Ravens

[UPINTHEMGUTS]

Christ i was talking about the dolphins and their fans

i didn't see the ravens game, but i'm hearing some of your own fans say your team got a gift today


http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=118&f=1666&t=6585087

E

I thought you were referring to me. Settle down, fella. Not every statement can be properly conveyed on a computer.

The Ravens got a HUGE gift. Ray Lewis stripped the ball from a Buffalo wide receiver in overtime. Some are suggesting that the whistle should have blown the play dead before the forced fumble occurred.

No pass rush on the QB, which allowed Buffalo to have a field day through the passing game. The Ravens probably should have lost this game but I'm happy to be 5-2 heading into the bye week.

[body88]

The four best teams in the AFC, period. Not in order.

Pats
Steelers
Ravens
Jets

[Dos Equis]

The four best teams in the AFC, period. Not in order.

Pats
Steelers
Ravens
Jets

I think it's the Jets in the AFC and then everyone else you mentioned.  I'd add the Titans to that group.

[UPINTHEMGUTS]

I think it's the Jets in the AFC and then everyone else you mentioned.  I'd add the Titans to that group.

I agree, defensively. The Titans defense is NASTY.....The average 4-6 sacks 1-2 Int's a week. I should know because I started them in fantasy against the Eagles.

They need a Qb who is worth a fuck before they can become a complete team. Collins is steady but way past his prime. He's strictly a game-managing QB.

[Dos Equis]

I agree, defensively. The Titans defense is NASTY.....The average 4-6 sacks 1-2 Int's a week. I should know because I started them in fantasy against the Eagles.

They need a Qb who is worth a fuck before they can become a complete team. Collins is steady but way past his prime. He's strictly a game-managing QB.

I wouldn't even call Collins a good game manager.  Look at how many INTs he has thrown in his career.  I've never liked him.  He has never been anything more than an average NFL QB. 

I'd take Vince Young any day of the week over Collins.  (Speaking of average NFL QBs.)   

[Option D]

I think it's the Jets in the AFC and then everyone else you mentioned.  I'd add the Titans to that group.

No.

[Option D]

PFT Power rankings


1.  New York Jets (No.1 last week; 5-1):  For now, the question is whether they're the best team in the nation.  Pretty soon, there could be an honest debate as to whether they're the best team in their own stadium. 

2.  Pittsburgh Steelers (No. 2; 5-1):  Plenty of people think the Steelers should be No. 1.  That group includes few Dolphins fans.

3.  New England Patriots (No. 3; 5-1):  The Pats tried to blow it against a Chargers team that hasn't quite figured out how to win football games, but in this craziest of crazy NFL seasons a win is a win and the Pats have won five of six.

4.  Tennessee Titans (No. 8; 5-2):  Coach Jeff Fisher finally has figured out his quarterbacks.  Kerry Collins plays well in the even years, and Vince Young plays well in the odd years.

5.  Indianapolis Colts (No. 5; 4-2):  The rash of injuries will give Peyton Manning a good idea of what his supporting cast will look like after he signs and new contract and the salary cap returns.

6.  New York Giants (No. 9; 5-2):  Losing to the Colts and Titans in consecutive weeks may have been the best thing that ever happened to this team.

7.  Baltimore Ravens (No. 4; 5-2):  The official rules of power rankings require a minimum drop of three spots when being pushed to overtime by the Bills

[body88]

I think it's the Jets in the AFC and then everyone else you mentioned.  I'd add the Titans to that group.

Not I.

I watch the Jet's play pretty much every weekend, and all the teams I mentioned can beat them.

The AFC is wide open, imo.

[CalvinH]

The AFC is wide open, imo.

Same with the NFC.

[body88]

I wouldn't even call Collins a good game manager.  Look at how many INTs he has thrown in his career.  I've never liked him.  He has never been anything more than an average NFL QB.  

I'd take Vince Young any day of the week over Collins.  (Speaking of average NFL QBs.)  

Collins is a game manager, imo.

Just because Young is a superior game manager compared to Collins, that does not mean that Collins is not an effective game manager in his own right. 2008 proves Collins can be a very effective as a game mananger, imo

Game manager:
2008 Tennessee NFL 16 242 415 58.3 2676 12 7 25 49 0
2005 Oakland NFL    15 302 565 53.5 3759 20 12 17 39 1
2000 NYG NFL 16 311 529 58.8 3610 22 13 41 65 1
2001 NYG NFL 16 327 568 57.6 3764 19 16 39 73 0
2002 NYG NFL 16 335 545 61.5 4073 19 14 44 -3  

[body88]

Pats 5-1 #1 offense in the NFL -- (points per game)

Steelers 5-1 #1 defense in the NFL -- (points allowed)

Jets 5-1 #2 Defense in the NFL -- (points allowed)

These three teams are interchangable as the best team in the AFC, imo.

The Ravens deserve an honerable mention, but they have not been as strong as the teams above.

[Option D]

A QB is either a
Chain mover (for the good) 1. Ben 2. Vick 3. Young

Flat out baller 1. Brady 2. Manning (p) and 3. Brees

Game Manager (wont take risks...wont force.. takes what defense gives them...not afraid to punt...Only go down field on a play action. Collins is in this category...

[body88]

A QB is either a
Chain mover (for the good) 1. Ben 2. Vick 3. Young

Flat out baller 1. Brady 2. Manning (p) and 3. Brees

Game Manager (wont take risks...wont force.. takes what defense gives them...not afraid to punt...Only go down field on a play action. Collins is in this category...

Truth.

[Dos Equis]

No.

   You disagree, but then post power rankings that say the Jets are the best team in football? 

[Dos Equis]

Not I.

I watch the Jet's play pretty much every weekend, and all the teams I mentioned can beat them.

The AFC is wide open, imo.

I don't watch them every week, but I've seen them a few times this year.  They're the best team I've seen so far.  If Sanchez continues to play well they will be tough to beat. 

If by wide open you mean any one of a handful of teams can win it, then I agree. 

[Dos Equis]

Collins is a game manager, imo.

Just because Young is a superior game manager compared to Collins, that does not mean that Collins is not an effective game manager in his own right. 2008 proves Collins can be a very effective as a game mananger, imo

Game manager:
2008 Tennessee NFL 16 242 415 58.3 2676 12 7 25 49 0
2005 Oakland NFL    15 302 565 53.5 3759 20 12 17 39 1
2000 NYG NFL 16 311 529 58.8 3610 22 13 41 65 1
2001 NYG NFL 16 327 568 57.6 3764 19 16 39 73 0
2002 NYG NFL 16 335 545 61.5 4073 19 14 44 -3  

The guy is average-to-bad for the overwhelming majority of his career.  He has 197 TDS and 190 INTs.  He's a career 55% passer.  Here is what he has done TD/INT-wise since 04

04:  21-20
05:  20-12
06:  1-6
07:  0-0
08:  12-7
09:  6-8
10:  5-3

That's 65 TDs and 55 INTs just since 04. 

A good game manager at QB by definition does not turn the ball over. 

[body88]

The guy is average-to-bad for the overwhelming majority of his career.  He has 197 TDS and 190 INTs.  He's a career 55% passer.  Here is what he has done TD/INT-wise since 04

04:  21-20
05:  20-12
06:  1-6
07:  0-0
08:  12-7
09:  6-8
10:  5-3

That's 65 TDs and 55 INTs just since 04. 

A good game manager at QB by definition does not turn the ball over. 

Who do you consider a good game manager?

[Dos Equis]

Who do you consider a good game manager?

Off the top of my head, I'd the best one is Roethlisberger.  Brady is good, but he's not really manager.  Sanchez. 

We're talking game managers, not the best QBs in the NFL.

[body88]

Off the top of my head, I'd the best one is Roethlisberger.  Brady is good, but he's not really manager.  Sanchez. 

We're talking game managers, not the best QBs in the NFL.

Brady is a hof player. Like you said, Brady and "game manager" don't really go in the same sentence.

Big Ben is an elite QB, not a game manager, imo.

Sanchez true, but if you don't like int's he threw 20 of those to his 12 td's last year.

To me a game manager is a guy who is average to slightly above average... A guy who can run plays and will not lose games. Collins is better than many options team are going with right now, imo. An example of a terrible game manager would be Sage Rosenfeld.

[Fury]

Pats are a step behind the Steelers and Jets in the AFC. Truth.

[body88]

Ya, you're right. It's not a huge step, though.

Here are the some truths:

-The Pats have the #1 offense in the NFL (ppg) and their schedule has been and is pretty brutal.
-They have shitload of offensive weapons, including two TE's that no one has had an answer for thus far.
-They have a HOF qb and coach
-Their young defense has a lot of potential and will continue to get better as the season wears on
- They have remained pretty healthy thus far
- Pro bowl guard Logan Mankins will return after week 10.

So yes, they are probably the third best team in the AFC, but when the going gets tough, they have the tools to win a head to head game with any of the teams mentioned in your post.

They won't win the sb this year, but so what...when your team is 5-1 during a "transition year", it don't get much better than that.

[Dos Equis]

Brady is a hof player. Like you said, Brady and "game manager" don't really go in the same sentence.

Big Ben is an elite QB, not a game manager, imo.

Sanchez true, but if you don't like int's he threw 20 of those to his 12 td's last year.

To me a game manager is a guy who is average to slightly above average... A guy who can run plays and will not lose games. Collins is better than many options team are going with right now, imo. An example of a terrible game manager would be Sage Rosenfeld.

I think we have different definitions.  Neither one is wrong IMO.  I don't think a game manager has to be average.  He's typically a player that isn't required to do too much.  That's why I mentioned Big Ben.  He's an elite QB, but he's not the focal point of the offense.  Going back to his first Super Bowl win, that season I think is a classic example of a game manager.    

Sanchez was a rookie last year, so he gets a pass on those stats.  He has improved tremendously this year.

I think other examples would be Brad Johnson and Trent Dilfer the years they won the Super Bowl.  

[Earl1972]

ben was a game manager during that season but he played like an elite qb in the playoff wins against the bengals, colts, and broncos

E

[Dos Equis]

ben was a game manager during that season but he played like an elite qb in the playoff wins against the bengals, colts, and broncos

E

I think a game manager can be an elite QB. 

[The Showstoppa]

I think a game manager can be an elite QB. 

For us old geezers who remember, that is essentially what Bradshaw was.   I'm sure Earl would agree.