Why compete if it means losing $$$?

[Red Hook]

I truly don't understand the rational behind incurring the cost of buying specialized food, "supplements", living a rigid lifestyle and travel cost while fully knowing that you won't place in the money at B or C level show like the Australia Pro.  Other than the top guys the other guys are really bad at business.  I feel that people like Frank McGirth and Evan Centopani(sp?) are using or have used the system to their benefit! get paid for not competing.

Top 6

1. Kai Greene
2. Dexter Jackson
3. Roelly Winklaar  == $2K USD
---------------------------------------
4. Mike Kefalianos
5. Melvin Anthony
6. Grigori Atoyan



Honestly, how are these guys surviving being such bad business men?

[gcb]

gay 4 pay - escort work? 

[The Showstoppa]

Livin' the dream.

[BB]

A lot of these guys crave attention. Lots of validation type issues in bodybuilding and to a lesser extent, the other power sports. Also it's hard to put a dollar amount on how much extra traffic/cash a bodybuilder gets from competing in these shows in the from of supplement deals, pt clients, schmoing/gay for pay, website viewers, etc....

With the backend, maybe these guys eek out a decent life, beats bouncing....

[Chick]

Ronnie didn't make a dime either in his first few years as a pro...we know how that turned out.

Neither did Toney Freeman, or many other pro's who have gone on to win shows...climbing the ladder has to start with at least having a ladder to climb. No competitions means no experience, no opportunity, and little to no exposure.

The "business of BB" is comprised of many avenues, only ONE of which is actually competing. The pro's you mention all have some means of supporting themselves, the monetary loss they may take in getting ready for a show is an investment as far as they are concerned...

That said...at SOME point, you have to assess whether that investment is going to have a return...

No one in the history of professional bodybuilding ever got into it for the money...

[Vince G, CSN MFT]

Ronnie didn't make a dime either in his first few years as a pro...we know how that turned out.

Neither did Toney Freeman, or many other pro's who have gone on to win shows...climbing the ladder has to start with at least having a ladder to climb. No competitions means no experience, no opportunity, and little to no exposure.

The "business of BB" is comprised of many avenues, only ONE of which is actually competing. The pro's you mention all have some means of supporting themselves, the monetary loss they may take in getting ready for a show is an investment as far as they are concerned...

That said...at SOME point, you have to assess whether that investment is going to have a return...

No one in the history of professional bodybuilding ever got into it for the money...

Lets not forget that some supplement company contracts require an athlete to compete a certain amount of times a year and usually their expenses are paid for. 

I don't think the problem is prize money, the problem is with not having any major sponsors.  While we have companies like Muscletech, we don't have Nike or Accenture or Goldman Sach etc.  If bodybuilding attracted the major companies then the sport would grow very rapidly. 

[Chick]

Lets not forget that some supplement company contracts require an athlete to compete a certain amount of times a year and usually their expenses are paid for. 

I don't think the problem is prize money, the problem is with not having any major sponsors.  While we have companies like Muscletech, we don't have Nike or Accenture or Goldman Sach etc.  If bodybuilding attracted the major companies then the sport would grow very rapidly. 

I can assure you, the only expenses paid for by a supp company, are supps and possibly travel/ hotel...

[Vince G, CSN MFT]

I can assure you, the only expenses paid for by a supp company, are supps and possibly travel/ hotel...

That's pretty sad.  If they are requiring them to compete a certain number of times a year then it would be a serious strain on finances. 

[The Showstoppa]

I can assure you, the only expenses paid for by a supp company, are supps and possibly travel/ hotel...

Bob, do they supply you with booth chicks?

[Chick]

That's pretty sad.  If they are requiring them to compete a certain number of times a year then it would be a serious strain on finances. 

Thats why they are hired in the first place...and paid

[jaejonna]

Maybe if the BBs had someone who looks out for their interest instead of a puppet wielded by the strings held by few ..

[Sir Humphrey]

I can assure you, the only expenses paid for by a supp company, are supps and possibly travel/ hotel...

What about Future Mr O The Barely Legal Freak Trey Phenom Brewer's 6-figure contract with BSN?  

[Chick]

Maybe if the BBs had someone who looks out for their interest instead of a puppet wielded by the strings held by few ..

Why do you insist on making retarded comments on matters you know nothing about?

Go back to making Jon Gosselin look-a-like appearances loser...

[#1 Klaus fan]

Ronnie didn't make a dime either in his first few years as a pro...we know how that turned out.

Neither did Toney Freeman, or many other pro's who have gone on to win shows...climbing the ladder has to start with at least having a ladder to climb. No competitions means no experience, no opportunity, and little to no exposure.

The "business of BB" is comprised of many avenues, only ONE of which is actually competing. The pro's you mention all have some means of supporting themselves, the monetary loss they may take in getting ready for a show is an investment as far as they are concerned...

That said...at SOME point, you have to assess whether that investment is going to have a return...

No one in the history of professional bodybuilding ever got into it for the money...

Gotta pay them dues...

[ShipSekki]

 It's the same thing as guys who move to LA and sacrifice everything to try to make it huge as a rapper, rock star or actor or whatever. Just guys chasing a dream with little chance of success, but having a lot of fun doing it. Maybe they don't really have any other major prospects in life so they just decide to go all the way with what they got?

 Not everyone is all about making cash in life, some people are more into following passions and dreams.

[Vince G, CSN MFT]

Thats why they are hired in the first place...and paid

In that event, I wouldn't even sign a contract if the supplement company was not going renumerate me for at least travel and lodge expenses.  Contractual agreements shouldn't be a negative asset to a bodybuilder if it means bouncing checks to fulfill an obligation.  

Like I said, the IFBB needs to attract the major sponsors like Nike and etc to give the athletes more money.  Just about every other athlete in the world gets that same privilege

[affeman]

I can assure you, the only expenses paid for by a supp company, are supps and possibly travel/ hotel...

Don't think Muscletech pays Jay in CellTech and Hydroxicut only.

[Mr Nobody]

In that event, I wouldn't even sign a contract if the supplement company was not going renumerate me for at least travel and lodge expenses.  Contractual agreements shouldn't be a negative asset to a bodybuilder if it means bouncing checks to fulfill an obligation.  

Like I said, the IFBB needs to attract the major sponsors like Nike and etc to give the athletes more money.  Just about every other athlete in the world gets that same privilege

Bodybuilders are not athletes Vince remember?

[Chick]

In that event, I wouldn't even sign a contract if the supplement company was not going renumerate me for at least travel and lodge expenses.  Contractual agreements shouldn't be a negative asset to a bodybuilder if it means bouncing checks to fulfill an obligation.  

Like I said, the IFBB needs to attract the major sponsors like Nike and etc to give the athletes more money.  Just about every other athlete in the world gets that same privilege

OK...so you snub your nose at the $75K contract because they wont pay your travel and lodging....guess you win!

Every athlete's contract is different, I'm just giving you th most common senario...especially if you're not one of the top guys...

[Topskin69]

OK...so you snub your nose at the $75K contract because they wont pay your travel and lodging....guess you win!

Every athlete's contract is different, I'm just giving you th most common senario...especially if you're not one of the top guys...

You should expound on this. What is a 75k contract after taxes, and expenses? I don't remember the exact figure you put out there, but I seem to remember you once being quoted as saying that your average show runs about ten grand for prep. I am assuming that covers gear, food, (probably the biggest expense), and anything else.

Do three shows... spend an easy 25-30 grand, then take out taxes, and time. Seems like your bodybuilder is left with a job that pays about 12-14 dollars an hour, and that is being generous. This entire scenario seems far too absurd, not to mention highly exploitative.

The only way things are going to change for bodybuilding is to get people to understand it. The only way to do that is to package it in a reality format, and try to expose it that way. There is enough drama in this subculture that if you can humanize the existential aspects of Bodybuilding, then you stand a shot of connecting to a future audience.  

[BayGBM]

gay 4 pay - escort work? 

[Topskin69]

I should rent out a booth for you at the next bodybuilding expo, so you can get your G4P consulting firm off the ground! 

[BayGBM]

I should rent out a booth for you at the next bodybuilding expo, so you can get your G4P consulting firm off the ground! 

No booth needed.  Email is more private. 

[Vince G, CSN MFT]

OK...so you snub your nose at the $75K contract because they wont pay your travel and lodging....guess you win!

Every athlete's contract is different, I'm just giving you th most common senario...especially if you're not one of the top guys...

Depends on how much travel is the supplement company requiring and how many competitions they are made to do.  If overall travel and funds needed for contest prep is to the point where the athlete is making almost minimum wage, then it isn't worth it.  Having a 75k doesn't really mean much when you have to spend most of it to fulfill the obligation.  You would have to really love the sport of bodybuilding to do so.

I don't know Chick, I'm not an IFBB pro so I would have no earthly idea as to how much money would be needed in terms of "supplements", foods, paying a prep coach, and travel.  The only thing I'm hearing about is that a number of bodybuilders are broke....mostly through the fault of their own management of money but yet they are still losing money.

The reason I'm asking these questions is because I'm building a site "muscleceo.com" is helps athletes bring in money and manage it more wisely.  As an IFBB pro and successful business person, what would you suggest that IFBB pros and upcoming bodybuilders do???

[mwbbuilder]

The bodybuilders are not employees. They are general contractors who get a 1099 form. They are responsible for paying their own taxes. They set up the own business entities and have all the taxes advantages of any business. Travel expenses and such are tax deductible. I'm sure that 75k nets down to just about tax free.