what was the purpose of WWII

[tu_holmes]

Stalin was an atheist you moron.

He openly persecuted Jews.

Using propaganda papers from Germany doesn't make any of what you said fact.

He attended an Orthodox Private School... That would infer that he was in fact a Christian.

[IFBBwannaB]

He attended an Orthodox Private School... That would infer that he was in fact a Christian.

Wow....first you know nothing of Nuremberg laws and now this.

So what if he attended an Orthodox private school...how old he was then?

Communism opposed all religions.

[loco]

He attended an Orthodox Private School... That would infer that he was in fact a Christian.

Joseph Stalin a Christian.   

"Continuous persecution in the 1930s resulted in the near-extinction of the Russian Orthodox Church: by 1939, active parishes numbered in the low hundreds (down from 54,000 in 1917), many churches had been leveled, and tens of thousands of priests, monks and nuns were persecuted and killed. Over 100,000 were shot during the purges of 1937–1938.

Many religions popular in the ethnic regions of the Soviet Union including the Roman Catholic Church, Uniats, Baptists, Islam, Buddhism, Judaism, etc. underwent ordeals similar to the Orthodox churches in other parts: thousands of monks were persecuted, and hundreds of churches, synagogues, mosques, temples, sacred monuments, monasteries and other religious buildings were razed."

Alexander N. Yakovlev (2002). A Century of Violence in Soviet Russia. Yale University Press. pp. 165.
http://books.google.com/books?visbn=0300103220&id=ChRk43tVxTwC&pg=PA165&lpg=PA165&ots=ICIxg28Jud&dq=a+century+of+violence+in+soviet+russia+the+Russian+Orthodox+clergy&ie=ISO-8859-1&sig=C9k9Hr7Vn222WCHf_1iSJOHVsgo

Richard Pipes (2001). Communism: A History. Modern Library Chronicles. pp. 66.

[pillowtalk]

He attended an Orthodox Private School... That would infer that he was in fact a Christian.

You know what, I could very easy refute that claim.

But you would just call it racist propaganda (probably from a neo-Nazi site, right ??) you just can't make that horse drink.
I am wasting my time, no matter what I bring to the table, I am surrounded by "ney Sayers"

I have no reason to post here, & in fact the realization that I am, 100% no doubt, wasting my valuable time has set in.
I am going to India in June on business, & I really should be investing my time more wisely (lots to do).

You ask questions on this board, but only want to hear certain answers.

Muslim/gay/Paki bashing.

But point out any-thing you pricks feel uncomfortable with & you get called all sorts, just because you do not like what you hear.
You never even bother to look at evidence (I have tried) it just get's poo-pooed.


MattC has made his exit (sounds to me) for the same reason - I will be catching the door before it shuts.

It is not my business to contribute to a board of this nature.

You are all welcome to sit here & talk shit about the economy/Muslims  (with-out) realizing where to look for the real blame.
You sit here talking shit until some of that 'Pakistani Uranium' makes it's way through the Mexican border & fucks about 5 of your major cities (trust me it is in the post).
Then we will see where your ignorance to real world events, & who is orchestrating what gets you.

Yes Ozmo - yes, yes, I know you will say that I am running away because I am a little bitch, & can't take it, blah blah........
But getting to a point where you are bored with the whole thing/realizing that you are just wasting your time, is not the same thing at all.
I will tell you 'Ozmo, that deleting my post on the rise of 'national socialism' & JOO's in the rest of the world is what (proverbially) broke the back of the Donkey.
It was on Topic & factual - every-thing in that post could be verified, yet it get's deleted, that is an offense to freedom of speech, on this topic WWII.
So fuck you & good luck with your bruk ass future in the united states of Bull-shit !!

Tata...................

Matt-H (PT)

[tu_holmes]

Joseph Stalin a Christian.   

"Continuous persecution in the 1930s resulted in the near-extinction of the Russian Orthodox Church: by 1939, active parishes numbered in the low hundreds (down from 54,000 in 1917), many churches had been leveled, and tens of thousands of priests, monks and nuns were persecuted and killed. Over 100,000 were shot during the purges of 1937–1938.

Many religions popular in the ethnic regions of the Soviet Union including the Roman Catholic Church, Uniats, Baptists, Islam, Buddhism, Judaism, etc. underwent ordeals similar to the Orthodox churches in other parts: thousands of monks were persecuted, and hundreds of churches, synagogues, mosques, temples, sacred monuments, monasteries and other religious buildings were razed."

Alexander N. Yakovlev (2002). A Century of Violence in Soviet Russia. Yale University Press. pp. 165.
http://books.google.com/books?visbn=0300103220&id=ChRk43tVxTwC&pg=PA165&lpg=PA165&ots=ICIxg28Jud&dq=a+century+of+violence+in+soviet+russia+the+Russian+Orthodox+clergy&ie=ISO-8859-1&sig=C9k9Hr7Vn222WCHf_1iSJOHVsgo

Richard Pipes (2001). Communism: A History. Modern Library Chronicles. pp. 66.

So you're saying he didn't attend a Christian based school?

Really?

I'm not saying he was a practicing Christian in any aspect... I'm not even saying he was a "Christian".

I'm saying he attended a Christian school and his family upbringing was most likely Christian.

Whether or not he saw himself as a Christian is not what I'm talking about... My point was directly related to him being labeled Jewish... Which there is zero evidence of.

Wow....first you know nothing of Nuremberg laws and now this.

So what if he attended an Orthodox private school...how was he then?

Communism opposed all religions.

Not really the point... When he was a child, he did in fact attend and Orthodox school, that is a Christian entity.

You have not yet shown me where my inference is at all incorrect.

Just because he rose to power in the communist party does not mean he was not raised in the Russian Orthodox religion, he simply chose to not follow it, and instead followed the power.

[loco]

So you're saying he didn't attend a Christian based school?

Really?

I'm not saying he was a practicing Christian in any aspect... I'm not even saying he was a "Christian".

I'm saying he attended a Christian school and his family upbringing was most likely Christian.

Whether or not he saw himself as a Christian is not what I'm talking about... My point was directly related to him being labeled Jewish... Which there is zero evidence of.

Not really the point... When he was a child, he did in fact attend and Orthodox school, that is a Christian entity.

You have not yet shown me where my inference is at all incorrect.

Just because he rose to power in the communist party does not mean he was not raised in the Russian Orthodox religion, he simply chose to not follow it, and instead followed the power.

Stalin was not only a big time atheist, but he was an anti-religion bigot. 

He attended a Georgian Orthodox seminary when he was sixteen years old only because he got a scholarship to attend.  He never finished.  This hardly infers that he was a Christian, but you said that it does.   

[Hereford]

Jesus Fvcking Christ...  You guys who try to villify christianity by associating Stalin with it.

unreal...    

[Fury]

Jesus Fvcking Christ...  You guys who try to villify christianity by associating Stalin with it.

unreal...    

Makes me laugh. Pol Pot was college educated and then went back to his homeland and killed anyone who could read and/or write. Wonder what that means!!!!

[tu_holmes]

Stalin was not only a big time atheist, but he was an anti-religion bigot. 

He attended a Georgian Orthodox seminary when he was sixteen years old only because he got a scholarship to attend.  He never finished.  This hardly infers that he was a Christian, but you said that it does.   

About as much as he's inferred to be a Jew.

My inference is about his upbringing... Many people would say I'm a Christian, which I would say I'm not... However, my parents sent me to a private Catholic school and are both Christians. People would say I am in turn a Christian as well.

Similarly... People with Jewish parents are called "Jews", even if they are Atheists themselves.

[tu_holmes]

Jesus Fvcking Christ...  You guys who try to villify christianity by associating Stalin with it.

unreal...    

Who is vilifying Christianity?

I have done no such thing... I'm simply talking about his upbringing. I'm certainly not saying that Christianity is in anyway shape or form responsible for what Stalin did while he was the leader of the USSR.

[loco]

About as much as he's inferred to be a Jew.

My inference is about his upbringing... Many people would say I'm a Christian, which I would say I'm not... However, my parents sent me to a private Catholic school and are both Christians. People would say I am in turn a Christian as well.

Similarly... People with Jewish parents are called "Jews", even if they are Atheists themselves.

tu_holmes, 

Stalin WAS NOT a Christian and nothing about his life infers that he was.  He was very much atheist and very much anti-religion.  Stop owning yourself.

[tu_holmes]

tu_holmes, 

Stalin WAS NOT a Christian and nothing about his life infers that he was.  He was very much atheist and very much anti-religion.  Stop owning yourself.

Dude... Whatever... I'm sure you all knew him and his family... You guys are ridiculous in your "know it all" attitudes when you have nothing to do but guess.

My point is not what he WAS, but rather what his upbringing was... his family and things of that nature... of which none of you know at all.

[Fury]

Stalin's anti-religion stance is the only worthwhile thing he did. The rest of the world should follow suit, minus the mass murdering.

[loco]

Dude... Whatever... I'm sure you all knew him and his family... You guys are ridiculous in your "know it all" attitudes when you have nothing to do but guess.

You are the only one guessing here.  I posted the historical evidence above.

[tu_holmes]

You are the only one guessing here.  I posted the historical evidence above.

So the fact he attended a Seminary, even though it was a scholarship, is of no consequence... I gotcha.

[IFBBwannaB]

So the fact he attended a Seminary, even though it was a scholarship, is of no consequence... I gotcha.

Exactly, decades of being anti religion >>>>> going to a religious school.

Got it buddy?

[tu_holmes]

Exactly, decades of being anti religion >>>>> going to a religious school.

Got it buddy?

I will never get anything that ever comes out of your mouth apparently.

>>>> does not mean of no consequence... At least not in the real world.


"During his time at the seminary, Stalin and numerous other students read forbidden literature that included Victor Hugo novels and revolutionary, including Marxist, material. He was caught and punished numerous times for this. He became an atheist in his first year.[1]"

So before this time, he was in fact raised to be a Christian.

What he did after is not at all the point I am making... I understand that he was an Atheist in his adult life, but he was raised as a Christian.

[loco]

So the fact he attended a Seminary, even though it was a scholarship, is of no consequence... I gotcha.

Correct!

[kcballer]

Firstly Pillow Biter nice meltdown.  You provided nothing factual at all.  Theodor Herzl believed in Zionism as a means to END Anti-Semitism as attributed to this quote - The Jewish question persists wherever Jews live in appreciable numbers. Wherever it does not exist, it is brought in together with Jewish immigrants. We are naturally drawn into those places where we are not persecuted, and our appearance there gives rise to persecution. This is the case, and will inevitably be so, everywhere, even in highly civilised countries—see, for instance, France—so long as the Jewish question is not solved on the political level. The unfortunate Jews are now carrying the seeds of anti-Semitism into England; they have already introduced it into America.

See how you took out of context a lot of what he said to fit your warped view of things.  Pathetic really.  

As for Hitler getting Jewish people into Palestine what a joke that is.  Firstly Palestine was basically like an English colony.  The reason they weren't going into Palestine was simple they weren't allowed.  England had an agreement that during the war Palestine wouldn't rise up as they had done in 1935.  A Palestinian homeland was to be created and because of the lack of freedom brought on by the signing of the white paper in 1939, the Jewish people had a quota for bringing people into the country this helped lead to the popularity of groups like the Stern Gang.

You take quotes out of context, understand none of the actual politics that occurred at the time, and really only care to spread anti Jewish propaganda.

How fitting that you leave the site in such a meltdown induced by a deletion of an obviously racist, biased and fabricated post.

 

[loco]

I will never get anything that ever comes out of your mouth apparently.

>>>> does not mean of no consequence... At least not in the real world.


"During his time at the seminary, Stalin and numerous other students read forbidden literature that included Victor Hugo novels and revolutionary, including Marxist, material. He was caught and punished numerous times for this. He became an atheist in his first year.[1]"

So before this time, he was in fact raised to be a Christian.

What he did after is not at all the point I am making... I understand that he was an Atheist in his adult life, but he was raised as a Christian.

You said having gone to a Christian school alone "infers" that Stalin was a Christian.  You did not specify that he was a Christian only in his childhood and you did not mention anything else in his life that would infer that he was a Christian.

So where did you get this text?  You left out the reference to your source.

[tu_holmes]

You said having gone to a Christian school alone "infers" that Stalin was a Christian.  You did not specify that he was a Christian only in his childhood and you did not mention anything else in his life that would infer that he was a Christian.

So where did you get this text?  You left out the reference to your source.

It's a wikipedia article... Is it anymore true than anything else, I have no idea.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stalin_before_the_Revolution

[Deedee]

You said having gone to a Christian school alone "infers" that Stalin was a Christian.  You did not specify that he was a Christian only in his childhood and you did not mention anything else in his life that would infer that he was a Christian.

So where did you get this text?  You left out the reference to your source.

Loco, it's like this. While religion often has a positive influence on the lives of people, the pragmatic dogma, mixed with familial abuse often leads to horrible consequences. Both Stalin and Hitler grew up with terribly abusive father figures, mixed with religious reinforced corporal punishment and intolerance. Stalin had a physical deformity to top it all off. Hitler probably had sexual deficiencies. You could basically say that both grew up to despise the religious upbringing and sought to punish all those who laid it on them when they were young. The religion-inspired sadism wreacked on both was a factor. Everyone knows that the boys who were victims of diddling priests have grown up to be very fucked up, so it's not surprising that in the day before tv and therapists, one or two really religiously screwed-up boys would burn the world. Hitler's hero was Luther, the anti-semite.

While religion may not be the cause of all war and calamity in the world, you'd be hard-pressed to find too many willing to fight and die without having some religious conviction. Nothingness after death doesn't inspire too many to take up the sword. Also, if you look at World War II posters, and the other propaganda, while it wasn't about religion per se, it's what got people to get into it and sacrifice their lives. I don't get why dems want to remove religion from the trenches. Why else would anyone enlist to fight?

So tu holmes was right.

[Deicide]

Loco, it's like this. While religion often has a positive influence on the lives of people, the pragmatic dogma, mixed with familial abuse often leads to horrible consequences. Both Stalin and Hitler grew up with terribly abusive father figures, mixed with religious reinforced corporal punishment and intolerance. Stalin had a physical deformity to top it all off. Hitler probably had sexual deficiencies. You could basically say that both grew up to despise the religious upbringing and sought to punish all those who laid it on them when they were young. The religion-inspired sadism wreacked on both was a factor. Everyone knows that the boys who were victims of diddling priests have grown up to be very fucked up, so it's not surprising that in the day before tv and therapists, one or two really religiously screwed-up boys would burn the world. Hitler's hero was Luther, the anti-semite.

While religion may not be the cause of all war and calamity in the world, you'd be hard-pressed to find too many willing to fight and die without having some religious conviction. Nothingness after death doesn't inspire too many to take up the sword. Also, if you look at World War II posters, and the other propaganda, while it wasn't about religion per se, it's what got people to get into it and sacrifice their lives. I don't get why dems want to remove religion from the trenches. Why else would anyone enlist to fight?

So tu holmes was right.

Religion, whilst traditionally attributed to the realm of faith and the 'spirtual' is little more than doctrine, dogma and the blind adherence thereto; inasmuch as this is true, secular religions abound and Stalinism as well as National Socialism were simply members of that secular group of religions.

[loco]

Loco, it's like this. While religion often has a positive influence on the lives of people, the pragmatic dogma, mixed with familial abuse often leads to horrible consequences. Both Stalin and Hitler grew up with terribly abusive father figures, mixed with religious reinforced corporal punishment and intolerance. Stalin had a physical deformity to top it all off. Hitler probably had sexual deficiencies. You could basically say that both grew up to despise the religious upbringing and sought to punish all those who laid it on them when they were young. The religion-inspired sadism wreacked on both was a factor. Everyone knows that the boys who were victims of diddling priests have grown up to be very fucked up, so it's not surprising that in the day before tv and therapists, one or two really religiously screwed-up boys would burn the world. Hitler's hero was Luther, the anti-semite.

While religion may not be the cause of all war and calamity in the world, you'd be hard-pressed to find too many willing to fight and die without having some religious conviction. Nothingness after death doesn't inspire too many to take up the sword. Also, if you look at World War II posters, and the other propaganda, while it wasn't about religion per se, it's what got people to get into it and sacrifice their lives. I don't get why dems want to remove religion from the trenches. Why else would anyone enlist to fight?

So tu holmes was right.

No, it's like this, Deedee:  Stalin was not a Christian.  Stalin was an atheist and anti-religion murderer who killed millions of innocent people.  If it were true that he was a Christian as a child and then later became an atheist and a murderer, then you are admitting that it would have been better for him to remain a Christian.

People who love to vilify Christianity will blame all of the world's atrocities on Christians no matter what, even the many atrocities committed by atheists such as Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot.   

tu_holmes is wrong, and so are you.

[MB_722]

the first 9 posts in this thread were good, then it went downhill