Eminent Domain strikes again. Do you really own your property?

[Soul Crusher]

Civil Liberties
 
Jonathan Serrie
Atlanta, GA
Eminent Domain Strikes Sour Note in Tenn
February 23, 2010 - 9:30 AM | by: Jonathan Serrie
________________________ ________________________ ______________

Artist's Rendering of Music City Center

After four years in business, the Musicians Hall of Fame is closing its doors.

A judge ruled that Nashville's Metropolitan Development and Housing Agency could take possession of the property through eminent domain to build the Music City Center, a $585 million convention facility scheduled to open in 2013.

What remains in dispute is compensation for the private museum's owner, Joe Chambers.

"Pay us what it would cost us to replace what we've got where we are," Chambers said.

Metro has offered Chambers $4.8 million  -- the estimated fair market value of the property. But Chambers said he needs nearly twice that amount if his museum is to relocate within Nashville's bustling tourist district.

"This is a tourist driven venue," Chambers said. "You can't put it somewhere that's not where the tourists are."

Metro officials said they are sympathetic to Chambers, but also must be good stewards of the taxpayers' money.

"We have to make offers that are based on independent, fair, reasonable appraisals," said Metro Attorney Brian Jackson.

Project managers and Nashville government officials said they are considering a proposal to house the Musicians Hall of Fame inside the new convention center. Chambers said he has set to see any offers in writing, but remains cautiously optimistic.

"We've managed to reach agreement with the overwhelming majority of property owners that are going to be affected by this project," Jackson said. "So, I'm confident that at the end of the day we'll reach an agreement with Mr. Chambers as well."

________________________ ________________________ ____________

So much for ownership. 

[Soul Crusher]

disgusting.  Many other cases even worse than this.  Where they've first driven down the property value so they didn't have to pay as much.  I think someone posted it here a while back.

Look, if its a highway, a hospital, a military base or something like that, thats one thing. 

But thats not the case more and more. 

[SAMSON123]

Is this where STRAWMAN comes in to argue his case about ownership???..... If he remains quiet on this issue I can assume someone has CLAIMED his computer..lol

[Straw Man]

Yeah Fuck the Constitution

Who cares if it's the state (in this case Tennessee) that actually grants and enforces property rights.

Did any of you guys actually read the article?

Metro officials said they are sympathetic to Chambers, but also must be good stewards of the taxpayers' money.

"We have to make offers that are based on independent, fair, reasonable appraisals," said Metro Attorney Brian Jackson.

Project managers and Nashville government officials said they are considering a proposal to house the Musicians Hall of Fame inside the new convention center. Chambers said he has set to see any offers in writing, but remains cautiously optimistic.

"We've managed to reach agreement with the overwhelming majority of property owners that are going to be affected by this project," Jackson said. "So, I'm confident that at the end of the day we'll reach an agreement with Mr. Chambers as well."

[Soul Crusher]

Yeah Fuck the Constitution

Who cares if it's the state (in this case Tennessee) that actually grants and enforces property rights.

Did any of you guys actually read the article?

Metro officials said they are sympathetic to Chambers, but also must be good stewards of the taxpayers' money.

"We have to make offers that are based on independent, fair, reasonable appraisals," said Metro Attorney Brian Jackson.

Project managers and Nashville government officials said they are considering a proposal to house the Musicians Hall of Fame inside the new convention center. Chambers said he has set to see any offers in writing, but remains cautiously optimistic.

"We've managed to reach agreement with the overwhelming majority of property owners that are going to be affected by this project," Jackson said. "So, I'm confident that at the end of the day we'll reach an agreement with Mr. Chambers as well."

Yeah, when people have a fucking gun to their head cocked back with a .357 round in the chamber its sort of easy to make a deal with people.  Also consider the fact that these govt vultures know that most people dont have the resources to wage a battle to save their own property and know they can screw them over regardless.

BTW - this is not a bridge, road, military base, or other public need, its a politicians boondagle.

Wake the hell up fool. 

[240 is Back]

Like Peter Schiff recommends, I rent.

I dont know who will be moving into the $300k houses on my street that sit vacant today... but those that have been filled have been the kinda people that sure can't afford a 300k house.

they'll rent to anyone - I like being able to up and move if I decide to shoot it out with the dealers on my block one day.

[Soul Crusher]

Like Peter Schiff recommends, I rent.

I dont know who will be moving into the $300k houses on my street that sit vacant today... but those that have been filled have been the kinda people that sure can't afford a 300k house.

they'll rent to anyone - I like being able to up and move if I decide to shoot it out with the dealers on my block one day.

We are all renting regardless.  Right now renting makes a lot more sense on every level. 

[Straw Man]

Yeah, when people have a fucking gun to their head cocked back with a .357 round in the chamber its sort of easy to make a deal with people.  Also consider the fact that these govt vultures know that most people dont have the resources to wage a battle to save their own property and know they can screw them over regardless.

BTW - this is not a bridge, road, military base, or other public need, its a politicians boondagle.

Wake the hell up fool. 

yeah - it's a convention center that the city has decided will generate greater revenue which is something they probably need. 

that's they way it works and you know that when you decide to buy property

boo hoo

go cry in your tea bag

[Soul Crusher]

yeah - it's a convention center that the city has decided will generate greater revenue which is something they probably need. 

that's they way it works and you know that when you decide to buy property

boo hoo

go cry in your tea bag

Just like the good communist you are Straw. 

Revenue is not traditionally a reason to justify ED.  Its supposed to be a road, a bridge, a damn, etc., not demolishing peoples' dreams to get more tax revenue to fund the greedy slobs and pigs in govt. 

I hope that your city determined a whorehouse would be more profitable where your house is and offers you a few dollars for it and see how you like it.   

[MRDUMPLING]

yeah - it's a convention center that the city has decided will generate greater revenue which is something they probably need. 

that's they way it works and you know that when you decide to buy property

boo hoo

go cry in your tea bag

So you're okay with government taking private property just to generate more tax revenue?  You don't think that is wrong on any level? 

[Soul Crusher]

So you're okay with government taking private property just to generate more tax revenue?  You don't think that is wrong on any level? 

Straw - you realize you just toally lost the argument from the commie thread with your post no? 

How can you own your property if the government can decide that it wants it for use that it deems fit and give your compensation it deems fit while holding a gun to your head? 

So now that you lost No 1, do you want to revive that thread and accept a beatdown on items 2-10?

[Straw Man]

Just like the good communist you are Straw. 

Revenue is not traditionally a reason to justify ED.  Its supposed to be a road, a bridge, a damn, etc., not demolishing peoples' dreams to get more tax revenue to fund the greedy slobs and pigs in govt. 

I hope that your city determined a whorehouse would be more profitable where your house is and offers you a few dollars for it and see how you like it.   

isn't the purpose for "public use"

can't a convention center be considered "public use" given the tax revenue and other benefits to the community as whole?

I totally agree with you in cases where it's seized from one private owner and given to another (or a group like in the case of George Bush and his buddies)

If this were a communist country or even a socialist country we would just take the property and give the owner nothing

[MRDUMPLING]

isn't the purpose for "public use"

can't a convention center be considered "public use" given the tax revenue and other benefits to the community as whole?

I totally agree with you in cases where it's seized from one private owner and given to another (or a group like in the case of George Bush and his buddies)

If this were a communist country or even a socialist country we would just take the property and give the owner nothing

But even doing that takes away private property rights if the government can just take away to give to itself.  Hiding behind the taxpayers is just an excuse to shore up too much spending. 

It is taking away and giving to another...the government is telling that property owner that he has no right that "the people" should have more right to his property than him.

[Soul Crusher]

isn't the purpose for "public use"

can't a convention center be considered "public use" given the tax revenue and other benefits to the community as whole?

I totally agree with you in cases where it's seized from one private owner and given to another (or a group like in the case of George Bush and his buddies)

If this were a communist country or even a socialist country we would just take the property and give the owner nothing

So could a whorehouse no? 

[SAMSON123]

So you're okay with government taking private property just to generate more tax revenue?  You don't think that is wrong on any level? 

Straw is OK with too many WRONGS to be considered normal. Then again he must live in some trailer park or some shack in the woods to be concerned about the affairs of others. ED is being ABUSED to the highest levels. You can not legally take someones home or business just because you want to open up another business YOU HOPE will produce more tax revenue. If that is the case, then everyone in america is in danger of losing their home or business...

If a business is potentially profitable why not open it a block or two away from this business? or if it is going to be so profitable why not try and buy the person out before undermining them with this ED nonsense?

[Straw Man]

Drink some tea and calm down. 

This has been in the Constitution since 1791:

Amendment 5 - Trial and Punishment, Compensation for Takings. Ratified 12/15/1791.

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

[Soul Crusher]

Straw is OK with too many WRONGS to be considered normal. Then again he must live in some trailer park or some shack in the woods to be concerned about the affairs of others. ED is being ABUSED to the highest levels. You can not legally take someones home or business just because you want to open up another business YOU HOPE will produce more tax revenue. If that is the case, then everyone in america is in danger of losing their home or business...

If a business is potentially profitable why not open it a block or two away from this business? or if it is going to be so profitable why not try and buy the person out before undermining them with this ED nonsense?

Samson - just look what happened in the KELO matter in connecticut.  

The homeowners got fucked and the development never even went up.  So in the end, the homeowners lost their property, and the taxes never happened as never did the development.  

Straw - now that you lost No. 1, - should I revive the commie thread?  

[Soul Crusher]

Drink some tea and calm down. 

This has been in the Constitution since 1791:

Amendment 5 - Trial and Punishment, Compensation for Takings. Ratified 12/15/1791.

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

Public use was traditionally meant to mean roads, dams, bridges, etc, not private enterprise with the justification that tax revenue would increase.   

[Straw Man]

Samson - just look what happened in the KELO matter in connecticut.  

The homeowners got fucked and the development never even went up.  So in the end, the homeowners lost their property, and the taxes never happened as never did the development.  

Straw - now that you lost No. 1, - should I revive the commie thread?  

how many times have I told you I agree with you on Kelo?

The same type of thing happened with Bush and his cronies with Ranger stadium regarding lack of tax revenue.  

[Straw Man]

Public use was traditionally meant to mean roads, dams, bridges, etc, not private enterprise with the justification that tax revenue would increase.   

all I see are the words "public use"

It's 2010 and that can certainly be interpreted in many ways and apparently a convention center has been deemed public use

Personally, I'd be fine if they built a ten story abortion clinic and made it free to the public

[Soul Crusher]

all I see are the words "public use"

It's 2010 and that can certainly be interpreted in many ways and apparently a convention center has been deemed public use

Personally, I'd be fine if they built a ten story abortion clinic and made it free to the public

Good, lets start with your house and they can use the basement for Barney Franks' gay lovers prostitution ring.  That should generate $ $ $

The driveway can be used as an illegal alien work pick up site.  We can charge a user fee for that.

The second floor can be used a gay wedding chapel and we can charge a tax on that to fund the govt.

The third floor can be used for ACORN.

The fourth floor can be used for planned parenthood for abortions. 

The fifth floor can be rented out to Rainbow Coalition.


I think I am going to write that up and send it to your city planners to steal your home.  You would be happy with that no?       

[Straw Man]

Good, lets start with your house and they can use the basement for Barney Franks' gay lovers prostitution ring.  That should generate $ $ $

The driveway can be used as an illegal alien work pick up site.  We can charge a user fee for that.

The second floor can be used a gay wedding chapel and we can charge a tax on that to fund the govt.

The third floor can be used for ACORN.

The fourth floor can be used for planned parenthood for abortions. 

The fifth floor can be rented out to Rainbow Coalition.


I think I am going to write that up and send it to your city planners to steal your home.  You would be happy with that no?       

are you really an attorney?

all the attorneys I know (and I know a bunch) are all really calm and cool and speak in measured precise words

you're a jumble of emotions and seem to get frustrated and angry very quickly

hmmmm - I think I see why you're basically a glorified bill collector

[Soul Crusher]

I guess I struck a nerve? 

[Straw Man]

I guess I struck a nerve? 

I'm just making an observation of your emotional volatility

[Soul Crusher]

I'm just making an observation of your emotional volatility

That's fine considering we all observe your intellectual volatility - it sucks!