Author Topic: gh-15 Question - saving receptors (Read 10282 times)

Tapeworm · « **Reply #25 on:** July 21, 2009, 10:40:30 PM »

According to Dr. Anthony Goodman, in a series of lectures entitled 'Understanding the Human Body,' a cell's receptors will decrease in number when there is an excess of the corresponding hormone.

tbombz · « **Reply #26 on:** July 21, 2009, 10:49:35 PM »

as far as receptors goes, there is no conlcusive evidence t support receptor number increasing or decreasing from aas.

the two legit studies i can remember... they showed that at first the subjects who were on 600mg test had a big increase in AR number, but over 6 months it returned to baseline. then another one that showed a small decline in AR number.

as lats mentioned exercise boosts AR number on its own. and eating carbs should help keep ar high as well. (some kind of anti AR metabolism effect of insulin IIRC)

dustin · « **Reply #27 on:** July 21, 2009, 11:00:08 PM »

Long story short (which is amazing considering I'm a meltdown machine), no one really needs to worry about androgen receptor down regulation, optimization, etc. Unless you're taking grams of androgens, using every other PED and making no progress then it is of no concern.

I think a lot of f*gs mistake AR downreg for the accumulation of SHBG elevation, being too fat and not dieting properly and using bunk or underdosed gear. That and a lot of people just become lazy after using AAS and other PEDs for too long. I've been off the sauce for longer than I wanted, but I've come to appreciate it more than anything. It was a good reality check.

Palpatine Q · « **Reply #28 on:** July 21, 2009, 11:02:20 PM »

I'd like to see what a lot of you sauced-up guys look like, seriously.

No flame, but there are a lot of dudes here who hit the gear pretty good and don't post a pic

tbombz · « **Reply #29 on:** July 21, 2009, 11:02:33 PM »

Quote from: dustin on July 21, 2009, 11:00:08 PM

I think a lot of f*gs mistake AR downreg for the accumulation of SHBG elevation,

well actually dont be so sure that this is a bad thing.

its possible that bound androgens can still exer their effects on AR.....and bound androgens are kept safe from liver metabolism....which means that they will be in circulation for alot longer than free androgens...

its possible shbg is beneficial

Rami · « **Reply #30 on:** July 21, 2009, 11:18:02 PM »

protein and creatin receptors are utmost important to save, so you have to cycle protein and creatin.

Van_Bilderass · « **Reply #31 on:** July 21, 2009, 11:23:03 PM »

Quote from: tbombz on July 21, 2009, 11:02:33 PM

well actually dont be so sure that this is a bad thing.

its possible that bound androgens can still exer their effects on AR.....and bound androgens are kept safe from liver metabolism....which means that they will be in circulation for alot longer than free androgens...

its possible shbg is beneficial

Yeah I wouldn't worry about SHBG elevation, especially since all steroids reduce it.

You don't need Proviron to combat your sky-high SHBG.

But even if it was elevated a bit it might not be a negative like you said.

Sir Bigness · « **Reply #32 on:** July 22, 2009, 01:05:42 AM »

Can the body only use a certain amount and the rest is overspill? (like pouring sugar into a spoon and it spills over after awhile) The same goes for Creatine, Protein, etc... Is there limits, without waisting sups and $$$?

Overload · « **Reply #33 on:** July 22, 2009, 01:42:30 AM »

Quote from: Sir Bigness on July 22, 2009, 01:05:42 AM

Can the body only use a certain amount and the rest is overspill? (like pouring sugar into a spoon and it spills over after awhile) The same goes for Creatine, Protein, etc... Is there limits, without waisting sups and $$$?

The sides just become much more difficult to handle.

DK II · « **Reply #34 on:** July 22, 2009, 02:05:33 AM »

Quote from: Stavios on July 21, 2009, 09:19:23 AM

I would read that, but unfortunately I don't speak 31 languages like you do

Sorry guys, i will translate the important parts.

Training for 14 years, 10 years on roids. Because of high blood pressure (10 years on ephedrine and roids) he goes low dose and still has good results.

50mg Testo P eod
0,5ml TriTren (BD) eod
10mg Stano ed

that's 150mg testo P, 300mg TrenMix (Acetat, Hexa, Enanthate) and 70mg Stano PER WEEK.

Comments?

LatsMcGee · « **Reply #35 on:** July 22, 2009, 02:22:33 AM »

GH15 is too busy sucking cocks for drug money to answer questions at this time.

gh15 · « **Reply #36 on:** July 22, 2009, 05:07:55 AM »

Quote from: Sir Bigness on July 21, 2009, 12:01:51 AM

Should an amateur come off totally when not compeating to save receptors or is there a low dosage for a certain period of time before trying to put on size again?

come off for what? you wont get no where if come off,,you come off for a month sometimes when yuore poor and suffer for that 1 month ,,most smart amatuer know that moment they come off gear they go on gh and insulin or gh so never off

BODYBUILDER NEVER OFF NEVER OFF NEVER OFF WE NEVER OFF EVERYTHING,,ALWAYS ON SOMETHING,,YOU WILL NEVER FIND A BODYBUILDER COMPLETLY OFF EVERYTHING,,NOT EXISTED AS OF 2009 UNLESS SICK OR NOT COMPETING AND DONT CARE ANYMORE BUT EVEN WHEN NOT COMPETING THEY ALL HAVE THE MENTAL THING,,ITS A DEASEASE ,,ONCE YOURE IN YOU VERY RARELY GO OUT UNLESS YOUR LIFE IS AT RISK AND MOST WOULD NOT GIVE A DAMN AND RISK THEIR LIFE UNLESS SOMETHING FAILS LIKE KIDNY ETC AND EVEN THEN YOU SEE THE GENIOUSES WHO GET BACK ON THE STUFF RIGHT AFTER DYALASYS ,,

BODYBUILDERS = ADDICTS

LEARN IT

MJ15 APPROVED

Dballn247 · « **Reply #37 on:** July 22, 2009, 05:17:59 AM »

Quote from: Van_Bilderass on July 21, 2009, 08:44:02 AM

someone please save my receptor

LOL

DK II · « **Reply #38 on:** July 22, 2009, 05:20:58 AM »

Quote from: gh15 on July 22, 2009, 05:07:55 AM

come off for what? you wont get no where if come off,,you come off for a month sometimes when yuore poor and suffer for that 1 month ,,most smart amatuer know that moment they come off gear they go on gh and insulin or gh so never off

BODYBUILDER NEVER OFF NEVER OFF NEVER OFF WE NEVER OFF EVERYTHING,,ALWAYS ON SOMETHING,,YOU WILL NEVER FIND A BODYBUILDER COMPLETLY OFF EVERYTHING,,NOT EXISTED AS OF 2009 UNLESS SICK OR NOT COMPETING AND DONT CARE ANYMORE BUT EVEN WHEN NOT COMPETING THEY ALL HAVE THE MENTAL THING,,ITS A DEASEASE ,,ONCE YOURE IN YOU VERY RARELY GO OUT UNLESS YOUR LIFE IS AT RISK AND MOST WOULD NOT GIVE A DAMN AND RISK THEIR LIFE UNLESS SOMETHING FAILS LIKE KIDNY ETC AND EVEN THEN YOU SEE THE GENIOUSES WHO GET BACK ON THE STUFF RIGHT AFTER DYALASYS ,,

BODYBUILDERS = ADDICTS

LEARN IT

MJ15 APPROVED

what do you say about this cycle?

50mg Testo P eod
0,5ml TriTren (BD) eod
10mg Stano ed

that's 150mg testo P, 300mg TrenMix (Acetat, Hexa, Enanthate) and 70mg Stano PER WEEK.

Figo · « **Reply #39 on:** July 22, 2009, 05:37:59 AM »

Quote from: gh15 on July 22, 2009, 05:07:55 AM

UNLESS SOMETHING FAILS LIKE KIDNY ETC AND EVEN THEN YOU SEE THE GENIOUSES WHO GET BACK ON THE STUFF RIGHT AFTER DYALASYS ,,

jon cole · « **Reply #40 on:** July 22, 2009, 05:44:51 AM »

Quote from: gh15 on July 22, 2009, 05:07:55 AM

come off for what? you wont get no where if come off,,you come off for a month sometimes when yuore poor and suffer for that 1 month ,,most smart amatuer know that moment they come off gear they go on gh and insulin or gh so never off

BODYBUILDER NEVER OFF NEVER OFF NEVER OFF WE NEVER OFF EVERYTHING,,ALWAYS ON SOMETHING,,YOU WILL NEVER FIND A BODYBUILDER COMPLETLY OFF EVERYTHING,,NOT EXISTED AS OF 2009 UNLESS SICK OR NOT COMPETING AND DONT CARE ANYMORE BUT EVEN WHEN NOT COMPETING THEY ALL HAVE THE MENTAL THING,,ITS A DEASEASE ,,ONCE YOURE IN YOU VERY RARELY GO OUT UNLESS YOUR LIFE IS AT RISK AND MOST WOULD NOT GIVE A DAMN AND RISK THEIR LIFE UNLESS SOMETHING FAILS LIKE KIDNY ETC AND EVEN THEN YOU SEE THE GENIOUSES WHO GET BACK ON THE STUFF RIGHT AFTER DYALASYS ,,

BODYBUILDERS = ADDICTS

LEARN IT

MJ15 APPROVED

"""HI FERLLAS,,,IN THE LIFE WHEN YOU WANT SOME.THING YOU MUST DO SCACRIFISE,,,COME OFF AND YOU 4LL STAY A LOCAL AMATEUR SO IF YOU WANT TO SAVE RECEPTOR JUST SWITCH WITH OTHER ROID.Z JUST SWITCH FROM TEST TO TREN OR GRAPEFRUIT"""
GH15 APPROVED

i was right.
i'm into the mind of gh15.

dustin · « **Reply #41 on:** July 22, 2009, 10:23:41 AM »

Quote from: tbombz on July 21, 2009, 11:02:33 PM

well actually dont be so sure that this is a bad thing.

its possible that bound androgens can still exer their effects on AR.....and bound androgens are kept safe from liver metabolism....which means that they will be in circulation for alot longer than free androgens...

its possible shbg is beneficial

True enough. But that, myostatin, prostaglandins, cytokines, all these millions of eccentric growth factors that we know nothing about, even progestin and prolactin, no one has really looked at the grand scheme of things in a bodybuilding application. There are plenty of endocrinologists and studies out there, but nothing focused towards a supraphysiological level of androgens being taken for the purpose of building muscle.

All we have are studies showing the androgenic and anabolic affects of sex steroids applied to rat muscle, and the hepatotoxic affects of large doses of androgens. We've got a few human studies on people with third degree burns and inherent wasting syndrome from chronic and irreparable illness. I don't think that we'll ever know, but I don't think we should immediately chalk it up to AR down regulation.

I remember, yeaarrs ago, I think it was Bill Lewellyn and Par Deus or some other AAS guru out there duking it out over AR down regulation. I think Patrick Arnold and Bruce Kneller joined in some heated debates too. Those were gold. But when I read them it was years before I even picked up a weight and I was barely over 100lbs, didn't even know what protein was but was interested in the science of getting big biceps. Anyone have a link to any of these old threads?

local hero · « **Reply #42 on:** July 22, 2009, 10:30:27 AM »

the reason you still look good at the lower doses when u drop down is that your keeping your self in an anabolic state, after so long gear acts as more as an anti catabolic.....

mark my words, if u want to go places dont come off,, blast and cruise.......

tbombz · « **Reply #43 on:** July 22, 2009, 10:34:23 AM »

Quote from: DonkeyKong on July 22, 2009, 05:20:58 AM

what do you say about this cycle?

50mg Testo P eod
0,5ml TriTren (BD) eod
10mg Stano ed

that's 150mg testo P, 300mg TrenMix (Acetat, Hexa, Enanthate) and 70mg Stano PER WEEK.

crap. dont shoot prop or acetate eod.

winny is a waste at 10mg.

wouldnt use BD tri tren ever... no fucking reason at all for mixed esters..overpriced garbage. the hexa ester is basically the same as the enanthate ester...anyone stupid enough to produce a steroid with acetate, enanthate, hex is nto smart enough to make a steroid iw ould buy. at least have some base knowledge befor eyou start making oils that will be injected into peoples bodies.

tbombz · « **Reply #44 on:** July 22, 2009, 10:37:28 AM »

Quote from: dustin on July 22, 2009, 10:23:41 AM

True enough. But that, myostatin, prostaglandins, cytokines, all these millions of eccentric growth factors that we know nothing about, even progestin and prolactin, no one has really looked at the grand scheme of things in a bodybuilding application.

absolutely.

which is why anecdotal evidence reigns supreme, as of now.

dustin · « **Reply #45 on:** July 22, 2009, 11:28:26 AM »

Quote from: tbombz on July 22, 2009, 10:37:28 AM

absolutely.

which is why anecdotal evidence reigns supreme, as of now.

Yeah, I'm not sure why most people here sweat it though. Aside from the few pros that are still on board, no one should be having problems with their androgen receptors. Just up the dose, use stronger anabolics and make sure that what you're injecting is REAL and not some bathtub brew.

Tatyana · « **Reply #46 on:** July 22, 2009, 11:44:13 AM »

The reasons that people often stop having gains at week 8-9 has nothing to do with androgen receptors.

It is more than likely linked to the fact that supra-physiological doses of testosterone up-regulate myostatin, inhibiting growth.

This does seem to taper off again at week twenty, so you can avoid this with short cycles or longer cycles.

Another endocrine interaction is that testosterone induces insulin resistance in muscle, so the anabolic effects of insulin are muted.

Sir Bigness · « **Reply #47 on:** July 22, 2009, 05:39:23 PM »

Quote from: Sir Bigness on July 22, 2009, 01:05:42 AM

Can the body only use a certain amount and the rest is overspill? (like pouring sugar into a spoon and it spills over after awhile) The same goes for Creatine, Protein, etc... Is there limits, without waisting sups and $$$?

Didn't get to much feedback on this part. Anybody else have any comments on this?

tbombz · « **Reply #48 on:** July 22, 2009, 11:07:50 PM »

Quote from: Tatyana on July 22, 2009, 11:44:13 AM

The reasons that people often stop having gains at week 8-9 has nothing to do with androgen receptors.

It is more than likely linked to the fact that supra-physiological doses of testosterone up-regulate myostatin, inhibiting growth.

This does seem to taper off again at week twenty, so you can avoid this with short cycles or longer cycles.

Another endocrine interaction is that testosterone induces insulin resistance in muscle, so the anabolic effects of insulin are muted.

where do you come up with this stuff, woman?

AFAIK test slighty decreases myostatin...

as far s insulin resistance, yes, however bodybuilders dont really get this as they are constantly depleting glycogen stopres through training which re-sensitizes them to insulin.

DK II · « **Reply #49 on:** July 22, 2009, 11:26:52 PM »

Quote from: tbombz on July 22, 2009, 10:34:23 AM

crap. dont shoot prop or acetate eod.

winny is a waste at 10mg.

wouldnt use BD tri tren ever... no fucking reason at all for mixed esters..overpriced garbage. the hexa ester is basically the same as the enanthate ester...anyone stupid enough to produce a steroid with acetate, enanthate, hex is nto smart enough to make a steroid iw ould buy. at least have some base knowledge befor eyou start making oils that will be injected into peoples bodies.

Well, maybe you should try it.

If a guy that megadosed for ten years likes it, it cannot be that bad.

I don't want to miscredit you, but the poster was the gh15 of a famous german board, he ran a famous german underground lab (maybe the most hyped UG lab in Germany ever) and looked quite decent.