Forever 21 Promoting Teen Pregnancy?

[kcballer]

Oh please, the stigma you just attached to planned parenthood shows exactly why kids don't go in there to get condoms.  Nor do schools hand them out, they can provide access to them but they are still stigmatized by people just like you.  It's the same argument that was made about prostitution in thailand and how giving them condoms wouldn't work because the men in the heat of the moment would refuse.  What they found was quite the opposite actually and it reduced HIV rates massively.  Educate and give access to condoms and IT DOES WORK at reducing pregnancy and STI infections.  Unless you'll argue teens are somehow hornier than thais looking to get laid by a prostitute 

[Dos Equis]

Oh please, the stigma you just attached to planned parenthood shows exactly why kids don't go in there to get condoms.  Nor do schools hand them out, they can provide access to them but they are still stigmatized by people just like you.  It's the same argument that was made about prostitution in thailand and how giving them condoms wouldn't work because the men in the heat of the moment would refuse.  What they found was quite the opposite actually and it reduced HIV rates massively.  Educate and give access to condoms and IT DOES WORK at reducing pregnancy and STI infections.  Unless you'll argue teens are somehow hornier than thais looking to get laid by a prostitute 

I'm to blame for kids not using condoms?  lol.  . . .     Absurd.  If you can't see how prevalent condoms are in this society you are being willfully blind.  They're everywhere.  Access is not the problem.  Awareness is not the problem.  The problem is consistent use.  Period.  The promotion of condoms as some sort of pregnancy prevention is disingenuous and has simply not worked.   

We're talking about teenaged boys and girls and pregnancy prevention, not adults having sex with prostitutes in Thailand.  In case you haven't noticed, although men can be really stupid, there is a little difference between a teenaged boy and a man. 

There is also the issue of what's best for kids.  Kids shouldn't be having sex.  They're not ready for the consequences.  It's an adult activity with adult consequences.

And no, I don’t like the abortion mill Planned Parenthood.  Despicable organization.  Just pull up any number of the threads Colossus or I have created that shows the lengths that group will pursue to perform abortions, including covering up rape, encouraging girls to lie, etc.  But that’s the subject for another thread. 

[drkaje]

The only "safe sex" is sex between married couples.  Condoms are an abject failure.  Kids will not consistently use them.  But that horse has been beaten to death on the board. 

Used properly condoms are very effective.

Anyone, regardless of age, who cannot figure out how to use condoms or BCPs is too stupid to have kids anyways.

[Dos Equis]

Used properly condoms are very effective.

Anyone, regardless of age, who cannot figure out how to use condoms or BCPs is too stupid to have kids anyways.

Except that (consistent, proper use) doesn't happen and will never happen.   

[drkaje]

Except that (consistent, proper use) doesn't happen and will never happen.   

So no one should use them?!

Marriage ain't magic, FFS! It doesn't stop people from being stupid, cure cancer, magically imbue parenting skills, or automatically make sex safe. People are still whoever/whatever they were, just legally tied to someone else. Two people with Down's Syndrome can marry, pop out a bunch of kids and need additional services until the day they die! Having the capacity to marry and working genitals doesn't mean someone will be a great parent.

People should really question the motives of those who argue for control over reproductive rights based upon religious dogma.

[kcballer]

So no one should use them?!

Marriage ain't magic, FFS! It doesn't stop people from being stupid, cure cancer, magically imbue parenting skills, or automatically make sex safe. People are still whoever/whatever they were, just legally tied to someone else. Two people with Down's Syndrome can marry, pop out a bunch of kids and need additional services until the day they die! Having the capacity to marry and working genitals doesn't mean someone will be a great parent.

People should really question the motives of those who argue for control over reproductive rights based upon religious dogma.

Good post.  What beach doesn't get is the 'condoms don't work' is a self fulfilling prophecy.  The access and stigma around it is still there, just look at how he views planned parenthood.  Perhaps less teens would get abortions if people like beach weren't so foolish as to believe condoms don't work.  Maybe that's why we need better sex ed and less religious intervention in schools, maybe that's why teens should be given free condoms no questions asked, maybe that's why we still have this issue of teen pregnancy and STI rates because instead of progressing forward, we're going backwards against science and against common sense. 

[brooklynbruiser]

Newmom started a war! I still say Forever 21 should sell 'em if they can.

[drkaje]

Newmom started a war! I still say Forever 21 should sell 'em if they can.

She's quite the rabble rouser.

[Dos Equis]

So no one should use them?!

Marriage ain't magic, FFS! It doesn't stop people from being stupid, cure cancer, magically imbue parenting skills, or automatically make sex safe. People are still whoever/whatever they were, just legally tied to someone else. Two people with Down's Syndrome can marry, pop out a bunch of kids and need additional services until the day they die! Having the capacity to marry and working genitals doesn't mean someone will be a great parent.

People should really question the motives of those who argue for control over reproductive rights based upon religious dogma.

I didn't say no one should use them.  What I've said is teenaged boys will not consistently use them, so trying to promote them as some form of birth control and/or STD prevention is disingenuous. 

Marriage isn't magic, but it's part of the foundation of our society.  Marriage is where lots of great things can happen:  a good relationship, kids, and the most fun of all – safe sex.   

I never said getting married means someone will be a great parent.  I didn't mention "reproductive rights" or religion.  I assume you're just on your soap box, because you certainly are not responding to, or summarizing, anything I've said. 

[drkaje]

I didn't say no one should use them.  What I've said is teenaged boys will not consistently use them, so trying to promote them as some form of birth control and/or STD prevention is disingenuous. 

Marriage isn't magic, but it's part of the foundation of our society.  Marriage is where lots of great things can happen:  a good relationship, kids, and the most fun of all – safe sex.   

I never said getting married means someone will be a great parent.  I didn't mention "reproductive rights" or religion.  I assume you're just on your soap box, because you certainly are not responding to, or summarizing, anything I've said. 

How can something this silly

Except that (consistent, proper use) doesn't happen and will never happen.

be summarized?

I guess pretending any teen sex is a case of poor moral foundation or inability to adhere to parental guidance is better than saying "Proper condom use can reduce the risk of pregnancy and disease".

You wrote married sex was safer and there's no merit to that statement whatsoever. It simply can't even be argued.

Foundation of our society is more wishful thinking or longing for the good old days than some debatable fact. Certainly family is important but arguing the simple act of being married means people have a working, functional family unit is more or less confusing faith with fact. I can see wanting/needing to believe it's true, just not imposing it upon others through legislation.

[Dos Equis]

How can something this silly  be summarized?

I guess pretending any teen sex is a case of poor moral foundation or inability to adhere to parental guidance is better than saying "Proper condom use can reduce the risk of pregnancy and disease".

You wrote married sex was safer and there's no merit to that statement whatsoever. It simply can't even be argued.

Foundation of our society is more wishful thinking or longing for the good old days than some debatable fact. Certainly family is important but arguing the simple act of being married means people have a working, functional family unit is more or less confusing faith with fact. I can see wanting/needing to believe it's true, just not imposing it upon others through legislation.

It's pretty easy to summarize or respond to a specific comment, rather than just making stuff up.     My opinion on the failure of condoms has been repeatedly stated in this thread (and others).  You disagree.  That's fine. 

No merit to safe sex within the confines of marriage?  I don't need to argue this.  It's a fact.  Two people in a good marriage will only have sex with each other, which makes the chance of contracting an STD pretty close to zero. 

You're completely distorting my comments.  I didn't say marriage is a panacea.  I said marriage is where a lot of good things can happen.  Note the qualifier "can."  In other words, not every marriage will be a good one.  Not every spouse will be faithful.  But the fact is marriage is one of the bedrocks of our society and the main reason our society continues to exist.  It's where beautiful things CAN happen, including lots of great, safe sex.

You can’t make the same statement about kids having sex.  It’s reckless.  It’s dangerous.  It’s something that shouldn’t happen.     

We should absolutely should "impose" whatever is best from a policy standpoint on our society.       

[drkaje]

It's pretty easy to summarize or respond to a specific comment, rather than just making stuff up.     My opinion on the failure of condoms has been repeatedly stated in this thread (and others).  You disagree.  That's fine. 

No merit to safe sex within the confines of marriage?  I don't need to argue this.  It's a fact.  Two people in a good marriage will only have sex with each other, which makes the chance of contracting an STD pretty close to zero. 

You're completely distorting my comments.  I didn't say marriage is a panacea.  I said marriage is where a lot of good things can happen.  Note the qualifier "can."  In other words, not every marriage will be a good one.  Not every spouse will be faithful.  But the fact is marriage is one of the bedrocks of our society and the main reason our society continues to exist.  It's where beautiful things CAN happen, including lots of great, safe sex.

You can’t make the same statement about kids having sex.  It’s reckless.  It’s dangerous.  It’s something that shouldn’t happen.     

We should absolutely should "impose" whatever is best from a policy standpoint on our society.       

I honestly think you may be tied with Toxy in the hopeless romantic/idealist department.

It might be a good idea for you to seek help or counseling with major life decisions.

[Dos Equis]

I honestly think you may be tied with Toxy in the hopeless romantic/idealist department.

It might be a good idea for you to seek help or counseling with major life decisions.

No, not at all.  I'm a realist, not an idealist.  Take your blinders off and quit plugging your ears.    

I always seek help and counseling with major life decisions.  It's part of the reason I often make good decisions.    

[drkaje]

No, not at all.  I'm a realist, not an idealist.  Take your blinders off and quit plugging your ears.    

I always seek help and counseling with major life decisions.  It's part of the reason I often make good decisions.  

It's a slow one ..... give it time.

[Mons Venus]

Teen pregnancy is a parenting problem and has nothing to do with clothing.

QFT

[bears]

Good post.  What beach doesn't get is the 'condoms don't work' is a self fulfilling prophecy.  The access and stigma around it is still there, just look at how he views planned parenthood.  Perhaps less teens would get abortions if people like beach weren't so foolish as to believe condoms don't work.  Maybe that's why we need better sex ed and less religious intervention in schools, maybe that's why teens should be given free condoms no questions asked, maybe that's why we still have this issue of teen pregnancy and STI rates because instead of progressing forward, we're going backwards against science and against common sense. 

seriously?  do you really think that teen pregnancy is caused because two kids have sex and no one told them about these things called condoms and that they wouldn't know how to use them even if they had some because they didn't have a class on using them?  seriously?  kids don't wear them because they suck.  period.  they usually start off wearing them.  then they have sex without one.  it sounds like you're saying that kids in this country don't have access to sex education.  our public schools around here have sex education in middle school AND they talk about contraception.  every kid knows what condoms are and how to use them.  our public high schools give out condoms.  kids are still getting pregnant every day.  why.  because they're kids and they are not intellectually mature enough nor emotionally mature enough to have a safe sexual relationship.  what I will tell my son is that sex is for adults.  If you want to do adult things.  be ready to accept adult consequences.  its people like you who ruin kids by making them devoid of any real responsibility.   Why should these kids worry about pregnancy when they hear every day on their television set that it is OK to have an abortion.  They are hearing over and over again that what they created is not a life.  its just tissue.  why should they feel any responsibilty towards a piece of tissue?  I honestly feel bad for this generation.  we have bunch of parents who are teaching them not to take responsibility for their actions and to villify anyone who thinks that they should.  sad.

[MRDUMPLING]

When I was a teen I ALWAYS used a condom...I was more scared to get a chick pregnant when I was 17 then getting a STD!  LOL No joke!  Your logic doesn't float Beach...you'd be surprised at the response of teenagers if they had the proper education.

Now I disagree with KC because I don't think you should give out condoms to elementary kids. 

[bears]

When I was a teen I ALWAYS used a condom...I was more scared to get a chick pregnant when I was 17 then getting a STD!  LOL No joke!  Your logic doesn't float Beach...you'd be surprised at the response of teenagers if they had the proper education.

Now I disagree with KC because I don't think you should give out condoms to elementary kids. 

so did I.  and i never had sex education.  nor was ever taught in a classroom how to use a condom.  i was scared shitless about having a baby.  abortion was not an option to me.  it just wasn't.  i was always told that if i create a life i am responsible for that life.  pretty crazy right? 

[Dos Equis]

seriously?  do you really think that teen pregnancy is caused because two kids have sex and no one told them about these things called condoms and that they wouldn't know how to use them even if they had some because they didn't have a class on using them?  seriously?  kids don't wear them because they suck.  period.  they usually start off wearing them.  then they have sex without one.  it sounds like you're saying that kids in this country don't have access to sex education.  our public schools around here have sex education in middle school AND they talk about contraception.  every kid knows what condoms are and how to use them.  our public high schools give out condoms.  kids are still getting pregnant every day.  why.  because they're kids and they are not intellectually mature enough nor emotionally mature enough to have a safe sexual relationship.  what I will tell my son is that sex is for adults.  If you want to do adult things.  be ready to accept adult consequences.  its people like you who ruin kids by making them devoid of any real responsibility.   Why should these kids worry about pregnancy when they hear every day on their television set that it is OK to have an abortion.  They are hearing over and over again that what they created is not a life.  its just tissue.  why should they feel any responsibilty towards a piece of tissue?  I honestly feel bad for this generation.  we have bunch of parents who are teaching them not to take responsibility for their actions and to villify anyone who thinks that they should.  sad.

*APPLAUSE*  Someone who gets it.   

[Dos Equis]

When I was a teen I ALWAYS used a condom...I was more scared to get a chick pregnant when I was 17 then getting a STD!  LOL No joke!  Your logic doesn't float Beach...you'd be surprised at the response of teenagers if they had the proper education.

Now I disagree with KC because I don't think you should give out condoms to elementary kids. 

If you always used a condom as a teen, I'd say you were the exception. 

Here is a question I heard someone ask on the radio a long time ago:  if you knew a person had HIV or AIDS (or any other serious STD like herpes) would you still have sex with them if you could use a condom? 

[MRDUMPLING]

If you always used a condom as a teen, I'd say you were the exception. 

Here is a question I heard someone ask on the radio a long time ago:  if you knew a person had HIV or AIDS (or any other serious STD like herpes) would you still have sex with them if you could use a condom? 

No, but it's not just about STDs; we're talking about teen pregnancy and the rate of it in our country.

[newmom]

Newmom started a war! I still say Forever 21 should sell 'em if they can.

Oh crips

She's quite the rabble rouser.

et tu doc

[Dos Equis]

No, but it's not just about STDs; we're talking about teen pregnancy and the rate of it in our country.

Why not?  If condoms will protect you from an STD, then what's to worry about?