Author Topic: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates  (Read 1184 times)

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Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« on: March 26, 2010, 12:03:44 PM »
No fourth star for you General Mixon.  I think his opinion represents the majority of the rank and file. 


Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
Commander of U.S. Army Pacific called repeal 'ill-advised'

By William Cole
Advertiser Military Writer

The top uniformed officer in the U.S. military yesterday sharply criticized Fort Shafter's Lt. Gen. Benjamin R. "Randy" Mixon after Mixon said he is against repealing the "don't ask, don't tell" policy regarding gays in the military.

 
Adm. Mike Mullen, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and Defense Secretary Robert Gates took Mixon to task on the same day that the Pentagon announced new limitations on "don't ask, don't tell," which prohibits gays from openly serving in the military.

President Obama has called for a repeal of the 1993 law.

Mixon yesterday did not publicly address the rebuke from the Pentagon's top military and civilian leaders or his status afterward.

"At this time, Gen. Mixon does not have any comment, but we appreciate your concern," said his spokesman, Lt. Col. Mike Donnelly.

Mixon, who has led the U.S. Army in the Pacific from Fort Shafter since Feb. 1, 2008, was commissioned an officer in the Army in 1975. Before arriving at Fort Shafter, he was commander of the 25th Infantry Division at Schofield Barracks. During 2006-07, he commanded 23,000 U.S. troops in northern Iraq.

Mixon penned a letter to the editor that was published March 8 in the military newspaper Stars and Stripes in which he made reference to reports that most service members are in favor of repealing "don't ask, don't tell."

"I do not believe that is accurate. I suspect many servicemembers, their families, veterans and citizens are wondering what to do to stop this ill-advised repeal of a policy that has achieved a balance between a citizen's desire to serve and acceptable conduct," Mixon said in the letter.

The three-star general added that "now is the time to write your elected officials and chain of command and express your views."

Both Gates and Mullen yesterday said Mixon's actions were inappropriate. Mullen said the issue is being addressed and that he had spoken specifically to Gen. George Casey, the chief of staff of the Army, about Mixon.

Mullen said if there is a policy that someone in uniform disagrees with "and you feel so strongly about it, you know, the answer is not advocacy, it is in fact to vote with your feet."

polarizing issue
The swift rebuke has returned the polarizing issue of "don't ask, don't tell" to Hawai'i, and raised anew the rights of military leaders to criticize U.S. policy.

While other U.S. general officers have spoken out against a repeal of "don't ask, don't tell," the comments have been in response to questions from Congress.

That's where Mixon erred, said Lawrence Korb, a senior fellow at the Center for American Progress, and a former assistant secretary of defense in the Reagan administration.

"If Congress were to ask the general, 'What do you think about this?' I think it would be perfectly appropriate to say he doesn't agree with it," Korb said. "But this was a little bit different. He was telling people to write letters."

Korb said officers can express concerns through their chain of command, but once a policy is decided upon by the president and Pentagon, "you've got to follow it. If you can't, the honorable thing to do is step down."

Other flag officers have gone public with complaints or political views before. Some survived with careers intact, and some did not.

Korb said Army Gen. David Petraeus, now head of the U.S. military effort in the Middle East, wrote an opinion piece that was published in 2004 before the presidential election.

The newspaper piece talked "about how good things were going in Iraq. I criticized him for that," Korb said. "A, it was too close to the election, and B, it wasn't true."

In 2008, a public disagreement with the Bush administration over its Iran policy led Navy Adm. William "Fox" Fallon to resign from the position that Petraeus now holds.

The Pentagon yesterday made policy changes that make it harder to discharge gay members of the military.

reactions varied
The news of Mixon's admonishment and continued efforts to repeal "don't ask, don't tell" brought a variety of reactions.

One Hawai'i soldier, who requested anonymity because he was not authorized to speak, said, "Don't ask, don't tell, it works."

Repealing the policy would diminish the high standards of the military because openly gay people would draw attention to themselves, he said.

Gay activists will "fuel it up. I demand this now. I demand that now," the soldier said.

"I support Lt. Gen. Mixon's statement," he said. "If we feel that it (a repeal of 'don't ask, don't tell') is wrong, we should be able to say it's wrong without repercussions."

Army Spc. Michael Bowyer, 28, said there are mixed emotions about a possible repeal of "don't ask, don't tell," which he believes is not discriminatory and does not prevent gays from serving.

"I think most people would be OK with it (a repeal). It is going to take some getting used to," Bowyer said. "Are we going to have to have separate showers and latrines and all that stuff?"

Bowyer said he doesn't have a problem with gays serving openly, although religiously, he believes homosexuality is wrong.

"I've had friends who are gay and I've never had a problem working with them," he said.

Shannon Smith, a lesbian who was on active duty in the Army for six years, including three at Fort Shafter, and then was a Reservist at Fort Shafter from 2002 to 2005, said a repeal of "don't ask, don't tell" is important because the policy is discriminatory.

"We can go serve and die for our country, but oh my God, don't be gay," she said.

Gay soldiers knew other gay soldiers and Smith, now 41, remembers two girls getting caught. "They just turned all our names in and I remember how scared I was living in the barracks knowing they (military officials) could come in at any time," she said.

Smith said under a repeal of "don't ask, don't tell," gay soldiers would continue to blend into the ranks because the military weeds out bad behavior.

"You can have a straight person in the military and if they don't behave appropriately, that should be dealt with," she said. "Just because you are gay, that shouldn't be a reason to be pointed at or segregated."

The whole issue of a repeal would settle down after a while, she believes.

"It doesn't matter if you are gay or straight — you are supposed to be carrying yourself and handling yourself in a professional manner in the military," Smith said. "That (being gay) shouldn't be the defining factor."

http://www.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/20100326/NEWS01/3260359/Army+commander+in+Hawaii+rebuked+by++Pentagon++Gates

Dos Equis

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2010, 12:04:38 PM »
And . . . what is the difference between General Mixon's comments and the Chair of the Joint Chiefs giving a "personal" opinion that the ban should be repealed? 

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2010, 12:16:09 PM »
pretty disrespectful to attack his superiors.

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #3 on: March 26, 2010, 01:36:28 PM »
I think his opinion represents the majority of the rank and file. 
I think the majority of the rank and file would like to see it repealed but then it doesn't really matter what they want does it?

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2010, 03:42:13 PM »
have there been any polls conducted on the rank and file to see where they stand on don't ask/dont tell?

Surely this is a Q they have asked them, right?

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #5 on: March 26, 2010, 04:18:09 PM »
have there been any polls conducted on the rank and file to see where they stand on don't ask/dont tell?

Surely this is a Q they have asked them, right?

I doubt anyone has conducted a poll of the military to ask their opinion

Anyone's opinion is nothing more than that



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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2010, 06:45:31 PM »
Marine officer: Gays, straights shouldn't share housing
By the CNN Wire Staff
March 26, 2010
U.S. Marine Corps
(CNN) -- The Marine Corps' top officer says he would want to avoid housing gay and heterosexual Marines in the same rooms on base if the ban on gays openly serving in the military is lifted.

"I would not ask our Marines to live with someone that's homosexual if we can possibly avoid it," Marine Commandant Gen. James Conway told a Web site in an interview posted Friday. "And to me that means we've got to build [barracks] that have single rooms."

Asked about the possibility of gay and straight Marines living together, Conway told the site Military.com that he would "want to preserve the right of a Marine that thinks he or she wouldn't want to do that -- and that's the overwhelming number of people that say they wouldn't like to do so."

Conway said the Marine Corps is the only branch of the armed services that houses two to a room.

On Thursday, Defense Secretary Robert Gates announced that the Pentagon will start to ease its enforcement of the "don't ask, don't tell" policy prohibiting homosexuals from serving openly in the military.

Among other things, Gates said the Pentagon is raising the threshold for what constitutes an appropriate level of information necessary to launch a "credible inquiry" into allegations of homosexual behavior.

The change, which will take effect in 30 days and apply to all current cases, is a reflection of "common sense" and "common decency," Gates said.

"These changes reflect some of the insights we have gained over 17 years of implementing the current law, including the need for consistency, oversight and clear standards," Gates said.

President Obama and Adm. Mike Mullen, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, support a legislative repeal of "don't ask, don't tell," which was first enacted in 1993. Some senior members of the military, however, have expressed concern over the impact of the ban's repeal on unit cohesion and morale, among other things.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/03/26/marines.gay.housing/index.html?hpt=T1

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #7 on: March 26, 2010, 07:09:45 PM »
don't they already share housing?


Dos Equis

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #8 on: March 31, 2010, 12:16:10 PM »
Only express your opinion if you agree with the president, General Mixon.   ::)

Mixon won't be reprimanded
Advertiser Wire Services

The Hawaii-based commander of the Army in the Pacific will not be sanctioned for publicly urging troops to lobby against repeal of a ban on openly gay military service.

Army Secretary John McHugh said today that Lt. Gen. Benjamin Mixon has been told that what he did was inappropriate for an active-duty officer but that he won't receive a letter of reprimand or be forced to step down.

McHugh said Mixon now "recognizes the difficulties in appearing to become an advocate in trying to shape the opinion of the force rather than ascertain" its view on the issue.

"We consider the matter closed as of today," McHugh told reporters in Washington.

Mixon, who is based at Fort Shafter, wrote a letter to the editor of Stars and Stripes saying he didn't believe most military personnel would support repeal of the so-called "don't ask, don't tell" policy on gays. In the letter Mixon urged troops and families to make their feelings known to their commanders and elected officials.

President Barack Obama wants the military to do away with the ban on openly gay service, and Defense Secretary Robert Gates is conducting a review on the matter.

Gates and Adm. Mike Mullen, head of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, publicly criticized Mixon for his letter.

Mullen was especially pointed, saying officers who didn't agree with policy should "vote with their feet."

http://www.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/20100331/BREAKING01/100331005/Mixon+won+t+be+reprimanded+

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #9 on: March 31, 2010, 12:32:11 PM »
The military isn't a democracy or free speech zone.  That commander is way out of line with those remarks in public.  He does what he's told by his superiors, that is what all soldiers are taught.  Obedience.  But now we have these pro military nutbags wanting them to disrespect their superiors.  If the commander says it, it is so.  Don't like it?  Leave the military. 
Abandon every hope...

Dos Equis

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #10 on: March 31, 2010, 12:46:50 PM »
They can say whatever they want, so long as they agree with Obama.   ::)  For example:

Mike Mullen Calls For Repealing 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell': 'Right Thing To Do'
ANNE FLAHERTY | 02/ 2/10

WASHINGTON — It's time to repeal the military's "don't ask, don't tell" policy and allow gay troops to serve openly for the first time in history, the nation's top defense officials declared Tuesday, with the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff proclaiming that service members should not be forced to "lie about who they are."

However, both Defense Secretary Robert Gates and Joint Chiefs Chairman Adm. Mike Mullen asked for a year to study the impact before Congress would lift the controversial policy.

Reversing the Pentagon's 17-year-old policy toward gays "comes down to integrity," for the military as an institution as well as the service members themselves, Mullen told a Senate hearing. Unpersuaded, several Republican senators said they would oppose any congressional effort to repeal the policy.

. . . .


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/02/02/mike-mullen-calls-for-rep_n_446067.html

Straw Man

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #11 on: March 31, 2010, 03:43:06 PM »
Maybe the difference is more that one person was speaking at a Senate hearing and answering a quesrtion and the other voluntarily offered an opinion in a letter to an editor of a paper.    That distinction was pointed out in the story at the beginning of this thread

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #12 on: April 01, 2010, 01:02:47 AM »
The military isn't a democracy or free speech zone.  That commander is way out of line with those remarks in public.  He does what he's told by his superiors, that is what all soldiers are taught.  Obedience.  But now we have these pro military nutbags wanting them to disrespect their superiors.  If the commander says it, it is so.  Don't like it?  Leave the military. 

He's a 3 star general...he can sorta say what he wants. The guy expressed an opinion that completely goes against the current admin. I know Mixon, I sent my XO to be his aid when he was a 1 star. I don't like the guy because he's a dick, but his view represents the vast majority of servicemen. The Army Times did survey...65% were againts the repeal. Thats down about 5-10% since 94 or the last time they did one.
L

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #13 on: April 01, 2010, 12:39:05 PM »
He's a 3 star general...he can sorta say what he wants. The guy expressed an opinion that completely goes against the current admin. I know Mixon, I sent my XO to be his aid when he was a 1 star. I don't like the guy because he's a dick, but his view represents the vast majority of servicemen. The Army Times did survey...65% were againts the repeal. Thats down about 5-10% since 94 or the last time they did one.

Not surprised.  That's consistent with what I've heard from my friends in the service. 

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #14 on: April 01, 2010, 12:50:19 PM »
He's a 3 star general...he can sorta say what he wants. The guy expressed an opinion that completely goes against the current admin. I know Mixon, I sent my XO to be his aid when he was a 1 star. I don't like the guy because he's a dick, but his view represents the vast majority of servicemen. The Army Times did survey...65% were againts the repeal. Thats down about 5-10% since 94 or the last time they did one.

Are you referring to a survey from 2004.

Here's one that was published in February 2010:

http://www.armytimes.com/news/2010/02/military_dontask_survey_020510w/

Opposition to gays serving openly in the military has declined sharply among those wearing the uniform today.

An exclusive survey of some 3,000 active-duty troops shows such opposition has fallen sharply from nearly two-thirds (65 percent) in 2004 to about half (51 percent) today. The survey results appear Monday in Army Times, Air Force Times, Navy Times and Marine Corps Times.

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #15 on: April 03, 2010, 11:00:30 AM »
Most recent poll of active military (Feb 2010) shows clear trend

those opposed to allowing gays to serve openly went from 63% to 51%
those in favor went from 24% to 30%
those who were neutral or declined to answer went from what appears to be ~ 11% to ~ 20%

http://www.armytimes.com/news/2010/02/military_dontask_survey_020510w/

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #16 on: October 16, 2010, 10:26:22 AM »
Marines Chief Warns Most Are Uncomfortable Serving With Openly Gay Troops
By Justin Fishel
Published October 15, 2010 | FoxNews.com
 

WASHINGTON -- As many as 95 percent of Marines would be uncomfortable serving alongside openly gay troops, the retiring commandant of the Marine Corps told Fox News in an exclusive interview.

Gen. James Conway told Fox News' Jennifer Griffin that a majority of his men and women think a repeal of the "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy barring gays from serving openly will be problematic, so he has to believe that, too.

"When we take a survey of our Marines, by and large, they say that they are concerned that it will cause potential problems with regard to their order and discipline -- that it will impact their sense of unit cohesion," Conway said.

Gen. Conway was the first member of the Joint Chiefs of Staff to speak out against a repeal earlier this year after Defense Secretary Robert Gates and Joint Chiefs Chairman Admiral Mike Mullen publicly endorsed President Obama's desire to change the law.

Conway plans to retire Oct. 22 after 40 years of service with the Marines. He's only the second Marines chief ever to serve his entire tenure as commandant during wartime.

And wartime, he said, is "probably not the time" to change the military's policy on gays.

Right now, there are 20,000 Marines serving in Afghanistan. Conway told Fox he "wouldn't hazard a guess" as to how many are gay, but he think it's a small percentage, in the "low single digits."

Conway says these few gays don't cause a problem now because their homosexuality is not known publicly. But he said if their sexuality does become public, "90 to 95 percent of the Marines" he has informally surveyed are concerned about the consequences. Conway cited impromptu surveys he has conducted by a "show of hands" among Marines at town hall style meetings.

Late Thursday, Obama's Justice Department requested that California U.S. District Judge Virginia Phillips allow the military to continue enforcing the gay ban during the appeal of her landmark ruling Tuesday, which declared the law unconstitutional.

The move amounted to an admission from the White House that they would not let this policy be legislated in the courts, that it had to be decided by Congress. Congress has failed once already this year to pass a change the law, even with a majority of Democrats in both houses and with public opinion polls that slant heavily toward a repeal.

Gen. Conway agrees that only the Congress should have that ability. "I think that the Congress represents the will of the people," he said. "And we are a nation of laws. The military abides by the laws. And I think we would be much more comfortable, if it's going to change, it comes as a result of the change to the law, not an independent judicial determination in a district somewhere in California."

Meanwhile the military finds itself in the awkward position of having to abide by an injunction that calls on the government "immediately to suspend or discontinue any investigation or discharge, separation or other proceeding that may have been commenced under "Don't Ask, Don't Tell."

Conway says this unfortunately creates "an element of uncertainty" among commanders in the field about how they should handle existing cases.

IRAQ AND AFGHANISTAN

Conway is known for being outspoken, sometimes a renegade, and didn't always agree with the advice being given from the field about the way ahead in Iraq and Afghanistan. He often butted heads with Gen. David Petraeus over the surge in Iraq.

"Frankly, David Petraeus and I disagreed a little bit on this," Conway said. It was Conway's belief that the Marines stationed in Anbar were well on their way to turning the war's momentum. "So we have said that the surge reinforced successes that were already happening in the Anbar."

Conway also weighed in on the controversial July 2011 date that President Obama has set for the start of a troop withdrawal in Afghanistan, saying his Marines serving in the more violent southern regions of Helmand and Kandahar won't be affected by it. "There is an expectation in some regards that it is a precipitous event -- and in fact I think it will be hardly noticeable, probably especially in the south," Conway said. "If you accept that conditions will drive our drawdown it's not logical then that we would start drawing down at first."

Commanders in Afghanistan have argued strongly in recent days that reconciliation with senior Taliban leaders could be the way to end the war in Afghanistan. Some have even compared it to the Anbar Awakening, when Sunni sheiks turned against Al Qaeda and joined forces with the U.S. But Gen. Conway didn't seem sure now is the right time for talks.

"In Iraq, you had what we call a single bellybutton -- a leading sheik, if you will, that influenced thousands or maybe even tens of thousands of people," Conway said. "The Afghan tribal fabric is much more disparate than that. And so one tribal sheik does not necessarily control the thoughts and emotions of -- of thousands."

Conway told Fox News, however, that reconciliation with lower level fighters is feasible and will eventually be necessary. But to engage in those talks now he said, "may be a bit early."

As for the extremist threat coming from the tribal areas of Pakistan, Conway said it's a reason for concern. "Pakistan is a nuclear-armed country and if you are concerned about the nexus of nuclear weapons and terrorism, as we all should be, Pakistan represents the closest danger in that context."

RETIREMENT

When he leaves on Oct. 22, Gen. Conway says he has plans to retire to a log cabin he and his wife, Annette, built in Pennsylvania. His office in the Pentagon is decorated with a Norman Rockwell painting, antique muskets, a five-pound small-mouth bass he caught in Fredericksburg, Va. Before leaving, he reflected on lasting memories he'll take from his service.

One of his biggest successes while serving the Marines, he said, was getting his men and women vehicles that protected against the insurgent's deadliest weapon: roadside bombs. Mine Resistant Ambush Protected vehicles, or MRAPS as they are known, have become a staple for U.S. troops in Iraq and Afghanistan. Their heavy V-shaped hull has saved thousands of lives according to Conway. The program was so successful that in 2007 Defense Secretary Robert Gates expanded the program beyond the Marines to include the Army.

Annette Conway has been a tireless advocate for wounded Marines and their families. The only real regret Gen. Conway says he has is that Marines have been killed or wounded. Gen. Conway told Fox News about a recent visit he and his wife made to meet with wounded Marines.

"We were just at the hospital again yesterday. And each one is -- is just special. Each one has his own or her own story, as the case may be," he said. "And you just hate to see a young man at that point in his life, this is a life-changing event that he's going to have to live with for the rest of his time. That said, their attitude is just incredible. You go out there thinking your going to pump them up and just the opposite takes place because they're such warriors that they're -- that it's just incredible."

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/10/15/retiring-marines-chief-warns-uncomfortable-serving-openly-gay-troops/

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #17 on: October 16, 2010, 10:47:01 AM »
weird that one guy, retired and hired by fox, would know what 95% of marines believe.

He didn't have any empirical data to back up that claim, but I'm sure he "feels it in his bones".

Good enough for me.

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Re: Army commander in Hawaii rebuked by Pentagon, Gates
« Reply #18 on: October 16, 2010, 03:37:39 PM »
weird that one guy, retired and hired by fox, would know what 95% of marines believe.

He didn't have any empirical data to back up that claim, but I'm sure he "feels it in his bones".

Good enough for me.

That's how my grand pappy predicted the weather!