Author Topic: some hope and common sense for those naturals (Read 1817 times)

disco_stu · « **on:** May 15, 2009, 07:16:25 PM »

stick with it those who choose to be natural...it comes in the long run.

ive been in the game for 21 years now and seen them come and go, from bikers who only train in summer and use massive amounts of gear and get huge each year then go completely off gear and training for the next 8 months, to those who come in and ruin their potential with GH and slin and end up with polumbuism and massive guts..

yet i see these freaks of muscle come in as skinnt 16 year olds and become massive by 19 or 20, and very few go further than that, or they stay the same for the next 10 years, or even get smaller...whilst the natural guys are still here, week in, week out, and over a decade they have become darn impressive.

sure it takes alot longer, but it seems that they are still around whereas the others are not- for a bunch of reasons i can only speculate on. Then theres the acne bloated type that are still skinny as shit but walk around with their arms out at right angles..

stick with it naturals as eventually your metabolism slows and muscle goes on easier, and it does actually go on..you dont need gear to make muscle, you only need it to make loads of muscle, and/or to do it in a short time frame.

you cant tell me that being 200-220lb and lean and clean at, say 5'11" or 6' isnt a nice place to be?- even if it takes 5-10 years to get there?..and for some its more like 240 or more over 10 years.

ive said in other threads that ive seen it more times than i can count..a good friend of mine, who i dont catch up with much these days is a great example who never succumbed to the temptation despite others encouraging him too and watching them get to 90,100,100kg whilst he was still 85kg... he's 110kg now and they are either not training, have chronic injuries, are dead, or are still stuck at 110kg and taking loads of gear.

i notice this board has a lot of steroid supporters and advocates. i think this has more to do with trying to justify it so they feel ok with their decision than any real rational thought.

i expect a big slag fest now for posting this, bring it on. for those who are natural and choosing to stay so, stick to it and it will come.

mitchyboy · « **Reply #1 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:15:01 PM »

You said lean and mean at 220 and clean, mabye even 240.

Bro, thats as big or biger than alot of pros.

Get a fucking clue

disco_stu · « **Reply #2 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:17:02 PM »

no it isnt jerk boy.
those guys are devoid of water and fat at less than 2%.

put 10kg of water and 18% fat on a 6' pro and you got 330lb...

a far cry from 250lb.

who's got a clue?- do the math wanker.

dont you know any 110kg naturals?...if you dont, you need to get out.

elite_lifter · « **Reply #3 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:23:16 PM »

Stu if you have been lifting for 21 years you aren't exactly a youngster and if you think you will get to 250 lean and natural you are DELUSIONAL!!

disco_stu · « **Reply #4 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:26:26 PM »

by the way, not every weight training gets on the stage also moron..

for a number of reasons..you're taking the elite guys with the best aesthetics and drawing a generalised baseline from that.

let me put it this way, a pro who is 265 on stage at 6' has no water, less than 2% bfat and lost at least 20lb of muscle.

so lets say he retains that muscle, then he's 285, lets say he retains the water..and yes, 10kf (22lb) is reasonable as a night of lasix can get rid of 10kg out of your dick no problem..if you dont mind standing over the toilet for 3-4 minutes at a time..

so now we have a guy who has 2% bfat and weighs 307. add, say, 15% more bfat and he's weighing close on 350lb.

in other words the guy is holding about 255lb of lean muscle, organs and bone when onstage.

take my "clueless" weight of, lets go for 270lb, 6', 18%bfat natural and compare...you probably think that 270lb natural isnt possible...

reverse the math and work out what muscle that means..first we'll take off the same 20lb of muscle the pro lost while dieting, and we have a guy who weighs, now, 250lb.. take off the 10kg of water also..ok, maybe the natural holds less water, lets go for 5 kg then..so now he's down to 239lb.

plus he's got 18%bfat, so thats about 43lb...so he's made up of 197lb of lean tissue, organs and bone.

whats so unbelievable that a pro has nearly 60lb more lean tissue than a natural..since bones and organs should weigh about the same?

like i said, ive seen it many times in my 21 years in the gym...checkout the other athletes in power sports and see what they achieve without even trying to train for bodybuilding... heard of jonah lomu?..110kg at 6'2" i believe and plays rugby... we've got footballers who weigh 90kg and run 15 miles a game and have bfat at well under 10%..

the list goes on and on.

disco_stu · « **Reply #5 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:28:35 PM »

Quote from: elite_lifter on May 15, 2009, 08:23:16 PM

Stu if you have been lifting for 21 years you aren't exactly a youngster and if you think you will get to 250 lean and natural you are DELUSIONAL!!

another moron.

mitchyboy · « **Reply #6 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:28:50 PM »

Damn bro cut the dose, that test is starting to make you angry

disco_stu · « **Reply #7 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:29:22 PM »

its convenient to think you cant because it justifies your behaviour and lack of achievements..if that gets you by then great.

mitchyboy · « **Reply #8 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:29:37 PM »

Disco stu likes disco music, oh yeah

mitchyboy · « **Reply #9 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:30:22 PM »

So all 250 of your rippedness is here to shoew us the way ?

elite_lifter · « **Reply #10 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:31:09 PM »

Quote from: disco_stu on May 15, 2009, 08:28:35 PM

another moron.

if I am a moron you are a CLOWN!

mitchyboy · « **Reply #11 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:31:58 PM »

Back away not today disco lady

chaos · « **Reply #12 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:31:59 PM »

Quote from: disco_stu on May 15, 2009, 07:16:25 PM

stick with it those who choose to be natural...it comes in the long run.

ive been in the game for 21 years now and seen them come and go, from bikers who only train in summer and use massive amounts of gear and get huge each year then go completely off gear and training for the next 8 months, to those who come in and ruin their potential with GH and slin and end up with polumbuism and massive guts..

yet i see these freaks of muscle come in as skinnt 16 year olds and become massive by 19 or 20, and very few go further than that, or they stay the same for the next 10 years, or even get smaller...whilst the natural guys are still here, week in, week out, and over a decade they have become darn impressive.

sure it takes alot longer, but it seems that they are still around whereas the others are not- for a bunch of reasons i can only speculate on. Then theres the acne bloated type that are still skinny as shit but walk around with their arms out at right angles..

stick with it naturals as eventually your metabolism slows and muscle goes on easier, and it does actually go on..you dont need gear to make muscle, you only need it to make loads of muscle, and/or to do it in a short time frame.

you cant tell me that being 200-220lb and lean and clean at, say 5'11" or 6' isnt a nice place to be?- even if it takes 5-10 years to get there?..and for some its more like 240 or more over 10 years.

ive said in other threads that ive seen it more times than i can count..a good friend of mine, who i dont catch up with much these days is a great example who never succumbed to the temptation despite others encouraging him too and watching them get to 90,100,100kg whilst he was still 85kg... he's 110kg now and they are either not training, have chronic injuries, are dead, or are still stuck at 110kg and taking loads of gear.

i notice this board has a lot of steroid supporters and advocates. i think this has more to do with trying to justify it so they feel ok with their decision than any real rational thought.

i expect a big slag fest now for posting this, bring it on. for those who are natural and choosing to stay so, stick to it and it will come.

Pics or I'm calling bullshit.

disco_stu · « **Reply #13 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:32:29 PM »

Quote from: mitchyboy on May 15, 2009, 08:30:22 PM

So all 250 of your rippedness is here to shoew us the way ?

read my post again...im done dealing with tools..like i said, i expected the psychologically unstable, insecure to respond with insults..thats just the way your type is.

message me in 10 years.

mitchyboy · « **Reply #14 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:33:24 PM »

Ok i will try and have a rational convo with good sir

mitchyboy · « **Reply #15 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:34:26 PM »

I never once insulted merely called out, big diff

elite_lifter · « **Reply #16 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:34:58 PM »

Quote from: disco_stu on May 15, 2009, 08:32:29 PM

read my post again...im done dealing with tools..like i said, i expected the psychologically unstable, insecure to respond with insults..thats just the way your type is.

message me in 10 years.

You'll be dead old man.

mitchyboy · « **Reply #17 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:37:10 PM »

Ive been i the game quit awhile also and can pretty much garuntee, all those "naturals" you speak of are most likely not.
You say to use comen sense, Not sure what you mean by that, but i do agree with hope

mitchyboy · « **Reply #18 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:39:30 PM »

If we quit before we begin we may never know what we can achive. I do apolagize if I ofended you in any way, you kinda seem like the sensitive type

chaos · « **Reply #19 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:40:34 PM »

Damn bitchyboy is melting down badly!

elite_lifter · « **Reply #20 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:40:57 PM »

"Naturals" haha like the guy, 5'9" 210lbs, in my gym who repped 405 for 10 and claimed to be a natural.

mitchyboy · « **Reply #21 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:41:30 PM »

By the way, i never have nor never will use steroids unless for a medical reason.

mitchyboy · « **Reply #22 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:42:44 PM »

Quote from: chaos on May 15, 2009, 08:40:34 PM

Damn bitchyboy is melting down badly!

Just not sure how to get all my points across in 1 post

chaos · « **Reply #23 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:43:37 PM »

Quote from: elite_lifter on May 15, 2009, 08:40:57 PM

"Naturals" haha like the guy, 5'9" 210lbs, in my gym who repped 405 for 10 and claimed to be a natural.

On squats or deads?

physicsgeek · « **Reply #24 on:** May 15, 2009, 08:46:55 PM »

These numbers are impossible!