Author Topic: Obama Admn: "U.S. consumers should pay for China's carbon emissions."  (Read 932 times)

Soul Crusher

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Commerce Secretary: America needs to pay for China’s emissionsposted at 12:00 pm on July 19, 2009 by Ed Morrissey

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It’s bad enough that the Obama administration wants to penalize all Americans for their energy use through the cap-and-tax scheme that will hobble our economy and hike electricity and gas costs, but until now they only proposed to penalize us for our own energy use. 

With China refusing to join the West in economic suicide, who will pay for their emissions?  Commerce Secretary says that the American consumer is to blame for China’s energy-production emissions — and we’ll pay for that instead of the Chinese:

Commerce Secretary Gary Locke said something amazing—U.S. consumers should pay for part of Chinese greenhouse-gas emissions. From Reuters:

It’s important that those who consume the products being made all around the world to the benefit of America — and it’s our own consumption activity that’s causing the emission of greenhouse gases, then quite frankly Americans need to pay for that,” Commerce Secretary Gary Locke told the American Chamber of Commerce in Shanghai.

The idea that rich-country consumers should pick up the tab for some of China’s industrial emissions has been gaining currency lately—but not from within the Obama administration. The argument is that many of China’s factories churn out cheap stuff for the West, not for domestic consumption, so those consumers are actually responsible for the emissions. China, of course, loves the idea.

Commerce sent this non-responsive statement to the Wall Street Journal when they reported this late Friday night:

“Secretary Locke has been very clear on emphasizing the importance of fair trade as a part of the United States’ relationship with China. He believes U.S. companies should not be disadvantaged by Chinese imports not bound by responsible policies to reduce carbon emissions. China and the US must work together to ensure a level playing field and reduce our carbon footprints. The Secretary’s trip to China demonstrated his commitment to fair trade and his belief that both the United States and China can benefit from shared investments and cooperation in clean energy that will lead to commercial and environmental benefits for both countries.”

This could happen in one of two ways.  The Obama administration could make cap-and-tax more expensive in order to make up for the emissions from China, which would absolutely delight Beijing.   In fact, that would allow them an easily-adjustable pressure point on the American economy by simply increasing their emissions.  If the US increased the penalties for domestic emissions in order to compensate, the Chinese could sell their good much more cheaply in the US than domestic producers.

The other option would be energy-production tariffs on imported goods, which would touch off a trade war with China.  That would make goods more expensive in the US at the same time energy bills begin to skyrocket, launching an inflationary spiral and begging China for retaliation.  Since China holds a large amount of US debt, that retaliation could get extremely expensive for both countries.

The US does not need to pay for China’s carbon emissions, even if the “greenhouse effect” presents a danger to the planet, a theory which increasingly looks suspect.  This is yet another version of the blame-America impulse in the Obama administration, one that will hit us all in the wallet — and in our outlets and furnaces.
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Kazan

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Ah, Gary Locke can go fuck himself and needs to be relieved of his position immediately if not sooner.

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

GigantorX

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Dos Equis

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lol @ the "Blame Amercia" pic.   :)

w8tlftr

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lolz... funny pic.  ;D

George Whorewell

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He should be relieved of his life the same way that chinaman who got run over by the tank in Tienamen Square did.


Geezus H. Christ. I really could have lived with Hillary as prez. Isn't some of this insanity starting to bother even the most staunch leftists on get big?

I am not going to lead the charge on pressing the panic button. 333386 takes care of that. I just watch from the sidelines and either shake my head or laugh. Now I'm really starting to buy into the hype. This new world order shit is serious- This Administration wants to topple the capitalist system and make America marginal like the rest of the world in some smug, idiotic attempt to repay the third world and the rest of the greedy inept wanna be superpowers for America's dominance. I'm telling you, this fucking douchebag has been in office 6 months and already he's turned the George Bush disaster into the Barry Obama catastrophe. This is really bad folks. Stay tuned.

pedro01

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I'm all for this to be honest but I wonder if the WTO will step in.

Why not make Chinese products more expensive in the US ? Then maybe the jobs will come back, that's where a lot of US jobs went, anyway.

Same for India.


Hugo Chavez

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how about the corporations pay for it.  It was their fucking bright idea to dump the American workforce for more profit.  Tax Walmart :D

pedro01

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It doesn't matter really - if you make corporations pay for it, they'll pass on the cost to the consumer.

Bottom line, if you really can pass a law that makes stuff from China more expensive without them going whining to the WTO, then jobs will come back to the US where they need to be. If they played fair with their currency, it may not have come to this.

Just 15 years ago, I was working mostly in Knoxville & quite a bit in Charlotte in the textile industry. From what I hear, there's not a lot of it left there now.

In the UK in the 80's, Thatcher killed off the mining industry in a very short period and some of the towns that were very reliant on mining just never recovered. When industries just disappear like that, it takes a long time for something to come back in it's place. Thatcher wasn't all bad, but it was too rapid a change.

As for all this 'service economy' stuff - it's bollocks in my opinion. The US needs to be making stuff.

Soul Crusher

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It doesn't matter really - if you make corporations pay for it, they'll pass on the cost to the consumer.

Bottom line, if you really can pass a law that makes stuff from China more expensive without them going whining to the WTO, then jobs will come back to the US where they need to be. If they played fair with their currency, it may not have come to this.

Just 15 years ago, I was working mostly in Knoxville & quite a bit in Charlotte in the textile industry. From what I hear, there's not a lot of it left there now.

In the UK in the 80's, Thatcher killed off the mining industry in a very short period and some of the towns that were very reliant on mining just never recovered. When industries just disappear like that, it takes a long time for something to come back in it's place. Thatcher wasn't all bad, but it was too rapid a change.

As for all this 'service economy' stuff - it's bollocks in my opinion. The US needs to be making stuff.


100%.  We ned to scrap "cap & trade" and focus on getting factories and plants over here.  No more "green" nonsense.  We need to makle appliances, conmuser goods, etc. 

GigantorX

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100%.  We ned to scrap "cap & trade" and focus on getting factories and plants over here.  No more "green" nonsense.  We need to makle appliances, conmuser goods, etc. 

Our nation will not be making TV's and toaster's anymore and honestly, we shouldn't be. Car's, Aircraft, military equipment, heavy Caterpillar type equipment...absolutely. The U.S. shouldn't be in the business of pulling levers, we are in the business of making the levers.

We face the problem of wanting the "good old days" of making watches, shoes and coffee makers while we should be focused on the future of hi-tech, high profit and advanced production/R&D. That is how the U.S. will extend/maintain its dominance, not by making toy cars and mechanical pencils.

Problem is with organized labor and its political clout trying to drag us back to the stone age and not being adaptable. This is also a politicians dream talking point. Our educational sys. is also utterly inadequate, and being an educator.....or "test teacher" as we should be called, I know first hand.

Soul Crusher

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Our nation will not be making TV's and toaster's anymore and honestly, we shouldn't be. Car's, Aircraft, military equipment, heavy Caterpillar type equipment...absolutely. The U.S. shouldn't be in the business of pulling levers, we are in the business of making the levers.

We face the problem of wanting the "good old days" of making watches, shoes and coffee makers while we should be focused on the future of hi-tech, high profit and advanced production/R&D. That is how the U.S. will extend/maintain its dominance, not by making toy cars and mechanical pencils.

Problem is with organized labor and its political clout trying to drag us back to the stone age and not being adaptable. This is also a politicians dream talking point. Our educational sys. is also utterly inadequate, and being an educator.....or "test teacher" as we should be called, I know first hand.

This admn and the dems in both houses are seriously the worst of my lifetime.  Never have I ever witnessed such a collection of morons concentrated in one place. 

And ZERO is the biggest one. 


pedro01

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Our nation will not be making TV's and toaster's anymore and honestly, we shouldn't be. Car's, Aircraft, military equipment, heavy Caterpillar type equipment...absolutely. The U.S. shouldn't be in the business of pulling levers, we are in the business of making the levers.

We face the problem of wanting the "good old days" of making watches, shoes and coffee makers while we should be focused on the future of hi-tech, high profit and advanced production/R&D. That is how the U.S. will extend/maintain its dominance, not by making toy cars and mechanical pencils.

Problem is with organized labor and its political clout trying to drag us back to the stone age and not being adaptable. This is also a politicians dream talking point. Our educational sys. is also utterly inadequate, and being an educator.....or "test teacher" as we should be called, I know first hand.

Interesting point of view. The problem with orienting yourself around stuff that needs a lot of R&D is that you are relying on the people in the US being smarter than elsewhere. Are Americans really smarter than Japanese, Indians, Chinese, Taiwanese & Singaporeans ? Is the US education system that good ?

If you only make high-ticket items, then you get hammered worse with each recession as companies reduce spending on capital equipment first in a recession and people do pretty much the same thing.

If the above would work, then the US auto industry would not be where it is today.

Take running shoes for instance - is it now beneath the US Citizen to make such an item ? Should they all be making space ships instead ? I like US-made running shoes and I buy more of those than I do space-ships.