NOAM CHOMSKY doesn`t think much of RON PAUL or his Supporters. :)

[Kazan]

Yeah, maybe the mindset is wrong. I mean those people who want to pay less taxes are thinking the same thing - give me back as much of my money as possible.

Really? Maybe the people that want to pay less taxes thinks the government pisses away the money like America is their own personal piggy bank.

[gcb]

Really? Maybe the people that want to pay less taxes thinks the government pisses away the money like America is their own personal piggy bank.

Yeah there is a bit of that too - but then maybe pay no taxes, have then have no police, firemen, schools, roads, public libraries, etc...

[gcb]

The unions have a big hand in the destruction of the US auto industry, you do realize that there are union members that haven't worked in years, who job is to go to the mailbox and get their check. GM has still gone bankrupt even after government "interference". You don't see the Toyotas or Nissans going belly up( they don't use union labor) and make a good product that people actually want.

They use union labour in Germany I think and their auto-industry is much healthier.

[Benny B]

Ok sancho panza.  Keep following windmills with your Don Quixote messiah.

You're not even making sense, son. All the Mexican references... I don't get it, sorry. "Don Quixote" is a great book though. Ranked as the greatest all time work of fiction on many lists. You should read it, 33344567.
The messiah stuff though? I think you might want to lay off using messiah in this context. We Christians that believe Jesus was the Messiah? See, we consider this blasphemy. Now if you sincerely believe President Obama is the messiah 33344567, I am willing to respect your religious beliefs...because I am tolerant of unusual religious beliefs. But others on this board? Not too sure how they'll take it. 

[Kazan]

Yeah there is a bit of that too - but then maybe pay no taxes, have then have no police, firemen, schools, roads, public libraries, etc...

That is not the point, we all understand that we have to pay taxes for our society to function. The problem arises when government takes advantege of the tax payer and wastes the money, instead of using it for the things listed above. I get up and go to work everyday to provide for my family, I pay my bills, I earn the money not the government. Why am I expected to live within my means when the government doesn't?

[Kazan]

They use union labour in Germany I think and their auto-industry is much healthier.

Yeah but it isn't the UAW, the unions in America are as corrupt as the politicians, hell the teamsters were run by the mafia for most of it's existance.

[gcb]

Yeah but it isn't the UAW, the unions in America are as corrupt as the politicians, hell the teamsters were run by the mafia for most of it's existance.

All these things lead back to American inadequacy - are you telling me that the US is inferior to Germany in this regard?

[GigantorX]

All these things lead back to American inadequacy - are you telling me that the US is inferior to Germany in this regard?

Many unions, especially the UAW, operated and demanded with no regard for the business that was paying writing their checks. It wasn't what was fair, reasonable and mutually productive. No, it was what was the best for the UAW and who gives a damn about the Golden Goose. Insane job classification systems, work rules, forcing the auto-companies to even sign contracts stating that only certain product could be built in certain factories....why do you think it took so long for the Camaro to begin production? And a 1st class, world class pension, pay and benefit package....that made it impossible to make profit on small cars.

If that's what you mean by "inadequate" then yes, the American Unions fucking suck.

[Deicide]

Ideology always fails...at the end of the day.

[Soul Crusher]

All these things lead back to American inadequacy - are you telling me that the US is inferior to Germany in this regard?

No, we have strayed very far from what made the USA the greatest economic power on the earth.  Its our own fault.

The UAW in the USA does not work with the companies like they do in Germany.  The UAW, and almost all unions in America are worthless and infested with scumbags.   

[James]

Noam Chomsky is another liberal dreamer who has never produced a damn thing, never run a business, never met a payroll, never created a job, never been accountable for the results of his idiotic ideas, etc.

No thanks.

You just described true adonis   

[Soul Crusher]

You just described true adonis   

Unlike TA - I have been through all levels of education (B.A.,J.D.), been employed as a laborer mixing cement and digging holes for a fence company from 12 y/o through 22 y/o, been employed at a major corporation (UST), been unemployed for a year, worked for a mid sized firm, small firm, deal with clients all day from all sorts of economicx positions, started my own business with $700.00 to my name.  Im not saying I am better or worse off, but will say I have a far greater band of experiences than he does when it comes to how things work in the business and real world.       

I have seen the "brilliant" academic types, and the rough blue collar plumbers and electricians.  I have dealt with organized crime people and corporate people (although they are probably the same).  most of the professors I had probably could not even handle a basic real estate closing or will signing, let alone anything complex. 

That is why I value someone like Michael Bloomberg more than Chomsky.  Its not $$$$ per se, but just basic overall accomplshment.

Sitting in a chair all day and spewing ones' theories and philosophies is easy to do, starting a corporation, becoming mayor, and doing an amzing job at both is, to me at least, truly something to be admired.         

[headhuntersix]

Its funny how the lib douchbags look down at ditch diggers while pretending to be their champions.

[Soul Crusher]

Its funny how the lib douchbags look down at ditch diggers while pretending to be their champions.

At 2 am when the main water pipe goes, who are you calling - a plumber or Noam Chomsky? 

When your taxes need to be handled - do you call your account or Chomsky?

When your kid gets arrested and you need to get him out of jail - do you call the lawyer or Chomsky?

When you need to get treatment for a broken bone, do you call your Doctor or Chomsky? 


Im not saying that Chomsky is not a smart guy, but lets be honest, he is really not the useful other than giving his views to a captive audience of students who are not going to challenge his views. 

BTW here is the difference between a guy like Chomsky and the electrician - The electrician can be as well read and smart on his views on the world as Chomsky. 

BUT

Chomsky cant change the light bulb.     

[the_steevo_uk]

Sitting in a chair all day and spewing ones' theories and philosophies is easy to do, starting a corporation, becoming mayor, and doing an amzing job at both is, to me at least, truly something to be admired.         

I do understand what your saying, there is nothing worse than theory that is not empirical, it's a very European tradition to sit in the ivory tower and come up with grand theories of the world. US social science is quite different in that respect, it is mostly quantitative (though that has its limits) and extremely empirical, which is why I like the way chomsky does things actually since he grew up in that tradition. The work is relevant and useful to people trying to make sense of who societies/organisations/human interactions work. Sometimes Social scientists overstate how important they are, but they do play an important role...take for instance Israel where sociologists were essentially employed for thirty years to 'build' the state, which they did fairly successfully. They essentially built a country.

So there's swings and roundabouts, in my mind, philosophy and theory are important because they inform the way people see the world and how institutions of governance are created and shaped. The fact that 95% of people working in those institutions have no idea what theory is or how it affects their lives does not denigrate it's importance.

Bare in mind you can only build a business, run for office, or whatever within certain paradigms that have been created that allow you to work in that particular way. I respect people who run their own businesses and work their arses off as well, but I also respect those who work hard to understand how the whole thing fits together in order to inform better policy choices.

[the_steevo_uk]

One last thing, creating a theory from scratch is NOT easy...it takes years of work and hard thought.

[Deicide]

I do understand what your saying, there is nothing worse than theory that is not empirical, it's a very European tradition to sit in the ivory tower and come up with grand theories of the world. US social science is quite different in that respect, it is mostly quantitative (though that has its limits) and extremely empirical, which is why I like the way chomsky does things actually since he grew up in that tradition. The work is relevant and useful to people trying to make sense of who societies/organisations/human interactions work. Sometimes Social scientists overstate how important they are, but they do play an important role...take for instance Israel where sociologists were essentially employed for thirty years to 'build' the state, which they did fairly successfully. They essentially built a country.

So there's swings and roundabouts, in my mind, philosophy and theory are important because they inform the way people see the world and how institutions of governance are created and shaped. The fact that 95% of people working in those institutions have no idea what theory is or how it affects their lives does not denigrate it's importance.

Bare in mind you can only build a business, run for office, or whatever within certain paradigms that have been created that allow you to work in that particular way. I respect people who run their own businesses and work their arses off as well, but I also respect those who work hard to understand how the whole thing fits together in order to inform better policy choices.

Syntax is NOT a social science. It is much closer to a mathematical science than social is. There are fixed rules. Remember that Linguistics (syntax) is a young science as well.

[Deicide]

At 2 am when the main water pipe goes, who are you calling - a plumber or Noam Chomsky? 

When your taxes need to be handled - do you call your account or Chomsky?

When your kid gets arrested and you need to get him out of jail - do you call the lawyer or Chomsky?

When you need to get treatment for a broken bone, do you call your Doctor or Chomsky? 


Im not saying that Chomsky is not a smart guy, but lets be honest, he is really not the useful other than giving his views to a captive audience of students who are not going to challenge his views. 

BTW here is the difference between a guy like Chomsky and the electrician - The electrician can be as well read and smart on his views on the world as Chomsky. 

BUT

Chomsky cant change the light bulb.     

Plenty of people challenge Chomsky's views. I think it is important to be pragmatic but a world devoid of intellectual learning would be poor indeed. You don't know anything about what Chomsky has done for say, computational science as well as the understanding of human cognition in general. Chomsky is not simply 'well read'. It is people like him who have forwarded human knowledge.

[Deicide]

Unlike TA - I have been through all levels of education (B.A.,J.D.), been employed as a laborer mixing cement and digging holes for a fence company from 12 y/o through 22 y/o, been employed at a major corporation (UST), been unemployed for a year, worked for a mid sized firm, small firm, deal with clients all day from all sorts of economicx positions, started my own business with $700.00 to my name.  Im not saying I am better or worse off, but will say I have a far greater band of experiences than he does when it comes to how things work in the business and real world.       

I have seen the "brilliant" academic types, and the rough blue collar plumbers and electricians.  I have dealt with organized crime people and corporate people (although they are probably the same).  most of the professors I had probably could not even handle a basic real estate closing or will signing, let alone anything complex. 

That is why I value someone like Michael Bloomberg more than Chomsky.  Its not $$$$ per se, but just basic overall accomplshment.

Sitting in a chair all day and spewing ones' theories and philosophies is easy to do, starting a corporation, becoming mayor, and doing an amzing job at both is, to me at least, truly something to be admired.         

Do you think physicists pursuing String Theory are wasting their time?

[the_steevo_uk]

Syntax is NOT a social science. It is much closer to a mathematical science than social is. There are fixed rules. Remember that Linguistics (syntax) is a young science as well.

I wasnt really referring to Chomsky as such...more 33864's point that theory is easy and not very useful

[Deicide]

I wasnt really referring to Chomsky as such...more 33864's point that theory is easy and not very useful

Steevie UK G-homey in da mutha fuckin house!

[Soul Crusher]

Do you think physicists pursuing String Theory are wasting their time?

I specifically told you that this did not apply to people in hard sciences like physics and chemistry, etc.  If what you are saying about linguistics is true, fine, but my point was more to the utility and importance of his "social commentary" versus many other things that in my mind have far more utility that get largely ignored.   

[Deicide]

I specifically told you that this did not apply to people in hard sciences like physics and chemistry, etc.  If what you are saying about linguistics is true, fine, but my point was more to the utility and importance of his "social commentary" versus many other things that in my mind have far more utility that get largely ignored.   

Linguistics is the science of how language works with different subfields, speech production and description, cognitive. Yeah, it is much closer to a hard science than a humanities subject.

Nevertheless, you can't claim that humanities are completely useless? Or is that your position.

[Soul Crusher]

Linguistics is the science of how language works with different subfields, speech production and description, cognitive. Yeah, it is much closer to a hard science than a humanities subject.

Nevertheless, you can't claim that humanities are completely useless? Or is that your position.

I didnt say they are useless, but they are not, at least in my mind, something to elevate to very high status.   

[Deicide]

I didnt say they are useless, but they are not, at least in my mind, something to elevate to very high status.   

Then money is king?