Author Topic: Ron Paul: "56 bases and a huge embassy in Iraq"  (Read 1046 times)

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Ron Paul: "56 bases and a huge embassy in Iraq"
« on: March 08, 2009, 11:15:49 PM »
Wow, Ron paul says we'll still have all of this there by 2011. 

I watched "W" tonight.  Anyone see it?  Cheney's speech about how we'll own the oil of the world if we can just set up a bunch of bases in iraq.  He was onto something.   Once you get past those silly lies about WMD, the bases kinda make sense, no?

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Re: Ron Paul: "56 bases and a huge embassy in Iraq"
« Reply #1 on: March 08, 2009, 11:23:03 PM »
the Oliver Stone movie?

yes.  good movie.

There is a part where Cheney breaks down the importance of owning access to the world's oil assets in 25 years.  Said that RUS and CHI will need those resources, and we have oceans separating us from it.  He said the only thing we can do to preserve out influence and contorl on their 40 of 60 undeveloped oil fields is to set up bases.  Said it would also allow future action to move on iran, undermine them, etc, and they're even more important for oil than Iraq is.

It's funny... it made perfect sense.  The worlds #1 resource, and one small war and we influence its use and access for the next few decades... of course you'd take it, right?  Throw morality out the window...

I still get annoyed when twats say "We did it for democracy!  For WMD!" But I understand the mentality of small minded people who can't accept most wars in history were fought for global position or reources, and this one is no different.  It just had a nice WMD packaging to scare people and pacify their moral qualms about stealing.

So after seeing this movie, I'm a bigger Cheney fan.  And RP, saying on the DL Hughley show tonight that we have 56 bases and a big embassys, and they're not going anywhere under Obama... maybe it's a good thing we have that kinda influence over there.

Eyeball Chambers

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Re: Ron Paul: "56 bases and a huge embassy in Iraq"
« Reply #2 on: March 08, 2009, 11:27:36 PM »
W. was a really interesting Movie.

It actually caused me to think more of Bush than I did before.
S

Hugo Chavez

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Re: Ron Paul: "56 bases and a huge embassy in Iraq"
« Reply #3 on: March 08, 2009, 11:42:16 PM »
W. was a really interesting Movie.

It actually caused me to think more of Bush than I did before.
It seemed to elisist sympathy for W, make you feel sorry for him.  I'm unsure if that's a good thing.  Out of all of Stone's movies, this one ranks pretty low imo.  I just watched it about a week ago.

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Re: Ron Paul: "56 bases and a huge embassy in Iraq"
« Reply #4 on: March 08, 2009, 11:55:32 PM »
yes.  good movie.

There is a part where Cheney breaks down the importance of owning access to the world's oil assets in 25 years.  Said that RUS and CHI will need those resources, and we have oceans separating us from it.  He said the only thing we can do to preserve out influence and contorl on their 40 of 60 undeveloped oil fields is to set up bases.  Said it would also allow future action to move on iran, undermine them, etc, and they're even more important for oil than Iraq is.

It's funny... it made perfect sense.  The worlds #1 resource, and one small war and we influence its use and access for the next few decades... of course you'd take it, right?  Throw morality out the window...

I still get annoyed when twats say "We did it for democracy!  For WMD!" But I understand the mentality of small minded people who can't accept most wars in history were fought for global position or reources, and this one is no different.  It just had a nice WMD packaging to scare people and pacify their moral qualms about stealing.

So after seeing this movie, I'm a bigger Cheney fan.  And RP, saying on the DL Hughley show tonight that we have 56 bases and a big embassys, and they're not going anywhere under Obama... maybe it's a good thing we have that kinda influence over there.
that's probably one of the most important parts of the movie.

headhuntersix

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Re: Ron Paul: "56 bases and a huge embassy in Iraq"
« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2009, 01:24:33 AM »
I won't comment about the movie...its Stone..but I offer this.

Milblog website.


Remember the Iraq drawdown you heard about last month? The one where a Brigade originally scheduled for Iraq was going to Afghanistan instead? Well, a funny thing about that...

Last weekend we noted this obscure bit of news from ABC:

Gen. Odierno will receive a Stryker Brigade to replace the incoming replacement brigade diverted to Afghanistan just a week ago. That means that he will continue to maintain the current level of two Stryker brigades in Iraq.
While that story might be obscure, it's anything but insignificant. The diversion of the Stryker Brigade (one of two that were then scheduled to replace the two currently in Iraq) to Afghanistan made headlines as the President appeared at Camp Lejeune to announce his Iraq drawdown and Afghanistan "surge". As noted here at the time, that followup report - if accurate - "exposes everything you've heard about troop deployments to Iraq and Afghanistan over the past two weeks as an absolute hoax on the American public."

Read the first entry in this series for details of the preparations made by the Stryker Brigade for an Iraq deployment - 10-month Arabic language schools being just part of the training rendered useless by a reassignment to a country where the locals don't speak it.

Of course, "intensive, 10-month Arabic language training" and "exercises... where they had to help their commanders negotiate with native-speaker role players" were now useless - but if they were no longer needed in Iraq, so be it.
But they were needed in Iraq - just not as badly as the Obama administration needed to make it appear that troops initially slotted for Iraq were going to Afghanistan instead - seemingly making good on a key campaign promise. So with much fanfare the Iraq drawdown (consisting entirely of the Stryker Brigade)/Afghanistan surge (Strykers plus a Marine unit) was announced, and subsequent polls indicated Americans were wildly enthusiastic about the idea.

And a few days later no one would notice the bombshell reported by ABC: "Gen. Odierno will receive a Stryker Brigade to replace the incoming replacement brigade diverted to Afghanistan just a week ago" - perhaps because within 24 hours of reporting that news they changed it to this:

ABC News has also learned that Gen. Odierno will continue to maintain a Stryker Brigade presence in Iraq through the upcoming elections as he had requested. There are currently two Stryker Brigades in Iraq. When their tours end later this year, only one of those departing brigades will be replaced by an incoming Stryker Brigade.
Not only was there no explanation of the "correction", there wasn't even an acknowledgment of the change on the site.

But wait... there's more...

*****
I don't like conspiracy theories - I suspected that ABC's initial report was due to some sort of simple misunderstanding and that the corrected version was in fact correct. But to confirm that I sent a simple email to them:

Greetings
Just linked this in a post, but subsequently discovered the line "ABC News has also learned that Gen. Odierno will receive a Stryker Brigade to replace the incoming replacement brigade diverted to Afghanistan just a week ago" has since vanished without explanation.

What happened?
Even though it was the weekend they were kind enough to reply:
That was updated.
I checked to see if they were referring to a subsequent update - they weren't. So I replied:
Clearly. But that's rather a dramatic change to make without explanation, don't you think? The original version indicates the entire narrative of diverting troops from Iraq to Afghanistan is a fraud perpetrated on the American public. The later version is hardly newsworthy.

Aren't corrections of that magnitude worthy of an appended explanation?
It's been a week since that was sent and I've received no reply. But that's probably because other developments have rendered the point somewhat moot.

*****
Specifically, last Monday the DoD announced:

The Department of Defense announced today that 4th Brigade, 2nd Infantry Division, based in Ft. Lewis, Wash., will deploy in the fall of 2009 to support Operation Iraqi Freedom.

The brigade consists of approximately 4,000 personnel and will deploy as a replacement unit for a formation currently operating in Iraq. Its deployment will provide commanders in Iraq the flexibility to maintain the appropriate level of effort based on their assessment of the security situation on the ground.
The next day's Tacoma News Tribune would report:
A Fort Lewis Stryker combat brigade will deploy to Iraq this fall, several months ahead of the original schedule, Army officials said Monday.

When the 4th Brigade, 2nd Infantry Division departs, all three Stryker brigades based at the Army post will be simultaneously deployed to combat for the first time. Each brigade has about 4,000 soldiers.

And ABC would change their story once again - this time with an explanation:
Editor's Note: Over the weekend, additional information led us to rework this article. We have restored the original wording as additional reporting reconfirms the information posted Friday night.

Gen. Odierno will maintain a two-Stryker Brigade presence through the rest of this year even though a replacement Stryker Brigade had been redirected to Afghansitan [sic]. The Pentagon's announcement Monday that the 4th Stryker BCT, 2nd Infantry Division will head to Iraq in the Fall means both brigades currently in Iraq will be replaced by Stryker Brigades. In shorthand, the 4th SBCT/2nd ID will replace the 1st SBCT/25th ID and the 3rd SBCT/2nd ID will the 56th National Guard Stryker Brigade.

Kudos to them for reporting it, but they fail to connect the dots - removing a Brigade from Iraq (or from the schedule to go to Iraq) and replacing it with another Brigade is no way to accomplish a "drawdown" (except in newspaper headlines).

*****
Let's recap the salient points here:

1. In September, 2008, the 5th Stryker Brigade Combat Team (SBCT) - after months of preparation - is ordered to Iraq. (One of two SBCTs that were then scheduled to replace the two currently in Iraq)

2. In February, 2009, President Obama announces his Iraq drawdown/Afghanistan surge - the 5th SBCT will be diverted to Afghanistan instead of Iraq.

3. March, 2009, the DoD announces the 4th SBCT will deploy to Iraq this fall, several months ahead of the original schedule replacing the 5th SBCT in the rotation in order to maintain two Stryker Brigades in Iraq.

For the record, I'm in favor of commanders on the ground getting the forces they need to get the job done. I have no doubt that two Stryker Brigades are needed in Iraq, and others in Afghanistan.

I'm deeply concerned when I see troop rotations "adjusted" in what appears to be an effort to fool the American public. But I appreciate that the Obama administration can do that in plain sight, even providing press releases detailing exactly how they're doing it.

I'm even more concerned that those efforts - and the ramifications thereof - are obvious to an American media assumed to be independent of the Executive Branch but apparently unconcerned about reporting its activities. Item two above was headline grabbing/TV news lead story material - item three indicates it was a fraud.

One year ago that would have been a hell of a story, don't you think?


L

headhuntersix

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Re: Ron Paul: "56 bases and a huge embassy in Iraq"
« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2009, 01:32:46 AM »
We won't sustain 56 bases..but the big ones will stay. The Kurds are scared shit of us leaving and HATE the arabs. I really hope Obama doesn't sell them out. They have big plans for a major US military presence in Kurdish Iraq. They forsee a Germany or Korea type deal, with the US as a cash cow. I can't blame them. We are never leaving...50,000 troops might be small, but its enough. I would also caution what u see in the Iraqi media and national media as far as our presence. U really need to look at the audience. Most of the crap coming out of Iraq, is aimed at keeping the locals happy. The Iraqi army would prefer to have us stay and help. The same can be said for Karzi in Afghanistan. He whines about airstrikes but thats to keep the locals happy. He has my former boss as the Ambassador, he'd marry him if he could. He knows he'd last about 10 seconds without US support. P4 has 2 years to try and "fix" Afghanistan before Barry packs up our shit, which is a mistake.
L

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Re: Ron Paul: "56 bases and a huge embassy in Iraq"
« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2009, 03:05:33 AM »
the Oliver Stone movie?

i dont have the urge to see that one anymore since i saw they strawed in all these "famous" oneliners into random conversations. made a bit of cheap impression to me.

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Re: Ron Paul: "56 bases and a huge embassy in Iraq"
« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2009, 09:25:59 AM »
We won't sustain 56 bases..but the big ones will stay. The Kurds are scared shit of us leaving and HATE the arabs. I really hope Obama doesn't sell them out. They have big plans for a major US military presence in Kurdish Iraq. They forsee a Germany or Korea type deal, with the US as a cash cow. I can't blame them. We are never leaving...50,000 troops might be small, but its enough. I would also caution what u see in the Iraqi media and national media as far as our presence. U really need to look at the audience. Most of the crap coming out of Iraq, is aimed at keeping the locals happy. The Iraqi army would prefer to have us stay and help. The same can be said for Karzi in Afghanistan. He whines about airstrikes but thats to keep the locals happy. He has my former boss as the Ambassador, he'd marry him if he could. He knows he'd last about 10 seconds without US support. P4 has 2 years to try and "fix" Afghanistan before Barry packs up our shit, which is a mistake.

Do you know if the draw down includes other Arab nations, like Qatar, Kuwait and Bahrain.

I see that whole region as one major shell game.
Where America might draw down in Iraq but then increase their presence in Kuwait.
To offset Iran.

I can't see Barrack selling out the Arabs like he has Israel and the Czech republic.

But he seems to be soft on Iran like Carter.

So who knows.
Z

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Re: Ron Paul: "56 bases and a huge embassy in Iraq"
« Reply #9 on: March 09, 2009, 09:35:39 AM »
yes.  good movie.

There is a part where Cheney breaks down the importance of owning access to the world's oil assets in 25 years.  Said that RUS and CHI will need those resources, and we have oceans separating us from it.  He said the only thing we can do to preserve out influence and contorl on their 40 of 60 undeveloped oil fields is to set up bases.  Said it would also allow future action to move on iran, undermine them, etc, and they're even more important for oil than Iraq is.

It's funny... it made perfect sense.  The worlds #1 resource, and one small war and we influence its use and access for the next few decades... of course you'd take it, right?  Throw morality out the window...

I still get annoyed when twats say "We did it for democracy!  For WMD!" But I understand the mentality of small minded people who can't accept most wars in history were fought for global position or reources, and this one is no different.  It just had a nice WMD packaging to scare people and pacify their moral qualms about stealing.

So after seeing this movie, I'm a bigger Cheney fan.  And RP, saying on the DL Hughley show tonight that we have 56 bases and a big embassys, and they're not going anywhere under Obama... maybe it's a good thing we have that kinda influence over there.

You're an evil guy Rob. :-\
I hate the State.

240 is Back

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Re: Ron Paul: "56 bases and a huge embassy in Iraq"
« Reply #10 on: March 09, 2009, 09:37:41 AM »
You're an evil guy Rob. :-\

i go back and forth.

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Re: Ron Paul: "56 bases and a huge embassy in Iraq"
« Reply #11 on: March 09, 2009, 09:38:36 AM »
i go back and forth.

Yeah, you're weird like that. Hard to pin down...and that's why we love you... ;)
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