An open letter to Vince Bassille, IFBB 1970 Mr Canada

[Van_Bilderass]

Obviously, any hard training gifted bodybuilder can make gains and look decent without drugs.
You may not get the massive freaks you desire to see, but it still is bodybuilding with or wothout drugs.
This kind of mindset seems more drug addict than advocate, sorry but it does.
Hmmm, female bodybuilding really took off when they went to drug extremes, right? 

You were and are a druggie.

Basile was a druggie.

Goodrum was a trenbolone freak, believe it or not.

Where are these natural bodybuilders you speak of?

I desire to see freaks? What about you? Yes, you only post about Eugen Sandow and his contemporaries, because when drugs were introduced it became a freak show that holds no interest for you.

[Howard]

I didn't miss shit....you were part of a committee that voted to implement drug testing. You went about it half-assed. Charles Durr failed your test and then teabagged the lot of you and not one of the "committee" had the sack to stand up to him. Drug use is prevalent in BBing because that is where the "image based" profits are made. Supplements, books and magazine sales etc. are driven by the goal of the "unattainable" physique. People pay to see the freaks....no one is interested in attending a BBing show where the contestants look like long distance swimmers.

If the schmoe Weiders couldn't (or didn't want to) remove drugs from BBing what made you think you could?

wtf? the underwritters of the insurance policy to cover damages was "sport disney".
Nobody sued me or the AAU America comm, directly ,you idiot.
Disney paid Durr a settlement and kept it our of court and THEN dropped BB from its' list of sports.

If freaks are the popular deal, then how come female BB is pretty low in appeal compred to figure and fitness babes?

[wes]

The stench of both the flotsam and jetsam are strong in Howards redundancy !! 

[Howard]

The stench of both the flotsam and jetsam are strong in Howards redundancy !! 

That was great, good one!
Ok on serious note, I am rode hard and put up wet on this drugs in BB issue....for now.

I am no pro or top national level BB , so drugs in BB really doesn't effect my personal BB life.
Now, when I fart badly after taking a dump and my wife has to use the same bathroom...that effects her life, let me tell ya

[Les Grossman]

wtf? the underwritters of the insurance policy to cover damages was "sport disney".
Nobody sued me or the AAU America comm, directly ,you idiot.
Disney paid Durr a settlement and kept it our of court and THEN dropped BB from its' list of sports.

If freaks are the popular deal, then how come female BB is pretty low in appeal compred to figure and fitness babes?

You're obviously retarded or senile....or both.

And if you need it spelled out, why hot woman have more appeal than drug-filled shemales, then I'd prefer you just die in a fire...preferably head first.

Jesus H. Christ, I wish stupidity caused pain.

[FREAKgeek]

It's only a matter of time when Getbig will give Basile a complete mental breakdown.

[Vince B]

Howard, make sure you start a thread when I am not asleep. Check the time zone for Sydney, Australia. Also, could you change the spelling of my name in the title. Click on modify.

I recall that Jay Cutler challenged his positive drug test in the IFBB and because they didn't use an accredited lab Jay won his case and retained his prize money and title. From that time no real testing has been done. So it appears that drug testing is expensive and litigation re that testing is even more expensive.

We know that other sports and the Olympic movement does testing so it can't be impossible to do properly. Perhaps the AAU tried to save money and presumed the muscleheads were dopes and would accept the results.

Some have posted that they want to see freeks. That is fine but they have to pass strict tests both during competition and out of competition. That is the only way to clean up this sport. Yes, the huge guys are impressive but the sport is not. If we remove the drugs we should transcend the criticism against us and become more popular than we can imagine. I remember when the Mr Olympia was broadcast nationally as a sport. Those days seem long gone and the way drugs are accepted today there is no way it will return.

The sport is run by thug-minded individuals who stick together and are more or less appointed. Bob C is merely the tip of the unsavoury iceberg. Getbiggers who agree with drug use will not be the kind of people who should be running the sport. It is about time drugs were jettisoned into the discard bin.

[Howard]

You're obviously retarded or senile....or both.

And if you need it spelled out, why hot woman have more appeal than drug-filled shemales, then I'd prefer you just die in a fire...preferably head first.

Jesus H. Christ, I wish stupidity caused pain.

Les, your reply was funny as hell and I am still laughing my ass off.
LOL classic line " ...wish stupdity caused pain" hehehehe
Great example of a classic getbig crack on another poster by clever funny wit

[Howard]

Howard, make sure you start a thread when I am not asleep. Check the time zone for Sydney, Australia. Also, could you change the spelling of my name in the title. Click on modify.

I recall that Jay Cutler challenged his positive drug test in the IFBB and because they didn't use an accredited lab Jay won his case and retained his prize money and title. From that time no real testing has been done. So it appears that drug testing is expensive and litigation re that testing is even more expensive.

We know that other sports and the Olympic movement does testing so it can't be impossible to do properly. Perhaps the AAU tried to save money and presumed the muscleheads were dopes and would accept the results.

Some have posted that they want to see freeks. That is fine but they have to pass strict tests both during competition and out of competition. That is the only way to clean up this sport. Yes, the huge guys are impressive but the sport is not. If we remove the drugs we should transcend the criticism against us and become more popular than we can imagine. I remember when the Mr Olympia was broadcast nationally as a sport. Those days seem long gone and the way drugs are accepted today there is no way it will return.

The sport is run by thug-minded individuals who stick together and are more or less appointed. Bob C is merely the tip of the unsavoury iceberg. Getbiggers who agree with drug use will not be the kind of people who should be running the sport. It is about time drugs were jettisoned into the discard bin.

Vince , with all due respect , I think you are taking this way too serious my friend. Just go workout, hit a contest and enjoy the scene for what it is. Besides most hardcore types would rather see the ship go down then have it be a success drug free.
The ironic thing , lots of juicemonkeys will never win a national title like YOU did. take care my friend

[The Ugly]

The sport is run by thug-minded individuals

"Sport," that's good. Are you being cheeky?

Do Australians get cheeky?

[Vince B]

Howard, I honestly believe the sport is ruined. How can we stand by and do nothing? They say that when the good men don't participate the bad men take over. Well, look at the mess in bodybuilding. Who is responsible? Everyone who condones all the drugs and cheating re augmenting the body in some way.

Things have changed but when are they going to return to some degree of sanity? I think it is sad that intelligent, experienced guys go along with the current practices. I suppose the honest truth is those drugs have spoiled bodybuilding and made titles and trophies worthless.

[Howard]

Howard, I honestly believe the sport is ruined. How can we stand by and do nothing? They say that when the good men don't participate the bad men take over. Well, look at the mess in bodybuilding. Who is responsible? Everyone who condones all the drugs and cheating re augmenting the body in some way.

Things have changed but when are they going to return to some degree of sanity? I think it is sad that intelligent, experienced guys go along with the current practices. I suppose the honest truth is those drugs have spoiled bodybuilding and made titles and trophies worthless.

Vince, You can't usher in chanage when the vast majority are VERY much against it.
           I went to the regional NPC meeting 17 yrs ago and made a motion that we do a basic urine test for the 1st place winners only' in each state meet. It not only got voted down 99% against, if looks were any indication of hate, they wanted to  kill me. hehe.
I have come to the conclusion that the steroid issue is some kind of addiction in the hardcore camp.
Telling them to quit useing is like telling a flat chested babe with implants, to remove them. The extreme drug useing crowd can't imagine BB without drugs. Many honestly feel drugs are as common and required as wts and the gym are to build muscle.
It is what it is Vince and for me it is a fun hobby , no more, no less.

[jwb]

did you take drugs when you competed howard?

[Mr Nobody]

Post your drug pricelist howard

X2 and PTPS

[Howard]

Howard, I honestly believe the sport is ruined. How can we stand by and do nothing? They say that when the good men don't participate the bad men take over. Well, look at the mess in bodybuilding. Who is responsible? Everyone who condones all the drugs and cheating re augmenting the body in some way.

Things have changed but when are they going to return to some degree of sanity? I think it is sad that intelligent, experienced guys go along with the current practices. I suppose the honest truth is those drugs have spoiled bodybuilding and made titles and trophies worthless.

Vince you may be right but it won't help you enjoy BB. You won a decent title in your prime and like anything else things change over time. My advice for you is to :
1. Simply accept BB for what it is, go to some contests, work out and keep it as a fun hobby that changed, etc
2. Move on to other sports of interest. In my case,  I really enjoy running now. I suck as a 5k runner, but I enjoy the feeling I get from running. I have seen ex bodybuilders get into cycling as well.

[Howard]

did you take drugs when you competed howard?

I did from 83  to 87. After that by my own choice I competed in mostly UNtested shows wiithout juicing 88-95.
I did one drug at a time in moderate amounts. I am too cheap to spend much on juice and figured I wasn't going pro after a couple yrs on the sauce. I just wasn't good enough with or without drugs.

[Vince B]

I talked to Ryan Laos who trains at my gym. He won a natural Mr Australia and Mr World. There is no way he can compete with the professionals who take drugs. He accepts that they do that and people like to see giants. However, it isn't a level playing field and why shouldn't natural guys like Ryan have a chance to be Mr Olympia?

I told him I would like to change things and do away with all the drugs. Test entrants for drugs and substances, and do this out of competition randomly during the year. Polygraph all competitors, too. Positive tests will result in being banned for life. Anyone competing has to sign a statement agreeing that they will never compete in bodybuilding again, in any other contests, if they test positive or fail the polygraph.

Start this in 2011 at all shows. Bad luck to all the professionals as that is a lifestyle no sensible person would elect to do. Bodybuilding has been ruined and just because the professionals accept it is no reason for everyone to accept it. If we respect sports and athletes who are drug tested then we should have the same standards in bodybuilding. Marion Jones had to give up her Olympic medals because she cheated.

[Topskin69]

I talked to Ryan Laos who trains at my gym. He won a natural Mr Australia and Mr World. There is no way he can compete with the professionals who take drugs. He accepts that they do that and people like to see giants. However, it isn't a level playing field and why shouldn't natural guys like Ryan have a chance to be Mr Olympia?

I told him I would like to change things and do away with all the drugs. Test entrants for drugs and substances, and do this out of competition randomly during the year. Polygraph all competitors, too. Positive tests will result in being banned for life. Anyone competing has to sign a statement agreeing that they will never compete in bodybuilding again, in any other contests, if they test positive or fail the polygraph.

Start this in 2011 at all shows. Bad luck to all the professionals as that is a lifestyle no sensible person would elect to do. Bodybuilding has been ruined and just because the professionals accept it is no reason for everyone to accept it. If we respect sports and athletes who are drug tested then we should have the same standards in bodybuilding. Marion Jones had to give up her Olympic medals because she cheated.

Vince you fail to comprehend that without an audience, one does not have a sport, or anything else for that matter. No one wants to see what is pedestrian, or ordinary, one wants to see what is beyond human, you can apply this to many things in life, especially bodybuilding.

No one gives a rats ass about Natural bodybuilding....remove the drugs, remove the freak factor, remove the audience, and one will successfully remove the "sport."

Now perhaps you can go back to the drawing board, and offer some more pragmatic suggestions.

[Howard]

I talked to Ryan Laos who trains at my gym. He won a natural Mr Australia and Mr World. There is no way he can compete with the professionals who take drugs. He accepts that they do that and people like to see giants. However, it isn't a level playing field and why shouldn't natural guys like Ryan have a chance to be Mr Olympia?

I told him I would like to change things and do away with all the drugs. Test entrants for drugs and substances, and do this out of competition randomly during the year. Polygraph all competitors, too. Positive tests will result in being banned for life. Anyone competing has to sign a statement agreeing that they will never compete in bodybuilding again, in any other contests, if they test positive or fail the polygraph.

Start this in 2011 at all shows. Bad luck to all the professionals as that is a lifestyle no sensible person would elect to do. Bodybuilding has been ruined and just because the professionals accept it is no reason for everyone to accept it. If we respect sports and athletes who are drug tested then we should have the same standards in bodybuilding. Marion Jones had to give up her Olympic medals because she cheated.

I admire your drive and effort to change this.I lack the desire or energy to get back involved with BB on any official basis.I prefer to do my own thing , my way and enjoy the sport , as is, for better or worse.
I simply don't care enough to spend a lot of time, money or personal resource on this issue.
I sincerely admire you for putting in the personal effort to change things on an official basis in Aussie BB.

[Howard]

Vince you fail to comprehend that without an audience, one does not have a sport, or anything else for that matter. No one wants to see what is pedestrian, or ordinary, one wants to see what is beyond human, you can apply this to many things in life, especially bodybuilding.

No one gives a rats ass about Natural bodybuilding....remove the drugs, remove the freak factor, remove the audience, and one will successfully remove the "sport."

Now perhaps you can go back to the drawing board, and offer some more pragmatic suggestions.

If Vince B is in an OFFICIAL position to change drug policy in sanctioned BB contests in Australia, it will happen.
If he is merely experessing his opinion, NOTHING much will happen and that is why I advised him to just do his own thing and enjoy the sport as is.

[Van_Bilderass]

I talked to Ryan Laos who trains at my gym. He won a natural Mr Australia and Mr World. There is no way he can compete with the professionals who take drugs. He accepts that they do that and people like to see giants. However, it isn't a level playing field and why shouldn't natural guys like Ryan have a chance to be Mr Olympia?

You are such a retard. That guy is far from natural or drug free. He saw that you were a little "special" so he had no problem lying to your face.

Here's Ryan talking about himself. Ryan knows there's no test for it in bodybuilding, he knows where he can buy it (at the pub).

Everyone's at it: Mr World
DAVID SYGALL
March 14, 2010

The first Australian to be crowned the Mr World of natural bodybuilding says sports authorities are in denial if they believe Australia's elite athletes aren't cheating by using human growth hormone.

Ryan Laos, a life-time drug-free bodybuilder, says the expensive HGH, which is available by prescription as an anti-ageing drug - and which actor Sylvester Stallone was caught with at Sydney airport in 2007 - is easily obtainable on the black market and believes claims that it doesn't enhance performance in rugby league are ''a load of rubbish''.

''It would be totally stupid to think that there aren't people in elite sports who have been using HGH for many years,'' Laos said.
Advertisement: Story continues below

AFL last week became the first Australian sporting code to implement blood-testing for HGH.

However, rugby league is yet to follow. It is set to become a tricky issue after Wakefield hooker Terry Newton was banned for two years by England's Rugby Football League after testing positive to HGH, the first such result in any code.

The league's executive chairman, Richard Lewis, said England strongly supported blood testing - the only way to identify HGH - in addition to the range of urine-based testing. But the NRL is still deliberating.

''There are plenty of people who say that [HGH] is not a threat for rugby league,'' NRL spokesman John Brady said. ''Some of our advice is that, by nature of what it does, [HGH] is going to suit an athlete in AFL more than league because it's more aerobic. There are others who say it can't be taken without steroids and if you take it with steroids you'll test positive anyway.''

Brady said the tests were expensive - about $600 each - and the NRL didn't want to spend a lot on low-risk testing at the expense of higher-risk areas.

The reason HGH is so hard to detect is because growth hormones occur naturally.

''So if you find it in a sample the person can say it's just natural,'' said an endocrinologist, associate professor Tony O'Sullivan, from the University of NSW's St George Clinical School.

Hard to detect, but not hard to buy. Laos said that finding hormones was no harder than finding illicit drugs.

''It's available all over the place,'' he said. ''You can ask in a pub and you'll probably get someone carrying steroids or HGH, just like they might have cocaine or ecstasy.''

And it's no cheaper. Laos said the people he knew who use HGH spent about 10 times as much as they would on anabolic steroids, precluding many bodybuilders from using it.

''In other sports there might be people earning a lot of money and they can afford it and they can get away with it,'' Laos said.

As in league or, until now, AFL. And the indications are interesting.

''There's some footy players who will say they've put on eight or 10 kilos in the off-season,'' Laos said. ''You think to yourself, 'Bloody hell, how did you do that?'

''Then you see them with their shirt off and they're lean. They haven't put on fat. I don't want to accuse anyone but for an intermediate or advanced trainer, you can only gain up to three kilos of lean muscle per year. A beginner might put on 10 kilos quickly, but not someone who's been training for a while.''

Richard Ings, chief executive of Australian Sports Anti-Doping Authority, said the authority had the ability under legislation to test athletes any time anywhere, as a urine test or blood test, and did not need permission from the sport.

''When AFL says they've agreed to testing for these substances, it means that they've agreed to fund it,'' he said. ''What kind of tests the rugby league chooses to fund or not is entirely up to them. It's a difficult drug to test for.''

Another big problem with HGH testing is that it clears the body within a day or two; if testers are going to catch a cheat they need to have intelligence about when the drug is being used so they can catch the person in time.

On Thursday, the authority announced a two-year ban on 2008 International Sport Kickboxing Association welterweight world champion Andrew Keogh for possession and use of HGH. In December 2008, Queensland Police found Keogh in possession of HGH. He pleaded guilty to possessing dangerous drugs on January 21, 2009.

DRUGS STOLEN

UNIVERSITY of NSW associate professor Tony O'Sullivan was trying to study the effects of human growth hormone when he fell victim to the drug's black market..

The steroid hormones expert was set to commence a study into growth hormones 15 years ago but the supply never arrived.

''It was only a small amount and it doesn't necessarily mean that it was stolen for use by sportsmen, it could have been used by bodybuilders or whatever,'' O'Sullivan said. ''But I suspect it was stolen by someone who wanted to sell it on the market. That's what happens,'' he said.

[Vince B]

I watched Ryan on TV last week. He talks to a lot of guys so they tell him stuff. He is a genuine guy and doesn't bs. He has been training hard in our gym for many, many years now and at no time did he gain size quickly.

As far as I am concerned he is fair dinkum and drugfree.

[Chick]

Howard, I honestly believe the sport is ruined. How can we stand by and do nothing? They say that when the good men don't participate the bad men take over. Well, look at the mess in bodybuilding. Who is responsible? Everyone who condones all the drugs and cheating re augmenting the body in some way.

Things have changed but when are they going to return to some degree of sanity? I think it is sad that intelligent, experienced guys go along with the current practices. I suppose the honest truth is those drugs have spoiled bodybuilding and made titles and trophies worthless.

Just what do you consider "some degree of sanity", Basile?  Maybe only using SOME drugs like you did?

[Vince G, CSN MFT]

You were and are a druggie.

Basile was a druggie.

Goodrum was a trenbolone freak, believe it or not.

Where are these natural bodybuilders you speak of?

I desire to see freaks? What about you? Yes, you only post about Eugen Sandow and his contemporaries, because when drugs were introduced it became a freak show that holds no interest for you.

I used steroids for my job doing security work and as a correctional officer and I haven't used any gear in 9 years nor have I ever used it in any bodybuilding competition.

In any event, I wasn't a tren freak and didn't use that much.  It was 50 mg every other day with a gentle touch of Anavar.

[Van_Bilderass]

I used steroids for my job doing security work and as a correctional officer and I haven't used any gear in 9 years nor have I ever used it in any bodybuilding competition.

In any event, I wasn't a tren freak and didn't use that much.  It was 50 mg every other day with a gentle touch of Anavar.

I was just kidding. I think you're one of the few who says they have used but actually haven't.

Can you name the brand of Anavar you claim you used?