Author Topic: How much is Phil Heath 'all drugs' compared to other current bodybuilders?  (Read 31886 times)

Fatpanda

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Re: How much is Phil Heath 'all drugs' compared to other current bodybuilders?
« Reply #100 on: September 27, 2010, 11:43:00 AM »
It being water based would seem to make it even more unlikely to have site specific effects, I think. Muscle tissue is very vascular and the peptide is dispersed quickly. Diabetics of course depend on this, the systemic effect, so it inhibits glucose production in the liver and so on.

Some have said insulin has site specific lipogenic effects when injected sub-q. I'm not sure about that either, kind of doubt it. Could be wrong of course. If it did to any significant extent you'd think bodybuilders would have trouble dropping belly fat during prep or gaining more fat there when bulking.

If insulin has injection-site specific effects my guess is the effect is minute and unmeasurable. I remember Milos actually addressing this and saying to do the insulin sub-q as it doesn't have site specific effects. But that's just one gurus opinion. :D

here you go, i knew i read a study on this:


Extreme hyperinsulinemia unmasks insulin's effect to stimulate protein synthesis in the human forearm

Insulin clearly stimulates skeletal muscle protein synthesis in vitro. Surprisingly, this effect has been difficult to reproduce in vivo. As in vitro studies have typically used much higher insulin concentrations than in vivo studies, we examined whether these concentration differences could explain the discrepancy between in vitro and in vivo observations. In 14 healthy volunteers, we raised forearm insulin concentrations 1,000-fold above basal levels while maintaining euglycemia for 4 h. Amino acids (AA) were given to either maintain basal arterial (n = 4) or venous plasma (n = 6) AA or increment arterial plasma AA by 100% (n = 4) in the forearm. We measured forearm muscle glucose, lactate, oxygen, phenylalanine balance, and [3H]phenylalanine kinetics at baseline and at 4 h of insulin infusion. Extreme hyperinsulinemia strongly reversed postabsorptive muscle's phenylalanine balance from a net release to an uptake (P < 0.001). This marked anabolic effect resulted from a dramatic stimulation of protein synthesis (P < 0.01) and a modest decline in protein degradation. Furthermore, this effect was seen even when basal arterial or venous aminoacidemia was maintained. With marked hyperinsulinemia, protein synthesis increased further when plasma AA concentrations were also increased (P < 0.05). Forearm blood flow rose at least twofold with the combined insulin and AA infusion (P < 0.01), and this was consistent in all groups. These results demonstrate an effect of high concentrations of insulin to markedly stimulate muscle protein synthesis in vivo in adults, even when AA concentrations are not increased. This is similar to prior in vitro reports but distinct from physiological hyperinsulinemia in vivo where stimulation of protein synthesis does not occur. Therefore, the current findings suggest that the differences in insulin concentrations used in prior studies may largely explain the previously reported discrepancy between insulin action on protein synthesis in adult muscle in vivo vs. in vitro.

full text here:

http://ajpendo.physiology.org/cgi/reprint/274/6/E1067

i don't want to go into how insulin effects cell volume ( and the benefits it causes) and how it increases protein uptake, water, glycogen, and how all this can increase local igf-1, satellite cells , etc etc all the things i mentioned.

you will know what i'm talking about, its pity no one's glass is already full, all 2ml of it  ::)

its funny that you mention milos, as his athletes do not get 'guts'. he says its due to them only taking insulin around the workout while there is increased blood flow to muscles rather than spread evenly throughout the body. This he believes caused insulin to be absorbed by the receptors in the muscles primarily.

in my mind IM injections will do exactly this, only faster. Also in tying in with the above study with admittedly crazy insulin dosages. the full amount of insulin is absorbed through the muscle rather than a small % of it when absorbed sc, and absorbed via standard blood flow. ( am i making sense ? )

just one fat guys opinion  :D
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w8m8

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Re: How much is Phil Heath 'all drugs' compared to other current bodybuilders?
« Reply #101 on: September 27, 2010, 01:54:18 PM »

I wish I could take credit for this work    :D




Fatpanda

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Re: How much is Phil Heath 'all drugs' compared to other current bodybuilders?
« Reply #102 on: September 27, 2010, 03:17:50 PM »
you can fit in there?

do you have to cover yourself in margarine in order to squeeze in and out of it?

wow, all these hours and all you could come up with was that  :o

not even an attempt at posting something intellectual.

probably better that way for you, that way you don't get owned even more.

carry on......
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Emmortal

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Re: How much is Phil Heath 'all drugs' compared to other current bodybuilders?
« Reply #103 on: September 27, 2010, 04:00:17 PM »
Where did you get that pic from?

Google.

NarcissisticDeity

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Re: How much is Phil Heath 'all drugs' compared to other current bodybuilders?
« Reply #104 on: September 27, 2010, 04:24:58 PM »
I think you are an asshole who posts intentionally idiotic questions to try and get a rise out of people

And you fell for it.