Author Topic: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.  (Read 1001 times)

SAMSON123

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So much for the promise of a TURNAROUND

Projection: It'll be years before jobs return to much of U.S.

By Tony Pugh | McClatchy Newspapers



To see interactive map click on link below...

http://www.sacbee.com/1098/story/1936416.html

WASHINGTON — Unlike the labor market collapse that killed millions of U.S. jobs in a matter of months, the nation's return to peak employment will not be nearly as uniform nor as swift.

While signs indicate that the worst of the recession may be over, only six metropolitan areas across the country are expected to regain their pre-recession employment levels by the end of 2009, according to projections from IHS Global Insight, a leading economic forecaster.

The areas poised for a jobs rebound later this year are: Anchorage, Alaska; Champaign-Urbana, Ill.; Coeur d'Alene, Idaho; Columbia, Mo.; Laredo, Texas; and the Houma-Bayou Cane-Thibodaux areas of Louisiana.

Only five areas are expected to see a similar jobs recovery in 2010: Las Cruces, N.M. and El Paso, San Antonio and the McAllen-Edinburg-Pharr and Austin-Round Rock areas of Texas.

Most of the country — 286 of 325 metro areas covered in the IHS analysis_ aren't likely to regain their pre-recession employment levels until at least 2012.

Of these areas, 112 probably won't return to their recent peaks until 2014 or later. These include Rust Belt towns such as Cleveland, Dayton and Akron, Ohio; Detroit, Warren and Flint, Mich.; the hurricane-ravaged Gulfport-Biloxi, Miss., area and the greater Los Angeles region, where the housing bubble and high unemployment have strangled the local economy.

The bleak jobs picture underscores the long, tough road ahead in rebuilding the U.S. economy after the worst recession since the Great Depression.

Of the 6 million jobs lost since the recession began 18 months ago, nearly 4 million were eliminated between November and April. The six-month freefall included a record four straight months with more than 600,000 job losses.

"This recession is unique because of the way it leveled the playing field," said James Diffley, IHS managing director of U.S. regional services. "The precipitating factor, after housing, was the finance industry, and that affected everybody. Now everybody's cutting back on debt, and the banks are being more cautious about lending, so there's less spending. All those things mitigate against a quick turnaround."

The IHS analysis covers 325 of 363 U.S. metropolitan areas, or population centers, as defined by the Census Bureau. Thirty-eight metro areas weren't included because of a lack of government data, said Jeannine Cataldi, an IHS senior economist.

Diffley said the projections reflect a local economy's response to various economic factors based on a statistical analysis of recent history.

IHS expects Texas, Oklahoma and Alaska to be among the first to match their previous employment peaks because their economies never fell as far as those in the rest of the country.

All three states are dominated by the energy industry and are benefitting from rising oil prices. They also have lower unemployment rates than the national average and have weathered only light-to-moderate job losses compared to the rest of the country. In April, Alaska was one of two states that had more people employed than it had in the previous year.

In addition, none of the states has suffered through the kind of major housing bubble that has sapped housing wealth nationwide. In fact, Alaska has one of the nation's lowest foreclosure rates.

Michigan, Ohio and Indiana, on the other hand, will take years to recover from manufacturing job losses, particularly in the troubled automobile industry.

President Barack Obama this week said that he expects the economic stimulus bill to create 600,000 jobs over the next 100 days, but most economists expect the economy to continue bleeding jobs for the foreseeable future.

"Although we expect the economy to bottom out in GDP terms during the second half of the year, job losses should continue throughout 2009, with the unemployment rate peaking just above 10 percent," said IHS chief U.S. economist Nigel Gault in a recent letter to investors. "We still expect total job losses to exceed 7 million. But the worst news is behind us, and employment declines should progressively soften as the year proceeds."

In fact, by the end of the year, the economy is expected to begin adding jobs. "We'll start to have an uptick, but it won't be very strong," Diffley said.

At least not until mid-2010, when a majority of states are likely to be adding jobs, Diffley said.

Expect much of the new job growth to occur in areas where the population is growing, Cataldi said. Many of the new jobs will be in the areas of professional and business services.

"We expect that to be a large growth sector going forward," Cataldi said.
C

Soul Crusher

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #1 on: June 16, 2009, 10:22:37 AM »
Come on Samson, dont you think Palin and gay marriage are more pressing issues to deal with??? 

Seriously though, this is exactly what people with a clue of common sense realize to be true.   

GigantorX

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #2 on: June 16, 2009, 10:45:09 AM »
Come on Samson, dont you think Palin and gay marriage are more pressing issues to deal with??? 

Seriously though, this is exactly what people with a clue of common sense realize to be true.   

That stuff is hugely important. That and Obama taking on Rush and O'Reilly.

Besides, new carbon taxes, taxes on the upper and middle classes, regulations and govt. interference in the private sector, no grown-up energy policy etc, will surely convince more businesses to not only flock back to the U.S., but not offshore more jobs!

It's brilliant. Kick back, have a snickers bar and relax.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #3 on: June 16, 2009, 10:55:06 AM »
That stuff is hugely important. That and Obama taking on Rush and O'Reilly.

Besides, new carbon taxes, taxes on the upper and middle classes, regulations and govt. interference in the private sector, no grown-up energy policy etc, will surely convince more businesses to not only flock back to the U.S., but not offshore more jobs!

It's brilliant. Kick back, have a snickers bar and relax.

The blow job crew is always silent on these threads.  It easier for them to attack Palin and Rush than deal with issues like this.

Or, lets all get stupid over gay marriage. 



 

drkaje

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #4 on: June 16, 2009, 11:12:23 AM »
It'll be a long time because so few goods are manufactured in the US. Every single time someone shops at Wal-Mart, Target, Kohl's, etc... they are delaying the return of production to America. Problem is so many people can't afford to shop anyplace else.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #5 on: June 16, 2009, 11:14:50 AM »
It'll be a long time because so few goods are manufactured in the US. Every single time someone shops at Wal-Mart, Target, Kohl's, etc... they are delaying the return of production to America. Problem is so many people can't afford to shop anyplace else.

Its because goods manufactured here are unreasonably high due to taxes, regs, unions, etc. 

We need to make this nation extremely more small - mid size business friendly.

Even China gets it! 

GigantorX

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #6 on: June 16, 2009, 11:50:11 AM »
It'll be a long time because so few goods are manufactured in the US. Every single time someone shops at Wal-Mart, Target, Kohl's, etc... they are delaying the return of production to America. Problem is so many people can't afford to shop anyplace else.

Rising cost of health care, next no savings rate, debt and credit helping to mask our declining standard of living.

The article that someone posted on here a few days ago was spot on. As manufacturing leaves this country, our standard of living has decreased. Our educational sys. is also not at all prepared to meet the global challenge and it's not even close. It's more geared towards being a social experiment and ideological battleground. So our kids aren't prepared to go into science, engineering, math etc.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #7 on: June 16, 2009, 11:58:02 AM »
Rising cost of health care, next no savings rate, debt and credit helping to mask our declining standard of living.

The article that someone posted on here a few days ago was spot on. As manufacturing leaves this country, our standard of living has decreased. Our educational sys. is also not at all prepared to meet the global challenge and it's not even close. It's more geared towards being a social experiment and ideological battleground. So our kids aren't prepared to go into science, engineering, math etc.

I'm reading Schiff's book Crash Proof right now and he talks about this very topic at length. 

Its a very good book.   

Al Doggity

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #8 on: June 16, 2009, 11:59:54 AM »
The blow job crew is always silent on these threads. 


 

Why do you post this  in so many threads? The same shit gets posted over and over. This subject has been tackled countless times. Just because you like re-posting the same talking points over and over, doesn't mean other members of the board are obligated to do so.

But, ftr, when has any of "the blowjob crew"  ::) claimed that the recession would be over in a snap? The most optimistic claim has been that there would be a trend reversal in employment numbers soon. That article pretty much falls in line with the administration's position that we'll return to growth by the end of 2010.


Soul Crusher

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #9 on: June 16, 2009, 12:04:53 PM »
Why do you post this  in so many threads? The same shit gets posted over and over. This subject has been tackled countless times. Just because you like re-posting the same talking points over and over, doesn't mean other members of the board are obligated to do so.

But, ftr, when has any of "the blowjob crew"  ::) claimed that the recession would be over in a snap? The most optimistic claim has been that there would be a trend reversal in employment numbers soon. That article pretty much falls in line with the administration's position that we'll return to growth by the end of 2010.



You are kidding right??????  Seriously, your post was a joke right???

If you will remember Obama tried to scare everyone into going along with the stimulus saying if it were not passed immediately the UE would reach 8.8%.  We are already up to 9.4% and going higher AFTER it was passed four months ago. 

Additionally, where is that create 4 million jobs figure that was touted ad infinitum????

No, we are left with the possibility of 450,000 jobs at how much of a cost per job????

 

Al Doggity

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #10 on: June 16, 2009, 12:13:36 PM »
You are kidding right??????  Seriously, your post was a joke right???

If you will remember Obama tried to scare everyone into going along with the stimulus saying if it were not passed immediately the UE would reach 8.8%.  We are already up to 9.4% and going higher AFTER it was passed four months ago. 

Additionally, where is that create 4 million jobs figure that was touted ad infinitum????

No, we are left with the possibility of 450,000 jobs at how much of a cost per job????

 

 We already had a discussion in another thread about the drop in production rates and manufacturing that took place early in the recession cycle. You admitted you'd witnessed it with your own eyes. Why is it so hard for you to understand that the jump in unemployment has a lot to do with that. Here is a clip from a few days ago, from the same paper linked in the opening post:

Quote
A few months ago, Bernick said information technology has progressed to the point that employers are quicker to spot trends - and adjust payrolls accordingly. In his view, we saw a slew of layoffs much earlier in the recession cycle than normal, and he believes this means they'll be quicker to rehire. He still thinks that's true, but he was dismayed that the April job figures weren't better. In April, some 64,000 jobs disappeared in California - slightly more than in March.

http://www.sacbee.com/static/weblogs/real_estate/archives/2009/06/when-will-the-j.html

Hey, you can question this guy's credibility till the cows come home, but he's not the only one saying this. You've admitted you've seen evidence of this through work and production numbers for the first quarter back this up.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #11 on: June 16, 2009, 12:16:05 PM »
Why do you post this  in so many threads? The same shit gets posted over and over. This subject has been tackled countless times. Just because you like re-posting the same talking points over and over, doesn't mean other members of the board are obligated to do so.

But, ftr, when has any of "the blowjob crew"  ::) claimed that the recession would be over in a snap? The most optimistic claim has been that there would be a trend reversal in employment numbers soon. That article pretty much falls in line with the administration's position that we'll return to growth by the end of 2010.



FROM KARL DENNIGER'S SITE - JUNE 9, 2009
________________________ ________________________ _____________

Posted by Karl Denninger in Macro Economics at 15:25

EMPIRICAL PROOF: Obama Stimulus = FAIL

Remember we had a graph trotted out with Obama's economic team when they proposed their "stimulus", and projected unemployment (and GDP!) with and without their stimulus?

Well, another blogger has plotted that first graph against actual results.

Keep in mind - the stimulus passed, of course.

Here's the graph:

http://market-ticker.denninger.net/archives/1101-EMPIRICAL-PROOF-Obama-Stimulus-FAIL.html


How dumb can you be, America?

You were sold the stock market when that "stimulus" plan was announced.  You were sold specific projections on unemployment, which of course tie directly to the economy and its health.

Employment is, in fact, everything.  It is payments on credit cards, it is payments on mortgages, it is ability to buy a new house, it is the ability to buy a car, pay for your iPhone and so on.

Without employment - sustainable, high-quality, high-paying employment that provides at least a solid middle-class wage, there is no economic stability, say much less economic growth.

Period.

Now look at the so-called "stimulus" projection, both with and without, and then take a gander at the actual results.

Did you buy the 666 low in the SPX?  Good.

Are you buying into this "green shoot" crap today, after a 40% rise in the market that was sold to you on the premise, in no small part, that the above graph, with the stimulus program would in fact pass?

You now have the actual results for five months against so-called "projections".

Who "sold" that projection to you?

The Administration.

Goldman Sachs and other 'analysts' who have been raising earnings estimates and projecting "the end of the recession."

Big banks who have had a lot of new stock to sell into the market so they can avoid being shut down by the government as a consequence of being bankrupt.

CNBC, owned and operated by GE - who is rather interested in you buying a new refrigerator or washer - made by them, of course.

How many of those fine folks who want to sell something to you have bothered to mention the facts against the entire premise upon which they claim that the market is a good value here and that you should buy stocks? That is, have any bothered to show you the above chart?

To compare projected results upon which their recommendations are based against actual results in the economy?

Just one more question: What do you think earnings, that is, profits, and thus stock prices, will look like when one adjusts those expectations for the actual unemployment rate as opposed to the "projections" against which all those "strong buy" recommendations were made?

Disclosure: Short the broad market.  This one is best filed under the category labeled "duh".

PS: This is a quick pictorial representation of what's about to happen:


________________________ ________________________ ________________________ _______

There is a good graph at the link that compares the projections to the actual results of the stimulus plan.  





Al Doggity

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #12 on: June 16, 2009, 12:24:13 PM »
You are kidding right??????  Seriously, your post was a joke right???

If you will remember Obama tried to scare everyone into going along with the stimulus saying if it were not passed immediately the UE would reach 8.8%.  We are already up to 9.4% and going higher AFTER it was passed four months ago. 

Additionally, where is that create 4 million jobs figure that was touted ad infinitum????

No, we are left with the possibility of 450,000 jobs at how much of a cost per job????

 

 We already had a discussion in another thread about the drop in production rates and manufacturing that took place early in the recession cycle. You admitted you'd witnessed it with your own eyes. Why is it so hard for you to understand that the jump in unemployment has a lot to do with that. Here is a clip from a few days ago, from the same paper linked in the opening post:

Quote
A few months ago, Bernick said information technology has progressed to the point that employers are quicker to spot trends - and adjust payrolls accordingly. In his view, we saw a slew of layoffs much earlier in the recession cycle than normal, and he believes this means they'll be quicker to rehire. He still thinks that's true, but he was dismayed that the April job figures weren't better. In April, some 64,000 jobs disappeared in California - slightly more than in March.

http://www.sacbee.com/static/weblogs/real_estate/archives/2009/06/when-will-the-j.html

Hey, you can question this guy's credibility till the cows come home, but he's not the only one saying this. You've admitted you've seen evidence of this through work and production numbers for the first quarter back this up.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #13 on: June 16, 2009, 12:41:34 PM »
We already had a discussion in another thread about the drop in production rates and manufacturing that took place early in the recession cycle. You admitted you'd witnessed it with your own eyes. Why is it so hard for you to understand that the jump in unemployment has a lot to do with that. Here is a clip from a few days ago, from the same paper linked in the opening post:

http://www.sacbee.com/static/weblogs/real_estate/archives/2009/06/when-will-the-j.html

Hey, you can question this guy's credibility till the cows come home, but he's not the only one saying this. You've admitted you've seen evidence of this through work and production numbers for the first quarter back this up.



The graph on that page speaks for itself.  The projections from the Govt are worthless. 

Al Doggity

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #14 on: June 16, 2009, 01:04:27 PM »
But the projections in the opening post are infallible, right?

Soul Crusher

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #15 on: June 16, 2009, 01:11:46 PM »
But the projections in the opening post are infallible, right?

The graph on Dennigers page speaks for itself.

The one Samson posted may or may not be as agood as what the govt puts out, but anyone who lives in these areas probably can validate it just by living there and seeing what happens day to day on the ground.

For example - why would any business ever move to MI????  Seriously, why would any corp ever move operations to MI with its high taxes, unions, etc?

That is one example yes, but many of the areas on that list suffer from the same business un-friendly atmosphere. 

Hereford

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #16 on: June 16, 2009, 02:42:41 PM »
That stuff is hugely important. That and Obama taking on Rush and O'Reilly.

Besides, new carbon taxes, taxes on the upper and middle classes, regulations and govt. interference in the private sector, no grown-up energy policy etc, will surely convince more businesses to not only flock back to the U.S., but not offshore more jobs!

It's brilliant. Kick back, have a snickers bar and relax.

Isn't it grand how the government keeps the game going by forcibly taking more and more from the fewer and fewer who actually produce something ... all the while doing nothing to stop the bleeding?

You guys need to come to California and see all the outright laughable waste and unnecessary or redundant governement programs and offices that exist. You will laugh when you see some of the things the gvt has going here. And of course, a ton of the programs really do nothing except provide work to Gvt workers. We have an agricultural inspection department that stops cars at the state border to check and make sure you are not bringing in fruit that has pests in it... even though the pests they are looking for have been state-wide since the 1970's.


Deicide

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #17 on: June 16, 2009, 02:49:21 PM »
Isn't it grand how the government keeps the game going by forcibly taking more and more from the fewer and fewer who actually produce something ... all the while doing nothing to stop the bleeding?

You guys need to come to California and see all the outright laughable waste and unnecessary or redundant governement programs and offices that exist. You will laugh when you see some of the things the gvt has going here. And of course, a ton of the programs really do nothing except provide work to Gvt workers. We have an agricultural inspection department that stops cars at the state border to check and make sure you are not bringing in fruit that has pests in it... even though the pests they are looking for have been state-wide since the 1970's.



You REALLY hate Mexicans...
I hate the State.

Hereford

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Re: Projection: It'll Be Years Before Jobs Return To Much Of U.S.
« Reply #18 on: June 16, 2009, 02:50:59 PM »
I'm sorry..... Where in that post did I mention Mexicans?   ???