Do you support this potential AZ law?

[240 is Back]

Police would be able to detain ANYONE they wish - and demand to see "their papers".

You could be breaking no law, the police will be able to detain you, and if you don't have an ID, your ass is going to the lockup.

Do you support this law?  it would be statewide in Arizona.

[BM OUT]

YES!Police can do that now anytime they want to.They can pull you over and give any excuse they want.Just have your fucking papers and your fine.

[240 is Back]

Arguments FOR: They could catch more illegals.  Police could stop anyone they want and run 'their papers'.  

Arguments AGAINST: Some serious freedom restrictions going on here.  You are breaking no law, and you can be rounded up, ID'd, etc, and detained if you forgot your wallet.  

[BM OUT]

Arguments FOR: They could catch more illegals.  Police could stop anyone they want and run 'their papers'.  

Arguments AGAINST: Some serious freedom restrictions going on here.  You are breaking no law, and you can be rounded up, ID'd, etc, and detained if you forgot your wallet.  

That happens now.If your driving the cops can pull you over and give any excuse they want.If you have no license or ID they can  drag you in.

[Soul Crusher]

DETAIN
DEBRIEF
DEPORT

[Hugo Chavez]

I like the idea but I guess I have to say no due to other potentials.  I would rather have border patrol allowed to fully be border patrol.  From what I've seen in the news over the last decade they've been held back and limited and imprisoned for doing their job.  If it had not been for that bullshit, AZ wouldn't be in a place where they felt it was needed to pass this new law.  Why not put the pressure on letting BP do their job?

[240 is Back]

I just want to be clear here... You guys actually support some law where ANY policeman can pull you out of a restaurant, off the street, out of a movie theater, or out of line at the grocery store, and demand to "See your papers now!"

[Soul Crusher]

I just want to be clear here... You guys actually support some law where ANY policeman can pull you out of a restaurant, off the street, out of a movie theater, or out of line at the grocery store, and demand to "See your papers now!"

I dont believe that is how it is going to work. 

IMHO, we should bring the troops home from a lot of areas and train them for border patrol and put them on the border. 

We should also have ICE officers in every emergency room and jail. 

I would also have an ICE officer in the school system and welfare office. 

Also, we should jail employers who hire these people and make stiff jail and financial penalties. 

We could solve this mess within 5 years if we wanted to. 

IKE had "Operation Wetback" and it worked great. 

[Hugo Chavez]

I just want to be clear here... You guys actually support some law where ANY policeman can pull you out of a restaurant, off the street, out of a movie theater, or out of line at the grocery store, and demand to "See your papers now!"

I actually said no.

[BM OUT]

I just want to be clear here... You guys actually support some law where ANY policeman can pull you out of a restaurant, off the street, out of a movie theater, or out of line at the grocery store, and demand to "See your papers now!"

A cop can do this now.He can ask for ID anytime he wants and make up any excuse he wants.

[240 is Back]

Guys, let me be the conservative in the room, if some of you want to just bend over and pray for lube.

Politicians are testing the water to see how a "Show us your papers!" policy would work in one state.  They're using the whole "we can't stop illegals" angle, so people on the right (who would be screaming if Obama tried this shit in NYC) will support it.

once it passes in AZ, you'll see this shit in all the border states.  Then, it'll be worked into other states once people are compliant.  

I can't believe what pussies some of yall are being on this, no offence.  If Obama proposed a nationwide "you must show your ID to any govt official who requests it", you'd be talking civil war 2.  However, since he's doing it in baby steps, you are all for it.  W T F?

[Hugo Chavez]

I dont believe that is how it is going to work. 

IMHO, we should bring the troops home from a lot of areas and train them for border patrol and put them on the border. 

We should also have ICE officers in every emergency room and jail. 

I would also have an ICE officer in the school system and welfare office. 

Also, we should jail employers who hire these people and make stiff jail and financial penalties. 

We could solve this mess within 5 years if we wanted to. 

IKE had "Operation Wetback" and it worked great. 

none of what you just said applies to the question.  I want this solved as much as you.

[240 is Back]

BILLY, if you're standing in line at the grocery store with your family, and some cop randomly pulls you out of line and cuffs you while he runs your papers...

You're cool with that?

Yes, cops make up bullshit reasons in traffic, but that doesn't make it right.  This law allows them to pull your beet red ass out of a wedding, a funeral, lunch, wherever, and detain and ID you.

You are cool with that? 

[Soul Crusher]

240 created a straw man argument. 

The issue is going to be that once detained, if the officer has reasonal suspicion to believe theperson is illegal that he can take action on that. 

That would come about as a result of fradulent id's, bogus info, and other stuff like that. 

[Hugo Chavez]

A cop can do this now.He can ask for ID anytime he wants and make up any excuse he wants.

doesn't make it right imo, I don't care what the supreme court of idiots says.

[240 is Back]

my ass was handcuffed this year.  

I was armed, there was an amber alert in my area for a scruffy 30 year old with a kid that looked just like mine, and there had just been a police shooting x 4 the day before.  Cops were on their toes, there was plenty of reason for me to go along with it.

And to this day, I still feel like shit when I drive past that parking lot where I spent 15 minutes in cuffs for doing absolutely fvcking nothing wrong.



You guys go ahead and play sheep on this one.  When the Obama "domestic service" team has the ability to stop anyone in america and pull you out of your front yard raking leaves, in order to 'run your papers'... you don't bitch then.  

Unless, of course, you trust the govt to do the right thing and not abuse its power

[Hugo Chavez]

240 created a straw man argument. 

The issue is going to be that once detained, if the officer has reasonal suspicion to believe theperson is illegal that he can take action on that. 

That would come about as a result of fradulent id's, bogus info, and other stuff like that. 

you're creating an idealistic argument.  We all know as time goes along that's not the way it ends up working out.

[Soul Crusher]

you're creating an idealistic argument.  We all know as time goes along that's not the way it ends up working out.

True, but I do believe this can be tailored in a way to help out with this mess that the Feds refuse to deal with. 

[240 is Back]

333386,

If Obama created a law tomorrow that allowed him to stop any Americans at any time, run their papers, in order to make sure they weren't part of a 'domestic terrorism' operation, you'd be screaming.

Since it's brown people in another state that will be getting fvcked with... it's cool with you?


Today, if you're not breaking the law, and a cop demands papers, you get a lawyer and you sue his ass for violating your civil rights. 

Tomorrow, should this law passes, if you visit AZ, you can be detained for as long as it takes for them to ID you.  And should the power be down due to any event, guess what... maybe it'll just be easier to put people in compounds.  Then we can check their IDs on the computer once the power comes back on

You see how this shit could be abused?

[Hugo Chavez]

True, but I do believe this can be tailored in a way to help out with this mess that the Feds refuse to deal with. 

I'd rather have BP allowed to do their job fully in this matter.  As a country, we're not much of a country unless we have established and enforced borders.  That's what needs fixed.  This just gives everyone less reason to demand it being fixed and less need for them to fix their bullshit.

[Soul Crusher]

333386,

If Obama created a law tomorrow that allowed him to stop any Americans at any time, run their papers, in order to make sure they weren't part of a 'domestic terrorism' operation, you'd be screaming.

Since it's brown people in another state that will be getting fvcked with... it's cool with you?


Today, if you're not breaking the law, and a cop demands papers, you get a lawyer and you sue his ass for violating your civil rights. 

Tomorrow, should this law passes, if you visit AZ, you can be detained for as long as it takes for them to ID you.  And should the power be down due to any event, guess what... maybe it'll just be easier to put people in compounds.  Then we can check their IDs on the computer once the power comes back on

You see how this shit could be abused?

GMAFB with your race nonsense.  

This is going to work in a way that if some mexi gets pulled over and has a forged NC drivers license in AZ and other info pops up that is obviously false, he gets deported, as it should be.  

Same for other stuff.  

they can do this now 240.  

[Soul Crusher]

I'd rather have BP allowed to do their job fully in this matter.  As a country, we're not much of a country unless we have established and enforced borders.  That's what needs fixed.  This just gives everyone less reason to demand it being fixed and less need for them to fix their bullshit.

However, if the FEDS refuse to do their jobs and the states are left to deal with their negligence, what are they supposed to do?  Nothing? 

Illegals are not only blight, but they are bankrupting states and cities. 

These states usually have an obligation to have a balanced budget and cant do it if they are forced to pay out billions to pay for illegal invaders who are raping and bleeding the system dry. 

[dario73]

I hope this law becomes Federal law.

If you are not doing anything wrong, if you are legal, what the hell do you have to fear?

This measure along with using troops on the border, ICE agents and local police working together to arrest illegal immigrants and scrutiny/heavy fines for businesses that hire illegals will curtail illegal immigration.

[BM OUT]

This argument that "does it make it right" is the dumbest thing Ive read.There are a MILLION laws and a million things this government does thats an outrage.The idea that you look at your check and they take over a third of it is wrong.The idea that they can drug test high school athletes is a disgrace.The idea that they can take your land and claim emininant domain is a disgrace.

I used to drive a car with tints on the window.I was pulled over at least twice a month because they assumeD A DRUG DEALER WAS DRIVING THE CAR.So what?I showed them my license and registration and went on my way.Cops can pull you out of line ask for your papers now and say you fit the description of a guy who just commited a crime now,anytime they want.

Almost everything this government does is wrong,the idea that we are outraged over this and not by our hard earned money being stolen and redistributed to pieces of lazy shit is silly to me.

[Danny]

A cop can do this now.He can ask for ID anytime he wants and make up any excuse he wants.

exactly like in former communist countries. I know it from my own experience. Now  if THAT is not moving closer to a police state I dont know what is.