Author Topic: Obama faced down Gates, Mullen and Petraeus on Iraq pullout (Read 1137 times)

240 is Back · « **on:** January 26, 2009, 04:24:00 PM »

Gates, Petraeus want longer pullout period from Iraq

By MARTIN SIEFFPublished: Jan. 23, 2009 at 1:05 PMOrder reprints | Feedback
/White House)

WASHINGTON, Jan. 23 (UPI) Barack Obama faced down his three top military officials in a policy confrontation during his very first day in office, U.S. military sources have told UPI.

On Wednesday, the president met with Secretary of Defense Robert Gates, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Adm. Michael Mullen and Central Command commander four-star Gen. David Petraeus. Gates, supported by Mullen and Petraeus, vigorously argued that the president should back away from his campaign pledge to withdraw all U.S. combat forces from Iraq within the next 16 months and space out the withdrawal over a longer period of time. However, the president instructed the three officials to prepare a plan that would still implement the 16-month withdrawal period, Pentagon sources said.

The discussion between the president and the three officials was friendly and respectful. However, the president's determination to implement his stated policy took the officials by surprise, one of the sources told UPI. Petraeus, in particular, had expected the recommendation to extend the period of the withdrawal timetable to be accepted, several sources said.

The sources all stressed that the necessity for the troop withdrawal was never at issue. Since July 7, 2008, Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki repeatedly has demanded a firm timetable and deadline for the completion of U.S. troop withdrawals from Iraq. He made it a condition of the Status of Forces Agreement that he finally signed with the outgoing Bush administration. The deadline in the SOFA for the withdrawal of U.S. combat forces is three years hence.

Once the president made his position clear, Mullen made clear he was determined to implement the policy, the sources said.

Dos Equis · « **Reply #1 on:** January 26, 2009, 04:27:37 PM »

Should listen to his commanders. I hope this doesn't blow up.

240 is Back · « **Reply #2 on:** January 26, 2009, 04:33:12 PM »

Quote from: Beach Bum on January 26, 2009, 04:27:37 PM

Should listen to his commanders. I hope this doesn't blow up.

All Bush did was listen to his commanders.

We were unable to win two wars in 7 and 5 years, respectively. And we almost got into a 3rd.

Maybe the commanders should be listening to the commander-in-chief, for once. You know, the way things used to be? Why? Because...

Military commanders do not concern themselves with:
----- The effects of the war on the economy at home
----- The effects on relationships with other world powers
----- The effects upon national unity
----- many other factors.

Plus, war is their business. Aside from the fact they slip from the pentagon to contractors like revolving doors... they make a LOT more $ when there is war. peacetime is broketime for military commanders.

It's like letting the ice cream man write your diet for you.

Dos Equis · « **Reply #3 on:** January 26, 2009, 04:37:30 PM »

Bush did not listen to his commanders, who said they needed a larger force in Iraq. Shinseki was basically fired for opening his mouth. Bush listened to Rumsfeld, who didn't have a clue.

I really hope he doesn't screw this up.

240 is Back · « **Reply #4 on:** January 26, 2009, 04:53:39 PM »

Quote from: Beach Bum on January 26, 2009, 04:37:30 PM

Bush did not listen to his commanders, who said they needed a larger force in Iraq. Shinseki was basically fired for opening his mouth. Bush listened to Rumsfeld, who didn't have a clue.

I really hope he doesn't screw this up.

The second half of his presidency, he listened to a military man, patraeus.

The first half, he obeyed the pentagon/defense contractors. Their goal wasn't a win. Their goal was a shitload of borrowed taxpayer money handed to big firms. You know, those highly paid 150k troops that were in iraq for 5 years? Completely unchecked spending, billions going missing, etc. It was a mission to plunder the treasury.

Finally, the desire to have some sort of decent legacy kicked in, in 2004. THEN he fired rummy and handed his keys to patraeus, who actually had a plan to win the war. He hasn't won it yet - we still have 200 to 250k men there, between the troops and the contractors.

You can say it til you're blue in the face - "RUmmy wanted to win the war". But everything he did was not reflective of that. He wanted to spend a shitload of money for the firms he worked in thru 1999 and which - surprise! - he's back working for now

Straw Man · « **Reply #5 on:** January 26, 2009, 05:05:27 PM »

Quote from: Beach Bum on January 26, 2009, 04:27:37 PM

Should listen to his commanders. I hope this doesn't blow up.

Obama is Commander in Chief.

We hired him to make these decisions

He's the Decider (sorry I couldn't resist)

tonymctones · « **Reply #6 on:** January 26, 2009, 05:39:21 PM »

Quote from: Straw Man on January 26, 2009, 05:05:27 PM

Obama is Commander in Chief.

We hired him to make these decisions

He's the Decider (sorry I couldn't resist)

he also ran on the platform of listening to those who know more about this then he does. Change you can believe in folks.

Soul Crusher · « **Reply #7 on:** January 26, 2009, 06:08:33 PM »

Quote from: tonymctones on January 26, 2009, 05:39:21 PM

he also ran on the platform of listening to those who know more about this then he does. Change you can believe in folks.

If nothing else, patreus knows a lot more about iraq than ZERO.

tonymctones · « **Reply #8 on:** January 26, 2009, 06:24:38 PM »

Quote from: 333386 on January 26, 2009, 06:08:33 PM

If nothing else, patreus knows a lot more about iraq than ZERO.

oh for sure, he was named specifically by obama as a person who he would listen to and take advice from on iraq.

Straw Man · « **Reply #9 on:** January 26, 2009, 06:52:37 PM »

Quote from: tonymctones on January 26, 2009, 05:39:21 PM

he also ran on the platform of listening to those who know more about this then he does. Change you can believe in folks.

I'm sure he's listening but it's still Obama's job to make the decisions

tonymctones · « **Reply #10 on:** January 26, 2009, 06:58:14 PM »

Quote from: Straw Man on January 26, 2009, 06:52:37 PM

I'm sure he's listening but it's still Obama's job to make the decisions

I agree

Dos Equis · « **Reply #11 on:** January 27, 2009, 10:37:16 AM »

Quote from: tonymctones on January 26, 2009, 06:24:38 PM

oh for sure, he was named specifically by obama as a person who he would listen to and take advice from on iraq.

Correct. Obama was alarmingly unqualified to be CIC, and made significant errors in judgment regarding military matters during the campaign, which makes the advice of his military men that much more important.

240 is Back · « **Reply #12 on:** January 27, 2009, 10:39:43 AM »

Quote from: Beach Bum on January 27, 2009, 10:37:16 AM

Correct. Obama was alarmingly unqualified to be CIC, and made significant errors in judgment regarding military matters during the campaign, which makes the advice of his military men that much more important.

Weird. You said Palin was qualified to be CIC.

Obama had years on the foreign relations committee. Palin had ZERO experience in managing military or foreign affairs. Even her claim of being involved with the alaskan national guard was dispelled by, well, the Alaska national guard themseleves.

Either they're both unqualified, or they're both barely qualified enough.

Dos Equis · « **Reply #13 on:** January 27, 2009, 10:42:02 AM »

Weird, you're making stuff up again.

What in the world does this have to do with Palin? This is about Obama's lack of experience, poor judgment, and poor decision making.

tonymctones · « **Reply #14 on:** January 27, 2009, 10:42:16 AM »

Quote from: Beach Bum on January 27, 2009, 10:37:16 AM

Correct. Obama was alarmingly unqualified to be CIC, and made significant errors in judgment regarding military matters during the campaign, which makes the advice of his military men that much more important.

exactly, his plan for iraq has changed more times then i can count, everytime he meet with somebody who knew what they where talking about he was forced to reform his plan...but now when 3 ppl who are more informed and familiar about the situation say otherwise he "faces them down"

Dos Equis · « **Reply #15 on:** January 27, 2009, 10:45:19 AM »

Quote from: tonymctones on January 27, 2009, 10:42:16 AM

exactly, his plan for iraq has changed more times then i can count, everytime he meet with somebody who knew what they where talking about he was forced to reform his plan...but now when 3 ppl who are more informed and familiar about the situation say otherwise he "faces them down"

Yep. I'm starting to worry a bit. This was my biggest concern about him being president and was the biggest reason why I voted against him.

Soul Crusher · « **Reply #16 on:** January 27, 2009, 10:46:46 AM »

Quote from: tonymctones on January 27, 2009, 10:42:16 AM

exactly, his plan for iraq has changed more times then i can count, everytime he meet with somebody who knew what they where talking about he was forced to reform his plan...but now when 3 ppl who are more informed and familiar about the situation say otherwise he "faces them down"

ZERO gets worse by the day. This latest nonsense with interogations and Gitmo is just brilliant.

Added to the fact that he wants to dictate fuel standards to us car companies already getting hammered is just another indication what garbage we are in for.

Straw Man · « **Reply #17 on:** January 27, 2009, 10:55:42 AM »

Rumsfeld had a lot of experience and sage "advices" for Bush and we probably all wish he hadn't listened to him.

Does anyone here remember "It could last six days, six weeks, I doubt six months"

Soul Crusher · « **Reply #18 on:** January 27, 2009, 10:56:47 AM »

Quote from: Straw Man on January 27, 2009, 10:55:42 AM

Rumsfeld had a lot of experience and sage "advices" for Bush and we probably all wish he hadn't listened to him.

Does here remember "I could last six days, six weeks, I doubt six months"

However, Patreus has a proven record of winning and getting it done. Rumsfeld did not.

Straw Man · « **Reply #19 on:** January 27, 2009, 11:04:27 AM »

Quote from: 333386 on January 27, 2009, 10:56:47 AM

However, Patreus has a proven record of winning and getting it done. Rumsfeld did not.

I don't know Patraeus' record but for better or worse Obama is The Decider (that word still makes me laugh)

headhuntersix · « **Reply #20 on:** January 27, 2009, 12:59:19 PM »

P4 took the 101st into OIF 1 and is super educated, super smart. I think u can look up his background. The timetable is optimistic but Obama keeps saying combat forces...well by late this year early next, there won't be any combat. U need a warrant now to arrest somebody, u need permission for offensive air support...not in aid of US troops. U won't be able to conduct force patrols unless asked for but the Iraqi army, u can patrol within 1 km of ur FOB. U get the idea, this is all happening now and has been planned for well before Barry came into office. We'er dealing with it. If P4 says we need more time...we'll get more time one way or another.

OzmO · « **Reply #21 on:** January 27, 2009, 01:02:08 PM »

Quote from: headhuntersix on January 27, 2009, 12:59:19 PM

P4 took the 101st into OIF 1 and is super educated, super smart. I think u can look up his background. The timetable is optimistic but Obama keeps saying combat forces...well by late this year early next, there won't be any combat. U need a warrant now to arrest somebody, u need permission for offensive air support...not in aid of US troops. U won't be able to conduct force patrols unless asked for but the Iraqi army, u can patrol within 1 km of ur FOB. U get the idea, this is all happening now and has been planned for well before Barry came into office. We'er dealing with it. If P4 says we need more time...we'll get more time one way or another.

So it is what it is and the what we are hearing right now is political blabber? Makes sense

headhuntersix · « **Reply #22 on:** January 27, 2009, 01:06:00 PM »

The elements of the ROE I posted are as we understand it today...we were brief about it this morning, for the guys headed there late spring. They have elections coming up and that will change things somewhat.....the Iraqi army still can't do some things but they control pretty much all of their country. We saw the budget for projects etc...u could win more on powerball so that faucet has been turned off.