Author Topic: The homemade Milos workout drink  (Read 10936 times)

240 is Back

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #25 on: January 08, 2009, 12:55:02 PM »
wait a minute i thought Rob's was the first thing he listed and then compared it to the Milos shake below it...............goddamn Rob don't tell me you're wasting money on the exact Milos shake are you?

lol... nope... all i had:

5 g glutamine, 5 g creatine, 1 scoop gatorade, and a bunch of ice cold water in a cup

I drank 90% of it in the gym, and 10% on the ride home.  That's it.  Then i waited 40 minutes and pigged the F out.

thelamefalsehood

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #26 on: January 08, 2009, 12:55:19 PM »
hahaha, finally a voice of reason, i'm sure if you asked 95 percent of IFBB pros about that drink they'd laugh in your face, better wear a diaper with that drink.

Exactly, I tried these 3 shakes pretty close to what 240 describes around a workout, and it felt like someone put a cement block in my stomach. Was farting for like 4 hours staright, just one long fart. WMS and all that stuff is good, but a steak and potato ala Ronnie Coleman works as well.

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #27 on: January 08, 2009, 12:57:01 PM »
lol... nope... all i had:

5 g glutamine, 5 g creatine, 1 scoop gatorade, and a bunch of ice cold water in a cup

I drank 90% of it in the gym, and 10% on the ride home.  That's it.  Then i waited 40 minutes and pigged the F out.

yeah that's what i thought you said, yeah that drink is fine for you, me or any other guy who doesn't have 260 pounds of ripped muscle to feed, hahahahaa, i'd be suffering on that Milos shake. ;D

MuscleMcMannus

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #28 on: January 08, 2009, 01:00:37 PM »
Exactly, I tried these 3 shakes pretty close to what 240 describes around a workout, and it felt like someone put a cement block in my stomach. Was farting for like 4 hours staright, just one long fart. WMS and all that stuff is good, but a steak and potato ala Ronnie Coleman works as well.

Dude the funny thing is MOST pros do not use many powders and pills.  Steroids and real wholesome food is still what matters most.  All these pills and powders are just a way to sell shit.  

Remember Casey Viator's Peanut Butter Pudding?
2lbs of peanut butter
1 jar of grape jelly
3-4 bananas
.  He also ate upwards of 2 dozen eggs and 2 gallons of raw milk a day.  

Real food and steroids is all you need!  

Cleanest Natural

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #29 on: January 08, 2009, 01:14:59 PM »
post workout for me are 2 chicken snitzel sandwiches and a coke ....or McDonalds

Van_Bilderass

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #30 on: January 08, 2009, 01:15:17 PM »
i dont really agree. did you look at what are in the milos shakes? its like 10 g carbs 10 g aminos. thats it. come creatieng lutamine and arginbine. but small amounts.

and i would suggest drinking they whey 45 min-an hour before to compensate for digestion rate, and whey during, to allow it to be available post workout immidietly. hydrosylate would be shorter. and i dont like gatorade either, as its about half fructose half glucose. rather use dextrose. cheaper, all glucose,  tastes better too.

Are we reading the same thing? It's 45 grams of aminos before, then 45 grams AGAIN during, and then 50 grams of whey after. That's ridiculous.

I've also seen no research showing free form aminos are faster than say whey isolate. Not saying it can't be but I'm not sure. I did see one paper where whey isolate was faster than hydrolyzed whey. These things don't always work like you may think.

Fatpanda

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #31 on: January 08, 2009, 01:18:12 PM »
This will yield similar results without the huge price tax.



A gallon of milk $3.40
A dozen raw eggs $1.99

Total = $5.40 plus tax. 

quoted for truth.

i have studies that show how useless bcaa and eaa are when you are already taking a whole protein source.

milk is natures pre/post workout shake  8)
175lbs by 31st July

tbombz

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #32 on: January 08, 2009, 01:18:19 PM »
Are we reading the same thing? It's 45 grams of aminos before, then 45 grams AGAIN during, and then 50 grams of whey after. That's ridiculous.

I've also seen no research showing free form aminos are faster than say whey isolate. Not saying it can't be but I'm not sure. I did see one paper where whey isolate was faster than hydrolyzed whey. These things don't always work like you may think.
ooo i saw that on about hydro and iso too. i just figured they fucked up and got i backwards.

im lookng a milos's pre load, xxpload, reload products on his site.

MuscleMcMannus

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #33 on: January 08, 2009, 01:48:10 PM »
quoted for truth.

i have studies that show how useless bcaa and eaa are when you are already taking a whole protein source.

Raw milk is natures pre/post workout shake  8)

Fixed! :)

MuscleMcMannus

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #34 on: January 08, 2009, 01:49:57 PM »
Here ya go Fatpanda:

There has been growing interest in the potential use of bovine milk as an exercise beverage, especially during recovery from resistance training and endurance sports. Based on the limited research, milk appears to be an effective post-resistance exercise beverage that results in favourable acute alterations in protein metabolism. Milk consumption acutely increases muscle protein synthesis, leading to an improved net muscle protein balance. Furthermore, when post-exercise milk consumption is combined with resistance training (12 weeks minimum), greater increases in muscle hypertrophy and lean mass have been observed. Although research with milk is limited, there is some evidence to suggest that milk may be an effective post-exercise beverage for endurance activities. Low-fat milk has been shown to be as effective, if not more effective, than commercially available sports drinks as a rehydration beverage. Milk represents a more nutrient dense beverage choice for individuals who partake in strength and endurance activities, compared to traditional sports drinks. Bovine low-fat fluid milk is a safe and effective post exercise beverage for most individuals, except for those who are lactose intolerant. Further research is warranted to better delineate the possible applications and efficacy of bovine milk in the field of sports nutrition.

My Comments

Milk, like all aspects of nutrition is often surrounded by controversy. From the nutjob tinfoil on the head anti-milk zealots to bodybuilders who say that milk makes you smooth, milk is often thought of as a terrible food for adult humans to eat.


Yet, objectively milk is an excellent source of high quality protein (a mix of casein and whey), carbohydrates (lactose, which admittedly some people have problems digesting) along with providing fluids, highly bio-available calcium, and electrolytes. Old time lifters often built large amounts of muscle mass with a program of squats and a gallon of milk per day; the idea is still around in various incarnations. In contrast to the anti-milk zealots, milk has been shown to have a number of potential health benefits beyond any sporting applications that may exist.

I’m not going to address the controversy regarding milk here, sufficed to say I’m on the side of milk (and dairy foods in general) being excellent for athletes and folks trying to improve body recomposition. The combination of both fast whey and slow casein is excellent for a lot of sporting and athletic applications, dairy calcium improves body composition, etc. And while dairy does contain quite a bit of sodium (which is what I suspect causes the issues with ’smoothness’ for contest bodybuilders), this is only an issue on the day of the contest. Dropping milk out 16 weeks out can only hurt fat loss, not help it.

You can read more about that in Contest Dieting Part 1. As well I discuss dairy proteins (both supplemental and whole food) in detail in The Protein book.


Which brings me in a roundabout way to today’s article which examines recent research examining the potential of milk as a sports drink.

The paper first examines much of what I talked about above, the overall macronutrient profile of milk. In that the recent area of research for sports nutrition revolves around carbohydrate, protein/amino acid intake, along with fluids and electrolytes, milk ends up covering all of those nutritional bases.

As noted above, milk contains a combination of both casein (a slow digesting protein) and whey (fast acting), along with a large proportion of the branched chain amino acids (BCAA). It also contains carbohydrates (lactose, see my note at the end of this piece), along with minerals, both sodium and potassium. Of course, milk automatically contains fluid and hydration/fluid balance is also important for optimal performance and recovery.

Moving on the paper first examines research on milk and resistance training adaptations. A number of studies have been performed from acute (single drink) studies to longer work looking at lean body mass gain. In one acute study, both fat free and whole milk were shown to improve protein synthesis following training; the whole milk worked better although the researchers weren’t sure why.

Of more interest, milk was shown to be superior to a soy based drink (both drinks contained identical protein, carbs and calories) in terms of lean body mass gains over 3-8 weeks. In addition, not only did the milk group gain more lean body mass, they lost a bit of fat. Of some interest, it was thought that the superiority of the milk was due to its slower digestion compared to the soy (a fast protein). As I detail in The Protein Book, in contrast to recurring beliefs that whey is superior post-workout, research shows that a slow or combination slow and fast protein following training appears to be superior in terms of lean body mass gains.

Quoting from the paper’s conclusion:

“Consumption of low-fat milk appears to create an anabolic environment following resistance training and over the long term with training, it appears that greater gains in lean mass and muscle hypertrophy can be obtained. Furthermore, milk may also lead to greater losses of body fat when it is consumed following resistance training.”

Now, moving onto endurance training, it’s first important to note that endurance athletes have a couple of issues to deal with (in terms of both performance and recovery) that strength trainers don’t necessarily have to deal with. This includes hydration and performance during training/competition as well as glycogen re-synthesis and re-hydration following training. While those certainly can be an issue following very voluminous strength training, they tend to be a bigger issue for endurance type training.

Now, about a zillion studies (give or take a couple hundred thousand) have looked at the impact of carb intake on endurance performance. The research is mixed and whether or not carbs help depends on the duration and intensity of training. Of more relevance here, some research has examined whether adding small amounts of protein during endurance competition can help performance. Some of it finds a benefit, some of it doesn’t; there is still some controversy over this issue.

In this vein, some work has examine the impact of milk during endurance training. While some potential benefits (such as increased blood amino acid levels) were seen, no performance benefits were seen and the subjects reported a fuller stomach due to the milk; this was likely due to the milk more slowly emptying from the stomach. This isn’t a good thing and what research has found a benefit of protein during endurance training invariably used faster proteins (whey or casein hydrolysate). I would not recommend milk during training.

However, as a post-workout drink, milk appears to be a good choice for endurance athletes. Some work has found that the combination of protein and carbs leads to better glycogen re-synthesis, however no research has directly examined milk in this context. One study compared chocolate milk to a commercial carbohydrate drink and found that the chocolate milk was at least as good at promoting performance as the carb drink.

With regards to hydration, a previous research review I did examined Milk as an Effective Post-Exercise Rehydration Drink, finding that milk was superior to water or commercial carbohydrate drinks for re-hydration following endurance exercise, presumably due to the sodium and potassium content.

Quoting again from the paper itself, the researchers conclude that

“The limited literature that does exist suggests that milk is as effective as commercially available sports drinks at facilitating recovery for additional performance…Furthermore, milk is also a very effective beverage at promoting fluid recovery following dehydrating exercise in the heat.”

The bottom link is that milk can be an effective post-workout drink for both resistance trainers and endurance athletes.




Practical Application

Clearly the research to date suggests that milk may be a superior post-workout drink following resistance training (at least compared to a fast protein like soy) and may have benefits for endurance athletes as well in terms of promoting glycogen synthesis, recovery and re-hydration following training.

Anyone who has read The Protein Book (or my other books for that matter) knows that I’m big on milk and milk proteins, they have massive advantages in terms of their protein content, dairy calcium, and other effects. Milk is readily available, tasty and relatively inexpensive.

However, there are a couple of caveats. For large athletes who need a large amount of carbohydrates or protein following training, milk may not be an ideal way of getting it. A typical 8-oz serving of milk contains roughly 12 grams of carbohydrates and 8 grams of protein. A large resistance training athlete might need 4-5X that many nutrients following training and drinking that much milk may not be feasible.

A compromise solution might be to use milk as a base and add extra nutrients (such as maltodextrin or dextrose powder for carbs and protein powder for protein) to achieve a higher nutrient density than milk itself can provide. So 16 oz. (2 cups) of milk with extra carbs/protein would get the benefits of milk along with sufficient nutrients for larger athletes to recovery. Similar comments would apply to endurance athletes who often need very large amounts of carbs following exhaustive training; drinking 4+ cups of milk following training may not be feasible.

As a final comment, if there is one major problem with milk for many people, it’s the presence of lactose (milk-sugar). Lactose, like all digestible carbohydrates requires a specific enzyme to be broken down called lactase. However, some people lose the ability to produce lactase/digest lactose; this can occur either completely or relatively (in the latter case, folks can handle small amounts of dairy).

Lactose intolerance, which should not be confused with a true milk allergy, can cause stomach upset, gas, and diarrhea in predisposed people; it’s racially based and some ethnicities are more or less likely to have problems. For those with lactose intolerance, but who wish to use milk following training there are several options.

The first is to find a source of lactose free milk. Brands such as Lactaid add lactase to milk to digest the lactose into glucose and galactose; this typically results in sweeter milk but without the offending lactase. Lactase pills are also available which can be taken with milk to help with digestion. Finally, there are products which claim to increase lactase levels in the gut and some people find that milk consumed with other food is tolerable; additionally, regular yogurt consumption can improve the ability to digest lactose.

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #35 on: January 08, 2009, 02:57:12 PM »
I have a new practice of mixing 5 g glutamine, 5 g creatine, 1 scoop gatorade, and a bunch of ice cold water in a cup for my workout.  I'm happy with the results so far (reduced soreness and of course the nice creatine bloat) and the extra sugar was great during leg day> I usually just drink water.

This is my ghetto version of the legendary Milos shake, which looks like this:

Pre Workout:
3-10g Creatine
3-10g Glutamine
15-20g Essential Amino Acids
15g BCAA
30-50g Vitargo or Dextrose
1tsp electrolyte drink powder

During Workout:
3-5g Creatine
3-10g Glutamine
15-20g Essential Amino Acids
15g BCAA
50g Vitargo or Dextrose
1tsp electrolyte drink powder


Post Workout
3-5g Creatine
3-10g Glutamine
40-50g Whey
50-75g Vitargo or Dextrose
1tsp electrolyte drink powder



Is it good "as is"?  Should I experiment with adding whey Insulin to it, or any of that dex?
Should protein be present in a During-workout drink?  BCAAs?  Aminos?

Shit your pants for the rest of the day. Oh, BTW, I fixed that other part for ya.

Bluto

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #36 on: January 08, 2009, 02:58:10 PM »
and a bunch of ice cold water in a cup for my workout. 

this is the key ingredient
Z

Tombo

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #37 on: January 08, 2009, 03:18:59 PM »
this is the key ingredient

is it cool if i just start ragging on you non-stop?

Bluto

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #38 on: January 08, 2009, 03:21:06 PM »
is it cool if i just start ragging on you non-stop?

sure "tombola"
Z

Tombo

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #39 on: January 08, 2009, 03:24:46 PM »
sure "tombola"

explain what you mean by Tombola

flexingtonsteele

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #40 on: January 08, 2009, 03:35:09 PM »
And just to add my 2 cents, milos' shakes are usually accompanied by insulin pre and post workout, so to use the same shake as milos is rediculous.

I do amino acids, creatine, and waxy maize pre workout, nothing during the workout, then amino acids and waxy maize post workout. But only 30g of waxy maize per shot because more than that will definetley give u the runs.

About an hour or so after the post workout shake, i eat a whole food meal with good carbs and a solid protein source.

IMHO, thats the best method. But what do I know, im 180lbs.  ::)

solida

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #41 on: January 08, 2009, 03:37:10 PM »
This will yield similar results without the huge price tax.



A gallon of milk $3.40
A dozen raw eggs $1.99

Total = $5.40 plus tax. 

 :)

tbombz

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #42 on: January 08, 2009, 03:38:04 PM »
And just to add my 2 cents, milos' shakes are usually accompanied by insulin pre and post workout, so to use the same shake as milos is rediculous.

I do amino acids and waxy maize pre workout, nothing during the workout, then amino acids and waxy maize post workout. But only 30g of waxy maize per shot because more than that will definetley give u the runs.

About an hour or so after the post workout shake, i eat a whole food meal with good carbs and a solid protein source.

IMHO, thats the best method. But what do I know, im 180lbs.  ::)
where do you guy get this " shakes give me the runs" crap?
your like the fifth person to claim this.

anyway..milos, from what i know, has people use 20iu slin pre workout.   you can get your body to release an equivelant amount of insulin on your own with simple carbs like dextrose.

theres no reason to say a person cant use "insulin shake" withou the exogenous insulin.


flexingtonsteele

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #43 on: January 08, 2009, 03:42:25 PM »
where do you guy get this " shakes give me the runs" crap?
your like the fifth person to claim this.

anyway..milos, from what i know, has people use 20iu slin pre workout.   you can get your body to release an equivelant amount of insulin on your own with simple carbs like dextrose.

theres no reason to say a person cant use "insulin shake" withou the exogenous insulin.



From personal experience.

webcake

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #44 on: January 08, 2009, 03:45:18 PM »
And just to add my 2 cents, milos' shakes are usually accompanied by insulin pre and post workout, so to use the same shake as milos is rediculous.

I do amino acids, creatine, and waxy maize pre workout, nothing during the workout, then amino acids and waxy maize post workout. But only 30g of waxy maize per shot because more than that will definetley give u the runs.

About an hour or so after the post workout shake, i eat a whole food meal with good carbs and a solid protein source.

IMHO, thats the best method. But what do I know, im 180lbs.  ::)

Brutal self ownage!!

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No doubt about it...

wes

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #45 on: January 08, 2009, 04:56:03 PM »
Too complicated.  I personally think PWO shakes are one of the most overrated things there is.  That being said if you do use one, a simple carb/standard protein mix will work just fine.  I've never understood 5 grams of this 10 grams of that 33% this crap.  Well lets put it this way, I've never seen anyone get incredible results by switching to something that complicated vs just the simpler item.
QFT

Stavios

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #46 on: January 08, 2009, 05:08:53 PM »
But what do I know, im 180lbs.  ::)

180 lbs of sexiness  8)

Go 4 It

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #47 on: January 08, 2009, 05:41:44 PM »
I've tried Milos's shakes and I've also made my own version on Trueprotein.com, never got the shits, and I've been getting awsome workouts, good pumps, look fuller when doing this pre/during/post shake protocal, I would have continued to order his supplements, but in the end it is just cheaper to make my own. Maybe you guys aren't drinking enough water which may be the reason the creatine is giving you the shits..
4

Emmortal

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #48 on: January 08, 2009, 05:49:26 PM »
Just drink 20oz of milk with 90g of whey PWO, Done.

HTexan

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Re: The homemade Milos workout drink
« Reply #49 on: January 08, 2009, 06:01:57 PM »
your version is fine for anyone not named Ronnie Coleman or Markus Ruhl, all the Milos version will give the average 190-200 pound trainer is expensive diahhrea.
so you're said it is great for dropping water weight? ;D
A