truth: what if anything can raise your test levels besides.....

[Tom]

is there any product (natural herb; prohormone,etc.) that can  truly raise your test levels besides actual aas test?

also if it (a product) does raise your test levels can actually keep them up without raising the levels for a hour or two and then your back down to your normal test levels?

[tstmaniac]

Your posting on the wrong board but try tribulus

[Montague]

Diet may be your best bet as a "natural" to maintain fairly constant test levels in the healthy/higher ranges.

Think healthy fats and dark, leafy green vegetables.

[The ChemistV2]

is there any product (natural herb; prohormone,etc.) that can  truly raise your test levels besides actual aas test?

also if it (a product) does raise your test levels can actually keep them up without raising the levels for a hour or two and then your back down to your normal test levels?

I have gotten good results from stacking 6-oxo, Vitrex, Dhea, and Action Lab's liquid Avena sativa. I feel some definite libido increase and great pumps, and increased muscularity. 6-oxo is an anti-aromatase that lowers estrogens and raises testosterone. Vitrex has liquified concentrated forms of tribulus and eurycoma..which raises test by stimulating  leutinizing hormone. Dhea in large doses raises testosterone , but does so without supressing your own output. The Avena sativa causes a release of "Free" testosterone. 6-oxo is off the market but amazon.com sells a 6-oxo clone. This stack should raise your natural test levels pretty good and will not shut you down if you go off. This has enabled me, at 46 years old, to still produce youthful test levels (verified by hormone blood tests).

[tbombz]

I have gotten good results from stacking 6-oxo, Vitrex, Dhea, and Action Lab's liquid Avena sativa. I feel some definite libido increase and great pumps, and increased muscularity. 6-oxo is an anti-aromatase that lowers estrogens and raises testosterone. Vitrex has liquified concentrated forms of tribulus and eurycoma..which raises test by stimulating  leutinizing hormone. Dhea in large doses raises testosterone , but does so without supressing your own output. The Avena sativa causes a release of "Free" testosterone. 6-oxo is off the market but amazon.com sells a 6-oxo clone. This stack should raise your natural test levels pretty good and will not shut you down if you go off. This has enabled me, at 46 years old, to still produce youthful test levels (verified by hormone blood tests).

6oxo will boost test and lower estrogen, but theres no evidence that this will cause any changes in body composition.

tribulus anecdotally does increase libido, but there is no evidence that it increases LH or test.

DHEA has been shown to restore natural test levels in some men with sub normal test levels. but theres no evidence that it would ever increase test levels beyond normal, or provide any benefit to a healthy man with normal test levels.

avena sativa, while im not familiar with it, it seems it probably lowers the amount of sex hormone binding gobulin. (SHBG). wich would result in more unboudn test, "free test". this is possible, but there is no evidence to believe this would be beneficial either... as its quite possible that bound test can interact with androgen receptors just like unbound test can....and in fact if this is the case(which it likely is) then bound test would be superior to unbound test, as bound test is protected from metabolism and stays in circulation for much longer than unbound test(which is quickly and easily metabolised)

[MCWAY]

I have gotten good results from stacking 6-oxo, Vitrex, Dhea, and Action Lab's liquid Avena sativa. I feel some definite libido increase and great pumps, and increased muscularity. 6-oxo is an anti-aromatase that lowers estrogens and raises testosterone. Vitrex has liquified concentrated forms of tribulus and eurycoma..which raises test by stimulating  leutinizing hormone. Dhea in large doses raises testosterone , but does so without supressing your own output. The Avena sativa causes a release of "Free" testosterone. 6-oxo is off the market but amazon.com sells a 6-oxo clone. This stack should raise your natural test levels pretty good and will not shut you down if you go off. This has enabled me, at 46 years old, to still produce youthful test levels (verified by hormone blood tests).

Define "large doses", in regards to DHEA.

[The ChemistV2]

6oxo will boost test and lower estrogen, but theres no evidence that this will cause any changes in body composition.

tribulus anecdotally does increase libido, but there is no evidence that it increases LH or test.

DHEA has been shown to restore natural test levels in some men with sub normal test levels. but theres no evidence that it would ever increase test levels beyond normal, or provide any benefit to a healthy man with normal test levels.

avena sativa, while im not familiar with it, it seems it probably lowers the amount of sex hormone binding gobulin. (SHBG). wich would result in more unboudn test, "free test". this is possible, but there is no evidence to believe this would be beneficial either... as its quite possible that bound test can interact with androgen receptors just like unbound test can....and in fact if this is the case(which it likely is) then bound test would be superior to unbound test, as bound test is protected from metabolism and stays in circulation for much longer than unbound test(which is quickly and easily metabolised)

I'm not googling studies here. I'm just relaying personal experience including the fact that I have measured my hormone levels before and after. After training and supplementing for over 30 years, I know when something works for me. Does it mean it's going to work for everyone? I don't know..which is why I said I got results from it. First of all I have taken tribulous pills with zero results..but the Vitrex formula works..I even have to use it sparingly because without the 6-oxo added in I see some slight gyno forming from the aromatization. To answer Mcway, I use a dose of dhea about 50-75 mg, but in a liposomal sublingual formula. On regular dhea tabs of that dose, I got zero results. Poor absorbtion orally.

[MCWAY]

I'm not googling studies here. I'm just relaying personal experience including the fact that I have measured my hormone levels before and after. After training and supplementing for over 30 years, I know when something works for me. Does it mean it's going to work for everyone? I don't know..which is why I said I got results from it. First of all I have taken tribulous pills with zero results..but the Vitrex formula works..I even have to use it sparingly because without the 6-oxo added in I see some slight gyno forming from the aromatization. To answer Mcway, I use a dose of dhea about 50-75 mg, but in a liposomal sublingual formula. On regular dhea tabs of that dose, I got zero results. Poor absorbtion orally.

I can get the DHEA tablets far easier (Wal-Mart sells it for $4 and change). If you were to give an educated guess, how many milligrams of DHEA would equal the 50-75 mg you get in the sublingual formula?

I remember Bill Phillips in his 1997 Supplement Review book, recommending 200 mg per day, but saying that if you don't get any results with that dosage, you won't see results at any dose.

I usually get Natrol's DHEA, 60 tablets @ 50 mg each, for just over $5. The kind that Wal-Mart sells is Schiff DHEA tablets 60 tablets @ 25 mg each. Occasionally, Schiff offers 33% more per bottle, or 80 tabs. That's when I buy Schiff's product.

[The ChemistV2]

I can get the DHEA tablets far easier (Wal-Mart sells it for $4 and change). If you were to give an educated guess, how many milligrams of DHEA would equal the 50-75 mg you get in the sublingual formula?

I remember Bill Phillips in his 1997 Supplement Review book, recommending 200 mg per day, but saying that if you don't get any results with that dosage, you won't see results at any dose.

I usually get Natrol's DHEA, 60 tablets @ 50 mg each, for just over $5. The kind that Wal-Mart sells is Schiff DHEA tablets 60 tablets @ 25 mg each. Occasionally, Schiff offers 33% more per bottle, or 80 tabs. That's when I buy Schiff's product.

Honestly I couldn't tell you what the sublingual mgs would equal the tablets in efficacy. I will say this. DHEA is a hormone and most oral steroids that were produced like dianabol or winstrol have been altered at th C-17 position or some have been methylated. This increases oral absorbtion. No one does this to DHEA, so absorbtion is a huge problem. I took 100 mg a day of the tabs for several weeks and didn't notice anything at all. I tried the sublingual at 30 mg a day and after 3 weeks noticed a libido boost, bodyfat reduction, sense of well being, better pump. So, just from my experience the difference was night and day.

[MCWAY]

Honestly I couldn't tell you what the sublingual mgs would equal the tablets in efficacy. I will say this. DHEA is a hormone and most oral steroids that were produced like dianabol or winstrol have been altered at th C-17 position or some have been methylated. This increases oral absorbtion. No one does this to DHEA, so absorbtion is a huge problem. I took 100 mg a day of the tabs for several weeks and didn't notice anything at all. I tried the sublingual at 30 mg a day and after 3 weeks noticed a libido boost, bodyfat reduction, sense of well being, better pump. So, just from my experience the difference was night and day.

I've never seen sublingual DHEA. That's why I asked how many tabs it would take to equate the 30 mg of the sublingual stuff you use.

Normally, I take 200 mg per day. But over the last 2 weeks, I've tried using 500 mg per day (250 in the morning and 250 pre-workout).

I used androstendione 12 years ago and figures that, since andro converts to testoterone at about 6% and DHEA converts to andro (I don't know the conversion rate), I'd have to take a high amount of DHEA to get a decent kick out of it.

Quantifying poor absorption rate is what I was basically asking (i.e. 10%). If that were the case, 500 mg of DHEA tabs would give me the 50 mg of DHEA you get from the liquid.

[The ChemistV2]

I've never seen sublingual DHEA. That's why I asked how many tabs it would take to equate the 30 mg of the sublingual stuff you use.

Normally, I take 200 mg per day. But over the last 2 weeks, I've tried using 500 mg per day (250 in the morning and 250 pre-workout).

I used androstendione 12 years ago and figures that, since andro converts to testoterone at about 6% and DHEA converts to andro (I don't know the conversion rate), I'd have to take a high amount of DHEA to get a decent kick out of it.

The company Source natural makes a Liposomal sublingual spray dhea which is a good product. Any good results from 500 mg a day? That seems pretty high, so you must be getting some decent mg. absorbtion.

[MCWAY]

The company Source natural makes a Liposomal sublingual spray dhea which is a good product. Any good results from 500 mg a day? That seems pretty high, so you must be getting some decent mg. absorbtion.

I think so. My calories are fairly low, as I'm determined to get my waist down. As of two weeks ago, my bodyweight was 232 lbs @ 20% bodyfat (at a height of 5'10").

My goal is to either stay in the low 230s and get to 18% bodyfat or jump to 240 at 20% bodyfat, by Christmas.

I'm recovering pretty well, as my protein consumption is down. My daily gram intake is around the low 300s. Carbs are mid-to-high 200s.

I am also using Vitamin Shoppe's Python, which has Trib, Avena Sativa, Urtica Diodica, Saw Palmetto, and other ingredients.

[JasonH]

Watch some porn.

[andreisdaman]

Watch some porn.

agreed ..thats what I do every morning before work and it gives me a boost all day

[MM2K]

In my opinion, the best way to boost testosterone levels is to overfeed yourself after you have been on a good healthy maintenance calorie diet for a while, or better yet, after you have been dieting. But you can only do it for about 12 days or so, because then the hormone levels will start to decline because your body has adapted to what you are doing, so you have to diet or go back on a maintenance calorie diet for a couple of weeks or so to reprime those anabolic hormones.

[darksol]

Novadex XT by Gaspari,
Take 3 before bed,

[calfzilla]

Novadex XT by Gaspari,
Take 3 before bed,

Tried that once, actually not bad stuff.