Author Topic: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...  (Read 7584 times)

Deicide

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I hate the State.

24KT

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #1 on: November 11, 2008, 05:18:12 PM »


Olbermann looks like he's on the verge of tears.

I cannot for the life of me understand how a group of citizens can propose the removal of rights from another group of American citizens. This is beyond belief, and truly tragic that such a thing can occur let alone stand.  :'(
w

tonymctones

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2008, 05:29:11 PM »
Im not familiar with all aspects of prop 8 but does it outlaw civil unions as well? Im not for defining marriage as anything other than between a man and a woman however I do believe that these ppl deserve the same rights as anybody else. Olbierman is a HUGE and i mean HUGE jackass, the fact that he quotes the ignorant 50% divorce rate just affirms my belief of this...ps whoever put this guy on the football pregame show should be drug out into the streets and beat with rubber hoses until his is dead too...sorry just my honest opinion.

Dan-O

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2008, 06:20:28 PM »
Oh brother ::)  Blatant, egregious demagoguery...  I cannot stand this guy's smug, arrogant, sanctimonious attitude for one thing.  Nor his narrow frame of reference.  WHO is denying gays the opportunity to be "a little less alone in the world?"  I mean, really.  What a schmaltzy load of BS.  I made it through about 1:30 of Olbermann's whiney little diatribe before I'd heard enough.

I mean what's the deal here...  is this about denying gays the right to be together with the one they love?  Absolutely not.  Is it about denying them all the benefits of a legal, civil union?  No.  What exactly are they being "denied?"  Strip away all the emotional doublespeak and this is nothing more than legal posturing, plain and simple.

w8tlftr

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2008, 07:19:04 PM »
Olbermann's a pussy.

But denying gays and lesbians the right to marry is fascist.

Besides, I want them to marry so they can suffer the marriage penalty and AMT like other heterosexual married couples.

Misery loves company.  ;D

Buffgeek

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2008, 07:55:00 PM »
I thougth they had the same rights basically as a married couple under civil unions???

Buffgeek

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #6 on: November 11, 2008, 07:55:36 PM »
Oh and this video makes me want to stab my eyes out. Obermen it the biggest tool in media. So much better when he was on EPSN

Buffgeek

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #7 on: November 11, 2008, 07:56:12 PM »
Wait I take that back... 2nd biggest tool.

Hannity is #1

24KT

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2008, 08:25:33 PM »
The very nature of "civil unions" for gays IS a redefinition of marriage for gays and lesbians.
It stinks with that old "separate but equal" BS that existed for years and we all know that was anything but equal. For all the hoopin' & hollerin' in the last week about how far the USA has come in her ability to get past the old ghosts of prejudice & bigotry that has haunted her for so long, ...the fact that people are unable to see this very blatant bigotted attack upon the civil rights of gay & lesbians indicates the USA has not come as far as she thinks she has, ...or at least as far as she needs to be. I find it very sad.  :'(
w

tonymctones

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #9 on: November 11, 2008, 10:10:42 PM »
The very nature of "civil unions" for gays IS a redefinition of marriage for gays and lesbians.
It stinks with that old "separate but equal" BS that existed for years and we all know that was anything but equal. For all the hoopin' & hollerin' in the last week about how far the USA has come in her ability to get past the old ghosts of prejudice & bigotry that has haunted her for so long, ...the fact that people are unable to see this very blatant bigotted attack upon the civil rights of gay & lesbians indicates the USA has not come as far as she thinks she has, ...or at least as far as she needs to be. I find it very sad.  :'(
The US hasnt done shit we elected a half WHITE half black president so the fuck what? the only ppl ranting and raving about this are the same ppl bitching about prop 8. OK so civil unions are the same thing as marriage by law is what your saying? so wtf are ppl complaining about? Im sorry im not sorry my beliefs say marriage is between a MAN AND A WOMAN so I will not vote against prop 8. Im not saying that they shouldnt have the same rights just that it should NOT be defined as marriage. you vote on your beliefs and others vote on theirs but you complain about ppl not being tolerant...I hope you see the irony in that statement

tonymctones

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #10 on: November 11, 2008, 10:14:52 PM »
P.S. OLBERMAN IS A FREAKING JACKASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! + THE 50% DIVORCE RATE IS SO WRONG THAT ITS RIDICULOUS THE FACT THAT HE SIGHTS THAT IS JUST TESTIMONY TO HIS RETARDATION.

Arnold jr

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #11 on: November 11, 2008, 11:12:57 PM »
The very nature of "civil unions" for gays IS a redefinition of marriage for gays and lesbians.
It stinks with that old "separate but equal" BS that existed for years and we all know that was anything but equal. For all the hoopin' & hollerin' in the last week about how far the USA has come in her ability to get past the old ghosts of prejudice & bigotry that has haunted her for so long, ...the fact that people are unable to see this very blatant bigotted attack upon the civil rights of gay & lesbians indicates the USA has not come as far as she thinks she has, ...or at least as far as she needs to be. I find it very sad.  :'(

There is a big major difference between the two types of things you are talking about.

First, prejudice against anyone is wrong, no sain person can argue that with any basis. Now, denying certain civil rights to anyone based on skin color or race is also wrong...obviously, it's not like anyone can control their race or skin color. Now, you probably think you know where I am going with this, and you're partialy right, but that's not the full story.

Yes, I believe homosexuality is a choice, not something that you're born into. I know some can point out studies that say otherwise, but there are more studies that prove this fact that it is choice, not genetic. Our behavior in all aspects of life is largely determined by our environment, who we associate with, how our world view develops, etc. Something I read that I found very interesting a few month ago (sorry can't remember off hand where, I'll try to find it) was that in a survey of homosexual men, most, not all but a strong majority grew up in single family homes where the father was absent. Inevitably these men became products of their enviroment, but it's still amounts to choice.

The main topic at hand: marriage is by no means something that can be argued that is due to all with whom they wish under the constitution. Under our constitution which by way the civil liberties act was born, requires that all people are entitled to their pursuit of life, liberty and happiness. Happiness though under the constitution does not mean actual happiness, it refers to property. That's how the actual constitution reads, people have simply substituted property with happieness. What this means is everyone is entitled to their fair share of ability to reach their dreams, and to protect against intrusion on anything that would hinder this ability. People are granted this freedom, but what they do with it is choice in regards to success or failure.

With what I said, some might say that preventing homosexuals from marrying hinders their abilities to these inalienable rights. It is taking away their "liberty" to choose how they live their lives. I simply do not see it this way at all. It obviously goes against the establishment of what marriage is, it is a slap in the face to those who are heterosexual and find themselves married and by what that stands for.

timfogarty

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #12 on: November 12, 2008, 12:05:09 AM »
I mean what's the deal here...  is this about denying gays the right to be together with the one they love?  Absolutely not.  Is it about denying them all the benefits of a legal, civil union?  No.  What exactly are they being "denied?" 

first, there is the separate but equal argument

but regarding California civil unions, they're 90% of marriage with regards to the state.  but you get benefits of marriage from other places besides the state.  companies are not required to offer the same benefits (to employees, to customers) to people in civil unions as they do to married couples.  if everyone is married, and since same sex marriage was granted due to the equal protection clause, then a company would have to grant a benefit to all married couples, or none.

Deicide

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #13 on: November 12, 2008, 01:36:28 AM »
Divorce rates are indeed well over 50%...
I hate the State.

tonymctones

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #14 on: November 12, 2008, 06:01:43 AM »
Divorce rates are indeed well over 50%...
LOL Deicide I have explained this to you more times than I can remember but lets do it again. Do you know how they come up with that ignorant pretty much arbitrary number? I know you do but you still spout it out every chance you get. Well gather round kids b/c ill explain it so everyone wont be taken in by olberman or Deicide...

They take the amount of marriages in a year and divided that by the number of divorces in a year...nevermind the ppl who dont get divorced we wont account for them now will we? will just sweep them under the rug. It doesnt take into account any of the ppl who arent married in THAT YEAR OR TIME OF REFERENCE only those divorced in that year. In reality the divorce rate is much much lower

Benny B

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #15 on: November 12, 2008, 06:24:05 AM »
Oh brother ::)  Blatant, egregious demagoguery...  I cannot stand this guy's smug, arrogant, sanctimonious attitude for one thing.  Nor his narrow frame of reference.  WHO is denying gays the opportunity to be "a little less alone in the world?"  I mean, really.  What a schmaltzy load of BS.  I made it through about 1:30 of Olbermann's whiney little diatribe before I'd heard enough.

I mean what's the deal here...  is this about denying gays the right to be together with the one they love?  Absolutely not.  Is it about denying them all the benefits of a legal, civil union?  No.  What exactly are they being "denied?"  Strip away all the emotional doublespeak and this is nothing more than legal posturing, plain and simple.
Olbermann is my boy, but I agree with Dan-O completely.  :o The first time I could not stomach an Olbermann special comment.
!

TrapsMcLats

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #16 on: November 12, 2008, 10:50:46 AM »
Let me make this simple:

people with reason: no on 8

people without reason: yes on 8

Only unreasonable people would see to keep gays from the right to marry.


Fury

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #17 on: November 12, 2008, 11:18:27 AM »
Why people are so hellbent on defending the fallacy known as marriage is beyond me. Whether or not gays marry will not affect heterosexuals ability to marry.  ::)

Dan-O

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #18 on: November 12, 2008, 11:24:38 AM »
Why people are so hellbent on defending the fallacy known as marriage is beyond me. Whether or not gays marry will not affect heterosexuals ability to marry.  ::)

Oh really, wow...  Gee, I didn't know that...  All this time I thought there was just so much marriage to go around and if they got theirs, it might mean I wouldn't get mine. ::)

big L dawg

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #19 on: November 12, 2008, 11:27:59 AM »
P.S. OLBERMAN IS A FREAKING JACKASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! + THE 50% DIVORCE RATE IS SO WRONG THAT ITS RIDICULOUS THE FACT THAT HE SIGHTS THAT IS JUST TESTIMONY TO HIS RETARDATION.

then what is the divorce rate?
DAWG

tonymctones

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #20 on: November 12, 2008, 11:37:16 AM »
then what is the divorce rate?
supposedly around 30something percent...did you read my other post on here l dawg and see how they come up with the 50%?

big L dawg

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #21 on: November 12, 2008, 11:43:49 AM »
supposedly around 30something percent...did you read my other post on here l dawg and see how they come up with the 50%?

yes I read it but what I don't like is someone saying something is wrong ad ridiculous,but then gives no credible source to back there shit up.so if 30 something percent is your claim where's your sources?
DAWG

tonymctones

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #22 on: November 12, 2008, 11:48:02 AM »
yes I read it but what I don't like is someone saying something is wrong ad ridiculous,but then gives no credible source to back there shit up.so if 30 something percent is your claim where's your sources?
hmmm well my social psychology class and books are my references...but here http://www.divorcereform.org/nyt05.html LOL again ive explained this many many many times to deicide and he still refuses to understand so i didnt feel the need to repost more sources.

Fury

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #23 on: November 12, 2008, 11:55:15 AM »
Oh really, wow...  Gee, I didn't know that...  All this time I thought there was just so much marriage to go around and if they got theirs, it might mean I wouldn't get mine. ::)

Well, then the only reason for your adamant opposition of it is either stupidity of the words of book written by men thousands of years ago.

drkaje

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Re: Pretty moving speech by Olberman on Prop. 8 and Religious maniacs...
« Reply #24 on: November 12, 2008, 01:36:11 PM »
The very nature of "civil unions" for gays IS a redefinition of marriage for gays and lesbians.
It stinks with that old "separate but equal" BS that existed for years and we all know that was anything but equal. For all the hoopin' & hollerin' in the last week about how far the USA has come in her ability to get past the old ghosts of prejudice & bigotry that has haunted her for so long, ...the fact that people are unable to see this very blatant bigotted attack upon the civil rights of gay & lesbians indicates the USA has not come as far as she thinks she has, ...or at least as far as she needs to be. I find it very sad.  :'(

Gays aren't a separate race, Judi.