Calvin and Hobbes on WAR

[Jezebelle]

 

[tonymctones]

Its a fact of life and part of human nature...deal with it and STFU please 

[Soul Crusher]

Its a fact of life and part of human nature...deal with it and STFU please 

Not to the deluded libs like TA and the rest of the left wing dupes. 

[Jezebelle]

Its a fact of life and part of human nature...deal with it and STFU please 

No it isn`t. There is only one fact of life.  You are born and then you die.  There is no such thing as "one" human nature.   As if war were a practical survival scheme or as if there's only one human nature.

[Soul Crusher]

No it isn`t. There is only one fact of life.  You are born and then you die.  There is no such thing as "one" human nature.   As if war were a practical survival scheme or as if there's only one human nature.

3500 years of recorded history disagrees with your idiocy. 

[Jezebelle]

3500 years of recorded history disagrees with your idiocy. 

Homo Sapiens are little older than 3500 years.  Anatomically modern humans appear from about 200,000 years ago.

[tonymctones]

No it isn`t. There is only one fact of life.  You are born and then you die.  There is no such thing as "one" human nature.   As if war were a practical survival scheme or as if there's only one human nature.

actually there is...you sound just like your dumb ass boy friend saying there is no such thing as family values...

look up archetypes, you really think that certain books are popular with millions of ppl is coincidental? you think that its a coincident that movie plots from different cultures are similar?

its human nature to protect yourself and seek to further your genes...guess what happens when you have limited resources?

there are many different aspects of human nature and fighting is part of it...to deny that is ignorant 

you think that a primate being dominant in order to further their place and acquire mates isnt in their nature?

there most certainly are things that are part of human nature and when youre denied these things you do what you have to in order to obtain them such as fighting or in other words WAR...not everything can be talked out  no matter how bad you want it obamas utopia isnt the way the world works 

[Jezebelle]

actually there is...you sound just like your dumb ass boy friend saying there is no such thing as family values...

look up archetypes, you really think that certain books are popular with millions of ppl is coincidental? you think that its a coincident that movie plots from different cultures are similar?

its human nature to protect yourself and seek to further your genes...guess what happens when you have limited resources?

there are many different aspects of human nature and fighting is part of it...to deny that is ignorant 

you think that a primate being dominant in order to further their place and acquire mates isnt in their nature?

there most certainly are things that are part of human nature and when youre denied these things you do what you have to in order to obtain them such as fighting or in other words WAR...not everything can be talked out  no matter how bad you want it obamas utopia isnt the way the world works 

Uh, there is a genetic component to almost all behavior but that certainly does not mean we can`t change or fix it. 

Furthermore, conflict is not always dictated by resources or the lack thereof.  Nor is there a "war" gene.

The genetic components for reciprocating altruism and which has lead to successful group living is one of the key reason how our brains got to be the size they are.

If I can recommend a book on the Mind:  How the Mind Works by Steven Pinker

[tonymctones]

Uh, there is a genetic component to almost all behavior but that certainly does not mean we can`t change or fix it. 

Furthermore, conflict is not always dictated by resources or the lack thereof.  Nor is there a "war" gene.

The genetic components for reciprocating altruism and which has lead to successful group living is one of the key reason how our brains got to be the size they are.

If I can recommend a book on the Mind:  How the Mind Works by Steven Pinker

man I really hope this is TA posting Id hate to think there are 2 of you walking around this dense...

I never said conflict is always dictated by lack of resources did I? I also never said there is a war gene, did I?

LOL one could also argue that there is no altruistic act as well

conflict is part of human nature, I believe it was plato who said "we are political animals" and as such we conflict is a natural part of human life...conflict also helps in successful group living there TA...

My first bachelors was in psychology...trust conflict is a part of human nature...

[Jezebelle]

man I really hope this is TA posting Id hate to think there are 2 of you walking around this dense...

I never said conflict is always dictated by lack of resources did I? I also never said there is a war gene, did I?

LOL one could also argue that there is no altruistic act as well

conflict is part of human nature, I believe it was plato who said "we are political animals" and as such we conflict is a natural part of human life...conflict also helps in successful group living there TA...

My first bachelors was in psychology...trust conflict is a part of human nature...

Conflict and War is not the same thing whatsoever.

Also, Plato is a little outdated and he was dead wrong (Forgivable since he lived 2400 years ago) on a lot of things.  You may want to go with someone a bit more, say current.  I prefer Evolutionary Psychologist Steven Pinker.

I wonder why they never had you read Pinker?  Did they teach about the Computational Theory of Mind?  Also, do you subscribe to the SSSM, The Standard Social Science Model?  Pinker and others pretty much have torpedoed that school of thought especially with genetics demonstrating that mind as a "blank slate" from birth is total hogwash.  I am not sure when or where you went to school or if they still teach the SSSM, but I can only hope they don`t.

[Soul Crusher]

How about you go with fucking reality for once in your dam life? 

[tu_holmes]

To achieve the ideal, one must become the ideal.

You'll always have war if you don't ever try to avoid it.

[Jezebelle]

How about you go with fucking reality for once in your dam life?  

I like to know the why and the how, but I do understand your concern and frustration.  I was frustrated as hell the other night reading about our Stereoscopic vision and how informational reference points from photons of light trigger certain neural connections in the brain allowing us to gauge an object`s boundaries and texture.

I looked at my dog and thought, he doesn`t give two fukcs about this, nor will he ever and he can see further than I can. PWNED.

[tonymctones]

Conflict and War is not the same thing whatsoever.

Also, Plato is a little outdated and he was dead wrong (Forgivable since he lived 2400 years ago) on a lot of things.  You may want to go with someone a bit more, say current.  I prefer Evolutionary Psychologist Steven Pinker.

I wonder why they never had you read Pinker?  Did they teach about the Computational Theory of Mind?  Also, do you subscribe to the SSSM, The Standard Social Science Model?  Pinker and others pretty much have torpedoed that school of thought especially with genetics demonstrating that mind as a "blank slate" from birth is total hogwash.  I am not sure when or where you went to school or if they still teach the SSSM, but I can only hope they don`t.

war is simply conflict on a bigger scale   its exactly the same

plato is 100% right about humans being political animals and as such conflict is a part of everyday life in one form or another...Ive never heard of pinker but I think he might have some interesting points as far as evolutionary psychology...sounds like though that you seem to want to steer the evolution in a certain direction which would be engineering...wasnt taught the SSSM

we are a mix of instincts and culture and conflict has an instinctive and believe it or not evolutionary beneficial place in our human nature...

[Soul Crusher]

War is a fact of life, you either are good at it or get eaten.  You either project strength or get taken over. 

 

[Jezebelle]

Actually, we are at our most peaceful existence in Human History right now, although it sounds absurd.

Here is Pinker on that very notion. "A brief History of Violence"  TonyMctones, being interested in Psychology you will find Pinker intriguing.  I hope you watch it as I would love to discuss it with you, others as well.

[tonymctones]

Actually, we are at our most peaceful existence in Human History right now, although it sounds absurd.

Here is Pinker on that very notion. "A brief History of Violence"  TonyMctones, being interested in Psychology you will find Pinker intriguing.  I hope you watch it as I would love to discuss it with you, others as well.

Ill try to watch it tomorrow and post my thoughts

even though we are supposedly in the most peaceful time in existence doesnt mean much in terms of eliminating war...sorry but there will always be conflict between ppl/cultures and therefor nations and as long as there is conflict there will be war there maybe less war at times when compared to others but you cannot eliminate conflict and by proxy war...sorry it would take everybody subscribing to the same thought process so basically everyone thinking exactly the same, reacting exactly the same, feeling exactly the same like robots...

[tonymctones]

first of all much like you this mans ideological beliefs are more than evident in his speech I have no respect for that. If you want to talk science, talk science dont talk science and politics the two should be mutually exclusive.

second Im not sure why you proposed this video to me? I would suppose that we maybe in the most peaceful time in human history just as he proposes that doesnt mean anything in terms of eliminating war. There are possibly hundreds of reasons why we are in a relatively peaceful time right now. The biggest one in my mind being technology...LOL i was actually posting this before I listened to the entire clip and as you can see technology is a reason cited for many of the theories as to the decline of violence and war.

There was a man named malthus who id be suprised if you havent heard of but basically he says the worlds population will continue to grow at an exponential rate and that the world has limited resources and as these resource become more and more scarce due to population growth conflict will become more frequent. He states that technology has an effect of pushing the point where there is not enough resources to support the population further out. So in effect the better the technology the more efficient the use of resources and the less conflict. This is just one way that technology has helped to lower conflict/war there are multiple ways through different facets of society that technology has helped to lower conflict but it will not eliminate it.

Another aspect of technology is it provides us with a more enjoyable life again stated in one of the theories. This also presents a problem though as we interpret our life and our standard of living in terms of others. 2000 yrs ago ppl living in afghanistan today would have a great standard of living compared to that time period today its shit. This discrepancy in SOL will cause envy again a part of human nature and will eventually lead to conflict...look at Iran and its nuclear ambitions, could they get along without nuclear power plants? of course they could but they choose to buck the rest of the world in order to raise their standard of living to be closer to ours.

Also no where in this clip does he remotely say that eliminating war is possible only that we are less violent now than before. As a matter of fact you could say that his speech does more to bolster my points than yours.

[JohnC1908]

Enjoyed the comic...very true...war is stupid.

[LurkerNoMore]

Amazing the twits that get worked up over a simple comic strip.

[Jezebelle]

first of all much like you this mans ideological beliefs are more than evident in his speech I have no respect for that. If you want to talk science, talk science dont talk science and politics the two should be mutually exclusive.

second Im not sure why you proposed this video to me? I would suppose that we maybe in the most peaceful time in human history just as he proposes that doesnt mean anything in terms of eliminating war. There are possibly hundreds of reasons why we are in a relatively peaceful time right now. The biggest one in my mind being technology...LOL i was actually posting this before I listened to the entire clip and as you can see technology is a reason cited for many of the theories as to the decline of violence and war.

There was a man named malthus who id be suprised if you havent heard of but basically he says the worlds population will continue to grow at an exponential rate and that the world has limited resources and as these resource become more and more scarce due to population growth conflict will become more frequent. He states that technology has an effect of pushing the point where there is not enough resources to support the population further out. So in effect the better the technology the more efficient the use of resources and the less conflict. This is just one way that technology has helped to lower conflict/war there are multiple ways through different facets of society that technology has helped to lower conflict but it will not eliminate it.

Another aspect of technology is it provides us with a more enjoyable life again stated in one of the theories. This also presents a problem though as we interpret our life and our standard of living in terms of others. 2000 yrs ago ppl living in afghanistan today would have a great standard of living compared to that time period today its shit. This discrepancy in SOL will cause envy again a part of human nature and will eventually lead to conflict...look at Iran and its nuclear ambitions, could they get along without nuclear power plants? of course they could but they choose to buck the rest of the world in order to raise their standard of living to be closer to ours.

Also no where in this clip does he remotely say that eliminating war is possible only that we are less violent now than before. As a matter of fact you could say that his speech does more to bolster my points than yours.

1. There is nothing ideological whatsoever about his presentation or the facts therein.  If you are referring to the Clinton quip, it was an attempt at humor.  Clinton spoke at the TED conference the same day and was likely in the audience.  Just a little humor and nothing else.  

2. His whole talk was on the elimination of Violence, Conflict and war from the start of Human History until now using statistical data to prove his point.  He also offers insight as to why this is happening.  I proposed this video because I stated that there is a genetic component to almost all behavior but that certainly does not mean we can`t change or fix it.  Technology, Government, Reciprocal Altruism etc.. We are not slaves to our genetic expression. As Pinker demonstrates Conflict and War are clearly not a necessity for the human species whatsoever and it certainly has been DRAMATICALLY mitigated.  

3.  Elimination of War is possible for many reasons and he demonstrated that is EXACTLY what is happening as this was Pinker`s point.  If the Elimination of Conflict and War were not happening, we would see the trend constant.  This is EXACTLY WHAT WE DO NOT SEE.  Wars and Conflict are being DRAMATICALLY eliminated and reduced Globally and have been decreasing throughout the entire History of our species.

[headhuntersix]

War is the natural state of man, we do it, we might hate it, but we continue to do it all the same. Its the only thing we're good at...conflict...conflict .....conflict.  The West thinks its gotten past it...liberal society may try to deny it but we're not changing our nature. Sticking ur head in the sand will not make it go away.

[tonymctones]

1. There is nothing ideological whatsoever about his presentation or the facts therein.  If you are referring to the Clinton quip, it was an attempt at humor.  Clinton spoke at the TED conference the same day and was likely in the audience.  Just a little humor and nothing else.  

2. His whole talk was on the elimination of Violence, Conflict and war from the start of Human History until now using statistical data to prove his point.  He also offers insight as to why this is happening.  I proposed this video because I stated that there is a genetic component to almost all behavior but that certainly does not mean we can`t change or fix it.  Technology, Government, Reciprocal Altruism etc.. We are not slaves to our genetic expression. As Pinker demonstrates Conflict and War are clearly not a necessity for the human species whatsoever and it certainly has been DRAMATICALLY mitigated.  

3.  Elimination of War is possible for many reasons and he demonstrated that is EXACTLY what is happening as this was Pinker`s point.  If the Elimination of Conflict and War were not happening, we would see the trend constant.  This is EXACTLY WHAT WE DO NOT SEE.  Wars and Conflict are being DRAMATICALLY eliminated and reduced Globally and have been decreasing throughout the entire History of our species.

LOL not once did he mention the elimination of violence only the lessening of it...there is a huge difference here...conflict is in fact a very real necissity of human life and by proxy war...if I knew you wouldnt retaliate I would take whatever I wanted from you...I agree that there are ways to limit it but no way to eliminate it.

Again there is now way to eliminate war...again you mistake a low point in violence for eliminating war...you think you can eliminate murder as well? There are many reasons for the lessening of violence but that doesnt give credence to eliminating war...

please quote him saying eliminating war is possible...

what he was saying is that we are in a period of less conflict and violence due to many factor, you will never eliminate conflict...

[Jezebelle]

LOL not once did he mention the elimination of violence only the lessening of it...there is a huge difference here...conflict is in fact a very real necissity of human life and by proxy war...if I knew you wouldnt retaliate I would take whatever I wanted from you...I agree that there are ways to limit it but no way to eliminate it.

Again there is now way to eliminate war...again you mistake a low point in violence for eliminating war...you think you can eliminate murder as well? There are many reasons for the lessening of violence but that doesnt give credence to eliminating war...

please quote him saying eliminating war is possible...

what he was saying is that we are in a period of less conflict and violence due to many factor, you will never eliminate conflict...

1. Really?  If you knew that I  wouldn`t retaliate you would take from me?  Thats not very moral of you.    I would not engage in that behavior at all towards you because of reciprocal altruism and because I know how you would feel if I did and I do not want you feel that way as I care how you would feel.  My mirror Neurons and Frontal Lobes allow Forethought and Empathy.   I am sorry that the only thing stopping you from robbing and stealing by force is fear of retaliation.

2. Nobody is suggesting that there will be a complete (all or nothing) elimination of violence or conflict, only that it has dramatically lessened by magnitudes of 10 many, many times globally which indicates that Violence and War is NOT necessary whatsoever as a prerequisite for the continuation of our species.  If it were necessary and futile to prevent, we would not have such a decreasing trend against violence.  The instances of War, Violence and Conflict would remain steady or increase or would have increased.  That is NOT what has happened.  In fact, the less war, conflict and violence the greater the propagation of our species.   Obviously this is true for the entire history of our Human Species.  

3. War is not necessary for human survival whatsoever.  It does not make sense to suggest otherwise as there is no basis for this claim.

[Skip8282]

3. War is not necessary for human survival whatsoever.  It does not make sense to suggest otherwise as there is no basis for this claim.

I'm guessing your taking a 12 yr olds argument in that just because a person can "survive" under the boot of a brutal dictator, it means war is not necessary.  The reality is, either defend your way of life or lose it.