More auto union BS

[Hereford]

NUMMI auto workers in Fremont approve furlough plan
By Matt Nauman


Mercury News


Posted: 03/04/2009 12:14:05 PM PST
Updated: 03/04/2009 12:55:33 PM PST


Union auto workers in Fremont overwhelmingly approved a furlough program that requires them to take off one day without pay every week.

Members of United Auto Workers Local 2244 voted 86.5 percent in favor of the proprosal from management at the New United Motor Manufacturing, Inc., factory, the union announced Wednesday. Furloughs start this Friday and run until the union's contract expires in August.

"This is what I tell people," said Sergio Santos, the local union president. "It's not our workforce. It's not our product line. It's just that when we walk out the factory door, the banks aren't lending money and people aren't buying cars and big-ticket items."

Hit hard by the slump in U.S. sales, NUMMI has cut back on work days in recent months to trim production of the Toyota Corolla and Tacoma and Pontiac Vibe. Output in 2008 fell to a 15-year low. Initially, workers took vacation days or performed maintenance tasks and got paid on days when the assembly lines were silent.

But in February, plant management announced that if workers didn't agree to a "work-share" plan with unpaid furlough days, NUMMI would lay off some hourly employees.

Workers will get about $90 in state unemployment pay for those furlough Fridays, Santos said.



This went down recently in the Bay Area, basically the auto unions told the government that they were going to work a 4 day workweek, and the taxpayers were going to pay for the extra day off. All benefits stayed the same. The gvt, of course, rubber stamped it, just like they do for anything union.

How about laying off the unnecessary labor? How about some layoffs? Closing a plant?

[Decker]

I propose true 35 hour work weeks.

I propose optional 4 day work weeks.

I propose mandatory vacations starting at 3 weeks for all employees.

There's more to life than earning a buck. 

Working 2500 hours a year to make ends meet is not free enterprise under a capitalistic system at its best, it's modern day slavery.

[Hereford]

I propose true 35 hour work weeks.

I propose optional 4 day work weeks.

I propose mandatory vacations starting at 3 weeks for all employees.

There's more to life than earning a buck. 

Working 2500 hours a year to make ends meet is not free enterprise under a capitalistic system at its best, it's modern day slavery.

So quit if you dont want to be a slave.

If they didn't take 40% of my paycheck to support the democrat voting block, I wouldn't have to work so much.

[Soul Crusher]

I propose true 35 hour work weeks.

I propose optional 4 day work weeks.

I propose mandatory vacations starting at 3 weeks for all employees.

There's more to life than earning a buck. 

Working 2500 hours a year to make ends meet is not free enterprise under a capitalistic system at its best, it's modern day slavery.

Under your system, everyone would be without a job or near broke.

[Decker]

So quit if you dont want to be a slave.

If they didn't take 40% of my paycheck to support the democrat voting block, I wouldn't have to work so much.

There's always a reason why the average working guy has to work 48+ hours a week.

Always.  ...it's a global economy, we have to compete, taxes, etc. 

Yet I see the average worker charactrized as ungrateful and undeserving.

I mean look at the shitfit people threw when they discovered that union auto workers were earning a livable wage with basic benefits.

I don't think you are paying 40% or your paycheck in taxes.  The income tax is graded where the highest rate of 35% is paid on dollars earned over 330,000.  State income taxes are flat and small in amount.  Deductions, exemptions and the like also affect your tax rate.

If you are paying 40% on each dollar you earn, you are making a mistake.

[Decker]

Under your system, everyone would be without a job or near broke.

That's how the financial elites want us to think.

It will come to the extent that we will work for food and be happy about it.

France and Germany had the things I mentioned.  They aren't broke.

Are we captains of our own destiny or are we pawns in a global market where the vast majority of productivity inures to the benefit of a few wealthy elites?

[Hereford]

There's always a reason why the average working guy has to work 48+ hours a week.

Always.  ...it's a global economy, we have to compete, taxes, etc. 

Yet I see the average worker charactrized as ungrateful and undeserving.

I mean look at the shitfit people threw when they discovered that union auto workers were earning a livable wage with basic benefits.

I don't think you are paying 40% or your paycheck in taxes.  The income tax is graded where the highest rate of 35% is paid on dollars earned over 330,000.  State income taxes are flat and small in amount.  Deductions, exemptions and the like also affect your tax rate.

If you are paying 40% on each dollar you earn, you are making a mistake.

You are not considering things like sales taxes (10.25% here in California as of April 1st), punative taxes such as the car tax, utility taxes, bond debt/property taxes for property owners, gas taxes, etc, etc....

40% is a very conservative number.

Union auto workers get basic benefits and a livable wage? WTF are you smoking? You think the average american worker could tell his boss "Hey, I am only going to work 4 days a week, and go tell the taxpayers they owe me for my extra day off. Oh yea, and I want to keep all of my prevailing benefit package too."

[Soul Crusher]

That's how the financial elites want us to think.

It will come to the extent that we will work for food and be happy about it.

France and Germany had the things I mentioned.  They aren't broke.

Are we captains of our own destiny or are we pawns in a global market where the vast majority of productivity inures to the benefit of a few wealthy elites?

Those countries dont have 20 million illegals on welfare, legions of fat lazy aslobs like we have, and 300 million people. 

Socialists always like to dream, and never take responsibility for the mess they create for their insane policies that never work over any period of time.

Dont you think it is odd that China is moving to more capitilism while we are moving to more socialisim??? 

[MRDUMPLING]

I propose true 35 hour work weeks.

I propose optional 4 day work weeks.

I propose mandatory vacations starting at 3 weeks for all employees.

There's more to life than earning a buck. 

Working 2500 hours a year to make ends meet is not free enterprise under a capitalistic system at its best, it's modern day slavery.

Just throwing this out there.

I'm all for working hard to make a living and bettering ourselves, but does anybody think WHY we have to work 50+ hours to make it?  I know SEVERAL people with college educations that can't afford to live by themselves for the simple fact they don't get paid enough even with that pretty piece of paper.  Just things that make you go hmmm...

Yes, Decker, you are thinking just income taxes...Hereford brings up a great point with other taxes.  

[Soul Crusher]

Just throwing this out there.

I'm all for working hard to make a living and bettering ourselves, but does anybody think WHY we have to work 50+ hours to make it?  I know SEVERAL people with college educations that can't afford to live by themselves for the simple fact they don't get paid enough even with that pretty piece of paper.  Just things that make you go hmmm...

Yes, Decker, you are thinking just income taxes...Hereford brings up a great point with other taxes.  

Sales Tax
Energy Tax
Gas Tax
Cell Phone Tax
User Fees
telephone tax
Cable Bill Tax
FICA Tax
SS Tax


Did I mention Federal Income Tax? 

Did not have to.  We are taxed to death by these crimal robber barons and madoffs in all levels of govt. 

Madoff is a saint compared to these criminals and thieves.

[Hereford]

I saw a breakdown one time that showed that without sheltering your money, you will pay the gvt over 80% of every dollar you ever make in taxes and fees ranging from income tax to death taxes.

The gvt taxes absolutly everything they can conceivable tax these days. Seriously, who can justify getting taxed on dying? Really?

[Soul Crusher]

I saw a breakdown one time that showed that without sheltering your money, you will pay the gvt over 80% of every dollar you ever make in taxes and fees ranging from income tax to death taxes.

The gvt taxes absolutly everything they can conceivable tax these days. Seriously, who can justify getting taxed on dying? Really?

Who???  the liberal dreamers do it every day on this board every post.

[Hereford]

Who???  the liberal dreamers do it every day on this board every post.

It was a rhetorical question.

[Soul Crusher]

It was a rhetorical question.

No, it is a very real question and is the essence of almost every election we have.

Obama wants to tax everything, everyone, and everybody into submission.  The government complex wants take 100% of everything everyone earns all the time and dole it out to the welfare bums, fat cat campaign contributors, union bosses, family members, etc.

They have enough useful liberal idiots to defend it while the rest of us get screwed.   

 

[shootfighter1]

If you consider all taxes, many people do pay 35-40% tax on money earned.  Thats why I am firmly against increasing spending and any increase in taxation for working people.

[Decker]

You are not considering things like sales taxes (10.25% here in California as of April 1st), punative taxes such as the car tax, utility taxes, bond debt/property taxes for property owners, gas taxes, etc, etc....

40% is a very conservative number.

While those other taxes are indeed taxes, you are still not getting close to paying 40% of your gross income in taxes.  You aren't.  The Tax Foundation takes into account those taxes when it publishes its Tax Freedom Day paper.  The real number is more like 30%.  40% is not accurate.
http://www.taxfoundation.org/taxfreedomday/

Union auto workers get basic benefits and a livable wage? WTF are you smoking? You think the average american worker could tell his boss "Hey, I am only going to work 4 days a week, and go tell the taxpayers they owe me for my extra day off. Oh yea, and I want to keep all of my prevailing benefit package too."

Auto workers get a livable wage and basic benefits. 

Some have 4 day workweeks.  If there's a particular negotiated pay frame that calls for payments on a downday then so what?

I don't seem to recall you complaining about salaried autoexecutives getting paid for their days off?  And they make 6-7 figure salaries annually. 

Do the UAW lineworkers fly private jets to their own vacation retreats?  I'd bet the auto executives do.  After all, they flew the private jets to washington to collect a bail out.

[Soul Crusher]

You are completely out of your mind.

Taxes, when totaled are well over 40%.  Do the math.

I listed some of the taxes, not all that easily take a person over 40%.   

[Decker]

Those countries dont have 20 million illegals on welfare, legions of fat lazy aslobs like we have, and 300 million people. 

Neither does the US.

It's estimated there are 20 million illegal immigrants in the US.  You state that they are all on AFDC.  That's a bit of a stretch, wouldn't you say?

I'm not sure how you quantify 'legions' for the fat, lazy slob segment of our population.

Socialists always like to dream, and never take responsibility for the mess they create for their insane policies that never work over any period of time.

Those doggone socialists.  You just can't count on them.  They are just like liberals.

Dont you think it is odd that China is moving to more capitilism while we are moving to more socialisim??? 

You'd have to quantify what you mean here.  This is the same China that owns roughly 47% of the free and capitalist United States, right?

[Decker]

You are completely out of your mind.

Taxes, when totaled are well over 40%.  Do the math.

I listed some of the taxes, not all that easily take a person over 40%.   

No, you do the math.  You made the claim, you support it.  I cited a source that does the math and it comes out to a 30% clip.

[Decker]

Just throwing this out there.

I'm all for working hard to make a living and bettering ourselves, but does anybody think WHY we have to work 50+ hours to make it?  I know SEVERAL people with college educations that can't afford to live by themselves for the simple fact they don't get paid enough even with that pretty piece of paper.  Just things that make you go hmmm...

Yes, Decker, you are thinking just income taxes...Hereford brings up a great point with other taxes.  

Take a look at my response to him.

It's not just the college grads who will suffer.  IF the US enters a depression, then we'll all be in dire straits.  The average depression in US history has lasted 7 years.  Everyone will suffer.

And for what it's worth, education is its own reward.  It's not the piece of paper. 

[Soul Crusher]

Take a look at my response to him.

It's not just the college grads who will suffer.  IF the US enters a depression, then we'll all be in dire straits.  The average depression in US history has lasted 7 years.  Everyone will suffer.

And for what it's worth, education is its own reward.  It's not the piece of paper. 

Most people in this country are employed by small businesses.  They cannot function when everyone wants to work 7 hours a day.  It simply does not work that way. 

I own my own place and trust me, I wish I could only work 35 hours a week and make it, it just never will be.

[MRDUMPLING]

Take a look at my response to him.

It's not just the college grads who will suffer.  IF the US enters a depression, then we'll all be in dire straits.  The average depression in US history has lasted 7 years.  Everyone will suffer.

And for what it's worth, education is its own reward.  It's not the piece of paper. 

Yes, I was by no means trying to denounce a college education.  It was just an very general example as to how correlation is not causation.  Just the fact that the simple guy trying to make a living with a little R&R thrown in, but the rich just keep getting richer.

[Decker]

Most people in this country are employed by small businesses.  They cannot function when everyone wants to work 7 hours a day.  It simply does not work that way. 

I own my own place and trust me, I wish I could only work 35 hours a week and make it, it just never will be.

I did not say this was going to be easy.  I'm a firm believer in safety nets.  I think rank and file workers should have 35 hour work weeks.

If you or your employees want to reach for the brass ring and work more, go ahead.  Just make sure you pay your EEs for their extra effort.

[Decker]

Yes, I was by no means trying to denounce a college education.  It was just an very general example as to how correlation is not causation.  Just the fact that the simple guy trying to make a living with a little R&R thrown in, but the rich just keep getting richer.

Sorry Mr. Dumpling.  What do you call a guy with a Phd in American LIterature?  Waiter?!

[MRDUMPLING]

Sorry Mr. Dumpling.  What do you call a guy with a Phd in American LIterature?  Waiter?!