Nancy Pelosi: Health care was "hijacked by Health Insurance Companies"

[Soul Crusher]

I travel constantly and while people may dislike the extra security and shit... I can not say they are doing a bad job.

I can't say the CIA or NSA or FBI has done a poor job either... I feel like they're all doing an adequate job and while 9-11 did occur... You can't stop every lunatic on the planet.

Tell that to Randy Weaver and his wife. 

[tu_holmes]

You're going to bring up the Ruby Ridge incident? Really? I mean, we're talking about 1 out of thousands of operations the authorized by the DOJ.

Are you forgetting the fact that really, he was a criminal... supplying illegal guns and what not? Involved in white supremacist groups and the like?

If he had done his illegal firearms deals today, he'd be a terrorist and thrown under a hole.

[Soul Crusher]

You're going to bring up the Ruby Ridge incident? Really? I mean, we're talking about 1 out of thousands of operations the authorized by the DOJ.

Are you forgetting the fact that really, he was a criminal... supplying illegal guns and what not? Involved in white supremacist groups and the like?

If he had done his illegal firearms deals today, he'd be a terrorist and thrown under a hole.

That was but one example, there are countless others if you want me to list them. 

[tu_holmes]

I'm sure you can... like I said... thousands of DOJ approved operations occur constantly... The ones you will mention are but a few in the thousands.

Sorry man, but the assertion that the government is just completely wrong and that all pieces are just broken doesn't make sense.

Are you now saying that federal law enforcement officials consistently do a poor job?

[Soul Crusher]

I'm sure you can... like I said... thousands of DOJ approved operations occur constantly... The ones you will mention are but a few in the thousands.

Sorry man, but the assertion that the government is just completely wrong and that all pieces are just broken doesn't make sense.

Are you now saying that federal law enforcement officials consistently do a poor job?

I didnt say all, I said most.  and those that do "work" usually do so at a massive cost to the taxpayer far exceeding the cost of what the private sector could do.  . 

[tu_holmes]

The cost is the overhead and bureaucracy... The easy and accurate solution to the government expense problem is simple.

Make people responsible for their jobs or they get fired... Period.

The problem is that people are allowed to perform poorly and it's impossible to fire them.

You fix that issue and government will not cost more than private sector.

[Soul Crusher]

The cost is the overhead and bureaucracy... The easy and accurate solution to the government expense problem is simple.

Make people responsible for their jobs or they get fired... Period.

The problem is that people are allowed to perform poorly and it's impossible to fire them.

You fix that issue and government will not cost more than private sector.

no kidding but I am not holding my breath. 

[OzmO]

Nancy Pelosi: Health care was 'hijacked'
Politico ^

Posted on Thursday, March 11, 2010 1:16:39 PM by Sub-Driver

Nancy Pelosi: Health care was 'hijacked'

By: Andy Barr March 11, 2010 12:02 PM EST

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi concedes that Democrats allowed the health care reform debate to get “hijacked” by insurance companies and other interests set on killing the bill.

Pelosi, in the second part of an interview with PBS’s Charlie Rose that aired Wednesday, said that early Democratic messaging attempts were plagued by the fact that the House and Senate had yet to come to any agreement about what would be in the bill.

“When you don't (have) a bill yet, anyone can characterize it any way you want,” the California Democrat said. “I think that while there's some well-intentioned people who have concerns about budget and this and that, a lot of that sentiment was hijacked by a concerted effort on the part of the insurance companies and their supporters to make sure we don't a bill.”

“They could characterize it any way they wanted,” she added. “They could focus the debate.”

Pelosi pointed specifically to the focus on a public option as a tactic health care reform opponents used to damage the bill.

“If you are an insurance company, you want to take down public option, right? You want to get rid of that. But as you do it, you want to confuse the issue on health care reform,” Pelosi explained. “So as long as people are talking about this — the public option — they're not talking about what is in the bill for the American people.”


(Excerpt) Read more at politico.com ...

________________________ ________________________ ______________________

This nasty fucking bitch needs to go. 

Does she even realize that most of know that she and MAObama are the ones FORCING us to buy insurance from these same companies she and bammer attack daily? 

I think this may go don't as one of the greatest BOHICA's in our recent history. 

[Soul Crusher]

Ozmo - I am at a loss at how Obama Pelosi and the liberals and Democrats claiming the insurance companies are out to kill us cant see how insane and ridiculous it appears when it is Obama/Reid/Pelosi forcing an individual mandate to purchase insurance from these very same companies under threat of fines and jail? 

How anyone cannot see the gross contradiction in this is beyond me. 

[drkaje]

Will insurance companies be able to close down under their model?

[OzmO]

Ozmo - I am at a loss at how Obama Pelosi and the liberals and Democrats claiming the insurance companies are out to kill us cant see how insane and ridiculous it appears when it is Obama/Reid/Pelosi forcing an individual mandate to purchase insurance from these very same companies under threat of fines and jail? 

How anyone cannot see the gross contradiction in this is beyond me. 

Because not too many people (including me) have taken the time to really examine it.  Obama has to pass something or he'll surely lose the next election.

So I will have to buy insurance from these companies or i get fined?

[drkaje]

Because not too many people (including me) have taken the time to really examine it.  Obama has to pass something or he'll surely lose the next election.

So I will have to buy insurance from these companies or i get fined?

Do you believe private companies can be mandated (legally) to administer a government run healthcare plan?

[OzmO]

Do you believe private companies can be mandated (legally) to administer a government run healthcare plan?

Are they already with Medicare?

[drkaje]

Are they already with Medicare?

Secondary insurance isn't a good example. They only pay a percentage of a percentage.. after co-pay, until the patient's yearly deductible has been met. Unless you have a very busy practice it wouldn't even be worth billing them except for complying with the laws because getting a clean form through without paying a billing service or relatively expensive software is pretty time consuming.

I'm specifically wondering if insurance companies can do it. Unless you're talking about automatic checks the govt is pretty inept at paying claims in a timely manner. My first year in practice physicians were complaining that TriCare was 2+ years behind in payments and should be avoided like the plague.

My hope is that whatever gets passed is affordable, workable and sustainable. We really don't need a class war or the middle class to get hammered into submission. We definitely don't need 40+ million people to be insured one day and have nothing whatsoever the next.

[Dos Equis]

I travel constantly and while people may dislike the extra security and shit... I can not say they are doing a bad job.

I can't say the CIA or NSA or FBI has done a poor job either... I feel like they're all doing an adequate job and while 9-11 did occur... You can't stop every lunatic on the planet.

I travel quite a bit too, and I think they do a terrible job.  Nice people, but I think anytime someone wants to sneak something on a plane, they can probably do it.  Meanwhile, law abiding people like me have to darn near strip going through security. 

[240 is Back]

randy weaver?

he sold illegally modified shotguns... then started a gunfight with the feds, with his own kids in the middle of it.

poor example of a 'victim' here.  Yes, the ATF were some major a-holes in the 90s and WACO stinks... but he wasn't exactly an angel.

[Dos Equis]

randy weaver?

he sold illegally modified shotguns... then started a gunfight with the feds, with his own kids in the middle of it.

poor example of a 'victim' here.  Yes, the ATF were some major a-holes in the 90s and WACO stinks... but he wasn't exactly an angel.

There is that version, then there is what actually happened, after the feds killed his family:

Weaver was charged with multiple crimes relating to the Ruby Ridge incident, a total of ten counts including the original firearms charges and murder. Attorney Gerry Spence handled Weaver's defense, and argued successfully that Weaver's actions were justifiable as self-defense. The judge dismissed two counts after hearing prosecution witness testimony. The jury acquitted Weaver of all remaining charges except two, one of which the judge set aside. Weaver was found guilty of one count, failure to appear, for which Weaver was fined $10,000 and sentenced to 18 months in prison. The reason he failed to appear was due to the fact that he was officially told the court case was on the 20th March when in fact it was on the 20th February. He was credited with time served plus an additional three months, and was then released. Kevin Harris was acquitted of all criminal charges.[16]

In August 1995, the federal government avoided trial on a civil lawsuit filed by the Weavers, by awarding the three surviving daughters $1,000,000 each and Randy Weaver $100,000 over the deaths of Sammy and Vicki Weaver. The attorney for Kevin Harris pressed Harris' civil suit for damages, although federal officials vowed they would never pay someone who had killed a U.S. Marshal (Harris had been acquitted by a jury trial on grounds of self-defense). In September 2000 after persistent appeals, Harris was awarded a $380,000 settlement from the government.[17]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randy_Weaver#Aftermath_of_the_Ruby_Ridge_incident

[240 is Back]

you didn't mention the sawed-off shotguns he sold.

Not surprising a birther like yourself would leave out things like details

[Dos Equis]

Read the excerpt.  The feds killed his wife and one of his kids.  He was acquitted in a criminal trial.  He sued the government and they paid his surviving family members millions. 

Not that the facts matter to you. 

[drkaje]

Read the excerpt.  The feds killed his wife and one of his kids.  He was acquitted in a criminal trial.  He sued the government and they paid his surviving family members millions. 

Not that the facts matter to you. 

Why is it only considered collateral damage when we drop bombs in distant lands?

[Soul Crusher]

Why is it only considered collateral damage when we drop bombs in distant lands?

Just one of those things I guess.

However, i like how Beach utterly destroyed 240 above.  Hysterical. 

[Soul Crusher]

PELOSI = OWNED

[tu_holmes]

Even Weaver does not deny he sold illegal shotguns.

That's a well documented fact.

The entire gun battle however, and how it made the government "look", especially considering how the death toll ended up, is why there was no criminal trial.

I don't believe a trial even occurred after that mess.

[Skip8282]

Even Weaver does not deny he sold illegal shotguns.

That's a well documented fact.

Maybe it's not well documented because you don't have it right.  He's never denied selling shotguns.  He has repeatedly denied selling illegal shotguns.  He claimed the gov't shortened the barrels after he sold them.

[Dos Equis]

Even Weaver does not deny he sold illegal shotguns.

That's a well documented fact.

The entire gun battle however, and how it made the government "look", especially considering how the death toll ended up, is why there was no criminal trial.

I don't believe a trial even occurred after that mess.

?

Weaver was charged with multiple crimes relating to the Ruby Ridge incident, a total of ten counts including the original firearms charges and murder. Attorney Gerry Spence handled Weaver's defense, and argued successfully that Weaver's actions were justifiable as self-defense. The judge dismissed two counts after hearing prosecution witness testimony. The jury acquitted Weaver of all remaining charges except two, one of which the judge set aside. Weaver was found guilty of one count, failure to appear, for which Weaver was fined $10,000 and sentenced to 18 months in prison. The reason he failed to appear was due to the fact that he was officially told the court case was on the 20th March when in fact it was on the 20th February. He was credited with time served plus an additional three months, and was then released. Kevin Harris was acquitted of all criminal charges.[16]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randy_Weaver#Aftermath_of_the_Ruby_Ridge_incident

/quote]