Joe Wilson's Free Health Care

[The Luke]

It's "regurgitated", not "reguritated".
It's "propaganda", not "propoganda".
It's "continuously", not "continuosly".
It's "without", not "withot".
The word you're looking for here is "insurance".
It's "exorbitant" not "exorbitat"

...yeah, sorry about that, switched over to a laptop with a very insensitive keyboard, most of those are simple omissions. My apologies. I'll proofread as I go from now on.

Now, by YOUR VERY OWN LOGIC, we can dismiss your malformed musings and idiotic postings.

...well I suppose you could if I actually had used that as a reason to dismiss other people's arguments. Rather I was making the point that I had overlooked such spelling mistakes. So you aren't using my logic against me, just your poor reading comprehension.

Read the comment in it's proper context:

In this thread I have overlooked poor spelling; bad grammar and atrocious syntax, all valid reasons to dismiss the malformed musings of idiotic posters, in an effort to counter actual arguments put forward with actual counter arguments.

...do you have an actual argument?

I'm neither an idiot, nor are my arguments the malformed musings of such, but if you would prefer to stop reading and turn the volume all the way up on your FOX News, I won't be offended.

It's "HMO's" here.
It's "soldier's".

...actually, no it's not. The relational gentive apostrophe only applies to genitve (possessive) case PROPER NOUNS.

Besides, in the instance of my use of "HMOs" which you cited, the original use is simple plural, not even the genitive. Plurals do not require apostrophes whether they are proper nouns or acronyms.


Again, I apologise for the spelling errors. Hope it didn't put anyone off reading that post.


The Luke

[Skip8282]

...actually, no it's not. The relational gentive apostrophe only applies to genitve (possessive) case PROPER NOUNS.

Besides, in the instance of my use of "HMOs" which you cited, the original use is simple plural, not even the genitive. Plurals do not require apostrophes whether they are proper nouns or acronyms.

The Luke

No, it doesn't.  It applies to any NOUN, common or proper.

Don't believe me?  Educate yourself...

http://www.write101.com/sample.htm

[The Luke]

No, it doesn't.  It applies to any NOUN, common or proper.

Don't believe me?  Educate yourself...

http://www.write101.com/sample.htm

...maybe in American, not in English.

What's next? Arguing color is correct but colour is not?


I write my posts in English... I don't care if that doesn't traslate into Ebonics perfectly.


The Luke

[Kazan]

...they still have troops in Northern Ireland, and why not, it's a separate county which is part of the United Kingdom, not part of the Republic of Ireland.

Didn't you earn about this growing up in the Mental Institution?


I'm Irish born and raised but I still know Alaska and Hawai are states of the US. Did you know that?



The Luke

Ireland just isn't that important to me, and as far as your usual attempts at insulting people why don't you go get drunk, isn't that what you worthless mick bastards do?

[The Luke]

Ireland just isn't that important to me, and as far as your usual attempts at insulting people why don't you go get drunk, isn't that what you worthless mick bastards do?

...and this relates to the healthcare reform debate how?


The Luke

[Mons Venus]

...and this relates to the healthcare reform debate how?


The Luke

The Luke is cool, calm and kicking azz!!   

[The Luke]

The Luke is cool, calm and kicking azz!!   

...the Luke is under personal attack because he has seemingly won the argument.

Damn socialist, eurotrash asshole... with his facts and logic.



The Luke

[Kazan]

...and this relates to the healthcare reform debate how?


The Luke

What do you want to debate? That the Federal Government has no constitutional authority in the matter?

[The Luke]

What do you want to debate? That the Federal Government has no constitutional authority in the matter?

...was I arguing that?

I thought I was attacking the propaganda arguments put forward by the healthcare monopoly lobby (via right-wing propaganda mouthpieces such as FOX News and Rush Limbaugh).

Let's stay on topic.


The arguments put forward by those opposing reform are totally divorced from reality.

Go use a socialised healthcare system. Go visit one of these countries being demonised in your press.


Maybe just ask yourself who benefits from all this brainwashing? 



The Luke

[Kazan]

...was I arguing that?

I thought I was attacking the propaganda arguments put forward by the healthcare monopoly lobby (via right-wing propaganda mouthpieces such as FOX News and Rush Limbaugh).

Let's stay on topic.


The arguments put forward by those opposing reform are totally divorced from reality.

Go use a socialised healthcare system. Go visit one of these countries being demonised in your press.


Maybe just ask yourself who benefits from all this brainwashing? 



The Luke

I don't watch FOX news or any other cable news channel for that matter its all opinionated crap. I don't really care how Ireland runs its healthcare system, or the rest of Europe, Asia, or Russia for that matter.

I don't want to use a socialized health care system, the one I have works just fine.

Maybe you think some on here are brainwashed, but when it comes right down to it health care is not a right, it is service that you must pay a licensed professional for, that in itself disqualifies it from being a right. If the Federal Government wants to make it a right there is a process to ammend the constitutution.

The government sets all the regulations on how the insurance companies must conduct buisness, then act surprised when they listen to lobbiest and do what they want and things get fucked up. And what really pisses me off is the sitcom attention spam of most of America as they just forget that government made this fucking mess and now are on their knee thanking that same government for "fixing" it.

[The Luke]

Good points, but I must take issue with some of your opinions...

I don't watch FOX news or any other cable news channel for that matter its all opinionated crap. I don't really care how Ireland runs its healthcare system, or the rest of Europe, Asia, or Russia for that matter.

Good for you regarding the boycott of corporate media.

But I don't understand this dismissive attitude to healthcare politics... the main reason why Americans are so easily ripped-off by profiteering insurance cartels is because Americans simply aren't aware of the successes other governments have had instituting universal healthcare.

Every single country with better healthcare than the US (36 of them) all have socialised care.

The French pay 60% of what you pay per capita (and 50 million Americans don't pay premiums) and they have the very best healthcare system in the entire world (2000 WHO Report).


Some of these other arguments are way off base too:

I don't want to use a socialized health care system, the one I have works just fine.

...even aside from the chronically selfish attitude displayed here, are you actually aware that you run a one in five chance of not being covered?

That's the denial rate for those who THINK they have full coverage. Remember, for most afflicted with sudden serious illness, denial means bankruptcy... and bankruptcy means homelessness.

If your coverage is employer supplied... what are your odds of losing your job during this recession/depression?


Think about it. Your "I'm alright, fuck everyone else!" attitude is a delusion...

You'd actually have better odds playing Russian Roulette.

...but when it comes right down to it health care is not a right, it is service that you must pay a licensed professional for, that in itself disqualifies it from being a right.

This IS brainwashing. Read the Declaration of Human Rights; read the Geneva Convention.

...why do American prison inmates receive healthcare in prison free of charge?

Why do the poor bastards being raped; mutilated and tortured in Gitmo have free taxpayer-funded government-run socialised healthcare?

Don't you as a patriotic tax-paying American deserve the same rights that socialist commie Bush granted to dem' dere turr-orists?



The Luke

[Soul Crusher]

Almost every state has programs to assist the poor with health coverage.  On a federal level, medicaid is available to poor people.   

[Soul Crusher]

Luke :  serious question. 

I went to Manhattan College in the Bronx NY and they had an exchange program with Irish students.  I did the throwing events and Ireland has a lot of good throwers in the hammer toss, etc. who came to Manhattan College.

Almost to a tee, other than a few cool guys, the first thing these guys always did was complain about the USA and tear down America.  Yet, they never could answer the question why they came here if Ireland was so much better and offered better opportunities. 

Is it an inferiority complex or are Irish people generally negative whiners who think they know more than everyone else?         

[Kazan]

Good points, but I must take issue with some of your opinions...

Good for you regarding the boycott of corporate media.

But I don't understand this dismissive attitude to healthcare politics... the main reason why Americans are so easily ripped-off by profiteering insurance cartels is because Americans simply aren't aware of the successes other governments have had instituting universal healthcare.

Every single country with better healthcare than the US (36 of them) all have socialised care.

The French pay 60% of what you pay per capita (and 50 million Americans don't pay premiums) and they have the very best healthcare system in the entire world (2000 WHO Report).


Some of these other arguments are way off base too:
...even aside from the chronically selfish attitude displayed here, are you actually aware that you run a one in five chance of not being covered?

That's the denial rate for those who THINK they have full coverage. Remember, for most afflicted with sudden serious illness, denial means bankruptcy... and bankruptcy means homelessness.

If your coverage is employer supplied... what are your odds of losing your job during this recession/depression?


Think about it. Your "I'm alright, fuck everyone else!" attitude is a delusion...

You'd actually have better odds playing Russian Roulette.


This IS brainwashing. Read the Declaration of Human Rights; read the Geneva Convention.

...why do American prison inmates receive healthcare in prison free of charge?

Why do the poor bastards being raped; mutilated and tortured in Gitmo have free taxpayer-funded government-run socialised healthcare?

Don't you as a patriotic tax-paying American deserve the same rights that socialist commie Bush granted to dem' dere turr-orists?



The Luke

1) The reason Americans are "ripped off" by the insurance companies is because the government is for sale to the highest bidder, the lobbiest have the politicians in their pocket and get what they want. If the politicians actually cared what was good for America and not their personal wealth and power there would be no need to discuss healthcare reform. I always here this "your selfish" bullshit from the socialist healthcare proponents, you see I believe that is my responsiblilty to take care of myself and my family. What are my chances of getting laid off probably slim, but even if that is the case I have marketable skills. You see I went to college on my own dime, I work hard and continue to learn everyday. And as far as other people, it is their responsibility to take care of themselves as well, I don't expect anything free from the government, you see nothing is free, either someone else is paying for it or you have sacrifice a freedom.

2)Declaration of Human rights? Geneva conventions? What exactly does that have to do with socialized healthcare? The only document that applies in this situation is the US constitution and no where in there does it say health care is a right.

3) Where are you trying to go with this? Prison, personally I think the prision system should be like it used to be and prisions should be such a horrible place that once is enough, but liberal "morality" put an end to that.
The poor bastards at Gitmo? I don't consider terrorist poor bastards and as far as your allegations fo torture, rape....... you better have proof before you go spouting that bullshit about American soldiers. As far as I'm concerned these fuckers weren't wearing uniforms and were fighting US soldiers they are illegal combatants and should have been executed.

No I don't think I deserve anything for simply being an American, tax paying huh, well then should all those who don't pay taxes be excluded from the plan?

[The Luke]

Almost to a tee, other than a few cool guys, the first thing these guys always did was complain about the USA and tear down America.  Yet, they never could answer the question why they came here if Ireland was so much better and offered better opportunities. 

Is it an inferiority complex or are Irish people generally negative whiners who think they know more than everyone else?         

Excellent question!

Ireland has been going downhill since the Dark Ages... we might have been the capital of Europe then, but we became a backwater under British rule.

Ireland has 4 million people, but 10 million cows.

We have no gold; silver; iron; copper; aluminium; no mining; no heavy industry; oil or natural gas; no real tangible natural resources... we have farming, rain and nothing much else.

Add to this the fact that we're only just recovering (demographically) from a chronic mass famine (population 1840: 9 million... population 1850: 2ish million).


But despite being dealt this poor hand, we have a basic respect for our fellow man and managed to develop a pretty progressive society.

We have free schooling... from kindergarten through primary school; secondary school; university; masters; even PhD and sometimes post-grad too.

We have the 19th best healthcare system in the world... free and universal, even caps on drug costs ($100 max per month per household).


What most Irish (even most Europeans) notice about America is how chronically fucked up it is... how corrupt... how wasteful... but mostly just how dumb and deluded most Americans are.

If we had America, it would be a utopia pretty quick.



The Luke

[Soul Crusher]

Luke I live in Woodlawn.  There is the biggest concentration of Irish people in my neighborhood than almost anywhere else. 

Most of the Irish people in my hood are the salt of the earth and we actually have the safest neighborhood in the area, other than Friday and Sat. nights once the guys get their paychecks.  We have more bars on McLean Ave. than I can count! 


   

[Mons Venus]

...the Luke is under personal attack because he has seemingly won the argument.

Damn socialist, eurotrash asshole... with his facts and logic.



The Luke

 

[Kazan]

[Skip8282]

We have free schooling... from kindergarten through primary school; secondary school; university; masters; even PhD and sometimes post-grad too.

The Luke

If you're an example of socialized schooling beyond high school, I'll pass.  I think it's pretty clear from your posts that you're not very educated.

-You can rarely, if ever, offer any type of meaningful, coherent, logical argument.
-In most of your posts you invariably resort to either calling people idiotic, moronic, etc., or implying that they are.  Hardly a sign of education or maturity (I'm guessing you're about 16 or so?).
-You have no respect for opinions that differ from yours.  Again, hardly a sign of education.
-You're not bright enough to discern other posters countering your arguments versus you simply disagreeing with their point of view.
-We've already established you can't spell, don't know when to use an apostrophe, and that you think proper grammer means starting a sentence with "...".

[Soul Crusher]

If you're an example of socialized schooling beyond high school, I'll pass.  I think it's pretty clear from your posts that you're not very educated.

-You can rarely, if ever, offer any type of meaningful, coherent, logical argument.
-In most of your posts you invariably resort to either calling people idiotic, moronic, etc., or implying that they are.  Hardly a sign of education or maturity (I'm guessing you're about 16 or so?).
-You have no respect for opinions that differ from yours.  Again, hardly a sign of education.
-You're not bright enough to discern other posters countering your arguments versus you simply disagreeing with their point of view.
-We've already established you can't spell, don't know when to use an apostrophe, and that you think proper grammer means starting a sentence with "...".

BOOOOOMMMMMMM!!!!!!

[slaveboy1980]

If you're an example of socialized schooling beyond high school, I'll pass.  I think it's pretty clear from your posts that you're not very educated.

-You can rarely, if ever, offer any type of meaningful, coherent, logical argument.
-In most of your posts you invariably resort to either calling people idiotic, moronic, etc., or implying that they are.  Hardly a sign of education or maturity (I'm guessing you're about 16 or so?).
-You have no respect for opinions that differ from yours.  Again, hardly a sign of education.
-You're not bright enough to discern other posters countering your arguments versus you simply disagreeing with their point of view.
-We've already established you can't spell, don't know when to use an apostrophe, and that you think proper grammer means starting a sentence with "...".

 

[The Luke]

If you're an example of socialized schooling beyond high school, I'll pass.  I think it's pretty clear from your posts that you're not very educated.

-You can rarely, if ever, offer any type of meaningful, coherent, logical argument.
-In most of your posts you invariably resort to either calling people idiotic, moronic, etc., or implying that they are.  Hardly a sign of education or maturity (I'm guessing you're about 16 or so?).
-You have no respect for opinions that differ from yours.  Again, hardly a sign of education.
-You're not bright enough to discern other posters countering your arguments versus you simply disagreeing with their point of view.
-We've already established you can't spell, don't know when to use an apostrophe, and that you think proper grammer means starting a sentence with "...".

Yeah, yeah... and I look French too.

...what does any of this have to do with healthcare?

I've read attacks, I've read dissent, but I haven't read a cogent counter argument... just parroted propaganda.


The Luke

[Soul Crusher]

Yeah, yeah... and I look French too.

...what does any of this have to do with healthcare?

I've read attacks, I've read dissent, but I haven't read a cogent counter argument... just parroted propaganda.


The Luke

Your post is a perfect example of what Skip said of you and you dont even realize it. 

[The Luke]

Your post is a perfect example of what Skip said of you and you dont even realize it. 

..so you've just conceded the argument and turned to personal attacks too?


The Luke

[Soul Crusher]

..so you've just conceded the argument and turned to personal attacks too?


The Luke

Just read his post and what you yourself responded with.  You claimed that all you hear is "propaganda" and not arguments against your points. 

That was one of skips main points against you.  That being, you refuse to even accept the fact that people can have valid disagreements with your points of view.  It seems that if anyone ever disagrees with you that their view point is automatically classified by you as "propaganda", not a potentially valid argument to your view point.