Author Topic: My dog is itching himself hairless  (Read 12854 times)

BigMenace

  • Getbig II
  • **
  • Posts: 148
My dog is itching himself hairless
« on: March 25, 2009, 07:33:02 PM »
That pretty much sums it up.  He is itching and licking like fvcking mad.  Making sore patches all over his back and under his front legs.  I have no idea what triggered this and have been using sulfodene a couple times a day (he instantly goes nuts and rolls on the ground to get it off him).  I've been bathing him once a week with an all natural oats and honey dog shampoo.  I don't use a lot because I'm not sure I'm helping or making it worse.  He seems to like the cool water over his back.  Should I shave him?  Am I doing what I should be doing?  Any advice would be fantastic.  I'll try to throw up some pics later tonight or manana.

Butterbean

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 19326
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2009, 06:18:31 AM »
Poor guy!

I don't think washing him that much would be good for him but I don't know.  Seems like it would dry out his skin quite a bit.

Have you seen any fleas?

How old is he?  Has he ever done this before?  A couple times a year my dogs seem to scratch a little (but nothing like you are saying) and we're pretty sure it's an allergy thing.

I would call the vet asap.

I will email this to flower and PM to Vet.
R

Princess L

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 13094
  • I stop for turtles
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2009, 07:25:53 AM »
Poor baby  :'(  He's probably miserable.  The Sulfodene might be very painful for him, giving him a burning sensation.

I'd get him into a vet asap.  It could be an allergy, but it could also be mange or scabies, something that NEEDS to be treated.  The vet would do a skin scraping and look at it under a microscope to diagnose.

I remember when Keesha was about 6 months old she developed some sort of rare mange and the vet said it is often times deadly if not treated soon enough and even then, the outcome was iffy.  Fortunately, we were able to treat it and she lived to be 19 years old.

Please get him in ASAP!

Oh, and I think some forms can be transmitted to humans.


http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?c=2+2107+2253&aid=764
The symptoms are varied, but usually include hair loss and severe itching especially on the elbows, ears, armpits, hocks, chest, and ventral abdomen (belly). The mites prefer to live on areas of the skin that have less hair. As the infection worsens it can spread over the entire body. Small red pustules often develop along with yellow crusts on the skin. Because of the severe itching and resultant scratching, the skin soon becomes traumatized and a variety of sores and infections can develop as a result. The itching seems to be much worse in warm conditions such as indoors or near a stove or heat vent. If the infection goes untreated or is mistakenly treated as an allergy, the skin may darken due to the constant irritation, and the surrounding lymph nodes may become enlarged.

Sarcoptic mange is a somewhat common infection and many cases have often been misdiagnosed as severe atopy (inhalant allergy). Any time we see a dog who does not have a prior history of allergies and develops severe itching, or if the itching is not seasonal but year-round, we have to suspect sarcoptic mange.


The intense itching caused by the sarcoptic mite is actually thought to be caused from a severe allergic reaction to the mite. When dogs are initially infected with Sarcoptes they do not develop itching for several weeks. If the animals are treated and then reinfected at a later time, severe itching starts almost immediately, which indicates the itching may be due to an allergic reaction. However, the standard treatments for allergies generally will not decrease the symptoms of scabies, and will do nothing to cure the disease.

:

Princess L

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 13094
  • I stop for turtles
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #3 on: March 26, 2009, 07:41:35 AM »
Is your puppy showing any signs?  Since mange is contagious, Menace could've caught it from the puppy.


http://www.barkbytes.com/medical/med0019.htm
 Demodectic mange is the result of Demodex canis, a microscopic mite multiplying out of control.  Most dogs have demodex mites on their skin in small numbers.  These mites are acquired by puppies shortly after birth, from their mother.
        The causative factors as to why some dogs develope demodectic mange while other dogs do not is not fully understood.  The tendancy to be suseptible to demodectic mange appears to be hereditary.  It is known that dogs with demodectic mange have an immune system defect.  It is this defect that appears to be inherited, making the pup unable to keep the demodex mites under control.
        Demodectic mange occurs in one of two forms.  The first form is the localized form.  This form most often appears in dogs under 1 year of age.  The first sign is a thinning of hair around the eyelids, the lips, the corners of the mouth and the front legs. The dog has a moth-eaten appearance.  The patches of hair loss can progress into circles of approximately one inch in diameter (occasionally confused with ringworm).  Mite removal/reduction normally consists of cleansing shampoos, antibiotic therapy, and immune stimulants.  Not all young animals that experience demodicosis are immunologically impaired for life.  A significant percentage will "self cure" as their immune system matures.  This maturity normally takes place between the ages of 8 months and 3 years, depending on the breed of dog.
        During treatment it is critical that the dog is making continuous improvement.  If the animal has 5 or more patches, or is not showing a marked improvement; the demodex could be progressing into the generalized form.
       The generalized form is the second presentation type of this condition.  Generalized demodex can begin as a localized case or can present itself as a sudden onset.  Numerous patches appear on the head, legs, and trunk.  These patches continuously spread developing into large areas of hair loss.  The hair follicles become congested with debris and mites.  The breakdown of the skin leads to the formation of sores, with crusting and draining sinus tracts.
        Treatment of dogs experiencing generalized demodex can be very prolonged.  The reponse to treatment is slow and often requires frequent changes in the medication.  In spite of the number of mite removal dips, topical ointments and antibiotics availale a cure is not always possible.  Generalized demodectic mange must be treated under veterinary supervision.
        Older dogs that develop demodectic mange (in either form) should be screened for underlying causative factors in immune system dysfunction.  Diseases such as diabetes, cancer or Cushing's disease can all impact therapy.
        Dogs treated for generalized demodectic mange should be neutered.
:

Princess L

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 13094
  • I stop for turtles
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2009, 07:48:59 AM »









Am I imagining a change in the skin around the eyes?



Potential home remedies: http://www.earthclinic.com/Pets/dog_mange_cure.html
if getting to the vet is impossible.
:

knny187

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22005
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #5 on: March 26, 2009, 10:12:22 AM »
As everyone else said....take him/her to the vet.

Could be allergic reaction to something.

Was this skin irritation happening before you gave the bath?


~flower~

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 3597
  • D/s
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2009, 10:49:04 AM »
A vet check would be in order as has been mentioned to rule out some medical reasons with a skin scraping.  Other than that I would look at environment and dietary changes and see if you can find a link.  Did you start using a new laundry soap?  Put something on the carpets? Does it seem to have happened with the change of seasons?  A new treat? etc etc.   Allergies can be difficult to pin point exactly and I believe even Vet has mentioned that the testing for them can be not be very helpful (correct me if I am wrong Vet  :)), so I would look at what is different now.

  Fish oil is good in general, so I would start giving that regardless of any issues.  1capsule per 10-20 pounds a day. I would do the 10# dosage since he is itchy.  Over-bathing can dry out the skin, so if it appears to be making things worse then I would cut back on that, also check the ingredients on what you are using and try and find a more natural one becuase some additives in them can be aggravating to skin.
 

Vet

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 1679
  • Immortal
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #7 on: March 26, 2009, 10:59:06 AM »









Am I imagining a change in the skin around the eyes?



Potential home remedies: http://www.earthclinic.com/Pets/dog_mange_cure.html
if getting to the vet is impossible.
Wow, that dog looks so much like The HOO its scary....


Breed alone i'd include allergies and demodectic mange on the differential list.   Allergies more so than demodex (although thats something I have had issues with with my one female off and on her entire life).   Demodex causes hair loss---thus the "raccoon eye" appearance that you hear so much about.   The mange mite lives in the hair follicles, so it can be itchy. The scratching leads to secondary bacterial infections.   Thus the name "red mange".   Demodex can also be localized (around the eyes) and not cause any clinical signs other than hair loss.  

Sarcoptic mange is a burrowing mite that literally burrows through the skin, and causes an intense itching secondary to the immune response.  Sarcoptic mange is also zoonotic in that it is a mange mite that humans can get (my wife got scabies from a dog at the humane society when we were vet students).  Scabies is not fun at all.  

From the pictures, that dog doesn't look like it has sarcoptic mange.  A skin scrape is needed to identify and differentiate scabies and demodex.  


Like its been said, if the dog is that uncomfortable, it needs to be seen by a veterinarian.  I would strongly caution against the old standby "depo" injection though and if the vet suggests that, consider finding a different vet.  Depomedrol is a long acting steroid that has been a standby treatment for too long in veterinary medicine.  The problem with depo is that if you have a dog that is corticosteroid sensitive, you will have all of the side effects with no way to remove the injection once its given.  Oral prednisone is a much better initial treatment, if corticosteroids are indicated.  My dogo is a prime example (he's a mess right now because of ringworm and secondary pyoderma).   He started itching severely this spring.  I gave him a single dose of 20 mg of prednisone orally to alleviate his itching--he literally pissed all  over my house the same day the drugs were given.   We've realized he's an extermely cortiocosteroid sensitive dog and had we gone the route of depo, he would have been pissing all over my house for weeks.    I've seen depo induced diabetes in both dogs and cats.  There are many side effects.  Again, once the injection is given, it cant be taken back out if there is a problem.  The problem is depo is dirt cheap, it provides some relief in some cases, and owners want a quick fix.  


Allergies in dogs can be extremely frustrating because you cant ask the dog what makes the itching feel better.  SO if you go the antihistamine route, it may take several tries to find the right one that works....  unfortunately most owners want a quick fix and they won't go that route.  


Anyway, enough soapbox.  If money is a huge issue, you can try diphenhdramine at a dose of 2-4 mg/kg (this is a commonly sited drug and dose on the internet) every 8 hours.  It may provide some temporary relief and the drug has minimal side effects.  

If that doesn't work, get the dog to a veterinarian.  

BigMenace

  • Getbig II
  • **
  • Posts: 148
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #8 on: March 26, 2009, 11:01:03 AM »
Princess.....it's my rednose (Ben) not the one you posted up (Menace).  My wife said he got into an anthill in the backyard last week.  I was out of town.  Said he actually looks a lot better now.  Menace had mange as a pup and this seems different.  The other dogs are fine....

Knny....yes it occured before the baths.  I thought the water might help and he seems to like it.

BigMenace

  • Getbig II
  • **
  • Posts: 148
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2009, 11:03:06 AM »
Vet....diphenhdramine is Benadryl yes?

biceps

  • Getbig III
  • ***
  • Posts: 538
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2009, 02:06:37 PM »
That pretty much sums it up.  He is itching and licking like fvcking mad.  Making sore patches all over his back and under his front legs.  I have no idea what triggered this and have been using sulfodene a couple times a day (he instantly goes nuts and rolls on the ground to get it off him).  I've been bathing him once a week with an all natural oats and honey dog shampoo.  I don't use a lot because I'm not sure I'm helping or making it worse.  He seems to like the cool water over his back.  Should I shave him?  Am I doing what I should be doing?  Any advice would be fantastic.  I'll try to throw up some pics later tonight or manana.

Are you in the USA? if yes I will send you free of charge (for 2 week) my product to try it out, in return I need photos before and after.

BigMenace

  • Getbig II
  • **
  • Posts: 148
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2009, 02:57:57 PM »
My wife informed me he got into an ant hill last week.  Trying the benadryl on him....

Vet

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 1679
  • Immortal
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #12 on: March 26, 2009, 03:09:31 PM »
Vet....diphenhdramine is Benadryl yes?
yes--make sure you read the label if you are using generic.

I'm assuming fire ants?  The will tear a dog up if the dog is sensitive to them.   Unfortunately, at this point only thing you can do is wait it out and try to keep them comfortable.  He may need antibiotics if he's scratched himself to the point of a superficial pyoderma (a superficial skin infection secondary to the ant bites). 

Dogs are sort of like people in the sensitivity they have.  Just as an example, my wife is SUPER sensitive.  One bite drives her nuts.   I on the other hand frequently use fire ants for preparation of bones and models for students.  As long as I don't get too many bites, they don't really bother me.    My one pit is SUPER sensitive to them.  My neighbors Australia cattle dog can literally sit on a fire ant nest and it just doesn't seem to bother him.   So be aware of the differences from dog to dog.   

Vet

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 1679
  • Immortal
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #13 on: March 26, 2009, 03:13:03 PM »
Oh, and I wouldn't shave a short haired dog like a pit unless there is severe crusting/collection of debris or open bleeding lacerations.  A clipper burn (they happen no matter how hard you try to avoid them) will only make things worse.   You generally don't have a problem seeing whats going on with that breeds skin. 

biceps

  • Getbig III
  • ***
  • Posts: 538
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #14 on: March 26, 2009, 03:50:06 PM »
My wife informed me he got into an ant hill last week.  Trying the benadryl on him....

Don`t try benadryl, you have my website,you can email me or call me, I will help you. Read the study.

chaos

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 57383
  • Ron "There is no freedom of speech here" Avidan
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #15 on: March 26, 2009, 04:04:41 PM »
Don`t try benadryl, you have my website,you can email me or call me, I will help you. Read the study.
Post a link for everyone to see, share with us all. :)
Liar!!!!Filt!!!!

biceps

  • Getbig III
  • ***
  • Posts: 538
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #16 on: March 26, 2009, 04:25:12 PM »
Post a link for everyone to see, share with us all. :)

OK, for USA www.petequinox.com for police K9 dogs www.agentk9.com for Europa www.dogtorrx.com

BigMenace

  • Getbig II
  • **
  • Posts: 148
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #17 on: March 26, 2009, 05:02:06 PM »
yes--make sure you read the label if you are using generic.

I'm assuming fire ants?  The will tear a dog up if the dog is sensitive to them.   Unfortunately, at this point only thing you can do is wait it out and try to keep them comfortable.  He may need antibiotics if he's scratched himself to the point of a superficial pyoderma (a superficial skin infection secondary to the ant bites). 

Dogs are sort of like people in the sensitivity they have.  Just as an example, my wife is SUPER sensitive.  One bite drives her nuts.   I on the other hand frequently use fire ants for preparation of bones and models for students.  As long as I don't get too many bites, they don't really bother me.    My one pit is SUPER sensitive to them.  My neighbors Australia cattle dog can literally sit on a fire ant nest and it just doesn't seem to bother him.   So be aware of the differences from dog to dog.   

They were black ants regular size i guess.  She sprayed the hill right away and then ran the spray hose on it for a while. 

Biceps...I'm not tryin to be a dick but that looks like an overall general health type of product or am I wrong?

biceps

  • Getbig III
  • ***
  • Posts: 538
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #18 on: March 26, 2009, 05:34:34 PM »
They were black ants regular size i guess.  She sprayed the hill right away and then ran the spray hose on it for a while. 

Biceps...I'm not tryin to be a dick but that looks like an overall general health type of product or am I wrong?

Actually is more than just general health, I have many veterinary hospitals using my product on dogs with liver and  kidney problems caused by prescription medications. And as you can see on the website I have published study. Toxicology files shows no any side effects. The toxicology study was conducted on humans and rats.

knny187

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22005
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #19 on: March 27, 2009, 10:02:47 AM »
Conducted on human & rats but given to dogs.  Makes sense to me.

I'm sure just like anything out there it may have effects (positive, or negative).

Just don't insist on what one person should do with their dog.  You wouldn't want to feel responsible for a dog getting sicker because your giving advice of 'not going to a vet' & try my product first.  I personally don't take any human workout supplements although there's numerous support showing their effectiveness.  I also don't take human medicine.  I also don't ever get sick. 

biceps

  • Getbig III
  • ***
  • Posts: 538
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #20 on: March 27, 2009, 12:24:43 PM »
Conducted on human & rats but given to dogs.  Makes sense to me.

I'm sure just like anything out there it may have effects (positive, or negative).

Just don't insist on what one person should do with their dog.  You wouldn't want to feel responsible for a dog getting sicker because your giving advice of 'not going to a vet' & try my product first.  I personally don't take any human workout supplements although there's numerous support showing their effectiveness.  I also don't take human medicine.  I also don't ever get sick. 


I don`t insist, I am offering my help. Yes the toxicological studies was conducted on humans and rats, because originally the product was intended to humans, the toxicological file includes:

Acute toxicity
Chronic toxicity
Micronuclei test
Cytogenic study
Armest test
Testing of oncogenicity and oncostimulating activity
conclusion's active ingredient without toxicity

Also the Radioactive determination shows no contamination with radioactive elements.

Than last year a study was conducted in Hungary on dogs by R. Gippert DVM reference:1.R.Gipper.,Clinical experiences,Small animal practice periodical 2008,2nd issue,page 78.

I do understand your concern and is nice that you care about animals.


knny187

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22005
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #21 on: March 27, 2009, 02:33:08 PM »
I don`t insist, I am offering my help. Yes the toxicological studies was conducted on humans and rats, because originally the product was intended to humans, the toxicological file includes:

Acute toxicity
Chronic toxicity
Micronuclei test
Cytogenic study
Armest test
Testing of oncogenicity and oncostimulating activity
conclusion's active ingredient without toxicity

Also the Radioactive determination shows no contamination with radioactive elements.

Than last year a study was conducted in Hungary on dogs by R. Gippert DVM reference:1.R.Gipper.,Clinical experiences,Small animal practice periodical 2008,2nd issue,page 78.

I do understand your concern and is nice that you care about animals.



all the more reason i wouldn't ingest that stuff or my dog

but thats my opinion

biceps

  • Getbig III
  • ***
  • Posts: 538
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #22 on: March 27, 2009, 06:06:49 PM »
all the more reason i wouldn't ingest that stuff or my dog

but thats my opinion

No problem.

Jadethegladiator

  • Competitors II
  • Getbig IV
  • *****
  • Posts: 2908
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #23 on: March 27, 2009, 07:24:37 PM »
Are you in the USA? if yes I will send you free of charge (for 2 week) my product to try it out, in return I need photos before and after.

I would definitely be interested in trying your product.  Baby Rocco is obsessed 24/7 with the licking & scratching thing.  Rocky & Roxy are not affected at all.  I will take some "before pics" tomorrow.   

This is him before the nightmare started. 

biceps

  • Getbig III
  • ***
  • Posts: 538
Re: My dog is itching himself hairless
« Reply #24 on: March 27, 2009, 09:21:03 PM »
I would definitely be interested in trying your product.  Baby Rocco is obsessed 24/7 with the licking & scratching thing.  Rocky & Roxy are not affected at all.  I will take some "before pics" tomorrow.   

This is him before the nightmare started. 

Just PM me your address or you can email me or call me, go to my website, I would not charg you.