Shoppers throng to Target openings

[tu_holmes]

Your opinion.  I like paying less for products. 

No... your opinion is simply invalid... A small business does not have the purchasing power of a Wal-Mart therefore they are not able to get the pricing that Wal-Mart does for goods. Therefore they must buy them for the best price that they possibly can, which is always higher than Wal-Mart. As such, they will be forced to charge more for the same item they sell.

Simply put... a small business owner can not compete with Wal-Mart based on that alone.

That is not opinion... That is fact.

[Dos Equis]

No... your opinion is simply invalid... A small business does not have the purchasing power of a Wal-Mart therefore they are not able to get the pricing that Wal-Mart does for goods. Therefore they must buy them for the best price that they possibly can, which is always higher than Wal-Mart. As such, they will be forced to charge more for the same item they sell.

Simply put... a small business owner can not compete with Wal-Mart based on that alone.

That is not opinion... That is fact.

It is a fact that I recently talked to a small business owner who said they cannot compete with Walmart's prices.  Instead, because Walmart sells the product for so much cheaper, the small business buys the product from Walmart and resells it in their store for a profit.  That's one way a small business can adapt. 

It is a fact that if a small business cannot adapt and compete with Walmart, the small business must close shop. 

Whether you, me, or anyone else believes that is a good thing is a matter of opinion.  I happen to think it's good that a store can offer more products for cheaper prices and provide more jobs than a Mom and Pop store.  The bigness part doesn't really bother me. 

[newmom]

I flipping love target...went in there saturday to get my daughter shoes and a toy for a bday party for her school mate in a few weeks, and walked out 125 bucks poorer...I do love Target though

[tu_holmes]

It is a fact that I recently talked to a small business owner who said they cannot compete with Walmart's prices.  Instead, because Walmart sells the product for so much cheaper, the small business buys the product from Walmart and resells it in their store for a profit.  That's one way a small business can adapt. 

It is a fact that if a small business cannot adapt and compete with Walmart, the small business must close shop. 

Whether you, me, or anyone else believes that is a good thing is a matter of opinion.  I happen to think it's good that a store can offer more products for cheaper prices and provide more jobs than a Mom and Pop store.  The bigness part doesn't really bother me. 

Ridiculous... You're still talking about a store owner who is selling a product for MORE than wal-mart.

Even if I buy it from Wal-Mart at a cheaper price than a distributor, I still have to sell it for more than Wal-Mart does... Or else I can not make a profit.

That's not adapting... That's ludicrous. Why would I buy it from that guy when it's STILL cheaper at Wal-Mart? WTF are you talking about? Are you even listening to yourself?

[Dos Equis]

Ridiculous... You're still talking about a store owner who is selling a product for MORE than wal-mart.

Even if I buy it from Wal-Mart at a cheaper price than a distributor, I still have to sell it for more than Wal-Mart does... Or else I can not make a profit.

That's not adapting... That's ludicrous. Why would I buy it from that guy when it's STILL cheaper at Wal-Mart? WTF are you talking about? Are you even listening to yourself?

No I'm not listening to myself.  I'm trying to help you.    If a small business buys a product from Walmart and sells it for more than they paid at Walmart, the small business makes a profit.  You don't get that? 

It absolutely is adapting.  The alternative is to stop carrying the product altogether, which makes no sense.

If you're talking about the consumer, then of course the consumer is going to buy the product at Walmart and pay a cheaper price.  I think I've said that about five different times/ways in this thread.

The reason a consumer might pay a higher price from the small business owner is the owner may carry some products that Walmart doesn't carry, which gets the consumer through the door, and then consumer will pay a higher price for other products that Walmart does carry to save the inconvenience of having to shop at two stores.   

[tu_holmes]

No I'm not listening to myself.  I'm trying to help you.    If a small business buys a product from Walmart and sells it for more than they paid at Walmart, the small business makes a profit.  You don't get that? 

It absolutely is adapting.  The alternative is to stop carrying the product altogether, which makes no sense.

If you're talking about the consumer, then of course the consumer is going to buy the product at Walmart and pay a cheaper price.  I think I've said that about five different times/ways in this thread.

The reason a consumer might pay a higher price from the small business owner is the owner may carry some products that Walmart doesn't carry, which gets the consumer through the door, and then consumer will pay a higher price for other products that Walmart does carry to save the inconvenience of having to shop at two stores.   

Dude... You have said yourself YOU won't pay more than Wal-Mart which is why you shop there... So if a merchant buys from Wal-Mart and then tries to sell it in his store... It's still more than Wal-Mart.

Hence, why you won't buy from that guy... You are being ludicrous. If "I" buy something from Wal-Mart and then try to sell it for MORE than Wal-Mart pays for it (So "I" can make a profit), I will not be in business for long because everyone else will just go to Wal-Mart in the first place.

Of course we're talking about "the consumer"... Who the hell else is buying the shit from Wal-Mart or the small business in the first place? It's OBVIOUSLY the consumer.

You really are not making any sense in this conversation and now that I've presented to you why it doesn't make sense... You're saying all kinds of insane things. Like a small business owner will have something Wal-Mart doesn't have? What planet is this? Sure... if you're like a comic shop or something... Fine... But on most general items it's nmot even remotely plausible and yet you say you're a business owner.

You are simply lucky that whatever business YOU are in isn't something that Wal-Mart sells... If it was any consumer product that is not "niche" then you'd be as fucked as everyone else.

You really aren't making much sense in this conversation to be honest BB...

There is no incentive for someone to buy a product from a small business who bought a product at Wal-Mart to sell it in his shop... It's still higher priced than Wal-Mart.

PS... You are of no help in this thread to me at all.

[Dos Equis]

Dude... You have said yourself YOU won't pay more than Wal-Mart which is why you shop there... So if a merchant buys from Wal-Mart and then tries to sell it in his store... It's still more than Wal-Mart.

Hence, why you won't buy from that guy... You are being ludicrous. If "I" buy something from Wal-Mart and then try to sell it for MORE than Wal-Mart pays for it (So "I" can make a profit), I will not be in business for long because everyone else will just go to Wal-Mart in the first place.

Of course we're talking about "the consumer"... Who the hell else is buying the shit from Wal-Mart or the small business in the first place? It's OBVIOUSLY the consumer.

You really are not making any sense in this conversation and now that I've presented to you why it doesn't make sense... You're saying all kinds of insane things. Like a small business owner will have something Wal-Mart doesn't have? What planet is this? Sure... if you're like a comic shop or something... Fine... But on most general items it's nmot even remotely plausible and yet you say you're a business owner.

You are simply lucky that whatever business YOU are in isn't something that Wal-Mart sells... If it was any consumer product that is not "niche" then you'd be as fucked as everyone else.

You really aren't making much sense in this conversation to be honest BB...

There is no incentive for someone to buy a product from a small business who bought a product at Wal-Mart to sell it in his shop... It's still higher priced than Wal-Mart.

PS... You are of no help in this thread to me at all.

I can't really explain it much more than I already have.  But let me try again:

1.  I shop at Walmart because they sell cheap stuff.  I'm sure there are many consumers like me.  There are times when I will pay more for a product for the sake of convenience.  For example, there is a store that sells very good produce and I buy nearly all of my produce from this store.  The same store also carries some of the same products that Walmart carries, but charges more than Walmart.  I sometimes buy the products at this store and pay more, because I don't feel like driving to Walmart.  That ties into the example I already gave you about why a consumer might pay more for a product. 

2.  There are stores that carry products that Walmart doesn't carry.  The small business owner I spoke with is one example.  There is nothing "insane" about what they are doing.  They're surviving.  They're finding creative ways to compete.  They sell products that Walmart doesn't carry and some that Walmart does carry.  Stores that cannot compete die.  That's how the free market works. 

[tu_holmes]

I can't really explain it much more than I already have.  But let me try again:

1.  I shop at Walmart because they sell cheap stuff.  I'm sure there are many consumers like me.  There are times when I will pay more for a product for the sake of convenience.  For example, there is a store that sells very good produce and I buy nearly all of my produce from this store.  The same store also carries some of the same products that Walmart carries, but charges more than Walmart.  I sometimes buy the products at this store and pay more, because I don't feel like driving to Walmart.  That ties into the example I already gave you about why a consumer might pay more for a product. 

2.  There are stores that carry products that Walmart doesn't carry.  The small business owner I spoke with is one example.  There is nothing "insane" about what they are doing.  They're surviving.  They're finding creative ways to compete.  They sell products that Walmart doesn't carry and some that Walmart does carry.  Stores that cannot compete die.  That's how the free market works. 

You have made no point what so ever... In your logic, you will shop at wal-mart because it's cheaper, but everyone else won't or shouldn't. Whatever.

There is still no competition because a small business owner can not compete with Wal-Mart's buying power. Then, by your logic, he can buy from Wal-Mart and the profit margin for a small business owner has been reduced even further... You can stop now because the idea of buying from a retail store and selling it for more than that retail store is not survival, it's simply delaying the inevitable. The business will go under.

Who else agrees with Beach Bum on this?

I just have to know... All of you small business owners out here... please explain how Beach is making any sense at all. As a person who deals with Budgest and finances from a practical business standpoint, I just don't get it.

[Internet Tough Guy]

Ah . . . no.  Me going to another store to pay more for products does not result in employees at places like Walmart earn a "living wage."  It just results in me paying more than I should.  Zero connection. 

Your taxes comments really don't make sense.  If you pay more for a product the sales tax is higher, so you're paying more in taxes.   

And no one is forced to worked at Walmart.  Slave wages?      

Got that right...

Slave wages???  Next thing she'll throw out that tired, "When WE were slaves" nonsense when she was never a slave . . . .

[Dos Equis]

You have made no point what so ever... In your logic, you will shop at wal-mart because it's cheaper, but everyone else won't or shouldn't. Whatever.

There is still no competition because a small business owner can not compete with Wal-Mart's buying power. Then, by your logic, he can buy from Wal-Mart and the profit margin for a small business owner has been reduced even further... You can stop now because the idea of buying from a retail store and selling it for more than that retail store is not survival, it's simply delaying the inevitable. The business will go under.

Who else agrees with Beach Bum on this?

I just have to know... All of you small business owners out here... please explain how Beach is making any sense at all. As a person who deals with Budgest and finances from a practical business standpoint, I just don't get it.

Actually I said a couple things about consumers.  (1) I shop at Walmart because they sell cheap stuff and I'm sure many consumers do the same.  (2) I also said I will occasionally pay more at other stores for the sake of convenience and I'm sure many consumers do the same.

I'm not talking about profit margin.  What I said (and probably won't say again) is businesses have to adapt, compete, or close down.  I gave one example of how a particular small business adapts to the fact that Walmart sells some of the small business' products for so much cheaper.  I'm sure there are other ways.  That's were creativity, etc., or survival of the fittest comes into play. 

And just to clarify, I'm just exchanging ideas, stating my opinion, etc.  I'm not trying to convince you to agree with me.  But if you want a poll to make you feel better let me know I'll set one up.     

[24KT]

I watched the first clip.  It's a yawner.  So he found people who were discriminated against, people who aren't happy with their wages, and people complaining about Walmart being so big and successful.  Not news.  Did the documentary include interviews with the thousands of people who are happy to have a job at Walmart?  Or the millions of shoppers who like the store?  

Perhaps you should watch the film and discover this answer for yourself?
Since you clearly don't trust my judgement or my responses to questions, that would only make the most sense.
Wouldn't you agree?

[Dos Equis]

Perhaps you should watch the film and discover this answer for yourself?
Since you clearly don't trust my judgement or my responses to questions, that would only make the most sense.
Wouldn't you agree?

Not interested. 

Yes I agree that I don't trust your judgment or your responses to questions.    One reason is I said the following:  I doubt there are a "significant number of communities where Walmart is (a) the only employer and (b) created less jobs than the stores that could not compete."  You said there are.  On what do you based your conclusion?  And don't give me some hour long clip.  Did you read this somewhere?  See statistics?     

[muscleforlife]

With the global economy going down the toilet, any mom and pop store will be able to survive.    With giants like fortunoffs, circuit city, etc going out of business.
And going into a business where the owner knows me by name and my needs is always a plus.
Sandra

[tu_holmes]

Not interested. 

Yes I agree that I don't trust your judgment or your responses to questions.    One reason is I said the following:  I doubt there are a "significant number of communities where Walmart is (a) the only employer and (b) created less jobs than the stores that could not compete."  You said there are.  On what do you based your conclusion?  And don't give me some hour long clip.  Did you read this somewhere?  See statistics?    

What would you consider significant?

20, 40, 100?

What do you consider "significant" when it comes to Wal-Mart forcing smaller places out of business?

[gordiano]

The trade-off is, no WMT shoppers are found in the store.  All in all it's a wash.

Exactly. Walmart is full of scumbags, crack heads, et cetera. I avoid that place....

[24KT]

Not interested. 

Yes I agree that I don't trust your judgment or your responses to questions.    One reason is I said the following:  I doubt there are a "significant number of communities where Walmart is (a) the only employer and (b) created less jobs than the stores that could not compete."  You said there are.  On what do you based your conclusion?  And don't give me some hour long clip.  Did you read this somewhere?  See statistics?     

Good grief! 

If you neither trust my judgement, nor my responses to questions posed, ...why do you keep asking me questions?

If you don't want to view Robert's film, ...how about an episode of "Family Guy" instead?     

[Eyeball Chambers]

Good grief! 

If you neither trust my judgement, nor my responses to questions posed, ...why do you keep asking me questions?

If you don't want to view Robert's film, ...how about an episode of "Family Guy" instead?     

HAHA 

[Hereford]

Exactly. Walmart is full of scumbags, crack heads, et cetera. I avoid that place....

I shop at Target and pay a little more mearly to avoid going to the walmart.

Walmart here is packed all the time with mexicans and tapout meth heads. Dirty and all around crappy.  Target is nicer.

[Eyeball Chambers]

Walmart here is packed all the time with mexicans

Same here

Not the legal ones, the dirty ones that roam in packs of 15 and smell bad. 

[LurkerNoMore]

Walmart appeals to the lowest common denominator in the factions of society. 

I will pay more for a better product and a better overall shopping crowd in the store instead of going to their crappy stores.

[Dos Equis]

Good grief! 

If you neither trust my judgement, nor my responses to questions posed, ...why do you keep asking me questions?

O.K.  You got me.  I should have prefaced my "questions" with the word "rhetorical." 

[Dos Equis]

What would you consider significant?

20, 40, 100?

What do you consider "significant" when it comes to Wal-Mart forcing smaller places out of business?

I don't really have a number, yet, but let's start with the list of the largest 262 cities in the country.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_cities_by_population

In how many of these is Walmart the only employer and created less jobs than the smaller businesses that couldn't compete? 

[tu_holmes]

I don't really have a number, yet, but let's start with the list of the largest 262 cities in the country.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_cities_by_population

In how many of these is Walmart the only employer and created less jobs than the smaller businesses that couldn't compete? 

How many of them have Wal-Mart supercenters close by.

Also, why is this indicative of what we're talking about?

Those 262 "largest cities" in the US are a very very small population of the US as a whole.

[Dos Equis]

How many of them have Wal-Mart supercenters close by.

Also, why is this indicative of what we're talking about?

Those 262 "largest cities" in the US are a very very small population of the US as a whole.

I don't know how many have Walmart supercenters close by (those are the only stores I was actually talking about). 

My comments were responsive to the following:

It doesn't benefit the community if there is only one employer (whose goods are supplied by China) and those jobs don't translate into people being able to to support their families like they used to be able to do.

[Eyeball Chambers]

Walmart is a great place to shop if you're an illegal Mexican, or trash that just doesn't know any better.