Dorian said "Ronnie would probably win, I don't know"

[NarcissisticDeity]

No, he didn't have a torn bicep in 93. 93 vs 98 still would be a very close contest, I just don't think bitch tits could be a problem, his calves would though.

So for the sake of argument let's say they had equal conditioning (I think they did), Ronnie has better muscularity. You said muscularity is the ability to show great detail and muscle separation and that it goes hand in hand with conditioning, since great conditioning is a must to show the muscle detail & separation.
Since we are saying they had equal conditioning or even if Dorian had slightly better, Ronnie has better muscularity due to his superior muscle separations & detail.  You ask where? All most every single bodypart when looked from the front.
Dorian does carry more muscular bulk, but muscularity is equally important right? I still don't see a 93-95 Dorian harder & drier than a 98 - 01 Ronnie.

Dorian in 93 has better balance & proportion than Ronnie, I admit it. But Ronnie still has some advantage in symmetry.

Yeah, I think Ronnie 98 or 01 are his best showings too.

No, he didn't have a torn bicep in 93. 93 vs 98 still would be a very close contest, I just don't think bitch tits could be a problem, his calves would though.

the bitch tits and the calves , no way is he beating Dorian if it were ' close ' these factors were swing it Yates way

So for the sake of argument let's say they had equal conditioning (I think they did), Ronnie has better muscularity. You said muscularity is the ability to show great detail and muscle separation and that it goes hand in hand with conditioning, since great conditioning is a must to show the muscle detail & separation.
Since we are saying they had equal conditioning or even if Dorian had slightly better, Ronnie has better muscularity due to his superior muscle separations & detail.  You ask where? All most every single bodypart when looked from the front.
Dorian does carry more muscular bulk, but muscularity is equally important right? I still don't see a 93-95 Dorian harder & drier than a 98 - 01 Ronnie.

I don't think Ronnie showed greater muscularity than Dorian , perhaps in certain areas sure overall? NO in almost every bodypart? Oh Boy 

lets say conditioning is equal , Dorian still has an advantage in muscular bulk while being just as hard and as dry while being better balanced , and more complete. no one part of the criteria supercedes the other however if all things being ' equal ' the better conditioned athlete usually wins

Dorian in 93 has better balance & proportion than Ronnie, I admit it. But Ronnie still has some advantage in symmetry.

As I've stated many times , but when we factor in everything I think it favors Yates if not by a lot than enough to win

[JP_RC]

the bitch tits and the calves , no way is he beating Dorian if it were ' close ' these factors were swing it Yates way

So for the sake of argument let's say they had equal conditioning (I think they did), Ronnie has better muscularity. You said muscularity is the ability to show great detail and muscle separation and that it goes hand in hand with conditioning, since great conditioning is a must to show the muscle detail & separation.
Since we are saying they had equal conditioning or even if Dorian had slightly better, Ronnie has better muscularity due to his superior muscle separations & detail.  You ask where? All most every single bodypart when looked from the front.
Dorian does carry more muscular bulk, but muscularity is equally important right? I still don't see a 93-95 Dorian harder & drier than a 98 - 01 Ronnie.

I don't think Ronnie showed greater muscularity than Dorian , perhaps in certain areas sure overall? NO in almost every bodypart? Oh Boy 

lets say conditioning is equal , Dorian still has an advantage in muscular bulk while being just as hard and as dry while being better balanced , and more complete. no one part of the criteria supercedes the other however if all things being ' equal ' the better conditioned athlete usually wins

As I've stated many times , but when we factor in everything I think it favors Yates if not by a lot than enough to win

the bitch tits and the calves , no way is he beating Dorian if it were ' close ' these factors were swing it Yates way

Yes, this could be a possibility.

I don't think Ronnie showed greater muscularity than Dorian , perhaps in certain areas sure overall? NO in almost every bodypart? Oh Boy 

lets say conditioning is equal , Dorian still has an advantage in muscular bulk while being just as hard and as dry while being better balanced , and more complete. no one part of the criteria supercedes the other however if all things being ' equal ' the better conditioned athlete usually wins

I think Ronnie showed greater muscularity than Dorian, I took it too far by saying ever bodypart though. Absolutely in certain areas and I think that overall he did. We can agree to disagree here.

As I've stated many times , but when we factor in everything I think it favors Yates if not by a lot than enough to win

I agree, the criteria could favor Dorian to win, but only slightly.

Again, we'll never know.

[Nirvana]

Oh boy  like most of Ronnie's fans you apparently have comprehension problems

no shit Ronnie and Dorian never stepped onstage at their bests

I'm saying statistically Ronnie is the best which has nothing to do with Dorian because not one single of his wins is over Dorian

You've been arguing this whole time about dorian being better than ronnie, now you're trying to say that they had nothing to do with each other because they didn't step onstage at their bests.

wtf

[Nirvana]

Yes, this could be a possibility.

I think Ronnie showed greater muscularity than Dorian, I took it too far by saying ever bodypart though. Absolutely in certain areas and I think that overall he did. We can agree to disagree here.

I agree, the criteria could favor Dorian to win, but only slightly.

Again, we'll never know.

ND knows for fact and is qualified to judge and knows the criteria

idk he'll probably change his mind now and say it's all opinnion

[NarcissisticDeity]

You've been arguing this whole time about dorian being better than ronnie, now you're trying to say that they had nothing to do with each other because they didn't step onstage at their bests.

wtf

We know this , Ronnie faced Dorian 8 times and LOST every single time , was Ronnie at his best? NO now the debate is who at their best would beat who , could Ronnie's improvements be enough to beat Dorian? in my opinion probably NOT

ND knows for fact and is qualified to judge and knows the criteria

idk he'll probably change his mind now and say it's all opinnion

I know for a fact just like you know for a fact that contests are fixed 

[Palpatine Q]

He's not stupid because he has a different opinion than me , he's stupid because he's cherry picking the judging criteria for what he likes or what he thinks wins contests while ignoring the rest , that's not how it works

And to further correct you , you can actually find more quotes from BBing magazine and industry people who say Ronnie is the best , and for all intents & purposes he is , he tied Haney for most Olympia wins and has more pro wins than anyone else , so technically he is the greatest Mr Olympia winner and bodybuilder of all-time which doesn't have much to do with Dorian because how many of those titles did he earn by beating Dorian?   

show me where I typed this? I dare you . I said Dorian had better triceps ( not bigger pay attention ) and better forearms but where did I try and convince anyone that Yates had better arms? show me I'll be waiting , in fact I've been pretty adamant that better parts don't make better poses for a long time now

you do the same thing

Go ahead and write another thousand word manifesto about how you know better and your opinion is backed up by facts...blah, blah blah.....you do the same exact shit 


If you were actually man enough to cop to that, i would be shocked...but apparently winning this argument is life and death for you and it seems beyond your scope to even concede the slightest point someone makes



as far as the arm remark, I'm not going digging around for it, but you've said it on a couple of occasions...... I don't just make shit up.

[Nirvana]

We know this , Ronnie faced Dorian 8 times and LOST every single time , was Ronnie at his best? NO now the debate is who at their best would beat who , could Ronnie's improvements be enough to beat Dorian? in my opinion probably NOT

I know for a fact just like you know for a fact that contests are fixed 

I believe groink has covered the shitty judging department

[NarcissisticDeity]

you do the same thing

Go ahead and write another thousand word manifesto about how you know better and your opinion is backed up by facts...blah, blah blah.....you do the same exact shit 


If you were actually man enough to cop to that, i would be shocked...but apparently winning this argument is life and death for you and it seems beyond your scope to even concede the slightest point someone makes



as far as the arm remark, I'm not going digging around for it, but you've said it on a couple of occasions...... I don't just make shit up.

NO I don't cherry pick anything in fact I've A) posted the criteria which these guys never knew and B) said Dorian meets ALL of it more than Ronnie , so you're flat out wrong again , I don't cherry pick I don't need to

We've already established there are NO winners or losers when it comes to an opinion on whose best , so how is this a life or death situation for me? how ? keep making empty statements I've walked away from this argument , I've offered a truce out of respect for other members , this alone proves this ' argument ' doesn't mean as much to me as you want it to

[NarcissisticDeity]

I believe groink has covered the shitty judging department

We're not talking about him YOU made the claim

[saucetradomous]

How trained harder Ronnie or Dorian?  let the fun begin!

[Palpatine Q]

NO I don't cherry pick anything in fact I've A) posted the criteria which these guys never knew and B) said Dorian meets ALL of it more than Ronnie , so you're flat out wrong again , I don't cherry pick I don't need to

We've already established there are NO winners or losers when it comes to an opinion on whose best , so how is this a life or death situation for me? how ? keep making empty statements I've walked away from this argument , I've offered a truce out of respect for other members , this alone proves this ' argument ' doesn't mean as much to me as you want it to

Yes you do....someone will post a pic of Yates looking bad...you immediately post one of him looking great and throw one of Ronnie looking shitty right next to it.

You have been doing this every day for 6 years now.

[saucetradomous]

Yes you do....someone will post a pic of Yates looking bad...you immediately post one of him looking great and throw one of Ronnie looking shitty right next to it.

You have been doing this every day for 6 years now.

Ronnie has Dorian beat in both comparisons though.. If you put two of their best pics beside each other Ronnie takes it.  If you put their two worst photos beside each other, Ronnie still takes it for looking worse.  Point is at his best he was unbeatable by anyone from any decade.

[NarcissisticDeity]

Yes you do....someone will post a pic of Yates looking bad...you immediately post one of him looking great and throw one of Ronnie looking shitty right next to it.

You have been doing this every day for 6 years now.

Oh boy  we're talking about cherry picking the judging criteria , which I don't because I don't have to because I know how contests are judged , the one who meets ALL of the criteria better than his contemporaries is usually declared the winner

and I'm guilty of doing that usually it's called a " Hulkster " comparison because he's notorious for it and the ironic part is these guys have been doing it for years yet you're bitching only at me for it , hypocrite much?

And again I'm glad you hang on my every word and follow me around and I'm glad I pissed you off compelled you enough to join the fray , because you're just another guy that needs to be corrected 

[NarcissisticDeity]

Ronnie has Dorian beat in both comparisons though.. If you put two of their best pics beside each other Ronnie takes it.  If you put their two worst photos beside each other, Ronnie still takes it for looking worse.  Point is at his best he was unbeatable by anyone from any decade.

I will put this shot of Dorian up against anything you can muster of Coleman and he beats him hands down 

[NarcissisticDeity]

And this one

[NeoSeminole]

Ronnie has Dorian beat in both comparisons though.. If you put two of their best pics beside each other Ronnie takes it.  If you put their two worst photos beside each other, Ronnie still takes it for looking worse.  Point is at his best he was unbeatable by anyone from any decade.

most brilliant post in this thread! Whether it's a contest to see who looks the best or worst, Ronnie is unbeatable

[Palpatine Q]

Oh boy  we're talking about cherry picking the judging criteria , which I don't because I don't have to because I know how contests are judged , the one who meets ALL of the criteria better than his contemporaries is usually declared the winner

and I'm guilty of doing that usually it's called a " Hulkster " comparison because he's notorious for it and the ironic part is these guys have been doing it for years yet you're bitching only at me for it , hypocrite much?

And again I'm glad you hang on my every word and follow me around and I'm glad I pissed you off compelled you enough to join the fray , because you're just another guy that needs to be corrected 

I think Hulkster is just as much of a tool when he does it, it's pure fanboy nonsense from both of you.

Apparently you "hang on my every word" too, because I haven't made a post recently in this thread that you have not responded to directly 

And please tell us all again....how exactly do you correct someone's opinion ?? Some people prefer Coleman, some Yates....you seem to be the only one who arrogantly (and childishly)  proclaims time and time again that your opinion is somehow more valid.

Hulkster is 1000% pro-Ronnie,and he can be a HUGE fanboy...... but he doesn't think he's "the authority" anywhere near the extent that you do.

You are comical

[RocketSwitch625]

And this one

That pic always puts Hulkster on the ropes and he thinks it is photoshopped. What a wanker! LOL

[NarcissisticDeity]

I think Hulkster is just as much of a tool when he does it, it's pure fanboy nonsense from both of you.

Apparently you "hang on my every word" too, because I haven't made a post recently in this thread that you have not responded to directly  

And please tell us all again....how exactly do you correct someone's opinion ?? Some people prefer Coleman, some Yates....you seem to be the only one who arrogantly (and childishly)  proclaims time and time again that your opinion is somehow more valid.

Hulkster is 1000% pro-Ronnie,and he can be a HUGE fanboy...... but he doesn't think he's "the authority" anywhere near the extent that you do.

You are comical

I hang on your word? you mentioned my name in this thread sport , I merely responded.   how do you correct someone's opinion? easy by showing them they contradict reality and facts. just because someone has an opinion doesn't mean they're right especially if it's not subjective , It's like claiming Ronnie's calves are more detailed that Dorians , this is easy to prove someone's opinion is wrong by posting two comparison photos showing who has more detail in the calves , this isn't open for discussion , this isn't subjective and when someone makes a claim like this they're wrong and easily proven wrong

And how do contests get judged? how does one determine who is the better bodybuilder? lets entertain Ronnie and Dorian met at their respective bests a winner would be determined , there is a way , out of the two of us I know my opinion is more informative , unbiased and educated , Hulkster and the rest of the lot are attempting to determine who is better without EVER even knowing how contests are judged and you're asking me how I can come to the conclusion how my point of view is more valid?

They never knew the IFBB judging criteria until I posted it, yet that never prevented them from declaring Ronnie would beat Dorian , they never once knew that all rounds are physique rounds and they were scratching their heads wondering how and why Dorian never lost a ' symmetry round or posing round ' despite not being the most ' symmetrical ' or the best ' poser ' yet they knew for sure Ronnie would beat Yates , these guys didn't even know balance & proportion were two separate things , yet that never stopped them from committing know-it-all opinions on how Ronnie would win , so to answer you question my opinion is more valid because I took the time to learn how contests are judged , what the judges look for and how to apply the criteria , they never did

And Hulkster doesn't come across as much as an authority as me? have you ever read any of his posts or just hung on my words?   he's said he's just as qualified to judge contest sitting at home on his p.c. than any professional IFBB judge is sitting feet away live & in person , I mean I really could continue for a long time with examples of how he thinks he's right and every professional who was there is flat-out wrong , he's not an authority because he's fucking clueless , he'd have to have an inkling of how things work in order to come across as an authority , he's clueless and like most Coleman fans ignorant and base everything on what they prefer.

[RocketSwitch625]

Checkout this high quality vid of the 94 Olympia posedown:


[ Invalid YouTube link ]

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I don't care what the haters think. Yates was unbeatable once again in 94 and the videos prove it.

[NarcissisticDeity]

That pic always puts Hulkster on the ropes and he thinks it is photoshopped. What a wanker! LOL

What else can he say? he's crushed he outright cried it was morphed and when the photographer Kevin Horton said it was an untouched scan from the original negative he basically called him a liar , the funny part is Horton said if Hulkster posted he would think it was fake because that's what Hulkster does 

Dorian is 283lbs in that pic ( even though Groink doesn't by it ) noticeably larger than all other showings and according to Horton ' shredded ' people always bring up Ronnie 2003 , big deal. Dorian's 4lbs lighter with better balance & proportion and conditioning , it's no wonder why these guys cry morphed and these pics don't matter because he never looked like that on-stage 

Kevin Horton said this was the absolute best he's ever seen Dorian even better than the pre-contest 1993 , I would love to see more pics from this shoot so it would silence a lot of fan-boys look how much damage this pic caused , they still haven't recovered.

[Palpatine Q]

I hang on your word? you mentioned my name in this thread sport , I merely responded.   how do you correct someone's opinion? easy by showing them they contradict reality and facts. just because someone has an opinion doesn't mean they're right especially if it's not subjective , It's like claiming Ronnie's calves are more detailed that Dorians , this is easy to prove someone's opinion is wrong by posting two comparison photos showing who has more detail in the calves , this isn't open for discussion , this isn't subjective and when someone makes a claim like this they're wrong and easily proven wrong

And how do contests get judged? how does one determine who is the better bodybuilder? lets entertain Ronnie and Dorian met at their respective bests a winner would be determined , there is a way , out of the two of us I know my opinion is more informative , unbiased and educated , Hulkster and the rest of the lot are attempting to determine who is better without EVER even knowing how contests are judged and you're asking me how I can come to the conclusion how my point of view is more valid?

They never knew the IFBB judging criteria until I posted , yet that never prevented them from declaring Ronnie would beat Dorian , they never once knew that all rounds are physique rounds and they were scratching their heads wondering how and why Dorian never lost a ' symmetry round or posing round ' despite not being the most ' symmetrical ' or the best ' poser ' yet they knew for sure Ronnie would beat Yates , these guys didn't even know balance & proportion were two separate things , yet that never stopped them from committing know-it-all opinions on how Ronnie would win , so to answer you question my opinion is more valid because I took the time to learn how contests are judged , what the judges look for and how to apply the criteria , they never did

And Hulkster doesn't come across as much as an authority as me? have you ever read any of his posts or just hung on my words?   he's said he's just as qualified to judge contest sitting at home on his p.c. than any professional IFBB judge is sitting feet away , I mean I really could continue for a long time , he's not an authority because he's fucking clueless , he'd have to have an inkling of how things work in order to come across as an authority , he's clueless and like most Coleman fans ignorant and base everything on what they prefer.

so when you answer my posts...it's "merely responding"...but i "hang on your every word" when i respond to you??

That's pretty much you in a nutshell, actually.

thanks for posting yet another 500 word rant....on cue, stating how your opinion matters more  

[kiwiol]

What else can he say? he's crushed he outright cried it was morphed and when the photographer Kevin Horton said it was an untouched scan from the original negative he basically called him a liar , the funny part is Horton said if Hulkster posted he would think it was fake because that's what Hulkster does 

Dorian is 283lbs in that pic ( even though Groink doesn't by it ) noticeably larger than all other showings and according to Horton ' shredded ' people always bring up Ronnie 2003 , big deal. Dorian's 4lbs lighter with better balance & proportion and conditioning , it's no wonder why these guys cry morphed and these pics don't matter because he never looked like that on-stage 

Kevin Horton said this was the absolute best he's ever seen Dorian even better than the pre-contest 1993 , I would love to see more pics from this shoot so it would silence a lot of fan-boys look how much damage this pic caused , they still haven't recovered.

Whether he weighs 247 lb or 287 lb, Ronnie carries at least 30 of those pounds in his gigantic ass

[NarcissisticDeity]

so when you answer my posts...it's "merely responding"...but i "hang on your every word" when i respond to you??

That's pretty much you in a nutshell, actually.

thanks for posting yet another 500 word rant....on cue, stating how your opinion matters more  

No and why? because ....... you seem to know an awful lot about many of my old posts that's why 

You asked on my opinion is more valid , I gave you a explanation and now you're bitching , great logic. you know you can't counter the argument so chalk it up as a ' rant ' or better yet a ' meltdown ' either you're here to debate or troll pick one , doesn't matter to me because my informed , educated opinion on the subject will be here waiting to correct you.

[NarcissisticDeity]

Whether he weighs 247 lb or 287 lb, Ronnie carries at least 30 of those pounds in his gigantic ass

  

800lb squats they don't only build huge quads