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Author Topic: Stinking Filthy "LIB"  (Read 8655 times)
Arnold jr
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« Reply #225 on: August 31, 2010, 08:05:57 PM »



Well many of the founders were Deist and most did not believe in trinity, the divinity of jesus, miracles, etc..  but besides that point at the time the Declaration was written there were human beings in this country who did not have their "god given" right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.   Why didn't God enforce their rights?
 
I don't believe any rights that we currently enjoy come from any "god"

All the rights we have come from man and man's creation ....government and legal system

The bold^^^ nothing more than a propagated lie in order to circumvent the rights granted by the constitution. Beyond that it makes no sense. If someone doesn't believe in God, fine, that's their choice, their right but to twist the beliefs of others only to create a false image makes no sense unless one is trying to twist the intent of the original statements, in this case the constitution.

Let's look at what some of the founders said in regards to God and Christ:

Samuel Adams:Known as "The Father of the American Revolution" and signer of the Declaration of Independence

"I . . . recommend my Soul to that Almighty Being who gave it, and my body I commit to the dust, relying upon the merits of Jesus Christ for a pardon of all my sins."


Benjamin Rush: Signer of the Declaration of Independence
"My only hope of salvation is in the infinite, transcendent love of God manifested to the world by the death of His Son upon the cross. Nothing but His blood will wash away my sins. I rely exclusively upon it. Come, Lord Jesus! Come quickly!"

John Dickinson: Signer of the Constitution
"Rendering thanks to my Creator for my existence and station among His works, for my birth in a country enlightened by the Gospel and enjoying freedom, and for all His other kindnesses, to Him I resign myself, humbly confiding in His goodness and in His mercy through Jesus Christ for the events of eternity."

John Hancock: Signer of the Deceleration of Independence

" I John Hancock, . . . being advanced in years and being of perfect mind and memory-thanks be given to God-therefore calling to mind the mortality of my body and knowing it is appointed for all men once to die [Hebrews 9:27], do make and ordain this my last will and testament…Principally and first of all, I give and recommend my soul into the hands of God that gave it: and my body I recommend to the earth . . . nothing doubting but at the general resurrection I shall receive the same again by the mercy and power of God"

Patrick Henry: Governor of Virginia and Writer of Articles of Confederation

"This is all the inheritance I can give to my dear family. The religion of Christ can give them one which will make them rich indeed."


John Jay: First Chief Justice of the U.S. Supreme Court

"Unto Him who is the author and giver of all good, I render sincere and humble thanks for His manifold and unmerited blessings, and especially for our redemption and salvation by His beloved son. He has been pleased to bless me with excellent parents, with a virtuous wife, and with worthy children. His protection has companied me through many eventful years, faithfully employed in the service of my country; His providence has not only conducted me to this tranquil situation but also given me abundant reason to be contented and thankful. Blessed be His holy name!"

Henry Knox: Revolutionary War General & Secretary of War


"First, I think it proper to express my unshaken opinion of the immortality of my soul or mind; and to dedicate and devote the same to the supreme head of the Universe – to that great and tremendous Jehovah, – Who created the universal frame of nature, worlds, and systems in number infinite . . . To this awfully sublime Being do I resign my spirit with unlimited confidence of His mercy and protection."

John Langdon: Signer of the Constitution

" In the name of God, Amen. I, John Langdon, . . . considering the uncertainty of life and that it is appointed unto all men once to die [Hebrews 9:27], do make, ordain and publish this my last will and testament in manner following, that is to say-First: I commend my soul to the infinite mercies of God in Christ Jesus, the beloved Son of the Father, who died and rose again that He might be the Lord of the dead and of the living . . . professing to believe and hope in the joyful Scripture doctrine of a resurrection to eternal life"



Roger Sherman: Signer of the Declaration of Independence & Constitution
"I believe that there is one only living and true God, existing in three persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. . . . that the Scriptures of the Old and New Testaments are a revelation from God. . . . that God did send His own Son to become man, die in the room and stead of sinners, and thus to lay a foundation for the offer of pardon and salvation to all mankind so as all may be saved who are willing to accept the Gospel offer."


Is that enough or do you need more?

And let me guess, you'll say something about Franklin, Washington or Jefferson...for some very stupid reasons people like to claim these three were atheist, when in fact the opposite is true...especially concerning Jefferson, a man who wrote over 70,000 letters in his lifetime, 70+ which called for things such as question everything even the existence of God...people who make the "Atheist" claim base their claimoff of those 70 letters and ignore the other 69,900+.
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« Reply #226 on: August 31, 2010, 08:20:39 PM »

great post
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« Reply #227 on: August 31, 2010, 08:21:19 PM »

now now now take it easy arnold they probably just didnt understand I know straw has problems understanding the definitions of words and obviously mcmannus does as well

seeing as he cited this as proof jefferson didnt believe in God even though this is an arguement for God
I hold (without appeal to revelation) that when we take a view of the universe, in all its parts, general or particular, it is impossible for the human mind not to perceive and feel a conviction of design, consummate skill, and indefinite power in every atom of its composition...

...it is impossible I say, for the human mind not to believe that there is in all this design, cause and effect up to an ultimate cause, a fabricator of all things from matter and motion, their preserver and regulator while permitted to exist in their present forms, and their regeneration into new and other forms. We see, too evident proofs of the necessity of a superintending power to maintain the universe in its course and order...


Thomas Jefferson
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« Reply #228 on: August 31, 2010, 08:40:20 PM »

The bold^^^ nothing more than a propagated lie in order to circumvent the rights granted by the constitution. Beyond that it makes no sense. If someone doesn't believe in God, fine, that's their choice, their right but to twist the beliefs of others only to create a false image makes no sense unless one is trying to twist the intent of the original statements, in this case the constitution.

Let's look at what some of the founders said in regards to God and Christ:

Samuel Adams:Known as "The Father of the American Revolution" and signer of the Declaration of Independence

"I . . . recommend my Soul to that Almighty Being who gave it, and my body I commit to the dust, relying upon the merits of Jesus Christ for a pardon of all my sins."


Benjamin Rush: Signer of the Declaration of Independence
"My only hope of salvation is in the infinite, transcendent love of God manifested to the world by the death of His Son upon the cross. Nothing but His blood will wash away my sins. I rely exclusively upon it. Come, Lord Jesus! Come quickly!"

John Dickinson: Signer of the Constitution
"Rendering thanks to my Creator for my existence and station among His works, for my birth in a country enlightened by the Gospel and enjoying freedom, and for all His other kindnesses, to Him I resign myself, humbly confiding in His goodness and in His mercy through Jesus Christ for the events of eternity."

John Hancock: Signer of the Deceleration of Independence

" I John Hancock, . . . being advanced in years and being of perfect mind and memory-thanks be given to God-therefore calling to mind the mortality of my body and knowing it is appointed for all men once to die [Hebrews 9:27], do make and ordain this my last will and testament…Principally and first of all, I give and recommend my soul into the hands of God that gave it: and my body I recommend to the earth . . . nothing doubting but at the general resurrection I shall receive the same again by the mercy and power of God"

Patrick Henry: Governor of Virginia and Writer of Articles of Confederation

"This is all the inheritance I can give to my dear family. The religion of Christ can give them one which will make them rich indeed."


John Jay: First Chief Justice of the U.S. Supreme Court

"Unto Him who is the author and giver of all good, I render sincere and humble thanks for His manifold and unmerited blessings, and especially for our redemption and salvation by His beloved son. He has been pleased to bless me with excellent parents, with a virtuous wife, and with worthy children. His protection has companied me through many eventful years, faithfully employed in the service of my country; His providence has not only conducted me to this tranquil situation but also given me abundant reason to be contented and thankful. Blessed be His holy name!"

Henry Knox: Revolutionary War General & Secretary of War


"First, I think it proper to express my unshaken opinion of the immortality of my soul or mind; and to dedicate and devote the same to the supreme head of the Universe – to that great and tremendous Jehovah, – Who created the universal frame of nature, worlds, and systems in number infinite . . . To this awfully sublime Being do I resign my spirit with unlimited confidence of His mercy and protection."

John Langdon: Signer of the Constitution

" In the name of God, Amen. I, John Langdon, . . . considering the uncertainty of life and that it is appointed unto all men once to die [Hebrews 9:27], do make, ordain and publish this my last will and testament in manner following, that is to say-First: I commend my soul to the infinite mercies of God in Christ Jesus, the beloved Son of the Father, who died and rose again that He might be the Lord of the dead and of the living . . . professing to believe and hope in the joyful Scripture doctrine of a resurrection to eternal life"



Roger Sherman: Signer of the Declaration of Independence & Constitution
"I believe that there is one only living and true God, existing in three persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. . . . that the Scriptures of the Old and New Testaments are a revelation from God. . . . that God did send His own Son to become man, die in the room and stead of sinners, and thus to lay a foundation for the offer of pardon and salvation to all mankind so as all may be saved who are willing to accept the Gospel offer."


Is that enough or do you need more?

And let me guess, you'll say something about Franklin, Washington or Jefferson...for some very stupid reasons people like to claim these three were atheist, when in fact the opposite is true...especially concerning Jefferson, a man who wrote over 70,000 letters in his lifetime, 70+ which called for things such as question everything even the existence of God...people who make the "Atheist" claim base their claimoff of those 70 letters and ignore the other 69,900+.


ah....when did I say any of them were atheist?

what point are you trying to make?

some of the founder were Christian and certainly some were comfortable in exercising their freedom of speech and their freedom of religion

is that your point?
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Arnold jr
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« Reply #229 on: August 31, 2010, 09:35:34 PM »

ah....when did I say any of them were atheist?

what point are you trying to make?

some of the founder were Christian and certainly some were comfortable in exercising their freedom of speech and their freedom of religion

is that your point?

Your words: "Well many of the founders were Deist and most did not believe in trinity, the divinity of jesus, miracles, etc.. "

Implying obviously most are not Christians, if you don't believe in the trinity, you're not a Christian, if you're a deist, you're not a Christian. I can post quote after quote of almost every single founding father and numerous ones that prove the claim that most were deist and didn't believe in the trinity to be false.
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« Reply #230 on: September 01, 2010, 04:51:47 AM »

Your words: "Well many of the founders were Deist and most did not believe in trinity, the divinity of jesus, miracles, etc.. "

Implying obviously most are not Christians, if you don't believe in the trinity, you're not a Christian, if you're a deist, you're not a Christian. I can post quote after quote of almost every single founding father and numerous ones that prove the claim that most were deist and didn't believe in the trinity to be false.

Don't bother Straw Man has his name for a reason. 
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« Reply #231 on: September 01, 2010, 10:36:11 AM »

Don't bother Straw Man has his name for a reason. 

You're probably right but I still can't resist posting a few more from George Washington since like Jefferson, for some reason guys like Straw love calling these guys deist:



“What students would learn in American schools above all is the religion of Jesus Christ"

"It is impossible to rightly govern the world without God and Bible."

"It is the duty of all Nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey his will, to be grateful for his benefits, and humbly to implore his protection and favors."

“O Most Glorious God, in Jesus Christ, my merciful and loving Father; I acknowledge and confess my guilt in the weak and imperfect performance of the duties of this day. I have called on Thee for pardon and forgiveness of my sins, but so coldly and carelessly that my prayers are become my sin, and they stand in need of pardon.”
“ I have sinned against heaven and before Thee in thought, word, and deed. I have contemned Thy majesty and holy laws. I have likewise sinned by omitting what I ought to have done and committing what I ought not. I have rebelled against the light, despising Thy mercies and judgment, and broken my vows and promise. I have neglected the better things. My iniquities are multiplied and my sins are very great. I confess them, O Lord, with shame and sorrow, detestation and loathing and desire to be vile in my own eyes as I have rendered myself vile in Thine. I humbly beseech Thee to be merciful to me in the free pardon of my sins for the sake of Thy dear Son and only Savior Jesus Christ who came to call not the righteous, but sinners to repentance. Thou gavest Thy Son to die for me.”

"Make me to know what is acceptable in Thy sight, and therein to delight, open the eyes of my understanding, and help me thoroughly to examine myself concerning my knowledge, faith, and repentance, increase my faith, and direct me to the true object, Jesus Christ the Way, the Truth, and the Life, ..."
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« Reply #232 on: September 01, 2010, 10:40:02 AM »

I am not a religious person at all, but believe firmly that our rights come from God almighty, not traitors and communists like obama and those who are power hungry psychos. 

I believe I have a right to take whatever steps necessary, including violent revolution, to repeal and repel those that would attempt to take said rights from me. 

That is the difference between typical leftists and those on the right.  Leftists have a slave mentality to where they want to be led and want to be told what to do by some "benign" dictator who they think has their interests at heart.   
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kcballer
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« Reply #233 on: September 01, 2010, 12:06:32 PM »

^ Proof that KC's parents are siblings.

Obviously you're too stupid to understand the argument being waged here. Nobody claims that God wrote the constitution or declaration of independence you douchebag. The argument is that some rights are fundamental to all human beings and are mandated by a higher power than a legion of politicians scribbling legislation down on a piece of paper. Freedom of speech, marriage, freedom of religion, etc. etc.  are all fundamental rights that the framers felt were so important to the public, that God, rather than the framers themselves was the final authority on such matters. Nobody is claiming that God appeared to Thomas Jefferson and told him and his pals to write another chapter of the Bible.

^proof that you completely missed my point.  I didn't mean literally God came down and commanded them or gave them a vision.  Perhaps you should look into your lineage before saying anymore about mine?

It's stupid to say God gave you rights at all or that there are even fundamental rights granted by a higher power other than man.  Last i checked man wrote the constitution and man wrote it during a period when not all had those 'fundamental rights' supposedly granted by God were not available to all.  That would lead one to logically conclude man mandated the rights that we enjoy.
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« Reply #234 on: September 01, 2010, 12:09:51 PM »

^proof that you completely missed my point.  I didn't mean literally God came down and commanded them or gave them a vision.  Perhaps you should look into your lineage before saying anymore about mine?

It's stupid to say God gave you rights at all or that there are even fundamental rights granted by a higher power other than man.  Last i checked man wrote the constitution and man wrote it during a period when not all had those 'fundamental rights' supposedly granted by God were not available to all.  That would lead one to logically conclude man mandated the rights that we enjoy.

this is why you are a mrxist and have a slave mentality along with all your fellow traveling progressives i.e. communists who think everything eminates from man.

According to you fools, man gave you rights, and hence can take them away.  This is why you communists on the left have no problem whatsoever infringing upon, usurping, and abrogating everyones' freedom whenever and however you see fit. 
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AE
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« Reply #235 on: September 01, 2010, 12:16:14 PM »

...
I believe I have a right to take whatever steps necessary, including violent revolution, to repeal and repel those that would attempt to take said rights from me. 
...   

I believe the government has a right and obligation to put a bullet between your eyes during said violent revolution.  Kiss
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« Reply #236 on: September 01, 2010, 12:21:49 PM »

I believe the government has a right and obligation to put a bullet between your eyes during said violent revolution.  Kiss

I hope they send you first, you wouldnt make it withing 300 yards of me. 
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AE
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« Reply #237 on: September 01, 2010, 12:29:46 PM »

I hope they send you first, you wouldnt make it withing 300 yards of me. 

Think incoming.  Shocked
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Kazan
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« Reply #238 on: September 01, 2010, 12:31:32 PM »

I believe the government has a right and obligation to put a bullet between your eyes during said violent revolution.  Kiss

So you think it is correct for the government to act unconstitutionally and take away your rights? You think that the citizens should just accept it and keep their mouths shut?
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ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
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« Reply #239 on: September 01, 2010, 12:34:04 PM »

So you think it is correct for the government to act unconstitutionally and take away your rights? You think that the citizens should just accept it and keep their mouths shut?

Yes!  The far left has a slave-master mentality and will go along with anything. 
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AE
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« Reply #240 on: September 01, 2010, 12:36:44 PM »

So you think it is correct for the government to act unconstitutionally and take away your rights? You think that the citizens should just accept it and keep their mouths shut?

What part of 86's violent revolution, didn't you understand?
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Kazan
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« Reply #241 on: September 01, 2010, 12:37:48 PM »

What part of 86's violent revolution, didn't you understand?

You are just not going to answer the question then?
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« Reply #242 on: September 01, 2010, 12:43:47 PM »

So you think it is correct for the government to act unconstitutionally and take away your rights? You think that the citizens should just accept it and keep their mouths shut?

Nope.  But violence is a last resort.  We have 333 posting that the dems are about to lose the upcoming election yet he still pipes on about violent revolution.  Why?  It seems democracy is going to take it's natural course.
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« Reply #243 on: September 01, 2010, 12:46:25 PM »

Nope.  But violence is a last resort.  We have 333 posting that the dems are about to lose the upcoming election yet he still pipes on about violent revolution.  Why?  It seems democracy is going to take it's natural course.

No, I said that regardless of elections - whatever - if the government tries to abrogate fundamental rights of the citizens that are guaranteed by the Dec. of Indep., Const, etc, that the citizens have a natural law right to violently overthrow throw the Govt.   
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« Reply #244 on: September 01, 2010, 12:46:59 PM »

Nope.  But violence is a last resort.  We have 333 posting that the dems are about to lose the upcoming election yet he still pipes on about violent revolution.  Why?  It seems democracy is going to take it's natural course.

Please do you really think there is a difference between the 2 parties? Its all lip service to keep the people divided so we don't actually flush the toilet that is DC. Natural course is the reason we are in the position we are in, same bunch of assholes keep getting re-elected only the POTUS changes.
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« Reply #245 on: September 02, 2010, 03:02:20 AM »

now now now take it easy arnold they probably just didnt understand I know straw has problems understanding the definitions of words and obviously mcmannus does as well

seeing as he cited this as proof jefferson didnt believe in God even though this is an arguement for God

Hey stupid fuck..............I never said Jefferson didn't believe in god.  I said he wasn't a Christian.  Does believing in a "god" make you a CHristian.  You are a dumb fuck for sure.
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« Reply #246 on: September 02, 2010, 03:04:15 AM »

Typical morons on getbig............the arguments weren't about whether or not the founding fathers believed in god............or a god..........they didn't consider themselves Christians.  Do most of you even understand that difference?  Obviously not.  For fuck's sake why the fuck do you idiots even care? It's not like you all are Christians yourselves.  I mean how many of you even go to church on Sunday?   Roll Eyes
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« Reply #247 on: September 02, 2010, 03:07:25 AM »

You're probably right but I still can't resist posting a few more from George Washington since like Jefferson, for some reason guys like Straw love calling these guys deist:



“What students would learn in American schools above all is the religion of Jesus Christ"

"It is impossible to rightly govern the world without God and Bible."

"It is the duty of all Nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey his will, to be grateful for his benefits, and humbly to implore his protection and favors."

“O Most Glorious God, in Jesus Christ, my merciful and loving Father; I acknowledge and confess my guilt in the weak and imperfect performance of the duties of this day. I have called on Thee for pardon and forgiveness of my sins, but so coldly and carelessly that my prayers are become my sin, and they stand in need of pardon.”
“ I have sinned against heaven and before Thee in thought, word, and deed. I have contemned Thy majesty and holy laws. I have likewise sinned by omitting what I ought to have done and committing what I ought not. I have rebelled against the light, despising Thy mercies and judgment, and broken my vows and promise. I have neglected the better things. My iniquities are multiplied and my sins are very great. I confess them, O Lord, with shame and sorrow, detestation and loathing and desire to be vile in my own eyes as I have rendered myself vile in Thine. I humbly beseech Thee to be merciful to me in the free pardon of my sins for the sake of Thy dear Son and only Savior Jesus Christ who came to call not the righteous, but sinners to repentance. Thou gavest Thy Son to die for me.”

"Make me to know what is acceptable in Thy sight, and therein to delight, open the eyes of my understanding, and help me thoroughly to examine myself concerning my knowledge, faith, and repentance, increase my faith, and direct me to the true object, Jesus Christ the Way, the Truth, and the Life, ..."


So what is your fucking point?  Let's put it on record here and now.  Are you saying most of the founding fathers were in fact Christians?  LOL
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« Reply #248 on: September 02, 2010, 03:49:08 AM »

LOL that isnt a belief...the belief would be that in general conservatives are for doing anything and everything that might need to be done to protect the US and its ppl...liberals in general are not...certain interrogation techniques would be the example of that...

and I dont know I havent polled or seen a poll but I would be in favor of doing anything and everything possible to protect the US and its ppl...how about you?
What would your views on torture have been if Clinton had introduced "waterboarding" during the 1990s?

You know you would be going nuts over how wrong it is.

Maybe we should start suicide bombing.

It's funny that people call torture an "interrogation technique".  Would child abuse be a "parenting technique"?
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« Reply #249 on: September 02, 2010, 06:01:16 AM »

Hey stupid fuck..............I never said Jefferson didn't believe in god.  I said he wasn't a Christian.  Does believing in a "god" make you a CHristian.  You are a dumb fuck for sure.
LOL HAHAHAHAH you have a bad shift or what?

actually brain child you never said which was which...you also said some were atheist as well...
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