Author Topic: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"  (Read 1742 times)

Soul Crusher

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Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« on: June 29, 2010, 12:32:30 PM »
Kagan: Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases
Associated Press ^ | June 29, 2010


Posted on Tuesday, June 29, 2010 3:26:59 PM by Free ThinkerNY

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Supreme Court nominee Elena Kagan says foreign law could be useful "for getting good ideas" when interpreting the U.S. Constitution but that justices should not feel bound by it.

Kagan was speaking Tuesday in response to questioning by Republican Sen. Charles Grassley on the role of international law in U.S. courts, which some conservatives oppose.


(Excerpt) Read more at hosted.ap.org ...


________________________ ____________________

Palin is more important.   ::)  ::)

Good job obama voters.  Kagan makes harriet meirs look great by comparison. 

kcballer

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #1 on: June 29, 2010, 12:34:11 PM »
Yes it could be important but as she said it's personal preference.  What you think judges aren't influenced by what's going on around them?  They are people you know, not robots.

You're clutching at straws here if that's all you have. 
Abandon every hope...

Soul Crusher

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #2 on: June 29, 2010, 12:35:52 PM »
Yes it could be important but as she said it's personal preference.  What you think judges aren't influenced by what's going on around them?  They are people you know, not robots.

You're clutching at straws here if that's all you have. 


Good, when you go to court and try to enforce a contract and the judge rules against you citing a case in pakistan or iran, while the us law would have favored your position, lets see your reaction. 

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #3 on: June 29, 2010, 12:37:10 PM »

Good, when you go to court and try to enforce a contract and the judge rules against you citing a case in pakistan or iran, while the us law would have favored your position, lets see your reaction. 

hahaha nice over reaction there buddy.  Swing and a miss 
Abandon every hope...

LurkerNoMore

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #4 on: June 29, 2010, 12:50:10 PM »
hahaha nice over reaction there buddy.  Swing and a miss 

Exactly.

The article he posted himself doesn't say that foreign law WILL be used to decided US cases.

As usual... epic fear mongering failure.

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #5 on: June 29, 2010, 12:51:29 PM »
Exactly.

The article he posted himself doesn't say that foreign law WILL be used to decided US cases.

As usual... epic fear mongering failure.

 ::)  ::)

The fat dyke you supported Sotomayor lied in her hearings re: the 2nd amendment and we have no reason whatsoever to believe that this hag will be any different.   

kcballer

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #6 on: June 29, 2010, 12:52:50 PM »
Exactly.

The article he posted himself doesn't say that foreign law WILL be used to decided US cases.

As usual... epic fear mongering failure.

Exactly.  All she's saying is what everyone does - have influence from outside sources.  Sh*t judges can be influenced by what a defendant wears to court or the lawyers voice or tone.  Law is subjective and all she's saying is that influences from other countries could be helpful especially when deciding something that has no case law history in america.  

But typical 333 over reacts.
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LurkerNoMore

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #7 on: June 29, 2010, 12:54:58 PM »

But typical 333 over reacts.

Yep.

He can't do or post anything without a whine slant to it.  WANGBC.

Oh look!!!  The sky is falling.


tu_holmes

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #8 on: June 29, 2010, 12:57:51 PM »
Our entire foundation of Law is based on foreign law.

Magna Carta, also called Magna Carta Libertatum (the Great Charter of Liberty), is an English legal charter, originally issued in the year 1215. It was written in Latin  and is known by its Latin name. The usual English translation of Magna Carta is Great Charter.

Magna Carta required King John of England to proclaim certain rights (pertaining to freemen), respect certain legal procedures, and accept that his will could be bound by the law. It explicitly protected certain rights of the King's subjects, whether free or fettered — and implicitly supported what became the writ of habeas corpus, allowing appeal against unlawful imprisonment.

Magna Carta was arguably [according to whom?]the most significant [citation needed] early influence on the extensive historical process that led to the rule of constitutional law today in the English speaking world. However, it was "far from unique, either in content or form" [1]. Magna Carta influenced the development of the common law [citation needed] and many constitutional documents, including the United States Constitution.[2] Many clauses were renewed throughout the Middle Ages, and continued to be renewed as late as the 18th century. By the second half of the 19th century, however, most clauses in their original form had been repealed from English law.

Magna Carta was the first document forced onto an English King by a group of his subjects (the barons) in an attempt to limit his powers by law and protect their privileges. It was preceded by the 1100 Charter of Liberties in which King Henry I voluntarily stated that his own powers were under the law.

In practice, Magna Carta in the medieval period mostly did not limit the power of Kings; but by the time of the English Civil War it had become an important symbol for those who wished to show that the King was bound by the law.

Magna Carta is normally understood to refer to a single document, that of 1215. Various amended versions of Magna Carta appeared in subsequent years however, and it is the 1297 version which remains on the statute books of England and Wales.

Magna Carta's "fame is primarily due, however, not to its intrinsic merits but the use parliamentarians made of it in their struggle with the Stuarts in the Seventeenth Century and the export of this myth to New England by the early settlers"[3].

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #9 on: June 29, 2010, 12:58:55 PM »
Yep.

He can't do or post anything without a whine slant to it.  WANGBC.

Oh look!!!  The sky is falling.



Two uninformed left wing dolts chipe in.  When assessing a case, you are supposed to look at legal precedent, the case law, the congressional intent, and the U.S. Constitution, not what Kenya does.  

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #10 on: June 29, 2010, 01:01:56 PM »
Our entire foundation of Law is based on foreign law.

Magna Carta, also called Magna Carta Libertatum (the Great Charter of Liberty), is an English legal charter, originally issued in the year 1215. It was written in Latin  and is known by its Latin name. The usual English translation of Magna Carta is Great Charter.

Magna Carta required King John of England to proclaim certain rights (pertaining to freemen), respect certain legal procedures, and accept that his will could be bound by the law. It explicitly protected certain rights of the King's subjects, whether free or fettered — and implicitly supported what became the writ of habeas corpus, allowing appeal against unlawful imprisonment.

Magna Carta was arguably [according to whom?]the most significant [citation needed] early influence on the extensive historical process that led to the rule of constitutional law today in the English speaking world. However, it was "far from unique, either in content or form" [1]. Magna Carta influenced the development of the common law [citation needed] and many constitutional documents, including the United States Constitution.[2] Many clauses were renewed throughout the Middle Ages, and continued to be renewed as late as the 18th century. By the second half of the 19th century, however, most clauses in their original form had been repealed from English law.

Magna Carta was the first document forced onto an English King by a group of his subjects (the barons) in an attempt to limit his powers by law and protect their privileges. It was preceded by the 1100 Charter of Liberties in which King Henry I voluntarily stated that his own powers were under the law.

In practice, Magna Carta in the medieval period mostly did not limit the power of Kings; but by the time of the English Civil War it had become an important symbol for those who wished to show that the King was bound by the law.

Magna Carta is normally understood to refer to a single document, that of 1215. Various amended versions of Magna Carta appeared in subsequent years however, and it is the 1297 version which remains on the statute books of England and Wales.

Magna Carta's "fame is primarily due, however, not to its intrinsic merits but the use parliamentarians made of it in their struggle with the Stuarts in the Seventeenth Century and the export of this myth to New England by the early settlers"[3].

Sorry Tu, go to law school like George W. and myself and get back us. 

What she was referring to is seeking a political solution to an issue where she can not find a legal one in American law.  This is all to seek a pre-determined outcome when the legal precedent disagrees with what she wants to be the outcome. 

You guys have absolutley no clue how dangerous this is. 

       

kcballer

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #11 on: June 29, 2010, 01:02:51 PM »
Two uninformed left wing dolts chipe in.  When assessing a case, you are supposed to look at legal precedent, the case law, the congressional intent, and the U.S. Constitution, not what Kenya does.  

What cases have you tried 333?
Abandon every hope...

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #12 on: June 29, 2010, 01:04:43 PM »
::)  ::)

The fat dyke you supported Sotomayor lied in her hearings re: the 2nd amendment and we have no reason whatsoever to believe that this hag will be any different.   

can't believe that vote was 5-4  :( should have been 9-0

if Obama gets to pick more radical judges our constitution will be dismantled
RIP Bob Probert

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #13 on: June 29, 2010, 01:04:43 PM »
So let me see.She kicks military recruiters off of Harvards campus because SHE disagrees with dont as dont tell.After she is resoundly overturned by the supreme court,she then allows access and actually has the balls in the hearings today to say she respects the military.

This alone should disqualify her as a candidate.However,the reason no republican should vote for her is because the little community organiser voted against both Roberts and Alito,BOTH of whom were FAR more qualified then Kagen and Sotomyor.Republicans should simply apply the same standards to Obamas appointees that he applies.They are liberals,therefore they dont get on the court.Just as he voted againt both Roberts and Alito simply because they were conservative[and white].Perhaps Obama was pissed off because Roberts makes him look like a light weight.

tu_holmes

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #14 on: June 29, 2010, 01:06:43 PM »
Sorry Tu, go to law school like George W. and myself and get back us. 

What she was referring to is seeking a political solution to an issue where she can not find a legal one in American law.  This is all to seek a pre-determined outcome when the legal precedent disagrees with what she wants to be the outcome. 

You guys have absolutley no clue how dangerous this is. 

       

I think you are over reacting to be honest.

We often site international law when it comes to human rights and things of that nature... And we expect other countries in the western world to also abide by our laws when it comes to certain things.

I think in this instance you are making a mountain out of a molehill.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #15 on: June 29, 2010, 01:07:23 PM »
What cases have you tried 333?

I have tried cases on the NYS State level, handled a few appeals, have a few Federal cases going, and took classes in Con Law in law school.

How about you KC?  

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #16 on: June 29, 2010, 01:09:35 PM »
1) I dislike kagan

2) This argument is silly - our entire system is based on foreign law, as are most societies dating back to, well, the code of hammurabi (sp?) the first law set?

3) Epic attempt to label her as foreign loving, american hating because she studies what works/fails in other nations.  Sad move by repubs who know she's getting the job and they can't stop it because they ran two goats in 2008 and backed bush, resulting in so many lost house/senate seats...

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #17 on: June 29, 2010, 01:13:02 PM »
I think you are over reacting to be honest.

We often site international law when it comes to human rights and things of that nature... And we expect other countries in the western world to also abide by our laws when it comes to certain things.

I think in this instance you are making a mountain out of a molehill.

You are confusing two things.    

The congress passing law that conforms to international norms can be in conformance with the U.S. Con.  For example, banning the death penalty, etc.    

That is not what she is saying.  A perfect example is lets say the AZ law on immigration comes before the court and the U.S. legal precedent says its ok for whatsoever reason.  And following u.s. legal precedent, the justices should uphold the law, however she seeks a different outcome.  What she is saying is that she should or think its useful to look at foreign law to decide how to rule on a case as to whether its constitutional or not.  

That's judicial anarchy, not legal process.    

kcballer

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #18 on: June 29, 2010, 01:13:19 PM »
I have tried cases on the NYS State level, handled a few appeals, have a few Federal cases going, and took classes in Con Law in law school.

How about you KC?  

So you're a former judge?
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Soul Crusher

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #19 on: June 29, 2010, 01:14:42 PM »
1) I dislike kagan

2) This argument is silly - our entire system is based on foreign law, as are most societies dating back to, well, the code of hammurabi (sp?) the first law set?

3) Epic attempt to label her as foreign loving, american hating because she studies what works/fails in other nations.  Sad move by repubs who know she's getting the job and they can't stop it because they ran two goats in 2008 and backed bush, resulting in so many lost house/senate seats...

Ok moron - please find me one U.S. Sup Ct ruling citing the code of hammurabi as the justification for its ruling.   ::)  ::)

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #20 on: June 29, 2010, 01:21:45 PM »
whats wrong with american constitutional law??  does it make too much sense ?
down with hussein

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #21 on: June 29, 2010, 01:24:26 PM »
1) I dislike kagan

2) This argument is silly - our entire system is based on foreign law, as are most societies dating back to, well, the code of hammurabi (sp?) the first law set?

3) Epic attempt to label her as foreign loving, american hating because she studies what works/fails in other nations.  Sad move by repubs who know she's getting the job and they can't stop it because they ran two goats in 2008 and backed bush, resulting in so many lost house/senate seats...

No she hates Americas military.She proved that all by herself.Backed Bush?You mean the guy that won two terms?

Soul Crusher

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #22 on: June 29, 2010, 01:26:29 PM »
So when this the U.S. Const has the 2nd Amend this hag is saying she can look to foreign laws for "good ideas" in ways to invalidate it based on her political views, not legal views. 

You morons are so ignorant of basic civics and education on these issues its scary.   

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #23 on: June 29, 2010, 01:30:20 PM »
Ok moron - please find me one U.S. Sup Ct ruling citing the code of hammurabi as the justification for its ruling.   ::)  ::)

I said it was based on foreign law leading back to the C of H.  And yes, there are a lot of similarities:

Um, eye for an eye?
All men created equal?
False accusations?
Building regulations?
Unborn having rights?
Medical malpractice?


I was a poli sci major for a year ;)

Soul Crusher

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Re: Kagan: "Foreign law can be useful in deciding cases"
« Reply #24 on: June 29, 2010, 01:32:43 PM »
I said it was based on foreign law leading back to the C of H.  And yes, there are a lot of similarities:

Um, eye for an eye?
All men created equal?
False accusations?
Building regulations?
Unborn having rights?
Medical malpractice?


I was a poli sci major for a year ;)

Guess what, I went through law school and have spent years reading on these issues. 

The Sup. Ct have never issued a ruling citing the code of hammurabi as the basis of its decision. 

Good try at kneepadding Kagan though.