as an example is as correct as it gets, but you can insert any athlete from just about any sport....if you believe most of them are clean...i've got some good property in New Orleans to sell to you

My point is for years the IFBB and supplement companies have tried to pass themselves off as ethical entities when many of them are anything but.  If you have a bodybuilder that attained results from drugs and you advertise that bodybuilder in a manner that they attained their results from using a product they didn't receive their results from that's anything but o.k.  Just about everyone on this board knows this but the new suckers that replaced us when we were 15-18 are out there spending their hard earned money on garbage that doesn't live up to its promise.  There are good companies out there but majority are not.  The IFBB may have had honest beginnings what it has been for a long time is anything but honest. The athletes are treated like shit by their own people......hell I don't have to repeat myself listen to the press conferences the last 9 years here in Vegas from the athletes themselves.  The few at the top aren't going to say anything because who wants to rock the boat to help everyone when your's truly is making money?  It will continue to be this way.  There have been small improvements and I applaud those from yourself and Shawn Ray.  The fact remains that is there was a Dateline story or something among those lines about the IFBB people would be sick to their stomachs.

Yes, there are many great things going on in pro-bodybuilding.  There are many bad things also.  You can say the same thing about other sports but I'm not talking about other sports I'm talking about bodybuilding.  I'm obviously not the first person to point this out and won't be the last.  

[Chick]

My point is for years the IFBB and supplement companies have tried to pass themselves off as ethical entities when many of them are anything but.  If you have a bodybuilder that attained results from drugs and you advertise that bodybuilder in a manner that they attained their results from using a product they didn't receive their results from that's anything but o.k.  Just about everyone on this board knows this but the new suckers that replaced us when we were 15-18 are out there spending their hard earned money on garbage that doesn't live up to its promise.  There are good companies out there but majority are not.  The IFBB may have had honest beginnings what it has been for a long time is anything but honest. The athletes are treated like shit by their own people......hell I don't have to repeat myself listen to the press conferences the last 9 years here in Vegas from the athletes themselves.  The few at the top aren't going to say anything because who wants to rock the boat to help everyone when your's truly is making money?  It will continue to be this way.  There have been small improvements and I applaud those from yourself and Shawn Ray.  The fact remains that is there was a Dateline story or something among those lines about the IFBB people would be sick to their stomachs.

Yes, there are many great things going on in pro-bodybuilding.  There are many bad things also.  You can say the same thing about other sports but I'm not talking about other sports I'm talking about bodybuilding.  I'm obviously not the first person to point this out and won't be the last.  

I'm assuming you are very young by your response...?

Welcome to the world of advertising, my friend....you mean there are companies that have spokesmen on payroll that don't actually use the products? You mean Tiger Woods DOESN'T actually drive a Buick? Jessica Simpson didn't REALLY use Pro Activ to clear her skin and make her into the beauty she is today? Bruce Jenner really DIDN'T eat Wheaties all those years ago to help him win the decathlon??

[Wiggs]

I'm 29 but I've been involved in bodybuilding since 15.  After seeing what really goes on from associates I gave up my pro aspirations many years ago and I'm not talking about the drugs.

[Chick]

I'm 29 but I've been involved in bodybuilding since 15.  After seeing what really goes on from associates I gave up my pro aspirations many years ago and I'm not talking about the drugs.

Sounds like you have some strange "associates"...

I began BB at age 13, knew exactly what went on, and still managed to make a career as a professional all the while, not getting involved in anything strange or unusual....

[HTexan]

because the sell unreachable goals. It is all about $$$.

[MuscleMcMannus]

My point is for years the IFBB and supplement companies have tried to pass themselves off as ethical entities when many of them are anything but.  If you have a bodybuilder that attained results from drugs and you advertise that bodybuilder in a manner that they attained their results from using a product they didn't receive their results from that's anything but o.k.  Just about everyone on this board knows this but the new suckers that replaced us when we were 15-18 are out there spending their hard earned money on garbage that doesn't live up to its promise.  There are good companies out there but majority are not.  The IFBB may have had honest beginnings what it has been for a long time is anything but honest. The athletes are treated like shit by their own people......hell I don't have to repeat myself listen to the press conferences the last 9 years here in Vegas from the athletes themselves.  The few at the top aren't going to say anything because who wants to rock the boat to help everyone when your's truly is making money?  It will continue to be this way.  There have been small improvements and I applaud those from yourself and Shawn Ray.  The fact remains that is there was a Dateline story or something among those lines about the IFBB people would be sick to their stomachs.

Yes, there are many great things going on in pro-bodybuilding.  There are many bad things also.  You can say the same thing about other sports but I'm not talking about other sports I'm talking about bodybuilding.  I'm obviously not the first person to point this out and won't be the last.  

So fucking true and SO fucking sad!  Scribbles you and your ilk i.e. the writers, editors, whoever are full of shit when it comes to bodybuilding.  It's all about money.  No other sport is built upon so many lies and half truths.  Half your fucking magazines are filled with bullshit ads.  Whine whine.......that's how you guys have to make money?  Bullshit.  It's a culture that started decades ago with fucking pukes like Joe Weider.  He ruined bodybuilding.  Ironman was a fucking decent magazine under Peary Rader.  MUCH classier compared to Joe Weiders MuscleBuilder.  I'd wouldn't pick up my dog's shit with Flex, Muscle and Fitness, or any of the mags nowadays.  Of course people like Chick are going to promote the sport as positively as possible.....his livelihood depends on it.  That's like telling a used car salesman he's a schmuck and should quit ripping people off......I'm sure he's got mouths to feed to.  But that doesn't make it right.  Hell Chick won't even admit his own drug use.  At his age he'd shrink down into a normal guy or worse a fat ass like the charlatan Phil Hernon over a ProMuscle, a tubby piece of shit.   What use is any of the mags?  99% of the reason most of us if we did read the mags would be for useful training and diet info.  But I'd rather get my info from guys like Lyle McDonald and Bryan Haycock.  Hell atleast MD has a column or used to by William Llwellyn.  Flex is a joke!  It's a jack off mag for fags just like all the other mags.  I mean shit there are more half naked men in the mags nowadays than women.  Atleast cater to heteros instead of homos and you might see your sales increase. 

[MuscleMcMannus]

Sounds like you have some strange "associates"...

I began BB at age 13, knew exactly what went on, and still managed to make a career as a professional all the while, not getting involved in anything strange or unusual....

Translated.......knew what a shady ass "sport" it was at age 13 but thought what the hell.......might as well get mine while I can and make my money.  We all see what happens to the pros when they come off drugs dude.  It's ridiculous.  I'll keep bringing up Phil Hernon cause he's such a piece of shit.  He's a fat tubby bastard nowadays.  A shell of his former self.  All he can do is peddle is shitty ass supplements all the while he promotes a drug using message board.  Atleast Draper, Pearl, and most of the old timers looked good well into their 40's and 50's. 

I mean fuck atleast MD has columns by Rick Collins and is doing something to promote the decriminalization of steroids.  What does Flex do?  Why doesn't the IFBB start a campaign to decriminalize steroids?  I mean fuck Ron Paul got killed in the Presidential race but atleast the guy made a stand. 

[Wiggs]

So fucking true and SO fucking sad!  Scribbles you and your ilk i.e. the writers, editors, whoever are full of shit when it comes to bodybuilding.  It's all about money.  No other sport is built upon so many lies and half truths.  Half your fucking magazines are filled with bullshit ads.  Whine whine.......that's how you guys have to make money?  Bullshit.  It's a culture that started decades ago with fucking pukes like Joe Weider.  He ruined bodybuilding.  Ironman was a fucking decent magazine under Peary Rader.  MUCH classier compared to Joe Weiders MuscleBuilder.  I'd wouldn't pick up my dog's shit with Flex, Muscle and Fitness, or any of the mags nowadays.  Of course people like Chick are going to promote the sport as positively as possible.....his livelihood depends on it.  That's like telling a used car salesman he's a schmuck and should quit ripping people off......I'm sure he's got mouths to feed to.  But that doesn't make it right.  Hell Chick won't even admit his own drug use.  At his age he'd shrink down into a normal guy or worse a fat ass like the charlatan Phil Hernon over a ProMuscle, a tubby piece of shit.   What use is any of the mags?  99% of the reason most of us if we did read the mags would be for useful training and diet info.  But I'd rather get my info from guys like Lyle McDonald and Bryan Haycock.  Hell atleast MD has a column or used to by William Llwellyn.  Flex is a joke!  It's a jack off mag for fags just like all the other mags.  I mean shit there are more half naked men in the mags nowadays than women.  Atleast cater to heteros instead of homos and you might see your sales increase. 

Word

[scribbler]

I knew it had to start sometime

BTW "99% of the reason most of us if we did read the mags would be for useful training and diet info."

Those are the main things we have in the mags, and the main reason we even produce Flex, the contest coverage is secondary to the training and nutrition, and in fact, the majority of our contest coverage is now on the sites with the migration to same day results.

I'm certainly not going to get into it with someone who starts into it with their second word, I simply stated my position as to why we do or do not talk about certain elements of the sport. We do not own the supplement companies or decide what content the ads have, but anyone who thinks that the supplement industry doesn't keep competitive BB alive is incredibly naive.

If you agree with us and what we do or not promote about the sport and like the magazine, then you will buy it, and thank you for that, if you don't like the magazine, do what i do when I go to the newsstand and pick up the mags you DO like. Either way even if you don't help our industry, you do help the economy.

C

[MuscleMcMannus]

I knew it had to start sometime

BTW "99% of the reason most of us if we did read the mags would be for useful training and diet info."

Those are the main things we have in the mags, and the main reason we even produce Flex, the contest coverage is secondary to the training and nutrition, and in fact, the majority of our contest coverage is now on the sites with the migration to same day results.

I'm certainly not going to get into it with someone who starts into it with their second word, I simply stated my position as to why we do or do not talk about certain elements of the sport. We do not own the supplement companies or decide what content the ads have, but anyone who thinks that the supplement industry doesn't keep competitive BB alive is incredibly naive.

If you agree with us and what we do or not promote about the sport and like the magazine, then you will buy it, and thank you for that, if you don't like the magazine, do what i do when I go to the newsstand and pick up the mags you DO like. Either way even if you don't help our industry, you do help the economy.

C

I get my training info from guys like Lyle McDonald and Bryan Haycock.  Hell ateast IronMan used to have articles by Stuart McRobert. 

[scribbler]

I get my training info from guys like Lyle McDonald and Bryan Haycock.  Hell ateast IronMan used to have articles by Stuart McRobert. 

That's cool.

As long as you get it from somewhere and you trust it.

A lot of people don't have that option, and they do turn to the mags or websites, anything that works.

C

[MuscleMcMannus]

I knew it had to start sometime

BTW "99% of the reason most of us if we did read the mags would be for useful training and diet info."

Those are the main things we have in the mags, and the main reason we even produce Flex, the contest coverage is secondary to the training and nutrition, and in fact, the majority of our contest coverage is now on the sites with the migration to same day results.

I'm certainly not going to get into it with someone who starts into it with their second word, I simply stated my position as to why we do or do not talk about certain elements of the sport. We do not own the supplement companies or decide what content the ads have, but anyone who thinks that the supplement industry doesn't keep competitive BB alive is incredibly naive.

If you agree with us and what we do or not promote about the sport and like the magazine, then you will buy it, and thank you for that, if you don't like the magazine, do what i do when I go to the newsstand and pick up the mags you DO like. Either way even if you don't help our industry, you do help the economy.

C

That's the whole problem........the entire sport of bodybuilding is propped up by the lying, deceitful, bullshit supplement industry.  

[MuscleMcMannus]

That's cool.

As long as you get it from somewhere and you trust it.

A lot of people don't have that option, and they do turn to the mags or websites, anything that works.

C

Judging by that statement I'm assuming you don't know who Lyle McDonald or Bryan Haycock is?  Of course I trust their work.  Most of it is backed up by scientific and real medical research.  These are two guys you should put on your payroll.  In fact like Stuart McRobert, Lyle I tihnk wrote for some of the major mags at one time.  Not some phony ass supplement ad with a no name bodybuilder in a white lab coat.  And as a matter of fact Lyle has a website and so does Bryan.  www. bodyrecomposition.com and www.thinkmuscle.com  Both of them wrote lots of articles for Mesomorphosis.com as well. 

[scribbler]

It was actually just making a generalization that it is good to get your info from somewhere that you know is trustworthy.

Sounds like you have the place, and no, I am not familiar with them, but I'm not a writer or an editor so I wouldn't be as familiar with writers and industry experts as our editorial staff would be. I can show you some good photographers and illustrators though LOL.

As for supplements, I think there are good and bad out there. I have used a lot of different kinds before, and though I will never be considered a big guy, there are definitely some that have had more effect than others over the years.

I guess I just wish that everyone would stop having such a negative outlook on the sport in general and try and focus on the positive for a change. This has to be one of the only sports where you can go to the biggest message boards associated with it and 90% of the posts are ripping on each other and have nothing to do with what the threads start as after the first 2 pages.

C

[hifrommike]

It depends on which board you're on. Is it moderated? No? Then you'll have psychos taking it over, as has largely happened on this board. 

[Purge_WTF]

  The only people who "need" steroids are pro-bodybuilders, which most of us won't, and probably don't ever want to, be. Plus, what's more important--drugs, or the basics of proper workout mechanics and nutrition?

[Gino30]

why does SI not list football players cycles in their profiles and game reports? Or ways to beat the tests etc.

We have just chosen to portray the sport in a more positive light.

Officially we do accept that that they a part of the sport, but we won't give info related or associated with the exact usage etc.

Oh yeah, and by the way, they are illegal as well :-)

C

--------------
Chris
Creative Director
FLEX Magazine

what?  for real? 

you're out of touch dude.....naive post.....ummm, let me think -----> $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

the rules of business and getting filthy rich are beyond your rational

oh yeh, as for FLEX....wouldnt even wipe my ass with it.....those mid 90s nasser, titus, mattarazzo face-straining pics still haunt me....

[emn1964]

Yep...only in the IFBB....and the NFL, and MLB, and NBA, and just about every sport you can name....welcome to 2008

LMAO. . .Chick talking like he is "in the know."  HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.  He doesn't know shit.  Ask any player in any of those sports who Chick is.  Here's the difference you twit.  Those other sports require at least a modicum of athletic talent.  What kind of talent does bbing require?  The ability to stand in front of a bunch of gay men oiled up in a thong?  Now go take your drugs and make your kids proud.

[hipolito mejia]

Yep...only in the IFBB....and the NFL, and MLB, and NBA, and just about every sport you can name....welcome to 2008

I like how delusional u are putting IFBB in the same group as real sports.

theres more drugs in cycling and swimming but the Difference is that none of those activities are judged base on looks, where BB  is 100 % physical appareance.... take the Bodybuilder off the drugs and whats left of the "IFBB"?

[The_Punisher]

Yep...only in the IFBB....and the NFL, and MLB, and NBA, and just about every sport you can name....welcome to 2008

and the Great Bob Chick is always there to defend the lovely IFBB......

[ManBearPig...]

I'll repeat what Robert Chick said and add on:

1. ifbb "pros", nba pros, nfl pros, etc. MUST use steroids these days.  no one wants to see the likes of leafy bug as an ifbb pro.  yes, the kid looks better than 99 percent of us, but at the end of the day he was 150 lbs.  there's no appeal in that, unless you're a chick.  i'd like to look like him, but there's nothing he can sell me that i'd buy.

2. i wonder how many nfl fans go "man, michael strahan lost 45 lbs since he won the superbowl 8 months ago.  he was on steroids and couldn't tackle shit now".  of course he was on steroids, and if you watched michael broadcasting this weekend, you'd see he's a shadow of his former self, even from 8 months ago.  does that make him any less of a football player?  shit, look at howie long, troy aikman, etc.  they all look like plain joe's now.

3. no one wants to go to a baseball game, and watch walks, bunts, singles, and an occassional double.  everyone wants to see a home run and a shattered bat at every at-bat.  no one wants to see a "solid 2.7 yards per carry" and an average score of 6-3 at an nfl game.  just get used to it.  money makes the world go round and these people do what it takes.