Author Topic: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.  (Read 48489 times)

Marty Champions

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #125 on: June 19, 2009, 05:24:23 PM »
you guys should just condense your points instead of spreading it out over 6 pages


state your point and let me articulate to help you bros find the solution ok? lets not get mad at eachother and name calling can we accomplish this?
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Royal Lion

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #126 on: June 19, 2009, 05:24:56 PM »
no thats wrong
I think size does follow strength.  As a muscle gets bigger it gets stronger and vice versa.  Sure, different programs can be used to focus primarily on one over the other, however, as a muslce gets stronger it will get bigger too.

Why are we debating this?  Isn't this common sense?  

Eisenherz

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #127 on: June 19, 2009, 05:25:17 PM »
o rly?


cool brah, you keep benching thouse 45 lb dumbells and just increase the number of sets and reps, I'm sure you'll be huge in no time.

challenge

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #128 on: June 19, 2009, 05:25:59 PM »
you guys should just condense your points instead of spreading it out over 6 pages


state your point and let me articulate to help you bros find the solution ok? lets not get mad at eachother and name calling can we accomplish this?

Can you start training please? Also stop with the demanted youtube escapades.

Marty Champions

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #129 on: June 19, 2009, 05:26:53 PM »
Can you start training please? Also stop with the demanted youtube escapades.

look at my latest youtube video im sure youve seen it by now champ
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io856

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #130 on: June 19, 2009, 05:26:58 PM »
cool brah, you keep benching thouse 45 lb dumbells and just increase the number of sets and reps, I'm sure you'll be huge in no time.
haha you got no idea what I lift but I'm not naive to think that strength training is the optimal method to achieve hypertrophy even though I really enjoy improving and getting stronger and performing it...

I find it very hard to believe that the 3D "popping" bodybuilder look you see in the pros is created through strength training... shit most of the pros like Victor don't even seem to go to failure and seem half asleep... although there is not much rest and plenty of volume... but are fuccking huge...

Cap

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #131 on: June 19, 2009, 05:28:18 PM »
The sprinters I worked out alongside in college did mostly power lifts.

Cleans (and jerk/press)
High pulls (from the floor)
Hang cleans
Step ups
Push jerks
box jumps
Split squats/pistol squats
Squats
Box squats
bench
Inverted rows
pullups/chins

a few other exercises not withstanding, this is what they did and most other athletes did the same thing.  A lot of the exercises were 5 reps, but they had phases where they would train up to 10 reps for some exercises and they would throw in some 20 rep squat sets.
Squishy face retard

suckmymuscle

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #132 on: June 19, 2009, 05:28:57 PM »
If you cant make the connection that increased strength results in increase of size then god help you.


  Ha ha ah...you must feel really stupid. Oh man...you can't even read your own fucking articles properly. You thought it said that one-set-to-failure increases mass, when in fact all it does is increase strengh. Which is exactly what I claimed since the beggining, genius. So in conclusion, you posted an article that agreed with me and thought it was validating your point. Epic self-ownage. It takes a true brainiac to get owned by oneself, I must say. ;D ;D ;)

SUCKMYMUSCLE

tbombz

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #133 on: June 19, 2009, 05:32:51 PM »
Ok cool, I'll continue to increase my poundages from week to week and stay the same size  ::).
And you continue to do what works for you.

P.S. I've lost all hope in humanity.
increasing poundage is great. but do it between 6-12 reps. for example..one week 315 for 8. the next week 315 for 8 1/2 (spotterhelps)...next week 315 for 9... ect... once you reach 12 reps then increase your weight to a number that makes you fail at 6 and start increasing your reps again... repeat.


the point smm made abouit increasing strength then using the new strength to train i the hypertrophy range is a good one and one ive thoguht baout and tried with some success before myself.

Eisenherz

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #134 on: June 19, 2009, 05:33:42 PM »
You thought it said that one-set-to-failure increases mass, when in fact all it does is increase strengh.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

Are you saying that one set to failure doesnt increase size and only strength?


Epic self-ownage. It takes a true brainiac to get owned by oneself, I must say. ;D ;D ;)


Royal Lion

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #135 on: June 19, 2009, 05:33:48 PM »
 Still waiting for your explanation for why you used the example of the sprinter to prove that low volume works with heavy weights work for mass since bodybuilders have more mass than sprinters and sprinters do a lot of volume with their sprinters.. Oh brother, that was dumb even for you. ;)

  Anyways, 6 sets for arms is 21 days is not strengh training. I have Mike Mentzer's Heavy Duty, and he doesen't even advocate training arms. His routine is nothing but deadlifts, military presses and dps. Do you really think powerlifters do barbell curls and triceps kickbacks, genius? Again, six sets for arms with reps in the 6+ range is hypertrophy training and not strengh training. You: stupido.

SUCKMYMUSCLE
You change your arguments every time you rebut someone's argument.  You have to do this because you get owned by everyone on here.  You specifically stated that that 6 sets for arms over 3 weeks is NOT LOW VOLUME (these are the words you used).  Yes that is low volume.  High volume trainers would hit 6 sets of arms in each workout.

If your panties are still in a wad over my sprinter example then I am not sure what to tell you.  I already explained it so a 5-year old would understand, but you still seem to be grasping.  

Let me try one more time: sprinters have fast-twitch muscle fibers (remember the explosive ones); they maximize these by performing olympic lifts and also low rep squats, deadlifts, and push press.  Their weight training program is typically 2 or 3 times per week which is low volume.   In accordance with this type of weight training they build muscular size as well as strength and power.  

I never claimed sprinters have the size of bodybuilders.  This was another one of your desperate twists, kind of like when you started counting every step a sprinter takes as part of their lifting program.  

Marty Champions

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #136 on: June 19, 2009, 05:34:26 PM »
increase food increase demand for food

SIMPLE
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io856

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #137 on: June 19, 2009, 05:34:41 PM »
Are you saying that one set to failure doesnt increase size and only strength?



bad example he had already acquired that size before HIT...

tbombz

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #138 on: June 19, 2009, 05:35:45 PM »


I never claimed sprinters have the size of bodybuilders.  This was another one of your desperate twists, kind of like when you started counting every step a sprinter takes as part of their lifting program.  

no, that was a good point he made, and it refuted your argument, basic debate tactics,he showed your argument was faulty and that dismissed it from your list of evidence...

Marty Champions

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #139 on: June 19, 2009, 05:37:05 PM »
football players wouldnt be as jacked and ripped if they did HIT training low volume

football players do ALOT of working out running drills weights ect

you are only fooling yourself if you think you can acheive mastery of bodybuilding through low volume
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Eisenherz

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #140 on: June 19, 2009, 05:37:42 PM »
bad example he had already acquired that size before HIT...

er..no.

suckmymuscle

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #141 on: June 19, 2009, 05:39:27 PM »
The sprinters I worked out alongside in college did mostly power lifts.

Cleans (and jerk/press)
High pulls (from the floor)
Hang cleans
Step ups
Push jerks
box jumps
Split squats/pistol squats
Squats
Box squats
bench
Inverted rows
pullups/chins

a few other exercises not withstanding, this is what they did and most other athletes did the same thing.  A lot of the exercises were 5 reps, but they had phases where they would train up to 10 reps for some exercises and they would throw in some 20 rep squat sets.

  How do you know their quad muscles are the result of this training and not the sprinting? Powerlifters should have more massive quads than bodybuilders since they can squat a lot more, and yet bodybuilders have much bigger quad muscles than powerlifters. Riddle me that? And if sprinters do heavy weights for low volume it also proves my point, since their quads are a lot smaller than bodybuiders'. The reason, methinks, why sprinters have quite large quads is due to the high reps and high speed involved in sprinting. They would have even bigger quad muscles if they stopped sprinting and focused on moderate sets and reps with moderate weights. What is stopping their gains is the relatively high volume of sprinting, just like what impedes powerlifters from having bigger quads is too little volume.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

Marty Champions

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #142 on: June 19, 2009, 05:41:51 PM »
 How do you know their quad muscles are the result of this training and not the sprinting? Powerlifters should have more massive quads than bodybuilders since they can squat a lot more, and yet bodybuilders have much bigger quad muscles than powerlifters. Riddle me that? And if sprinters do heavy weights for low volume it also proves my point, since their quads are a lot smaller than bodybuiders'. The reason, methinks, why sprinters have quite large quads is due to the high reps and high speed involved in sprinting. They would have even bigger quad muscles if they stopped sprinting and focused on moderate sets and reps with moderate weights. What is stopping their gains is the relatively high volume of sprinting, just like what impedes powerlifters from having bigger quads is too little volume.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

cmon brother you cant be seriously giving advice about sprinters needing to back off of there training to be better. that is simply wrong
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suckmymuscle

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #143 on: June 19, 2009, 05:46:19 PM »
You change your arguments every time you rebut someone's argument.  You have to do this because you get owned by everyone on here.  You specifically stated that that 6 sets for arms over 3 weeks is NOT LOW VOLUME (these are the words you used).  Yes that is low volume.  High volume trainers would hit 6 sets of arms in each workout.

If your panties are still in a wad over my sprinter example then I am not sure what to tell you.  I already explained it so a 5-year old would understand, but you still seem to be grasping.  

Let me try one more time: sprinters have fast-twitch muscle fibers (remember the explosive ones); they maximize these by performing olympic lifts and also low rep squats, deadlifts, and push press.  Their weight training program is typically 2 or 3 times per week which is low volume.   In accordance with this type of weight training they build muscular size as well as strength and power.  

I never claimed sprinters have the size of bodybuilders.  This was another one of your desperate twists, kind of like when you started counting every step a sprinter takes as part of their lifting program.  

  How did I change my arugument, you dipshit dumbass? I sustain that 6 sets for arms in 3 weeks is more volume than what powerlifters or HIT advocates do. How did I change my argument? You are one stupid ass who can't read.

  The example of the sprinter sucks because if their mass were attributable to the kind of weight training they do, then powerlifters should be equally as muscular, for instance, in the quads. But they aren't. Because this kind of training doesen't work for mass. What gives sprinters their quads is the sprinting, dumbass, and not doing doubles or triples in the squat. The reason why they have more muscle there than powerlifters is because of the volume, and the reason wy they have less than bodybuilders is because of the excess of volume. And again, by your own admission bodybuilders are bigger. Then why the fuck did you bring this point up if you're trying to demonstrate that the weight training sprinters do is better for mass? You: owned again. ;D

SUCKMYMUSCLE

suckmymuscle

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #144 on: June 19, 2009, 05:48:54 PM »
cmon brother you cant be seriously giving advice about sprinters needing to back off of there training to be better. that is simply wrong

  Would they be more muscular if they stopped being sprinters and did progressive weight training with multiple sets? Sure. Would 3-4 sets of squats in the 6 to 8 rep range build bigger quads in the long haul than sprinting? Sure.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

Royal Lion

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #145 on: June 19, 2009, 05:49:05 PM »
no, that was a good point he made, and it refuted your argument, basic debate tactics,he showed your argument was faulty and that dismissed it from your list of evidence...
That point does not refute the fact that fast twitch fibers are maximized by low volume explosive lifting.  And a byproduct of this same lifting method is increased muscle size.  Comparing a sprinter to a bodybuilder has nothing to do with this.

io856

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #146 on: June 19, 2009, 05:49:47 PM »
In fact, the sprinters are sort of following suckmymuscle's theory here. The neuromuscular and various other strength adaptations are made through the low rep pure strength training and then high volume intense bursts of sprinting is performed.  :D

Marty Champions

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #147 on: June 19, 2009, 05:54:07 PM »
  Would they be more muscular if they stopped being sprinters and did progressive weight training with multiple sets? Sure. Would 3-4 sets of squats in the 6 to 8 rep range build bigger quads in the long haul than sprinting? Sure.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

sprints are done maximally just like weights, both would give hypertrophy

anything done maximally with enough calories=hypertrophy
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Eisenherz

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #148 on: June 19, 2009, 05:55:53 PM »
I dont think Royal Lion knows who he is debating.

Sucky has claimed to bench 600lb+ with ease, he is a multi millionare, he was kicked out of the special forces because he was "too good", he broke a German Shepards back with his bare hands.

Royal Lion, you decide where to take it from here, LOL.

Royal Lion

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Re: The Reason Why Muscles Don't Grow With Low Volume.
« Reply #149 on: June 19, 2009, 05:58:36 PM »
I dont think Royal Lion knows who he is debating.

Sucky has claimed to bench 600lb+ with ease, he is a multi millionare, he was kicked out of the special forces because he was "too good", he broke a German Shepards back with his bare hands.

Royal Lion, you decide where to take it from here, LOL.
Thanks for the insight - I am not surprised!  I am done wasting my time attempting to explain relatively simple concepts to him.