If Obama Loses FL

[chavez81]

We can all Thank Ralph Nader who in the poll of polls by CNN Is picking up 3% of the vote in FL. This guy has already ruined a presidential election I sure hope he doesn't do it again!

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/01/battleground.polls/index.html

[garebear]

I personally like Nader, think he is the best and most honest candidate.

But man, he just doesn't get it. I think he sees no ideological differences between Obama and McCain.

Surely, this is a convenient perspective for him to have.

I wish he would wake up and get out of the race.

[chavez81]

I would agree with you! Nadar came well before his time! If he were as young as Obama we would be talking about him and he would be a legitmate stack at the Presidency in 2008. Be it that it may he is old and considered by most a wack job.

[marcus]

He would take votes from Obama and not McCain?

[Bast000]

I would agree with you! Nadar came well before his time! If he were as young as Obama we would be talking about him and he would be a legitmate stack at the Presidency in 2008. Be it that it may he is old and considered by most a wack job.

McCain is old too. It's that he's in the wrong party.

[24KT]

If Obama loses FL, then I say everyone should carve Florida off at the pan handle,
...and just let that fvcker drift off to sea. Sorry 240, ...but hopefully you'll be back up in Ohio by then.

[Hugo Chavez]

Make no mistake, the number one thing all off these third party candidates will do to get votes is to try and convince you that Obama and McCain are the same.  That's why you keep hearing all these guys say it over and over.  They need you to look at McCain and Obama and say, well it doesn't matter which one so I'll cast my vote for this other guy.  Don't let these guys tell you they are the same.  There are a few problems that effect both parties but there are huge differences between Obama and McCain.

[240 is Back]

many people voting for the fringe candidates will change to 1 of the 2 candidates when it's super-close.

You have NO idea how broke people are in Fl right now.  Construction's been horrible for a year now, and we're about to start 'season' where people from up north and tourists come here to spend.  They're not going to come this year.   So FL will get a lot worse in the next 2 months.  Doesn't bode well for Mccain.

I know ten Bush voters who are voting Obama - they brought it up to me. 

[w8tlftr]

We can all Thank Ralph Nader who in the poll of polls by CNN Is picking up 3% of the vote in FL. This guy has already ruined a presidential election I sure hope he doesn't do it again!

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/01/battleground.polls/index.html

Sweet baby Jesus, can the kool-aid drinking robots of the two-party system be more arrogant?

[garebear]

So fucking what if people, who support Nader, vote for him? It's their right.

Sweet baby Jesus, can the kool-aid drinking robots of the two-party system be more arrogant?

On the one hand, you have a credible arguement. It is Nader's own arguement, to tell you the truth.

But we all want to land somewhere closer to perfect, and Nader just isn't realistic.

But I feel your pain, brother.

[Benny B]

Make no mistake, the number one thing all off these third party candidates will do to get votes is to try and convince you that Obama and McCain are the same.  That's why you keep hearing all these guys say it over and over.  They need you to look at McCain and Obama and say, well it doesn't matter which one so I'll cast my vote for this other guy.  Don't let these guys tell you they are the same.  There are a few problems that effect both parties but there are huge differences between Obama and McCain.

Nader attempted the same thing in 2000 with Gore v. Bush. Lot's of people fell for it then, but does anyone really believe we'd have had such lousy leadership under eight years of Gore? That we would have invaded Iraq and be spending $10billion per month there with Gore as president? With no neocons in the top echelons of power, the clear answer is NO.

Nader's time has long passed. He now seems like an old, bitter, egomaniac who doesn't know when to give it up.

[Deicide]

Nader attempted the same thing in 2000 with Gore v. Bush. Lot's of people fell for it then, but does anyone really believe we'd have had such lousy leadership under eight years of Gore? That we would have invaded Iraq and be spending $10billion per month there with Gore as president? With no neocons in the top echelons of power, the clear answer is NO.

Nader's time has long passed. He now seems like an old, bitter, egomaniac who doesn't know when to give it up.

The Iraq Liberation Act was already on the table in 1998; it was going to happen. We went into Kosovo for the sake of an oil pipeline under Clinton; no, Iraq would have happened one way or another:

H.R.4655
Iraq Liberation Act of 1998 (Enrolled Bill (Sent to President))

 

Bill Summary & Status for the 105th Congress


H.R.4655
Public Law: 105-338 (10/31/98)
SPONSOR: Rep Gilman (introduced 09/29/98)

RELATED BILLS: S.2525

TITLE(S):


SHORT TITLE(S) AS INTRODUCED:
Iraq Liberation Act of 1998
SHORT TITLE(S) AS PASSED HOUSE:
Iraq Liberation Act of 1998

SHORT TITLE(S) AS ENACTED:
Iraq Liberation Act of 1998

OFFICIAL TITLE AS INTRODUCED:
A bill to establish a program to support a transition to democracy in Iraq.
STATUS: Floor Actions
10/31/98 Public Law 105-338 (11/12/98 CR D1205)
10/20/98 Measure presented to President (10/21/98 CR H11704)
10/20/98 Enrolled Measure signed in Senate (CR S12718)
10/19/98 Enrolled Measure signed in House (CR H11546)
10/07/98 Measure passed Senate (CR S11812)
10/07/98 Measure considered in Senate (CR S11811-11812)
10/07/98 Measure called up by unanimous consent in Senate (CR S11811)
10/05/98 Measure passed House, amended, roll call #482 (360-38) (CR H9494)
10/05/98 Measure considered in House (CR H9486-9494)
10/05/98 Measure called up under motion to suspend rules and pass in House (CR H9486)

STATUS: Detailed Legislative Status

House Actions
Sep 29, 98:
Referred to the House Committee on International Relations.
Oct 2, 98:
Committee Consideration and Mark-up Session Held.
Oct 2, 98:
Committee Agreed to Seek Consideration Under Suspension of the Rules, (Amended) by Voice Vote.
Oct 5, 98:
Called up by House under suspension of the rules.
Considered by House as unfinished business.
Passed House (Amended) by Yea-Nay Vote: 360 - 38 (Roll No. 482).
Senate Actions
Oct 6, 98:
Received in the Senate, read twice.
Oct 7, 98:
Passed Senate without amendment by Unanimous Consent.
Oct 8, 98:
Message on Senate action sent to the House.
Executive Actions
Oct 7, 98:
Cleared for White House.
Oct 20, 98:
Presented to President.
Oct 31, 98:
Became Public Law No: 105-338.
Signed by President.
STATUS: Congressional Record Page References



10/01/98 Introductory remarks on Measure (CR E1857)
10/05/98 Full text of Measure as passed House printed (CR H9486-9487)

COMMITTEE(S):


COMMITTEE(S) OF REFERRAL:
House International Relations
AMENDMENT(S):
***NONE***

COSPONSORS(1):

Rep Cox - 09/29/98


SUMMARY:

(REVISED AS OF 10/05/98 -- Passed House, amended)

Iraq Liberation Act of 1998 - Declares that it should be the policy of the United States to seek to remove the Saddam Hussein regime from power in Iraq and to replace it with a democratic government.

Authorizes the President, after notifying specified congressional committees, to provide to the Iraqi democratic opposition organizations: (1) grant assistance for radio and television broadcasting to Iraq; (2) Department of Defense (DOD) defense articles and services and military education and training (IMET); and (3) humanitarian assistance, with emphasis on addressing the needs of individuals who have fled from areas under the control of the Hussein regime. Prohibits assistance to any group or organization that is engaged in military cooperation with the Hussein regime. Authorizes appropriations.

Directs the President to designate: (1) one or more Iraqi democratic opposition organizations that meet specified criteria as eligible to receive assistance under this Act; and (2) additional such organizations which satisfy the President's criteria.

Urges the President to call upon the United Nations to establish an international criminal tribunal for the purpose of indicting, prosecuting, and imprisoning Saddam Hussein and other Iraqi officials who are responsible for crimes against humanity, genocide, and other criminal violations of international law.

Expresses the sense of the Congress that once the Saddam Hussein regime is removed from power in Iraq, the United States should support Iraq's transition to democracy by providing humanitarian assistance to the Iraqi people and democracy transition assistance to Iraqi parties and movements with democratic goals, including convening Iraq's foreign creditors to develop a multilateral response to the foreign debt incurred by the Hussein regime.

[Benny B]

The Iraq Liberation Act was already on the table in 1998; it was going to happen. We went into Kosovo for the sake of an oil pipeline under Clinton; no, Iraq would have happened one way or another:
 

no wholesale invasion would have taken place under Gore
You're suggesting Gore would have come up with the "Gore Doctrine", lied repeatedly to the American people, and not allowed the UN inspectors to finish their job? 

You sir, are a moron. Good day, I have much work to do.

[big L dawg]

[chavez81]

If Obama loses FL, then I say everyone should carve Florida off at the pan handle,
...and just let that fvcker drift off to sea. Sorry 240, ...but hopefully you'll be back up in Ohio by then.

240 Not sure where you live in FL I'm in South Florida. Miami Dade, West Palm, and Broward county usually vote 70-75% Democrate

It is the country bomkins in the Panhandle of Florida who wouldn't vote for Obama if he were the next coming of Jesus just because of his color.

[240 is Back]

I'm in Estero- just north of naples. 

I'd say there are a lot of people who are age 30 to 50 who are jumping due to $ concern.

Governor Palin is hitting FL like crazy next week.  jax, plus the Alico Areana near FGCU trying to rally the youth vote.

[chavez81]

You know. She would be best if she had Tina Fey speak for her.

She is a robot now.

I'm OBAMA all the way. Now 8 years ago I was a BIG Mccain Fan but 8 years later and he is a different man!

[240 is Back]

You know. She would be best if she had Tina Fey speak for her.

She is a robot now.

I'm OBAMA all the way. Now 8 years ago I was a BIG Mccain Fan but 8 years later and he is a different man!

She is much more fluid when she gives her own answers, but she really doesn't know most of these things, to be honest.  You can't just become wise on the ways of the world and the law in a month.

If she tries to regurgitate the question, compliment the Q, then talk about how ready she is... tonight... well, it'll get ugly.  She'll have 2 minutes to fill each time... that's a LOt of rambling.  She embarassed herself with 15-second answers on Couric.  She can't bluff it on nat'l TV, live for 70 million viewers, with the same techniques.

[Deicide]

no wholesale invasion would have taken place under Gore
You're suggesting Gore would have come up with the "Gore Doctrine", lied repeatedly to the American people, and not allowed the UN inspectors to finish their job? 

You sir, are a moron. Good day, I have much work to do.

Why was the Iraq Liberation Act in full swing ten years ago? Do you think Clinton was less of an imperialist? He was more subtle. Bush just takes off the mask.

[Hugo Chavez]

no wholesale invasion would have taken place under Gore
You're suggesting Gore would have come up with the "Gore Doctrine", lied repeatedly to the American people, and not allowed the UN inspectors to finish their job? 

You sir, are a moron. Good day, I have much work to do.

I agree, really stupid to say we would be in the same boat today under Gore.

[w8tlftr]

I agree, really stupid to say we would be in the same boat today under Gore.

Different boat.... same river.

[Hugo Chavez]

Different boat.... same river.

If same river is 9/11, I'll take the boat with Gore right after I shoot a hole in the boat loaded with neocons, thanks.

[Deicide]

Different boat.... same river.

Well said.

[w8tlftr]

If same river is 9/11, I'll take the boat with Gore right after I shoot a hole in the boat loaded with neocons, thanks.

9/11 would still happen.

Gore would have been forced into a military response.

But you're right... Iraq probably wouldn't have happened.

I don't think much else would be different though.

[big L dawg]

Different boat.... same river.

swift boat.