Author Topic: the next generation of MMA fighters  (Read 3375 times)

big L dawg

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the next generation of MMA fighters
« on: March 09, 2010, 03:11:27 PM »


By Don Kelley
(Aka: Blacksheep)

Evolution, every sport goes through it. Look at all of the sports we love, when Basketball started they used “Peach baskets” for nets nailed to a telegraph pole. Now they have shatter proof back boards and two hundred dollar sneakers. American Football, started on muddy cow fields with leather helmets and little to no padding, to wearing the latest in protective gear looking more like tanks than men. This is just the gear they use, the athletes them selves have also evolved. From average sized football players to 300 pound muscle bound monsters, and from average height basketball players with a vertical leap of a few feet, to an average height of almost seven feet that can dunk the ball from the free throw line. If you’re a follower of MMA, then you’re in for an exciting time the next few years. The average MMA fighter is about to make an evolutionary leap.

While MMA is nothing new to the world and has been around in one form or another for centuries (As covered so expertly in “Mixed Martial Arts: a Global Origin Across Time” mixed-martial-arts-a-global-origin-across-time-1-30-10-t54405.html) it is new to America. On November 12th 1993 at the McNichols Sports Arena in Denver, Colorado, America (and the world) was introduced to the UFC, and the sports fighting world has not been the same since.

In the early years of MMA, we were introduced to what was then the best fighters in the world. We were left in awe of their fighting powers and skills. Their submission games were like nothing we have ever seen before. Suddenly the top combat sport, Boxing seemed a little “Boring”. Regardless of what the naysayers may think or say, at the time the men of MMA were at the pinnacle of the fighting world. Today the pioneers and early legends of MMA are called “One Dimensional”, “One trick Ponies” etc. And by todays standards I suppose some of that is true. BUT, they were the best at that time and no one could beat them.

But as in all things, the sport of MMA started evolving from a bare knuckle no rules free for all, to a well respected sport with rules. After a few short years, the fighters themselves started to evolve. Most of these early fighters were passed up by younger, stronger more well rounded fighters. Men who entered the the sport with only one great skill such as wrestling or BJJ were soon being beat by men who had wrestling, BJJ, striking and a host of other skills.

For several years the sport of MMA seemed to be pretty even. On any given night no matter who was fighting for or defending the title, there was almost a 50/50 chance on who would win the match. But in recent years we have seen a few elite fighters rise above the rest. In my article “Too good for their own good?” too-good-for-their-own-good-1-17-10-t53456.html I talked about how Fedor, GSP and Anderson Silva have risen above all of their competition. How they have “Evolved” to the next level and passed their competition.

But even these great fighters did not start training in MMA until a few years before they actually competed. Yes they all had a form of Martial arts fighting under their belt, GSP had karate, Silva had BJJ, Fedor trained in Sambo, but the were all basically adults when they started training in MMA. As great as these men are in MMA, as much as they have evolved and forced the sport to grow and evolve with them, can you imagine what the “Next” generation of MMA fighters will be like?

Bruce Lee started Jeet Kune Do, a style “With out a style”. He took what worked and was best from several different fighting styles and made his own. MMA is basically the same thing. A bit of boxing, a little wrestling throw in some submissions and you have “MMA”. Today’s fighters normally come from one style of fighting (Wrestling, BJJ, Boxing etc) and add “Bits and Pieces” of other styles to round them out. This has been the way of MMA since the mid 90’s.

But the next generation, the one that will be in the cage in about 5 years, they will be the first “True” MMA fighters. They will not be a BJJ black belt or a wrestler with added skills. They will be the ones who have only trained in MMA “AS” a martial art/fighting style. Right now, there are countless young men and woman around the world who are training from ages as young as 12 in MMA gyms and even in some school systems. Winchester High School, just outside of Boston, is the first school in America that offers MMA as a sport along side football/basketball and all of the other sports we grew up with.

Can you imagine what these kids will be like when they hit the ring/cage? Just like Bruce Lee stripped all the unnecessary traditions from the martial arts,boxing and grappling and made his own unique style, so will the next generation of MMA fighters. They will not spend years learning ridged styles of sport Karate, useless pinning techniques of wrestling etc. They will only learn the best of what works from each style. They will spend YEARS learning these styles before ever stepping foot inside of a cage or ring.

When I first started reading MMA forums, there was a Sig floating around the web of the ultimate fighter. It had something like, the leg kick of Cro Cop, the heart of Big Nog, the head of Fedor etc etc. I can see the next generation of fighters being this very fighter. Young men, starting to learn MMA at the age of 10 to 12 in gyms and schools around the world. Watching tapes of all the great fighters, perfecting Cro Cop’s leg kick, Anderson Silva’s movements, Randy Couture’s nutrition on and on and on. They will be the very first generation to perfect the fighting style of MMA.

At the “Moment” GSP, Anderson and Fedor have evolved past all of their competition, they have evolved to the next level of fighting. When these “Kids” finally hit the cage or ring, they will make GSP, Anderson and Fedor look as obsolete as the three of them make the first generation of MMA fighters look.

It is no secret I am one of the “Older” members here. But when I was a child, the “Only” sport a young boy could play at a young age outside of school was “Little League baseball”. There was no “Pee Wee football” no summer basketball camps, no “traveling teams” heck even soccer was something only played in other country's. While every little boy knew how to play football, it was only learned in back yards and dusty fields. We were not even allowed to play “Organized” football until we were in the 9th grade.

Now? Unless you started playing football at the age of 8 or 9 you don’t even have a chance of making the high school team, let alone play college or professionally. Baseball, basketball, soccer, all the same thing. Parents trying to give their child the “Edge” later in life in sports are starting their children earlier and earlier. It is only natural MMA is following in the same footsteps.

As amazing as GSP, Anderson Silva and Fedor are now, can you even imagine what the “Next Generation” will be like? The athletic ability of GSP, the head movement of Anderson, the head and heart of Fedor, add to that the nutrition of Randy Couture starting at the age of 12 instead of 30. Now roll all of that into “One” fighter and have him train for years before he ever steps into a cage or ring. Multiply that fighter by a whole generation and what do you have? The evolution of the next generation of “MMA Fighters” !
DAWG

marty31672

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Re: the next generation of MMA fighters
« Reply #1 on: March 09, 2010, 10:30:11 PM »
my dream is to some day represent MY generation of fighters in the cage

RancherRanger

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Re: the next generation of MMA fighters
« Reply #2 on: March 10, 2010, 07:01:27 AM »
The article doesn't make sense.  Just like MMA gyms don't make sense IMO.  To me MMA training means jack of all trades, master of none.  I am not loyal to any martial art, but champions have a solid base whether it be BJJ, wrestling, Muay Thai, etc.

big L dawg

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Re: the next generation of MMA fighters
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2010, 09:30:57 AM »
The article doesn't make sense.  Just like MMA gyms don't make sense IMO.  To me MMA training means jack of all trades, master of none.  I am not loyal to any martial art, but champions have a solid base whether it be BJJ, wrestling, Muay Thai, etc.

thats the past..everything evolves overtime...And if you think what worked in the past will work in the future you are a dinosaur & like them will not survive....

DAWG

big L dawg

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Re: the next generation of MMA fighters
« Reply #4 on: March 10, 2010, 09:33:39 AM »
yea kids training like this in MMA gyms dont make sense ::)...when this generation hits the octagon in 10-12 years watch out...we havent seen nuthin yet...
DAWG

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Re: the next generation of MMA fighters
« Reply #5 on: March 10, 2010, 11:56:25 AM »
I understand the article. It makes sense in how he compared it to other american sports like football and basketball....(but I have a final opinion which I'll get to later about not having a solid foundation in an art form of some sort.) 

I'll use pop warner football as an example, throughout the years you hope to make it "pro"....didn't really need a foundation from any other sport since you will be "groomed" since pop warner to play american football. Yep, I get that....I agree.

But I see major discipline issues when you don't have a foundation in a "combat sport"

A wrestler or track and field guy can't round himself to play in the NFL. They'd get murdered. A wrestler, boxer, thai, bjj guy already have the discipline from a previous art learned .....they can round themselves into elite MMA fighters IMO.

this is where his article takes a twist to how they MMA gyms will actually need to work. Those kids will have to win tournaments in grappling like NAGA, possibly earn a black belt..etc something...you can't just teach every kid mma. 90% of the class will be paying fee's not learning crap, have no discipline yet call themselves MMA amateurs.

again I see discipline issues. Look at boxing..you have 40 year old guys beating up 20 year old that are supposed to be taking the torch nowadays. They want the fame and the name but don't want to put in the pain.

Back in the day those guys fought 200+ amateur matches, dominated olympics, had pride, and fought their way to the top. The young guys now barely fight 50 amateur fights, lose in the olympics, still get signed by hbo or some promotion...fight for the championship belt after like 10 fights... then get smashed when they run into an old school guy with discipline. 
 

big L dawg

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Re: the next generation of MMA fighters
« Reply #6 on: March 10, 2010, 12:34:27 PM »
I understand the article. It makes sense in how he compared it to other american sports like football and basketball....(but I have a final opinion which I'll get to later about not having a solid foundation in an art form of some sort.) 

I'll use pop warner football as an example, throughout the years you hope to make it "pro"....didn't really need a foundation from any other sport since you will be "groomed" since pop warner to play american football. Yep, I get that....I agree.

But I see major discipline issues when you don't have a foundation in a "combat sport"

A wrestler or track and field guy can't round himself to play in the NFL. They'd get murdered. A wrestler, boxer, thai, bjj guy already have the discipline from a previous art learned .....they can round themselves into elite MMA fighters IMO.

this is where his article takes a twist to how they MMA gyms will actually need to work. Those kids will have to win tournaments in grappling like NAGA, possibly earn a black belt..etc something...you can't just teach every kid mma. 90% of the class will be paying fee's not learning crap, have no discipline yet call themselves MMA amateurs.

again I see discipline issues. Look at boxing..you have 40 year old guys beating up 20 year old that are supposed to be taking the torch nowadays. They want the fame and the name but don't want to put in the pain.

Back in the day those guys fought 200+ amateur matches, dominated olympics, had pride, and fought their way to the top. The young guys now barely fight 50 amateur fights, lose in the olympics, still get signed by hbo or some promotion...fight for the championship belt after like 10 fights... then get smashed when they run into an old school guy with discipline. 
 

what do you think about the above vid?...I do agree about having a base/foundation in a specific art...It does show those kids compete in wrestling....But...If you don't think the athletes that come along in MMA in 10 years won't be far superior to the ones we are watching today I think your smokin somthin....Hell look no further than the guys that used to dominate in the early years compaired to todays fighters....not even close...and thats how I see it playing out again 10-12 years from now when you got young guns coming up that have been training there entire lives just to compete in MMA...
DAWG

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Re: the next generation of MMA fighters
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2010, 01:17:03 PM »
You've been harping this "evolution" thing for months and it sounds dumber and dumber every time you post. Whoever is going to dominate in the next decade is still going to be incredibly gifted/skilled at one specific thing. You aren't going to have "well-rounded" fighters who came up training a little bit of everything. Those guys don't make it work now and they won't make it work down the road.

Look at the top fighters now. They're good at almost everything but every guy has a certain strength that his fighting style plays to, be it striking, grappling, etc. Being OK at everything and great at nothing will not work.

big L dawg

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Re: the next generation of MMA fighters
« Reply #8 on: March 10, 2010, 01:53:38 PM »
You've been harping this "evolution" thing for months and it sounds dumber and dumber every time you post. Whoever is going to dominate in the next decade is still going to be incredibly gifted/skilled at one specific thing. You aren't going to have "well-rounded" fighters who came up training a little bit of everything. Those guys don't make it work now and they won't make it work down the road.

Look at the top fighters now. They're good at almost everything but every guy has a certain strength that his fighting style plays to, be it striking, grappling, etc. Being OK at everything and great at nothing will not work.

you must have me confused with someone else I havent been harping on shit the last couple months....hell look at my post history...I havent even posted in over a month untill 2 days ago...no need to apologize I already know your sorry... :)
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Re: the next generation of MMA fighters
« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2010, 02:30:59 PM »
what do you think about the above vid?...I do agree about having a base/foundation in a specific art...It does show those kids compete in wrestling....But...If you don't think the athletes that come along in MMA in 10 years won't be far superior to the ones we are watching today I think your smokin somthin....Hell look no further than the guys that used to dominate in the early years compaired to todays fighters....not even close...and thats how I see it playing out again 10-12 years from now when you got young guns coming up that have been training there entire lives just to compete in MMA...

Far superior in what aspect w/o the use of PEDS?

You'll have a handful of guys (just like any other sport) that takes over the reigns, but to think there will be some next level of superior skill set vs the current MMA skill set you are the one smoking.

There won't be a leap like that pre UFC cave man style vs current MMA ever again in MMA. All you can do is force rule changes and adjust around it's current format. Just like the NFL, NBA..etc. The athletes will only get stronger, faster...etc....it's still football and it's still basketball.....they already went through their "leap" to their current format.

Same with boxing....they had their leap from old joe johnson style days to current...everything after that is just "bigger or stronger or faster or all three" ...what changed? RULES....no more 15rds....more weight classes..etc.

As far as that video...means nothing. Posting a video of a kid doing something you showed him as he grew up means nothing. I could show you tapes of when I was in pop warner and I was dominating the other kids and ran like walter payton....means nothing..Everybody has a tape. When/if the kid makes it....we'll see it again...the majority tapes aren't even seen though..trust me.  

My point is beyond a video tape. I'm not knocking the idea of MMA gyms, so let's get that clear. I'm for combat sports.

My thing is i'm around this sh*t almost daily, and I can tell you the "I want to join a class to say I'm learning MMA / call myself a fighter" crowd is 10X's larger than the "I need to put 100% into everything to be the best I can be" crowd when it comes to MMA especially b/c it's the cool thing to be.

hell....my wife just had a class mate from a couple years back find her on facebook, they chatted and guess what he just randomly threw out in conversation "I'm learning MMA now".......I just shook my head, she laughed because she knows he is not the type and he's just doing that sh*t b/c it's cool and he likes watching it on tv only later to find out (after I told her when he's in the area we can spar, I want to learn some new stuff..etc,etc)...his tone changes.....he's one of the types I'm talking about.....joined some class and has no discipline and no intentions to do anything with the training that he's half assing when he actually shows up.

that is the new evolution right there. 90% will be like him unless they are in a true MMA academy with the real deal guys that will beat them and see if they come back...if they do..they'll get it...and i'm talking about teens to adults here. Let alone a kid.

Kids like to have fun....you have to be serious when mastering anything. they'll be one serious kid and 30 that could care less...that's how it works...so there is the evolution

 






big L dawg

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Re: the next generation of MMA fighters
« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2010, 03:44:33 PM »
Far superior in what aspect w/o the use of PEDS?

You'll have a handful of guys (just like any other sport) that takes over the reigns, but to think there will be some next level of superior skill set vs the current MMA skill set you are the one smoking.

There won't be a leap like that pre UFC cave man style vs current MMA ever again in MMA. All you can do is force rule changes and adjust around it's current format. Just like the NFL, NBA..etc. The athletes will only get stronger, faster...etc....it's still football and it's still basketball.....they already went through their "leap" to their current format.

Same with boxing....they had their leap from old joe johnson style days to current...everything after that is just "bigger or stronger or faster or all three" ...what changed? RULES....no more 15rds....more weight classes..etc.

As far as that video...means nothing. Posting a video of a kid doing something you showed him as he grew up means nothing. I could show you tapes of when I was in pop warner and I was dominating the other kids and ran like walter payton....means nothing..Everybody has a tape. When/if the kid makes it....we'll see it again...the majority tapes aren't even seen though..trust me.  

My point is beyond a video tape. I'm not knocking the idea of MMA gyms, so let's get that clear. I'm for combat sports.

My thing is i'm around this sh*t almost daily, and I can tell you the "I want to join a class to say I'm learning MMA / call myself a fighter" crowd is 10X's larger than the "I need to put 100% into everything to be the best I can be" crowd when it comes to MMA especially b/c it's the cool thing to be.

hell....my wife just had a class mate from a couple years back find her on facebook, they chatted and guess what he just randomly threw out in conversation "I'm learning MMA now".......I just shook my head, she laughed because she knows he is not the type and he's just doing that sh*t b/c it's cool and he likes watching it on tv only later to find out (after I told her when he's in the area we can spar, I want to learn some new stuff..etc,etc)...his tone changes.....he's one of the types I'm talking about.....joined some

 







I know exactly the type of guy your talking about...And I agree that there are alot of those types out there...Were I disagree Is that the guys you are referring to will never see the light of day in a major org like the UFC...The guys you are referring to will be chewed up and spit out in small local fights or in the gym before they ever test the waters in real combat...

Yea...90% of guys that start training will never be elite fighters.but those aren't the people I'm referring to in the first place...So yea guys that compete in MMA on the level of UFC are in the top 10% of fighters in the world...What I'm saying is I believe the fighters currently dominating today(the top 10%)will not be as good as the top 10% ten years from now...Just as the fighters today are better than the fighters from 10 years ago...The Matt hughes/Royce Gracie fight is a good example of the natural progression...Will the jump be as dramatic?..maybe...maybe not...but it will be a very noticeable jump none the less...

And to address your earlier comment of 40 year old boxers beating up the young guys that are supposed to be taking the torch...That has more to do with boxing being a dieing sport...All the naturally gifted athletes are choosing to compete in different sports these days...when I was growing up (1980's)there was a boxing gym in my area that actually had to turn people away because there were so many people training that it was against fire code and people weren't getting enough one on one training...That gym just went under a few years ago and when they did they had 6 boxers training there compared to hundreds 20 years earlier....The opposite is happening in MMA which means you have a larger pool of people to find the true talent out of...

I think me & you agree more than not...I just feel the watered down weekend warrior "cage fighters"...The ones that are just in it because it's popular and cool to say I'm a fighter...I believe those guysare a dime a dozen and have no Bering on were MMA is heading..Nor will those types have any effect on the evolution of the fight game...

10-12 years from now the competition will not only be bigger,stronger,faster...But be better trained,more experienced,And more naturally gifted athletes...Right now there is only one BJ Penn,only one GSP,only one Anderson Silva...As the sport & fighters progress and the skill level and compition get stronger the average fighters will have the skill level of the pre mentioned fighters while the elite champions will be
better than we have ever seen....that is/will be the natural evolution of the sport...
DAWG

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Re: the next generation of MMA fighters
« Reply #11 on: March 11, 2010, 01:20:12 PM »
I know exactly the type of guy your talking about...And I agree that there are alot of those types out there...Were I disagree Is that the guys you are referring to will never see the light of day in a major org like the UFC...The guys you are referring to will be chewed up and spit out in small local fights or in the gym before they ever test the waters in real combat...

Yea...90% of guys that start training will never be elite fighters.but those aren't the people I'm referring to in the first place...So yea guys that compete in MMA on the level of UFC are in the top 10% of fighters in the world...What I'm saying is I believe the fighters currently dominating today(the top 10%)will not be as good as the top 10% ten years from now...Just as the fighters today are better than the fighters from 10 years ago...The Matt hughes/Royce Gracie fight is a good example of the natural progression...Will the jump be as dramatic?..maybe...maybe not...but it will be a very noticeable jump none the less...

And to address your earlier comment of 40 year old boxers beating up the young guys that are supposed to be taking the torch...That has more to do with boxing being a dieing sport...All the naturally gifted athletes are choosing to compete in different sports these days...when I was growing up (1980's)there was a boxing gym in my area that actually had to turn people away because there were so many people training that it was against fire code and people weren't getting enough one on one training...That gym just went under a few years ago and when they did they had 6 boxers training there compared to hundreds 20 years earlier....The opposite is happening in MMA which means you have a larger pool of people to find the true talent out of...

I think me & you agree more than not...I just feel the watered down weekend warrior "cage fighters"...The ones that are just in it because it's popular and cool to say I'm a fighter...I believe those guysare a dime a dozen and have no Bering on were MMA is heading..Nor will those types have any effect on the evolution of the fight game...

10-12 years from now the competition will not only be bigger,stronger,faster...But be better trained,more experienced,And more naturally gifted athletes...Right now there is only one BJ Penn,only one GSP,only one Anderson Silva...As the sport & fighters progress and the skill level and compition get stronger the average fighters will have the skill level of the pre mentioned fighters while the elite champions will be
better than we have ever seen....that is/will be the natural evolution of the sport...

yes, on the majority we agree. I guess on the latter that we disagree on, time will tell.