Scott Roeder says he knows there are similar events planned around the country

[Dos Equis]

the topic of this thread is what we should do about a suspected murder and terrorist who claims to know of future attacks and won't talk to the police

the topic of this thread is Scott Roeder

 

Tony - please spend a few minutes watching this:  http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/#31177077

Frank Schaeffer knows what he is talking about.  If nothing else watch the video of the crowds and the signs they are holding

There is a fragment of this movement that is unstable and prone to losing it

[Straw Man]

what is it about his living conditions that he is not happy with?

Like i said when all other options have been exhausted...

to start being in jail

lhe's bitching about being "treated like a criminal" , being put in isolation, afraid he's going catch pneumonia, wants a sleep apnea machine, etc..

they can get whatever this guy has without torturing him

again, if this guy knows anything he's probably to stupid to know it and probably to stupid to not reveal it one way or another

[tonymctones]

man from the last clip you posted beach iono if i could stand there and let those 2 dudes talk like that to me without giving them a nice curb smile.

[tonymctones]

to start being in jail

lhe's bitching about being "treated like a criminal" , being put in isolation, afraid he's going catch pneumonia, wants a sleep apnea machine, etc..

they can get whatever this guy has without torturing him

again, if this guy knows anything he's probably to stupid to know it and probably to stupid to not reveal it one way or another

LOL hahahah well according to the geneva convention that is torture...

i havent been following much of anything the past few days why do you believe him to be so stupid?

[Straw Man]

sometimes it's hard to follow who is responding to who

Tony - please spend a few minutes watching this:  http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/#31177077

Frank Schaeffer knows what he is talking about.  If nothing else watch the video of the crowds and the signs they are holding

There is a fragment of this movement that is unstable and prone to losing it

yes and the point of this thread (which you would get if you read the title) is Scott Roeder and what exactly we should do with him

[Dos Equis]

man from the last clip you posted beach iono if i could stand there and let those 2 dudes talk like that to me without giving them a nice curb smile.

I think the one where they pretty much assault the old lady is worse, but yeah it would take a great deal of restraint.  One of the things these clips highlight is how no political philosophy, religious viewpoint, etc. has a monopoly on extremists.  But I'm preaching to the choir.  

[Straw Man]

LOL hahahah well according to the geneva convention that is torture...

i havent been following much of anything the past few days why do you believe him to be so stupid?

the geneva convention says being in jail is torture?

[tonymctones]

the geneva convention says being in jail is torture?

as with most ppl you probably havent read the geneva convention as it pertains to torture...do yourself a favor and read it just about anything could be deemed torture under that definition. Jail itself could be deemed torture its a stretch but just depends on the conditions, solitary confinement which he more then likely is in or some form of it could be argued fairly strongly to be torture again under the definition from the geneva convention.

[Straw Man]

as with most ppl you probably havent read the geneva convention as it pertains to torture...do yourself a favor and read it just about anything could be deemed torture under that definition. Jail itself could be deemed torture its a stretch but just depends on the conditions, solitary confinement which he more then likely is in or some form of it could be argued fairly strongly to be torture again under the definition from the geneva convention.

by definition

have we tortured this guy so far?

I don't think so

and he's already bitching

[tu_holmes]

I have to disagree

Give Tony credit for answering, but this is a US citizen you're ready to torture... Remember that slippery slope I mentioned before?

This is a 85 degree decline for it.

[tonymctones]

by definition

have we tortured this guy so far?

I don't think so

and he's already bitching

I dont know the details of his imprisonment so i cant say yes or no, i will say like i did earlier that just about anything could be deemed torture under the geneva convention so im pretty sure that it could be argued that he has been.

again go read the definition of torture from the geneva convention and you will understand that there is an arguement to be made that he is being tortured in response to just about everything.

[tonymctones]

Give Tony credit for answering, but this is a US citizen you're ready to torture... Remember that slippery slope I mentioned before?

This is a 85 degree decline for it.

LOL yea i definitely agree holmes i dont think it would be a far stretch from enhanced interrogation techniques for this and say for robery or something else...but then again the same arguement can be made for just about everything so...

[Straw Man]

I dont know the details of his imprisonment so i cant say yes or no, i will say like i did earlier that just about anything could be deemed torture under the geneva convention so im pretty sure that it could be argued that he has been.

again go read the definition of torture from the geneva convention and you will understand that there is an arguement to be made that he is being tortured in response to just about everything.

I'm familiar with it

how about just posting a link

I doubt Roeder has been tortured in any way, shape or form

he's only been in custody for a week so even total isolation is not torture at this point

[tonymctones]

I'm familiar with it

how about just posting a link

I doubt Roeder has been tortured in any way, shape or form

he's only been in custody for a week so even total isolation is not torture at this point

if your familiar with it theres no need to post a link and you know how loose a definition it provides and that an arguement for just about everything could be argued to be torture.

careful again like the abortion issue you need a logical reason for that statement...how long do you think that isolation has to be in place before its torture?

[24KT]

Ah that is a bunch of horse shit and you know it.

You can call him a Christian if you wish, but his actions say otherwise. A terrorist is a terrorist, foreign or domestic, waterboard his ass, make him listen to barney for 24 hrs. Crack the fucker like an egg to get the information.

Am I anti-abortion? Yes but I don't think it should be illegal. My postion as a Christian is that everybody has to make their own choices and answer for those choices when the time comes.

You want to talk about hypocrisy, a athiest, liberal what ever will fight tooth and nail for a worthless piece of shit that has proven that at best they don't deserver to live in out society. That has nothing to offer and probabaly is a multiple offender, to stave off execution. But has absolutly no problem ending the life of an unborn, a complete incent who has done nothing to warrant it. Did you ever stop to think that wasted life may have grown up to be the doctor the cures cancer, or is the next great leader? Guess we'll never know.

Kazan,

I hate to break it to you, ...but your very own stated position on the matter, ...it makes you Pro-Choice.

[tu_holmes]

I dont know the details of his imprisonment so i cant say yes or no, i will say like i did earlier that just about anything could be deemed torture under the geneva convention so im pretty sure that it could be argued that he has been.

again go read the definition of torture from the geneva convention and you will understand that there is an arguement to be made that he is being tortured in response to just about everything.

Well, the actualy word definition of torture is:

tor⋅ture  /ˈtɔrtʃər/  Show Spelled Pronunciation [tawr-cher]  Show IPA noun, verb, -tured, -tur⋅ing.
–noun 1. the act of inflicting excruciating pain, as punishment or revenge, as a means of getting a confession or information, or for sheer cruelty.
2. a method of inflicting such pain.
3. Often, tortures. the pain or suffering caused or undergone.
4. extreme anguish of body or mind; agony.
5. a cause of severe pain or anguish.



Well, none of them are isolation... You "may" be able to stretch number 4 to say it's extreme anguish of the body, BUT that's REALLY a stretch.

I think we almost all associate torture with a physical action.

[24KT]

What do gay people have to do with Dr. Tiller's murderer.

Why are you bringing all these 'gay themed' video clips into this.

This has nothing to do with whether Roeder should be tortured to obtain info about imminent threats?

[tonymctones]

Well, the actualy word definition of torture is:

tor⋅ture  /ˈtɔrtʃər/  Show Spelled Pronunciation [tawr-cher]  Show IPA noun, verb, -tured, -tur⋅ing.
–noun 1. the act of inflicting excruciating pain, as punishment or revenge, as a means of getting a confession or information, or for sheer cruelty.
2. a method of inflicting such pain.
3. Often, tortures. the pain or suffering caused or undergone.
4. extreme anguish of body or mind; agony.
5. a cause of severe pain or anguish.



Well, none of them are isolation... You "may" be able to stretch number 4 to say it's extreme anguish of the body, BUT that's REALLY a stretch.

I think we almost all associate torture with a physical action.

Thats exactly right, but as the defintion states extreme anguish of body or MIND...isolation can be extremely harsh on the mental component of a person and that premise could be used on just about everything...

also we never established what definition of torture we were going by the geneva conventions definition is slightly broader then that one.

[Straw Man]

Thats exactly right, but as the defintion states extreme anguish of body or MIND...isolation can be extremely harsh on the mental component of a person and that premise could be used on just about everything...
also we never established what definition of torture we were going by the geneva conventions definition is slightly broader then that one.

isolation is the only possible angle to your argument and he's only been in custody for a week so even if he was in isolation the entire time it wouldn't be torture...unless he's been buried in tiny underground cell or something like that

[tonymctones]

isolation is the only possible angle to your argument and he's only been in custody for a week so even if he was in isolation the entire time it wouldn't be torture...unless he's been buried in tiny underground cell or something like that

again what logical basis do you have for that claim? how long does a person have to be in isolation for it to be torture and why?

[Straw Man]

again what logical basis do you have for that claim? how long does a person have to be in isolation for it to be torture and why?

are you saying you think we've already tortured Roeder?

[tonymctones]

are you saying you think we've already tortured Roeder?

sighhhh

I dont know the details of his imprisonment so i cant say yes or no, i will say like i did earlier that just about anything could be deemed torture under the geneva convention so im pretty sure that it could be argued that he has been.

again go read the definition of torture from the geneva convention and you will understand that there is an arguement to be made that he is being tortured in response to just about everything.

[Straw Man]

sighhhh

ok

let's say Roeder has been held in isolation 23 hours a day for the last 7 days

in that example has he been tortured?

[MB_722]

good thread straw man.

this whole situation reeks.
Shall I be the first to say it? ...                      It's a distraction.

240's post sums it up good. It's good ol' divide and conquer bs.

unfortunately, the only "nutbag" here is the far-right neocon who shot an unarmed doctor in a church, and is keeping future terror acts secret.

You can shit on the libs all you want, but this prick is from your team...

[tonymctones]

ok

let's say Roeder has been held in isolation 23 hours a day for the last 7 days

in that example has he been tortured?

hahah i cant say as i dont know the extent to his mental anguish...i can tell you if i was in isolation for 23 hours a day for 7 days that i would feel like id been tortured.

reading the definition of torture from either the geneva convention which again is a tad more broad then the one holmes posted or even holmes definition itself is problematic b/c those definition are open to interpretation.